========================================================================= Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:52:25 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Mary Jo Malo Subject: mourning & poetics MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I've been sympathetically following the tragic death of Emma Bernstein and wonder why "quietist" poetry (and prose, I suppose) seem/s to better express grief. The one exception I've discovered so far is Mary Jo Bang's "Elegy." Who else am I missing? Additionally, reflecting only slightly upon Ron Silliman's post-avant/quietist dichotomy, I find the only way for me to categorize poetry is via my own poor pedantic: Poetry I Like vs. Poetry I Don't Like. Does -- http://thisshiningwound.blogspot.com/ http://apophisdeconstructingabsurdity.blogspot.com/ ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 09:23:54 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jennifer Karmin Subject: July 5: Buckminster Fuller Performance in Chicago MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Jen & Ira & You at the MCA Meet Buckminster Fuller Meeting the Hippies in Golden Gate Park : A Re-Performance SUNDAY, JULY 5th 2-4:30pm 4th-floor lobby Museum of Contemporary Art 220 East Chicago Avenue Chicago, IL http://www.mcachicago.org DURATIONAL PERFORMANCE instigated by Jennifer Karmin & Ira S. Murfin This is a performance of a transcript of the video Buckminster Fuller Meets the Hippies in Golden Gate Park. You are invited to watch this performance for as long or as briefly as you like. You are also invited to be a performer in it. You may stay as long or as briefly as you wish, and return as often as you like. FINAL DAY OF EXHIBIT Buckminster Fuller: Starting with the Universe is a fascinating mix of utopian vision and organic pragmatism, combining models, sketches, and other artifacts -- many on view for the first time -- represent six decades of the artist's integrated approach to housing, transportation, communication, and cartography. The exhibition features numerous models of Fuller's projects including his famous geodesic dome. Fuller's extensive connections with Chicago are also highlighted through photographs and documents from his years spent living, teaching, and working in the city. JENNIFER KARMIN is the author of the text-sound epic Aaaaaaaaaaalice (Flim Forum Press, forthcoming 2009). She curates the Red Rover Series and is a founding member of the public art group Anti Gravity Surprise. Her multidisciplinary projects have been presented nationally at festivals, artist-run spaces, and on city streets including: Betalevel (CA), Links Hall (IL), the Poetry Project (NY), the Urban Institute for Contemporary Arts (MI), and Woodland Pattern Book Center (WI). The recipient of numerous grants and residencies, Jennifer teaches creative writing to immigrants at Truman College and works as a Poet in Residence for the Chicago Public Schools. Recent poems are published in the journals Cannot Exist, MoonLit, Otoliths, and anthologized in Come Together: Imagine Peace (Bottom Dog Press), Not A Muse (Haven Books), and The City Visible: Chicago Poetry for the New Century (Cracked Slab Books). IRA S. MURFIN is a writer, educator, and theatre maker. His writing has appeared in Requited, elimae, Fiction at Work, Lark(!), Mobius, and the book The Mind Garden, among other places. Ira is Co-Artistic Director of the Laboratory for Enthusiastic Collaboration and a founding member of the Laboratory for the Development of Substitute Materials, two devised theatre collectives. His solo and collaborative writing and performance work has been presented at venues including the Chicago Cultural Center, Links Hall, Version Fest, The Neo-Futurists, Prop Thtr, the Chicago Calling Festival, by Walkabout Theater at the Peter Jones Gallery, and the Red Rover, Powells North, Quickies, and Reconstruction Room reading series. Ira is also the former Head of the Soleri Book Initiative at the urban design project Arcosanti. He lives in Chicago and teaches writing at North Park University, St. Augustine College, and with Urban Gateways. ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 19:35:54 -0700 Reply-To: derek beaulieu Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: derek beaulieu Subject: Drunken Boat Launch - reading and event July 10 Comments: To: "Undisclosed-Recipient:;"@invalid.domain MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > Drunken Boat, international online journal of the arts, will be publish= ing > its special 10th anniversary issue and celebrating its launch with an=20 > event > at the SoHo20 Chelsea Gallery in NYC. > > Friday, July 10th from 6:00 pm to 8:00 pm > SOHO20 CHELSEA GALLERY > > 511 West 25th St. > > Suite 605 > > NEW YORK, NY 10001 > > http://www.soho20gallery.com/ > > Featuring one of Canada=B9s most radical writers, derek beaulieu, the p= oet=20 > and > comix creator, Sommer Browning, novelist and Contributing Editor of Bon > App=E9tit, Rand Richards Cooper, award winning poet and director of The= =20 > Center > for Book Arts, Sharon Dolin, filmmaker and visionary Ram Devineni,=20 > Fulbright > fellow and Pushcart winner, Elizabeth Kadetsky, Barnard New Women Poet=B9= s > Prize winner and Director of The University Writing Program at Drexel > University, Harriet Levin, and award-winning filmmaker and Guggenheim > fellow, Elisabeth Subrin. > > SOHO20 was founded in 1973, in New York's Soho art district, as a > non-profit, artist-run organization devoted to increasing public awaren= ess > of the excellence and diversity of women's art. SOHO20 has a dynamic=20 > history > of supporting highly committed women artists both nationally and in the > world community through extensive exhibition programs and through an > exciting mix of multicultural events. A rigorous jurying process ensure= s=20 > the > high quality of the gallery membership and of its exhibitions. The=20 > gallery's > commitment to diversity brings a broad and impressive range of works to= =20 > the > public's attention each season. Major critics in leading magazines and > newpapers have cited SOHO20 Gallery for the achievements of its artists= =20 > and > exhibitions. > > derek beaulieu=B9s practice includes 4 books of poetry: with wax (Coach= =20 > House > Books, 2003), frogments from the frag pool: haiku after basho (co-writt= en > with Gary Barwin, Mercury Press, 2005), fractal economies (talonbooks,=20 > 2006) > and Chains (paper kite, 2008). He is also author of two books of=20 > conceptual > fiction: flatland, published in the United Kingdom by information as > material (2007) and Local Colour, published in Finland by ntamo (2008).= In > 2010 How to Write, a collection of plagiarised prose, will be published= by > Vancouver=B9s talonbooks. Beaulieu has been editorially involved with=20 > filling > Station, dANDelion, endNote and speechless magazines and also published= =20 > the > highly acclaimed micropresses housepress and no press. His work is > consistently praised as some of the most radical and challenging in > contemporary Canadian writing. > > Sommer Browning writes comix and draws poems in Brooklyn. Her latest > chapbook, The House, can be found in Narwhal, out with Cannibal Books. > > Rand Richards Cooper is the author of a novel, The Last to Go (Harcourt > Brace), and a story collection, Big As Life (The Dial Press). His ficti= on > has appeared in Harper=B9s, The Atlantic, Esquire, and many other magaz= ines, > as well as in the Selected Shorts series on NPR; his short story, =B3Jo= hnny > Hamburger,=B2 was included in Best American Short Stories 2003. The Las= t to=20 > Go > was produced for television by ABC. Cooper has been Writer in Residence= at > Amherst and Emerson colleges. A frequent contributor to the New York Ti= mes > Book Review, he is a film critic for Commonweal and a contributing edit= or > for Bon App=E9tit, for which he received a 2002 Lowell Thomas Gold Meda= l=20 > Award > from the American Society of Travel Writers. Rand Cooper lives in=20 > Hartford, > CT, with his wife, Molly, and their daughter, Larkin. He writes a colum= n > about fatherhood, =B3Dad on a Lark,=B2 for www.Wondertime.com. > > Sharon Dolin=B9s fourth book, Burn and Dodge, won the AWP Donald Hall P= rize=20 > in > Poetry and was recently published by the University of Pittsburgh Press= .=20 > Her > other books include Heart Work, Serious Pink, and Realm of the Possible= .=20 > She > is Writer-in-Residence at Eugene Lang College, The New School. She also > teaches poetry workshops at the Unterberg Poetry Center of the 92nd Str= eet=20 > Y > and directs The Center for Book Arts Annual Letterpress Poetry Chapbook > Competition. In May, Sharon was an artist-in-residence at Fundaci=F3n > Valparaiso in Moj=E1car, Spain during which time she was a guest blogge= r for > The Best American Poetry. > > Ram Devineni is a filmmaker and editor of Rattapallax magazine. He=20 > recently > produced Amir Naderi=B9s =B3Vegas: Based on a True Story=B2 which premi= ered at=20 > the > Venice Film Festival. He recently finished a film about Allen Ginsberg = and > his journey to India called =B3Ginsberg=B9s Karma.=B2 > > Elizabeth Kadetsky's fiction has appeared or is forthcoming in=20 > TriQuarterly, > Antioch Review, Best New American Voices, the Pushcart Prizes anthology= =20 > and > Gettysburg Review. The recipient of a Fulbright Fellowship in creative > writing to India, she wrote the memoir First There Is a Mountain (Littl= e > Brown, 2004) based on her year there as a student of the yoga guru B.K.= S. > Iyengar. This year, she has new non-fiction in Antioch Review and Going > Hungry > journalism have appeared in The Nation, Ms, Glamour, the Villa= ge=20 > Voice, > Santa Monica Review and many other venues. She has received artists gra= nts > from numerous places both in the US and abroad. She is a graduate of UC > Santa Cruz, the MFA Fiction program at UC Irvine and the graduate=20 > journalism > program at Columbia University. She grew up in New York City and has=20 > taught > creative writing at University of Pittsburgh, Sarah Lawrence College an= d > Ohio State University, as well as narrative writing in Columbia=20 > University's > graduate school of journalism. She is currently visiting writer in Pen= n > State University=B9s program in creative writing. > > Harriet Levin is the author of THE CHRISTMAS SHOW (Beacon Press), a=20 > Barnard > New Women Poet's Prize and a Poetry Society of America Alice Fay di > Castangola Award winner. A PEW Fellowship in the Arts Discipline winner= , > recent work appears or is forthcoming in Harvard Review, Prairie Schoon= er, > Kenyon Review, Antioch Review, Gulf Coast, Many Mountains Moving, Cimar= ron > Review and 32 Poems. She lives in Philadelphia where she is Director of= =20 > the > University Writing Program at Drexel University. To read about her work= =20 > with > the Lost Boys of Sudan, see her blog, harrietmillan.blogspot.com > > Elisabeth Subrin is an award-winning filmmaker and video artist. A=20 > Sundance > Institute Lab Fellow, she participated in their Writer=B9s and Director= =B9s=20 > Labs > with her first feature length screenplay, now in development with Foren= sic > Films. Subrin=B9s series of experimental bio-pics have screened extensi= vely=20 > in > the United States and abroad, including at The New York Film Festival, = The > Whitney Biennial, The Vienna International Film Festival, The Museum of > Modern Art, American Film Institute, Rotterdam International Film=20 > Festival, > The Robert Flaherty Film Seminar, the VIPER International Festival in > Lucerne, Switzerland, The Guggenheim Museum, The Sundance Channel, PBS,= =20 > and > numerous other major museums, universities, arts institutions and film > festivals. One-woman shows include The Museum of Modern Art in New York= ,=20 > San > Francisco Cinematheque, Film Forum in LA, the Institute of Contemporary= =20 > Art > in Boston, The Vienna International Film Festival, The Center for Media= , > Culture and History at New York University, The Northwest Film Center, = and > The Film Center at The Art Institute of Chicago. Subrin has received=20 > grants > and fellowships from The Rockefeller Foundation, The John Simon Guggenh= eim > Foundation, The Creative Capital Foundation, The Andrea Frank Foundatio= n, > The Wexner Center for the Arts, and The Yaddo and MacDowell Colonies.=20 > She=B9s > an assistant professor in the Department of Film and Media Arts at Temp= le > University and a visiting critic in the Graduate Program at Yale=20 > University > School of Art. She lives in Brooklyn, New York.=20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 21:41:51 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Eric Elshtain Subject: Download the Gnoetry software MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Gnoetry practitioner Eric Scovel has generously posted the ingredients you need to download the poetry-generating software Gnoetry0.2. Go here: http://mchainpoetics.wordpress.com/gnoetry-0-2-download-and-install-howto/ Please contact Eric Elshtain at Beard of Bees Press if you get the software up and running. Enjoy! Eric Elshtain Editor Beard of Bees Press http://www.beardofbees.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 08:58:00 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: "St. Thomasino" Subject: a noun sing e=?ISO-8859-1?Q?=B7ratio_12_=B7_2009__a_noun_sing_e=B7ratio_12_=B7_?= 2009 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v935.3) e=B7 a noun sing e=B7ratio 12 =B7 2009 with poetry by David Chikhladze, Gautam Verma, David Rushmer, Anne =20 Fitzgerald, Mary Ann Sullivan, Ruth Lepson, Virginia Konchan, Sandra =20 Huber, Paige H. Taggart, Marcia Arrieta, Sean Patrick Hill, Travis =20 Macdonald, Mark Lamoureux, Camille Martin, Nathan Thompson, Philip =20 Byron Oakes, Cyril Wong, and Derek Henderson E=B7ratio =B7 Issue 12.pdf http://www.eratiopostmodernpoetry.com/ edited by gregory vincent st. thomasino e=B7= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:42:18 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: "Zamsky, Robert" Subject: Contemporary French Writing In-Reply-To: A<20090630012030.EC63514C96@mxC.acsu.buffalo.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I'll be in France for the next month and am looking for reading suggestions -- poetry or prose. Thanks! - Robert Zamsky =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 11:12:18 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: UbuWeb Subject: Flarf & Conceptual Writing in July/Aug Poetry Magazine MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii An introduction to the 21st Century's most controversial poetry movements: http://www.poetryfoundation.org/journal/article.html?id=237176 UbuWeb http://ubu.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 13:32:08 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Patrick Dillon Subject: Re: Contemporary French Writing In-Reply-To: <846D336ED686FF48943D51955C2C5B23079FD558@quicksilver.network.ncf.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bookworm had a four or five part series called An American Bookworm in Paris. You can visit the website: http://www.kcrw.com/etc/programs/bw and then at the bottom there is a link "More past shows" It should not be too far back, but you can also search for it. It's pretty good and has about 15 or more contemporary French writers, many of whom would fit with the poetics of this list. On Wed, Jul 1, 2009 at 9:42 AM, Zamsky, Robert wrote: > I'll be in France for the next month and am looking for reading > suggestions -- poetry or prose. > > Thanks! > > - Robert Zamsky > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:56:18 +0530 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve dalachinsky Subject: Re: mourning & poetics MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit nice seeing your name out here again MJ On Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:52:25 -0400 Mary Jo Malo writes: > I've been sympathetically following the tragic death of Emma > Bernstein > and wonder why "quietist" poetry (and prose, I suppose) seem/s to > better express grief. The one exception I've discovered so far is > Mary > Jo Bang's "Elegy." Who else am I missing? > > Additionally, reflecting only slightly upon Ron Silliman's > post-avant/quietist dichotomy, I find the only way for me to > categorize poetry is via my own poor pedantic: Poetry I Like vs. > Poetry I Don't Like. Does > > -- > http://thisshiningwound.blogspot.com/ > http://apophisdeconstructingabsurdity.blogspot.com/ > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:12:15 -0600 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Scott Howard Subject: mourning & poetics Comments: cc: Mary Jo Malo In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, Mary Jo, Here are a few recommendations, re: mourning & poetics. 1. Inventions of Farewell, edited by Sandra Gilbert. That's an anthology of elegies and elegiac poetics/poetry. 2. Poetry of Mourning, by Jahan Ramazani. Scholarly study. 3. Both of the above are v. good for twentieth-century Anglo-American poetry & poetics of loss, but neither really begins to address postmodern poetics. If you're interested, you could also consider this book chapter: "'The Brevities': Formal Mourning, Transgression & Postmodern American Elegies", in _The World in Time and Space_ (Talisman House, 2002), 122-46. Best wishes, Scott Howard /// ----- Original Message ----- From: Mary Jo Malo Date: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 10:52 am Subject: mourning & poetics To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > I've been sympathetically following the tragic death of Emma Bernstein > and wonder why "quietist" poetry (and prose, I suppose) seem/s to > better express grief. The one exception I've discovered so far is Mary > Jo Bang's "Elegy." Who else am I missing? > > Additionally, reflecting only slightly upon Ron Silliman's > post-avant/quietist dichotomy, I find the only way for me to > categorize poetry is via my own poor pedantic: Poetry I Like vs. > Poetry I Don't Like. Does > > -- > http://thisshiningwound.blogspot.com/ > http://apophisdeconstructingabsurdity.blogspot.com/ > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 09:40:03 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: amy king Subject: Fogged Clarity [on behalf of Ben Evans] Comments: To: new-poetry@wiz.cath.vt.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable The July Issue of the arts review Fogged Clarity (http://www.foggedclarity.= com) is up: 3 short films An interview and poetry from Pulitzer Prize finalist Bruce Smith Short fiction from Ryan McCarl and Claire Foster, Poetry and readings from Michael Tyrell and Linda Nemec Foster The music of "The Horse's Ha" An essay by T.S. Eliot scholar Benjamin Lockerd And much more All free and beautiful at www.foggedclarity.com -- Executive Editor, "Fogged Clarity" http://www.foggedclarity.com Ben Evans --=20 Amy's Alias http://amyking.org/ =0AJuly 2009=0ATable of Contents=0A=0A=0AFiction=0A=0ARyan McCarl The Day-T= raderClaire Foster Hurricane Season=0A=0APoetry=0A=0ABruce Smith DEVOTION: = RED ROOF INNDEVOTION: AL GREENMichael Tyrell The GardenNixonLinda Nemec Fos= ter The Anonymous Woman Describes the RoomateJanuary, 2003Hillary Bartholom= ew Dali=E2=80=99s Last DreamTobi Cogswell Getting Off the Bus=0A=0AVisual= =0A=0ABrandon T. David A Little SecretMichael Fragstein A Wet DayForgetFran= cis Raven The World Without Us is BeautifulAesthetic RejectionJulia Haw The= Nine Day Wonder=0A=0APolemics=0A=0ABenjamin Lockerd Religion, Dawson, and = T.S. Eliot=0A=0AAural=0A=0AThe Horse=E2=80=99s Ha Of the Cathmawr Yards=0A= =0AInterviews=0A=0ABruce Smith The poet on his life and workJames Elkington= On, Of the Cathmawr Yards =0A--=20 =0A =0AAmy's Alias =0Ahttp://amyking.org/ =0A =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 21:20:17 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Marc Nasdor Subject: Re: mourning & poetics In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Have you checked out Jennifer Bartlett's book, "Derivative of the Moving Image" lately. See the poems "Elegy for the Trees" and "Going to Yugoslavia" -- particularly the former. I would not consider JB a Quietist poet in any sense. I am sure there are many others who express grief well, but not all of them do it in a narrative manner. Marc ---------------------------- Marc Nasdor 127 Thames Street, #3L Brooklyn, NY 11237 Telephone: (646) 408-4962 - cell Email: poodlecannon@yahoo.com http://www.myspace.com/poodlecannon ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:52:25 -0400 From: Mary Jo Malo Subject: mourning & poetics I've been sympathetically following the tragic death of Emma Bernstein and wonder why "quietist" poetry (and prose, I suppose) seem/s to better express grief. The one exception I've discovered so far is Mary Jo Bang's "Elegy." Who else am I missing? Additionally, reflecting only slightly upon Ron Silliman's post-avant/quietist dichotomy, I find the only way for me to categorize poetry is via my own poor pedantic: Poetry I Like vs. Poetry I Don't Like. Does -- http://thisshiningwound.blogspot.com/ http://apophisdeconstructingabsurdity.blogspot.com/ ================================== ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 00:45:14 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jonathan Skinner Subject: Contemporary French Writing Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Hi Robert!=20 Go to Mich=E8le Ignazi books in Paris, on rue du Jouy. Jennifer Dick keeps a blog of readings and literary events around Paris (much perhaps to glean from there): http://parisreadingsmonthlylisting.blogspot.com/ You can=B9t go wrong with anything by Jacques Roubaud. JS =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 21:52:42 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Lauren Russell Subject: Re: mourning & poetics MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable What is quietist poetry?=A0 I'm really curious; I've never heard the term. I tend to think of fragmented poetry (and prose) as best articulating grief= .=A0 Have you ever read Kristin Prevallet's I, Afterlife: Essay in Mourning= Time?=A0 And part of what I love about Alice Notley's work is that her poe= ms have engaged with grief in so many different ways.=A0 I can't claim to h= ave read the whole book (it's one of the books one's not aloud to check out= of the New York Public Library), but the introduction to Patricia Rae's Mo= dernism and Mourning makes some interesting points about the politics of gr= ief and writing about grief. I found it helpful alongside Ramazini, though = I can't claim to have read all of that, either. Lauren Russell Date:=A0 =A0 Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:12:15 -0600 From:=A0 =A0 Scott Howard Subject: mourning & poetics Hi, Mary Jo, Here are a few recommendations, re: mourning & poetics. 1. Inventions of Farewell, edited by Sandra Gilbert.=A0 That's an anthology= of elegies and elegiac poetics/poetry. 2. Poetry of Mourning, by Jahan Ramazani.=A0 Scholarly study. 3.=0ABoth of the above are v. good for twentieth-century Anglo-American=0Ap= oetry & poetics of loss, but neither really begins to address=0Apostmodern = poetics.=A0 If you're interested, you could also consider this=0Abook chapt= er: "'The Brevities': Formal Mourning, Transgression &=0APostmodern America= n Elegies", in _The World in Time and Space_=0A(Talisman House, 2002), 122-= 46. Best wishes, Scott Howard /// ----- Original Message ----- From: Mary Jo Malo Date: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 10:52 am Subject: mourning & poetics To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > I've been sympathetically following the tragic death of Emma Bernstein >=A0 and wonder why "quietist" poetry (and prose, I suppose) seem/s to >=A0 better express grief. The one exception I've discovered so far is Mary >=A0 Jo Bang's "Elegy." Who else am I missing? >=A0=20 >=A0 Additionally, reflecting only slightly upon Ron Silliman's >=A0 post-avant/quietist dichotomy, I find the only way for me to >=A0 categorize poetry is via my own poor pedantic: Poetry I Like vs. >=A0 Poetry I Don't Like. Does >=A0=A0=0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 00:59:21 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: David Seaman Subject: Re: Contemporary French Writing In-Reply-To: <846D336ED686FF48943D51955C2C5B23079FD558@quicksilver.network.ncf.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Do you read French? This year I have enjoyed The Elegace of the Hedghog ./ L'Elegance de l'herisson and I'll Never be French. David Seaman David W. Seaman, Ph.D. http://personal.georgiasouthern.edu/~dseaman/Welcome.html On Wednesday, July 01, 2009, at 10:42AM, "Zamsky, Robert" wrote: >I'll be in France for the next month and am looking for reading >suggestions -- poetry or prose. > >Thanks! > >- Robert Zamsky > >================================== >The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 03:24:08 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Alan Sondheim Subject: Alan Sondheim: The Drawing Un/Center/Ed (hi - please post, thanks!) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Alan Sondheim: The Drawing Un/Center/Ed An exhibition of graphics from 3d modeling transformations and other sources at: Millennium Gallery, 66 East 4th St., New York June 20, 2009 - July 31, 2009, and probably September, 2009 Monday - Wednesday and Friday evenings 7-10:30 pm Saturday 1-5 pm "Each of the prints here is unique; each is the result of print, print error, borderline and uncontrollable phenomena. Most of them originate from work done with the aid of Poser and other 3d modeling programs. The mannequins represent snapshots of distorted dynamic movement, movements real bodies in real spaces could never do, unless constrained by torture, dismemberment, fantasm, sexuality, or (other) uncomfortable elements within the imaginary - bridging the real, ascending, descending. I see every print as an entire world; if it doesn't work alone, it won't work in conjunction. I also see them as ruins - of fragile-analogic bodies, of the digital world, of memory. Ruins are fascinating; no matter how minimal, there always seems to be enough there, never enough there, never there." - Alan Sondheim, 6/16/09 "The word prolific always comes to mind when describing Alan Sondheim, who has produced an unending, constantly changing array of media works, writ- ings, and musical pieces; and has given innumerable workshops and lectures around the world. He has been a regular participant in the Personal Cinema Series." - Howard Guttenplan For further information, phone 212-673-0090 or email cinema@millenniumfilm.org. Please visit if you're in the neighborhood (4th Street between 2nd and 3rd Avenues). ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 23:09:07 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jim Andrews Subject: cross multiplication MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit we live in an age of rapid cross multiplication. in math, cross multiplication between two sets of things results in a new set that pairs each element of the first set with each element of the second set. {1, 2, 3} x {4, 5, 6} = {(1,4), (1,5), (1,6), (2,4), ( 2,5), (2,6), (3,4), (3,5), (3,6)} the first two sets are one-dimensional. the cross product is two dimensional. the cross product of two sets has more dimensions. the internet accelerates the processes of cultural cross multiplication. poetry x programming; poetry x spam; poetry x lots of things. because the internet is a vast network. a network is a bunch of nodes in relation to other nodes. and the relations grow between different nodes. and new nodes form out of unions of groups of nodes. as the lettrist poet isadore isou put it, "Each poet will integrate everything into Everything". given a finite set of plain old numbers, it makes sense to talk about the greatest one or the least one. but it doesn't make much sense to speak of the greatest or least in {(1,4), (1,5), (1,6), (2,4), ( 2,5), (2,6), (3,4), (3,5), (3,6)}. we can talk about the point which is the greatest distance from (0,0), or something like that, but it doesn't mean simply 'the greatest'. similarly, in a situation of cultural cross multiplication, standards that might loosely apply to, say, poetry, might not so easily apply to (poetry, programming). so we get a situation where no one knows what is greatest or least. because there really is no greatest or least in a situation of cross multiplication. ja http://vispo.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:08:29 -0500 Reply-To: halvard@gmail.com Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Halvard Johnson Subject: Hamilton Stone Review, Issue 18, Summer 2009, Now Online! MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit * Hamilton Stone Review*, Issue 18, Summer 2009, Now Online! Poetry by CL Bledsoe, James Grabill, Libby Hart, Nicholas Karavatos, Kathleen Kenny, Sandy McIntosh, Rodney Nelson, and David Woodward. Fiction by Miriam N. Kotzin, Jen Micharlski, Charles Rammelkamp, Grant Tracey, and Joyce Yarrow. http://www.hamiltonstone.org/hsr.html Submissions: *Hamilton Stone Review *is published three times a year: in June, October, and February. Poetry submissions to *Hamilton Stone Review* are temporarily closed. Fiction submissions may be sent to Lynda Schor at lyndaschor@gmail.com, and nonfiction to Reamy Jansen at reamyjj@gmail.com. No snail mail submissions, please, and it's a good idea to include your work in both the message and an attachment. Please put "HSR submission from [your name]" in your subject line. PLEASE SEND THIS ALONG TO OTHERS Thank you. Halvard Johnson ================ halvard@gmail.com http://sites.google.com/site/halvardjohnson/Home http://entropyandme.blogspot.com http://imageswithoutwords.blogspot.com http://www.hamiltonstone.org ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 12:38:50 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Charlotte Mandel Subject: BigCityLit Reading July 8 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable > I'll be part of a group reading: > Wednesday, July 8th, 2009, 6:00 pm > The Cornelia Street Caf=E9 > 29 Cornelia Street > (b/t Bleecker & West 4th) > Cover $7 (includes one house drink) > BigCityLit Reading > Featuring poets from the Spring 2009 issue, including Patricia =20 > Carragon, Allen C. Fischer, Deborah Flanagan, Joanne Grumet, Ann =20 > Lauinger, Linda Lerner, Charlotte Mandel, Mark Nickels, D. Nurkse, =20 > eve packer, Ron Price, Kryssa Schemmerling, Peter Schwartz, Maggie =20 > Schwed, Barry Wallenstein, Rob Wright and Angelo Verga > Read the issue at BigCityLit.com =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:12:05 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Mary Kasimor Subject: Re: mourning & poetics MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Lauren, Yes, the poem "White Phosphorus" is a beautiful poem about mourning= for her brother. Is that the Alice Notley poem you were thinking about? --- On Wed, 7/1/09, Lauren Russell wrote: From: Lauren Russell Subject: Re: mourning & poetics To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Wednesday, July 1, 2009, 11:52 PM What is quietist poetry?=A0 I'm really curious; I've never heard the term. I tend to think of fragmented poetry (and prose) as best articulating grief= .=A0 Have you ever read Kristin Prevallet's I, Afterlife: Essay in Mourning= Time?=A0 And part of what I love about Alice Notley's work is that her poe= ms have engaged with grief in so many different ways.=A0 I can't claim to h= ave read the whole book (it's one of the books one's not aloud to check out= of the New York Public Library), but the introduction to Patricia Rae's Mo= dernism and Mourning makes some interesting points about the politics of gr= ief and writing about grief. I found it helpful alongside Ramazini, though = I can't claim to have read all of that, either. Lauren Russell Date:=A0 =A0 Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:12:15 -0600 From:=A0 =A0 Scott Howard Subject: mourning & poetics Hi, Mary Jo, Here are a few recommendations, re: mourning & poetics. 1. Inventions of Farewell, edited by Sandra Gilbert.=A0 That's an anthology= of elegies and elegiac poetics/poetry. 2. Poetry of Mourning, by Jahan Ramazani.=A0 Scholarly study. 3. Both of the above are v. good for twentieth-century Anglo-American poetry & poetics of loss, but neither really begins to address postmodern poetics.=A0 If you're interested, you could also consider this book chapter: "'The Brevities': Formal Mourning, Transgression & Postmodern American Elegies", in _The World in Time and Space_ (Talisman House, 2002), 122-46. Best wishes, Scott Howard /// ----- Original Message ----- From: Mary Jo Malo Date: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 10:52 am Subject: mourning & poetics To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > I've been sympathetically following the tragic death of Emma Bernstein >=A0 and wonder why "quietist" poetry (and prose, I suppose) seem/s to >=A0 better express grief. The one exception I've discovered so far is Mary >=A0 Jo Bang's "Elegy." Who else am I missing? >=A0=20 >=A0 Additionally, reflecting only slightly upon Ron Silliman's >=A0 post-avant/quietist dichotomy, I find the only way for me to >=A0 categorize poetry is via my own poor pedantic: Poetry I Like vs. >=A0 Poetry I Don't Like. Does >=A0=A0 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 11:20:18 -0600 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Hilary Clark Subject: Re: mourning & poetics In-Reply-To: <406959.12136.qm@web53407.mail.re2.yahoo.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Another: *I, Afterlife [Essay in Mourning Time]* by Kristin Prevallet (Essay Press, 2007). The book mixes poetry and essay / prose. Hilary Marc Nasdor wrote: > Have you checked out Jennifer Bartlett's book, "Derivative of the Moving Image" lately. > > See the poems "Elegy for the Trees" and "Going to Yugoslavia" -- particularly the former. > > I would not consider JB a Quietist poet in any sense. I am sure there are many others who express grief well, but not all of them do it in a narrative manner. > > Marc > > ---------------------------- > > Marc Nasdor > 127 Thames Street, #3L > Brooklyn, NY 11237 > Telephone: > (646) 408-4962 - cell > > Email: poodlecannon@yahoo.com > http://www.myspace.com/poodlecannon > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:52:25 -0400 > From: Mary Jo Malo > Subject: mourning & poetics > > I've been sympathetically following the tragic death of Emma Bernstein > and wonder why "quietist" poetry (and prose, I suppose) seem/s to > better express grief. The one exception I've discovered so far is Mary > Jo Bang's "Elegy." Who else am I missing? > > Additionally, reflecting only slightly upon Ron Silliman's > post-avant/quietist dichotomy, I find the only way for me to > categorize poetry is via my own poor pedantic: Poetry I Like vs. > Poetry I Don't Like. Does > > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 16:18:46 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Tarpaulin Sky Press Subject: Save money, support first books by six young women writers, read Zornoza & Massman MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear TSky Friends, Two items that we think might interest you: 1) TSky Press Fall 2009/Spring 2010 subscriptions are now available. $60 for six books w/free shipping (vs. $103.94 from Amazon, or $107 from SPD) Yes, you read the above correctly. $60 will get you five paperbacks and one chapbook w/ free shipping. & Yes, you'll save around $45. Please visit our catalog at http://www.tarpaulinsky.com/Press/catalog.html to order online or pay by check. (THIS OFFER IS LIMITED TO 100 SUBSCRIBERS.) All first books. All from women writers. Which excites us no end. Although we have always been committed to publishing both new writers and women writers, the 2009/10 subscription series really puts our money where our collective mouth is. Fall 2009 books include Ana Bozicevic's full-length poetry collection, _Stars of the Night Commute_; Traci O Connor's book of short fictions, _Recipes for Endangered Species_; and Emily Toder's poetry chapbook, _Brushes With_; Spring 2010 titles include Joanna Ruocco's book of short fictions, _Man's Companions_; Kim Gek Lin Short's lyric novella, _The Bugging Watch and Other Exhibits_; and Shelly Taylor's book of interlocking short fictions / prose poems, _Black-Eyed Heifer_. 2) Andrew Zornoza's _Where I Stay_ and Gordon Massman's _The Essential Numbers_ are also now available. In the process of constantly disappearing, the unhinged, unmoored and unnamed narrator of WHERE I STAY travels through a cracked North America, stalked by his own future self and the whispers of a distant love. From Arco, Idaho to Mexico City, he flees along the highways and dirt roads of a landscape filled with characters in transition: squatters, survivalists, prostitutes, drug runners, skinheads, border guards and con-men. WHERE I STAY is a meditation on desperation, identity, geography, memory, and love-a story about endurance, about the empty spaces in ourselves, about the new possibilities we find only after we have lost everything. "Refreshing, pitch-perfect kind of steering that is innovative not only for the genre it might get called into, but for experiential and language-focused texts of every stripe."--BLAKE BUTLER. "A gifted journey through borderlands between text and image, glassy prose and suggestively indirect prose poem, facts and fictions, sanity and the other thing"--LANCE OLSEN. http://www.tarpaulinsky.com/Press/Zornoza/index.html from THE ESSENTIAL NUMBERS: "1715": "It is unimportant to me whether anyone reads these poems / or their assessment of them should they, I do not care under / whose name they are published, nor could I care less what / literary critics say about them, praise or condemnation, / nothing could be more vapid than some academic advanc- / ing his career on my efforts or within institutionally accept- / able parameters pushing my reputation this way or that, / most contemporary poetry is shit as is the industry that sur- / rounds it and I want no part of it, if I am harsh so be it, if / I am angry then that is life, if I have hurt my consanguineous / they are co-conspirators in their pain, nothing in this work / bears false witness nor have I broken one commandment, / I am a decent man imbued with a religious spirit and cap- / able of love, I have noticed the world is full of cowards." http://www.tarpaulinsky.com/Press/Massman/index.html All best, Elena Georgiou & Christian Peet Tarpaulin Sky Press ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 16:23:53 -0400 Reply-To: mtcross@buffalo.edu Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Michael T Cross Subject: Atticus/Finch presents: Judith Goldman's The Dispossessions MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Greetings Friends: =20 Atticus/Finch is incredibly excited to announce the release of Judith=20 Goldman's new chapbook, The Dispossessions. An ambitious series of competin= g=20 voices and cultural affects, The Dispossessions creates an intersubjective= =20 field of response to the violence of intimacy, both public and private (or= =20 better, the private as public!). Featuring an intricate die-cut wrap on=20 sumptuous Arches paper, this volume promises to challenge the most elegant= =20 Atticus/Finch productions of the past. Go to our website=20 (www.atticusfinch.org) to take a look at the cover and read a sample poem.= =20 =20 BUT THAT'S NOT ALL! To make the deal even more inviting, if you purchase=20 Judith's book along with David Larsen's Names of the Lion, I'll include a= =20 limited edition broadside featuring work by Rob Halpern FOR FREE (while=20 supplies last!)!! =20 And finally, I should mention that we've moved back to Oakland! You may ord= er=20 books at our website (www.atticusfinch.org) using Pay Pal or credit card, o= r=20 you can send a check payable to Michael Cross in the amount of ten dollars = to=20 our new address: =20 2325 Ransom Avenue #1 Oakland, CA 94601 =20 All my best, Michael Cross =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 05:04:50 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: { brad brace } Subject: five (5) new pleated plaid pamphlets published! Comments: To: WRYTING-L automatic digest -- Theory and Writing MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII 126-2 Roseate-Dreaminess Rough-Exterior Rough-Indication 127-2 Rumpled-Reproduction Run-Possibilities Royal-Personage 128-2 Rum-and-Coke Rumbling-Dozers Rumored-Role 129-2 Rumour-Factory Rump-Shake Royal-Zenana 130-2 Ruby-Eyes Ruddy-Brilliance Run-the-Risk five (5) new pleated plaid pamphlets published! second editions -- now 867 pages with copious illustrations merely $10 { brad brace } Pleated Plaid Pamphlets Volumes 126-130 Second Editions [accompaniment to insatiable abstraction engine] http://bbrace.laughingsquid.net/abstraction-engine.html http://www.bbrace.net/abstraction-engine.html bbrace@eskimo.com brad brace, bbrace, architecture, poetry, engineering, biography, memoir, illustration, map, creative, writing, drama, opera, puzzles, games, samizdat, artists' books, poetry, fluxus, contemporary, art, design, fiction,musical ppp126-2 http://www.lulu.com/content/e-book/pleated-plaid-pamphlet-vol-126-no-2/7352275 ppp127-2 http://www.lulu.com/content/e-book/pleated-plaid-pamphlet-vol-127-no-2/7353225 ppp128-2 http://www.lulu.com/content/e-book/pleated-plaid-pamphlet-vol-128-no-2/7354986 ppp129-2 http://www.lulu.com/content/e-book/pleated-plaid-pamphlet-vol-129-no-2/7354893 ppp130-2 http://www.lulu.com/content/e-book/pleated-plaid-pamphlet-vol-130-no-2/7354943 ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 05:28:15 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Obododimma Oha Subject: On Being Married to a Man Who Is Married to Books Comments: To: "NewPoetry: Contemporary Poetry News &, Views" , elsalites@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Being Married to a Man Who Is Married to Books By Obododimma Oha * http://x-pensiverrors.blogspot.com/2009/07/on-being-married-to-man-who-is-m= arried.html * I have heard it said that an intellectual is a polygamist, for s/he may not just be wedded to a human being whose needs and desires must be given some consideration, but also be similarly attached to books, to academic activities, to the endless pursuit of knowledge. These two commitments do not always submit to each other peacefully and may become the cause of serious agony for the married intellectual. As it is for men who are academics, so it is for their female counterparts. Perhaps, viewed from the perspective of women who are academics, the conflicting demands are more intense in their own case than in the case of men who are academics. In spite of the changes brought into the family by gender sensitization in modern life, women still have to make the home, catering for their husbands and children. And this does not excuse them from living up to the demands o= f their jobs: as academics they still have to carry out research, read books, teach students, supervise projects, publish articles or books, and engage i= n other professional activities. Indeed, as Virginia Woolf writes in A Room o= f One=92s Own the woman as a (literary artist) needs a space of her own, economic freedom, and freedom to use her mind, in order to function productively and meaningfully. It is certainly not an easy thing for her to have a =93room of her own=94 in the space of her husband when she functions= as a scholar. As a male scholar, I imagine, therefore, that it is not very easy for my female colleagues. As a male scholar married to a woman and to my books, what does my =93polygamy=94 orchestrate for me in my family life? Am I not like the man invited by his chi and his father-in-law to work on their farms on the same day at the same time? If I ignore my father-in-law and decide to work on my chi=92s farm, my father-in-law would be mad with me and withdraw his daught= er (at least, as culturally permitted in the Igbo society in which I was born and raised). If I ignore my chi and decide to work on my father-in-law=92s farm, my chi would also be mad with me and take my life. So, my tragedy is located somewhere between the possible loss of a wife and the loss of my life. And, being a faithful husband (oh yes I am!) I don=92t want to lose m= y wife I swear, neither do I want to lose my life and leave her a widow! It is 2.00 am and I am in my study, working at the computer again, fighting back the hands of sleep that have been trying to shut my eyes for me. I hav= e to finish reading an article sent to me for assessment and feed in my repor= t on the e-page of an electronic journal. Deadlines are deadlines, especially for electronic gatekeepers. Moreover, I have to prove to the editor of the journal that scholars based in Africa as not as =93dead=94 as the world is = made to believe. So, I am here, not really in my study anymore, but in cyberspace, mutually hallucinating with other cyborgs (thanks to Mel Gibson for that idea). I don=92t know whether I am asleep or awake again, just as = I can=92t say whether I am really Here or There, whether I am real or unreal! Well, in my nowhereness, I see her on the screen of my laptop, first as a pop-up, then as an emoticon. She is snoring and her snores are angry words. A software now, she jumps out of the screen and gets installed on my mind the real computer. I am browsing my mind now, my laptop has vanished and my mind is saying to me =85 Are you real? Are you really here? Are you really unreal? OK, she is your art now, she that you cannot browse. She is the message now the medium , sh= e that cannot give you a deadline. Are you not just another brand of falsehood? Sometimes when she needs your attention, you have a book in your hand or you are sitting before a computer, and you must chase that idea through the paragraphs and pages of some fields of thought. Sometimes she i= s kept waiting in the bedroom, and you are trying to finish writing that article to beat a deadline. Sometimes the food kept for you on the dining table =96 because you could not join the family at mealtime =96 gets cold a= nd you have to eat it quietly like a dog, afraid to complain, so as not to start a war. After all, if you didn=92t want it cold, you should have come = to eat it warm! Books and books and books everywhere. Books on the shelves. Books on the floor. Books on the table. Books in cartons. Books sitting on books. Books inside books, to mark where you have to return to, after angrily going to find out what she wants you to come and see. Books in the study. Books in the bedroom. Books and books and more books arriving. You cannot provide more money for weekend shopping, for you say the pay is low, the tax is high, and you have children=92s fees to pay soon, but you can=92t remove yo= ur eyes from books. You buy more and more books and smuggle them into the house! Sometimes you claim you got the books for free, even before she accuses you with her eyes. You keep buying books, sometimes three or four copies of the same book. Some copies for yourself; some copies for your students to borrow and disfigure through photocopying or sheer carelessness. This conference and that seminar and those workshops =85 where you shop for ideas on how to stay away from her! Absentee husband, you nickname is Professor Awayness, for you are busy providing awareness away from her and the children. Sometimes a week. Sometimes two weeks. And when you are returning from this one, you are leaving for that one. Sometimes you trans-conference or trans-seminar, after all, what=92s the point coming hom= e to say you are leaving soon? And your way of thinking! Haven=92t you been hardened by all those crazy id= eas and tortured language that communicates them? So, what do we have here: a human who can really sleep when he is asleep, play when it is playtime, and do stupid things when fun demands it, without caring so much about what thi= s or that theory says? You are discussing a point with her. Just a little argument and you take off as if you are in one of those crazy listserv debates, quoting this book and that book you have read. You see; that=92s a symptom of the illness that I mentioned earlier! Can you similarly quote her, your wife? No, not all! Has she got quotable ideas? It is books that tell you what to do. It is books that are right enough decide a little exchange between a husband and a wife! Yes, she needs a husband, not necessarily an academic hero. But you think that being an academic hero counts much in satisfying those needs of hers. And that=92s one problem: who determines her needs: you, your books, or she= ? She wants you to include her in your scheme of things, if not the main programme of your life. And you are uncomfortable about this, very. You think your academic life and pursuit could be hindered, if not ruined, by your focus on a human wife or family. Didn=92t you even once whisper to yourself: a writer married is a writer marred? Another idea you picked from those crazy associates of yours, those apostles of aloneness! And now you have discovered another opportunity for keeping her lonely (or another opportunity has discovered you the ready tool!): the Internet, with all those blogs you must update, those emails you must read and respond to, those chats (sometimes three or four going on simultaneously), those skirmishes on listservs you must engage in, those downloads and uploads tha= t increase the weight of your mental luggage. So, has she not suddenly become a widow, an =93Internet widow,=94 as Clifford Stoll calls it in Silicon Sna= ke Oil? At the mention of the word =93widow=94, I wake up and I am right on my feet= . My wife opens the door of my study and walks in, fear written on her face. =93Why were you screaming?=94 =93Screaming? Did I scream?=94 =93Of course, you did! I came to find out what was wrong. And don=92t you t= hink it=92s time for you to come to the bedroom and lie down?=94 And, suddenly, there=92s an electricity outage. 4.00 am. Indeed, it is time= to go to bed. --=20 Obododimma Oha http://udude.wordpress.com/ Dept. of English University of Ibadan Nigeria & Fellow, Centre for Peace & Conflict Studies University of Ibadan Phone: +234 803 333 1330; +234 805 350 6604; +234 808 264 8060. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 06:57:16 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Nicholas Ruiz III Subject: put your theory where your praxis is Comments: To: nruiz@intertheory.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Greetings all! Happy Independence Day weekend! In the name of putting my theory where my praxis is - I am running for Congress in 2010, FL District 24...tell your friends and neighbors! http://intertheory.org/nriiiforcongress2010.html ...and an Independence Day gift: Bjork - Declare Independence http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=igOWR_-BXJU pax et lux, NRIII Nicholas Ruiz III, Ph.D NRIII for Congress 2010 http://intertheory.org/nriiiforcongress2010.html ____________________________________ Editor, Kritikos http://intertheory.org ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 07:54:28 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve russell Subject: Re: mourning & poetics MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Quietist poetry: I've never heard of the term. A whimper, I suppose, is mo= re nuanced than a shout, but some very good not so quiet poems have been po= ems of mourning. Consider Kaddish. Ginsberg isn't exaclty quiet. Nor is Syl= via Plath, or any of the confessional poets. Perhaps quietist poetry is a w= ay of whispering with a megaphone.=20 --- On Thu, 7/2/09, Lauren Russell wrote: > From: Lauren Russell > Subject: Re: mourning & poetics > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Thursday, July 2, 2009, 12:52 AM > What is quietist poetry?=A0 I'm really > curious; I've never heard the term. >=20 > I tend to think of fragmented poetry (and prose) as best > articulating grief.=A0 Have you ever read Kristin Prevallet's > I, Afterlife: Essay in Mourning Time?=A0 And part of what I > love about Alice Notley's work is that her poems have > engaged with grief in so many different ways.=A0 I can't > claim to have read the whole book (it's one of the books > one's not aloud to check out of the New York Public > Library), but the introduction to Patricia Rae's Modernism > and Mourning makes some interesting points about the > politics of grief and writing about grief. I found it > helpful alongside Ramazini, though I can't claim to have > read all of that, either. >=20 > Lauren Russell >=20 > Date:=A0 =A0 Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:12:15 -0600 > From:=A0 =A0 Scott Howard > Subject: mourning & poetics >=20 > Hi, Mary Jo, >=20 > Here are a few recommendations, re: mourning & > poetics. >=20 > 1. Inventions of Farewell, edited by Sandra Gilbert.=A0 > That's an anthology of elegies and elegiac poetics/poetry. >=20 > 2. Poetry of Mourning, by Jahan Ramazani.=A0 Scholarly > study. >=20 > 3. > Both of the above are v. good for twentieth-century > Anglo-American > poetry & poetics of loss, but neither really begins to > address > postmodern poetics.=A0 If you're interested, you could also > consider this > book chapter: "'The Brevities': Formal Mourning, > Transgression & > Postmodern American Elegies", in _The World in Time and > Space_ > (Talisman House, 2002), 122-46. >=20 > Best wishes, > Scott Howard >=20 > /// >=20 >=20 > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Mary Jo Malo > Date: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 10:52 am > Subject: mourning & poetics > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >=20 >=20 > > I've been sympathetically following the tragic death > of Emma Bernstein > >=A0 and wonder why "quietist" poetry (and prose, I > suppose) seem/s to > >=A0 better express grief. The one exception I've > discovered so far is Mary > >=A0 Jo Bang's "Elegy." Who else am I missing? > >=A0=20 > >=A0 Additionally, reflecting only slightly upon Ron > Silliman's > >=A0 post-avant/quietist dichotomy, I find the only way > for me to > >=A0 categorize poetry is via my own poor pedantic: > Poetry I Like vs. > >=A0 Poetry I Don't Like. Does > >=A0=A0 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all > posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/= welcome.html > =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 11:12:44 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Evan Kennedy Subject: seeking Bay Area poets MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'm soon moving to the Bay Area and would like to hear about the poetry community there (reading series, bookstores). I especially want to hear from poets in their 20s and poets who run small presses. Does anyone wish to shed some light for me? xoxo, Evan ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 11:58:42 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: jared schickling Subject: RECONFIGURATIONS call for work In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear All=2C Reconfigurations: A Journal for Poetics and Poetry / Literature and Culture is currently seeking submissions for its third issue.=20 In addition to the general call for work pasted below=2C we=92re seeking a gathering of statements / questions / perspectives on the current status of poetry book reviews and suggestions for how that genre could be re-imagined=2C re-invigorated=2C etc.=20 We're open to any number of ways this might be approached. Pieces about re= views=2C email conversations about reviews=2C unique reviews themselves=2C = reviews of reviews...we'd like to see it. Please feel free to forward as you wish=2C and to send your submissions on this topic to: jschickling@hotmail.com If you=92re interested but the August deadline listed below is too soon=2C please don't hesitate to contact. =20 All the best=2C Jared Schickling CALL FOR WORK: Volume Three Volume three of Reconfigurations seeks innovative works concerning immanence / imminence=97that is=2C the phenomena of emergence & becoming=2C appearance & disappearance=97across a wide range of signification: matters inherent or abiding=3B objects intentional or manifest=3B perceptions noetical or pataphysical=3B actions impending or close-at-hand=3B communities realized or indeterminate. Submissions: April thru August Publication: November=2C 2009 Electronic Submissions: showard@du.edu. Submissions should be attached as a single .doc=2C .rtf=2C or .txt file.=20 Visuals should be attached individually as .jpg=2C .gif or .bmp files. Please include the word =93submission=94 in the subject line of your message. _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live=99: Keep your life in sync.=20 http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=3DTXT_TAGLM_WL_BR_life_in_synch_062009= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 13:01:30 -0400 Reply-To: az421@FreeNet.Carleton.CA Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Rob McLennan Subject: Marcus McCann in 12 or 20 questions Ottawa poet Marcus McCann participates in the 12 or 20 questions series; http://robmclennan.blogspot.com/2009/07/12-or-20-questions-with-marcus-mccann.html other recent interviews include Forrest Gander & Tim Conley; forthcoming: Nino Ricci, Lisa Robertson & others; rob -- writer/editor/publisher ...STANZAS mag, above/ground press & Chaudiere Books (www.chaudierebooks.com) ...coord.,SPAN-O + ottawa small press fair ...14th poetry coll'n - gifts (Talon) ...2nd novel - missing persons www.abovegroundpress.blogspot.com * http://robmclennan.blogspot.com/ ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 11:14:36 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: amy king Subject: Celebrate the 4th on the 5th... Comments: To: new-poetry@wiz.cath.vt.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable July 5th - Buckminster Fuller Performance SUNDAY, JULY 5th2-4:30pm=20 4th-floor lobbyMuseum of Contemporary Art220 East Chicago Avenue DURATIONAL PERFORMANCEinstigated by Jennifer Karmin & Ira S. Murfin This=0Ais a performance of a transcript of the video Buckminster Fuller Mee= ts=0Athe Hippies in Golden Gate Park. You are invited to watch this=0Aperfo= rmance for as long or as briefly as you like. You are also invited=0Ato be = a performer in it. You may participate for as long or as briefly=0Aas you l= ike, and return as often as you wish. FINAL DAY OF EXHIBITBuckminster=0AFuller: Starting with the Universe is a f= ascinating mix of utopian=0Avision and organic pragmatism, combining models= , sketches, and other=0Aartifacts -- many on view for the first time -- rep= resent six decades=0Aof the artist's integrated approach to housing, transp= ortation,=0Acommunication, and cartography. The exhibition features numerou= s models=0Aof Fuller's projects including his famous geodesic dome. Fuller'= s=0Aextensive connections with Chicago are also highlighted through=0Aphoto= graphs and documents from his years spent living, teaching, and=0Aworking i= n the city. FOR MORE, including -- "Waiting 4 the Bus", "Series A: Mary Kasimor and Car= rie Hunter" on July 8th, "First Fridays at St. Paul's" and other items of i= ntrigue, hit: http://www.chicagopoetrycalendar.org/ "God is a verb, not a noun." =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 "Truth is a tendency."=0A=0A --Buckminster Fuller http://www.chicagopoetrycalendar.org/ =0A=0A _______ =0A =0AAmy's Alias =0Ahttp://amyking.org/=0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 14:39:02 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Dan Wilcox Subject: Poets in the Park, July 11: Mary Kathryn Jablonski & Randall Horton Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Poets in the Park 2009 Saturdays in July at the Robert Burns statue Washington Park, Albany at Henry Johnson Blvd. & Hudson Ave. July 11, 7PM Mary Kathryn Jablonski Randall Horton July 18, 7PM LisaAnn LoBasso Tom Nicotera July 25, 7PM Lori Desrosiers George Wallace Free! & open to the public (just like the park) Bring chairs, blankets, etc. to sit on Rain site: the Social Justice Center, 33 Central Ave. sponsored by the Poetry Motel Foundation & the Hudson Valley Writers Guild This project is made possible in part through COMMUNITY ART$GRANTS, a program funded through the State and Local Partnership Program of the New York State Council on the arts, a State agency and the Arts Center of the Capital Region. for information call 482-0262 ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 12:40:05 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Lauren Russell Subject: Re: mourning & poetics MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable It seems to me like a lot of Notley's work is about grief--starting with a = number of the poems in Mysteries of Small Houses, including "Towards a Defi= nition" and "The Person That You Were Will Be Replaced," the longer poem "F= rom the Beginning," which was published as a chapbook by Owl Press, and the= epic The Descent of Alette.=A0 Actually, every time I hear Notley read, I = hear grieving in her work. What's really remarkable is how many different w= ays she's found of engaging with it in her poems. Lauren Russell Date:=A0 =A0 Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:12:05 -0700 From:=A0 =A0 Mary Kasimor Subject: Re: mourning & poetics Lauren, Yes, the poem "White Phosphorus" is a beautiful poem about mourning= =3D for her brother. Is that the Alice Notley poem you were thinking about? * =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 14:10:04 -0600 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Scott Howard Subject: mourning & poetics In-Reply-To: <20786.48401.qm@web36106.mail.mud.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable * Quietist poetry =2E =2E =2E =3F Well=2C Quietism seems to have emerge= d in the seventeenth century as a form of religious mysticism=2C but the= term has occasionally been used to describe various works (philosophica= l=2C poetic=2C political) that advocate a middle way between ideology an= d indifference=2E Sir Thomas Browne (also 17th c=2E) was called a =27qu= ietist=27=2C but he was really more of a skeptical essayist (in the trad= =2E of Montaigne)=2E Rae Armantrout=27s recent work strikes me as quiet= ist in mood/tone=2E * Prevallet=27s Afterlife=3A Essay in Mourning Time is very good=2E The= literature on mourning and poetics is diverse and extensive=2E See Ram= azani=27s bibliography=2C for example=2E See also=3A Beyond Consolation= by Melissa Zeiger for a post-Freudian take on things=2E Ramazani=27s b= ook works well for the modernist paradigm=2C but to get beyond that fram= ework=2C one needs to reconfigure the whole notion of resistance=2E On = that note=2C see=3A =22=27The Brevities=27=3A Formal Mourning=2C Transgr= ession =26 Postmodern American Elegies=22=2C in =5FThe World in Time and= Space=5F (Talisman House=2C 2002)=2C 122-46=2C which covers a lot of gr= ound=2E * Fragments and grief/mourning=3F =2E =2E =2E Have you read Mallarme=27s= =22Pour un tombeau d=27Anatole=22=3F Paul Auster=27s translation (Nort= h Point=2C 1983) is great=2E A classic=2E /// ----- Original Message ----- From=3A Lauren Russell =3Clmrussell04=40YAHOO=2ECOM=3E Date=3A Thursday=2C July 2=2C 2009 11=3A07 am Subject=3A Re=3A mourning =26 poetics To=3A POETICS=40LISTSERV=2EBUFFALO=2EEDU =3E What is quietist poetry=3F=A0 I=27m really curious=3B I=27ve never h= eard the term=2E =3E = =3E I tend to think of fragmented poetry (and prose) as best articulati= ng = =3E grief=2E=A0 Have you ever read Kristin Prevallet=27s I=2C Afterlife=3A= Essay in = =3E Mourning Time=3F=A0 And part of what I love about Alice Notley=27s w= ork is = =3E that her poems have engaged with grief in so many different ways=2E=A0= I = =3E can=27t claim to have read the whole book (it=27s one of the books o= ne=27s = =3E not aloud to check out of the New York Public Library)=2C but the = =3E introduction to Patricia Rae=27s Modernism and Mourning makes some = =3E interesting points about the politics of grief and writing about = =3E grief=2E I found it helpful alongside Ramazini=2C though I can=27t c= laim to = =3E have read all of that=2C either=2E =3E = =3E Lauren Russell =3E = /// =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 17:44:32 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jefferson Davis Subject: Do Tell MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Do Tell, a new festival in Hendersonville, NC, will feature poets Thomas Meyer, Laura Hope-Gill, Sebastian Matthews, Thomas Rain Crowe, and myself. It will also feature a passel of storytellers, masters of Jack Tale, Cherokee lore, Lincoln apocrypha, myths of St.George and the dragon, and sundry other bits of hermetic hearsay. It all gets underway next Saturday, July 11th, at 11:00 am. If you're not from around here, Hendersonville is just a few miles south of Asheville, a cultural crossroads situated between the Blue Ridge and the Great Smokies in the mountains of Western North Carolina. It's well worth a visit - especially this time of year, when temperatures in the flatlands reach into the high nineties. Not to gloat, but our nights are still in the fifties, and the porch thermometer tells me it's 75 F at 5:30 post meridian. Check the website at http://dotellfestival.org for the full schedule and more information about the performers. And do come on up and see us! Jeff Davis ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 19:02:45 -0600 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jonathan Penton Subject: Unlikely's July 4th Issue is here! MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Thanks to the assistance of Luis Cuauhtemoc Berriozabal, Unlikely 2.0's 2009 July 4th Issue has arrived, featuring: Three Songs by David Rovics A Neon Film by Jack Feldstein An Interview with Aviva Chomsky on coal mining in Kentucky and Colombia, by Hans Bennett Walter Brasch on /People/'s 100 most beautiful people Sheila Samples on nuclear warfare Evelyn Pringle's detailed investigation into the FDA's treatment of antipsychotics "Constitutional Rubbish" by Joel S. Hirschhorn "Overpass:" A Creative Essay by Dean Kisling "Whatever Happened to the Man with the Familiar Face?" a Novella by Rion Amilcar Scott More Fiction by Tom Bradley, Robert Ciesla and Stephen Muret Photographs by Gabriela Anaya Valdepeña, Christopher Woods, and Chuck Taylor and Poetry by Amy King, Leonard J. Cirino, justin.barrett, Hosho McCreesh, Gene Keller, León De La Rosa, Chris D'Errico, Mark Kerstetter, Mark Cunningham, and Deidre Elizabeth Luis, Assistant Editor Gabriel Ricard, Film Editor Belinda Subraman, and Art Editor C. Derick Varn have assembled a varied, complex, in-depth and absurdist look at whatever it is we're doing in this country, or at least what Mexicans and Australians think we're doing, which is better. K. R. Copeland has topped it with a new logo, and I've contracted the H1N1 virus for research purposes. Check it out; we think you'll love it. -- Jonathan Penton http://www.unlikelystories.org/ ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 14:46:32 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: David Chirot Subject: Re: mourning & poetics In-Reply-To: <351257.60803.qm@web52406.mail.re2.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable When i first heard of quietest poetry i thought it meant the language and post language writers as they=92re so quiet & absent from everything happening off the page of their work (Ironically if not a =93lyric self=94 perhaps more like the lyric ego??---I don=92t know-though involvement with writer and words on page to the exclus= ion of the world in many ways beyond the immediate self=97seems to be a major p= art of both language and what siliman calls quietist poetry Actually there is a real Quietist Poetry, and a historical Roman Catholic heresy called Quietism, which is the practice and belief in attainting a state of perfection during life, a state which is sinless and is found through a passivity and contemplation in which the emptying of the mind and annihilation of the self make possible a perfect union with God. Quietism as a movement was very strong and widespread in Italy, Spain and France in the 17th Century and its influence has been found in writers who weren=92t directly Quietist yet share many of the beliefs and express them in their writings=97St Theresa of Avila and St John of the cross for example. There are also besides this 17th century existence of Quietist that had to be violently executed so to speak extracted from the main body of the Catholic Church=97other much earlier strains of a Quietist form which did influence and grow into the Christian Quietism. The earliest forms are along the lines of the Stoic Philosophy and later its Roman descendents, which is how it must have =93hooked up=94 with the Christian version. A Quietist in a Christian sense then and not necessarily be a Christian, bu= t is a Mystic, one who attains the union with God, or the Cloud of unknowing, the Spirit, and this occurs while the person is alive; it is no a heaven above but one here below=97that is one of the heretical aspects of it as we= ll as the idea that one may fuse with God in the manner of a personal individual contact as is the mystic experience, called Quietist or not. In Louis the XIV=92s time, many prominent persons became Quietist, so it wa= s under the protection of the king, and at the same time considered outlawed. A poet like Gerard Manley Hopkins of r example might be thought of as a Quietist and d also the poets whose work involves a deep fusing with Nature as an energy of (Inscape) spiritual power outside the human self before which that self must be sacrificed to break down the barriers between the human being and the Divine being. (In other words Quietism and Quietist poetry is transgressive, is about the attainment of non-self, which might be accept by Siliman after a fashion, yet the fusion with a Divine Spirit , something far greater than human being=97perhaps wd not be so much accepted.) Though of course it is pretty idiotic of me to pretend to speak for Mr Siliman! O I apologize if the speculation =93crosses the line.=94!--) I don=92t see much difference between siliman and a quietist of the kind he describes, which is quite different fro the heretical form of Quietism. (Robert Grenier might be considered a Quietist poet of the heretical kind--= ) and just wrote a piece re a poem by nada Gordon and one by James Levine being pretty much the same despite one of them being Flarf and the other supposedly conventional (each form, movement, style, establishes its own conventions and then has conventions to hear them discussed in the conventional manners--) re grief i think the greatest line i read in English is the last line of Faulkner=92s the wild palms "between grief and nothing i take grief." Edgar Allan Poe, whose bi-centenary it is, wrote an immense amount on grie= f throughout his work and it is really his main theme, subject--source of energy--"mournful and never ending remembrance' as he wrote-- "death looked gigantically down" a language of mourning and "working through it" in the sense of Freud=92s t= he work of mourning (which could also be thought of as the work of morning, in the way that Poe's morning on the Wissihican puns on Mourning on the Wissihican--) is Robert Smithson=92s work and writings with earthworks, in which the mourning for the destruction of landscapes and earlier earthworks such as Indian mounds--is "worked through" by bringing Earthworks art to collaborat= e with the landscape itself using technology and yes also the corporations responsible for the disasters--to work together to create a new landscape a= s it were "out of the shell of the old" as the Wobblies say-- the mourning of the earth and the Morning of Time--in conjunction --the mourning of the Goddess, Mother earth, the creation--and how to work with the earth in "working through it together' with the humans who have brought the mourning about-- Mohamed Choukri=92s great work For Bread Alone is a work of mourning re his brother, killed y their father --and at the same time a morning as the twenty year old illiterate Mohamed Choukri decides to learn to read and write and become a writer--in classical Arabic, too--very difficult for an educated person let alone an illiterate street person-- i know it is not poetry but then prose is often just as or more poetic than much poetry-so i=92d include the novel by the great Catalan writer Merce Rodorede, Camellia Street Whitman wrote many mourning poems including the famous one for Lincoln-- and Robert Frost's Death of a Hired hand though dirge like is certainly a mourning expressed throughout without intruding-- Shakespeare has many a fine farewell in his poetry and plays-- mourning and grief--and the ancient Greek dramas and poetry have some of th= e greatest-- in the western languages that have read "At five o'clock in the afternoon" the famous Lorca poem re a bullfighter killed in the ring-- (a lot of Dylan Thomas' poems are the refusal to mourn, which is paradoxically form of mourning----"Do not go gentle into that good night=92, =93Refusal to mourn the death by fire of child in London=94 etc=97 One moment of grief I recall very specifically is the last few lines of Ton= i Morrison=92s Sula=97 And the horrific killing of the children in Jude obscure by their own parents=97 And the greatest one I know =93Death letter=94 by Son House=97you can find him singing it in various ve= rsions on you tube It=92s very good to hear from you! And =93glory Fourth=94-! --david On Fri, Jul 3, 2009 at 7:54 AM, steve russell wrote= : > Quietist poetry: I've never heard of the term. A whimper, I suppose, is > more nuanced than a shout, but some very good not so quiet poems have bee= n > poems of mourning. Consider Kaddish. Ginsberg isn't exaclty quiet. Nor is > Sylvia Plath, or any of the confessional poets. Perhaps quietist poetry i= s a > way of whispering with a megaphone. > > --- On Thu, 7/2/09, Lauren Russell wrote: > > > From: Lauren Russell > > Subject: Re: mourning & poetics > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > Date: Thursday, July 2, 2009, 12:52 AM > > What is quietist poetry? I'm really > > curious; I've never heard the term. > > > > I tend to think of fragmented poetry (and prose) as best > > articulating grief. Have you ever read Kristin Prevallet's > > I, Afterlife: Essay in Mourning Time? And part of what I > > love about Alice Notley's work is that her poems have > > engaged with grief in so many different ways. I can't > > claim to have read the whole book (it's one of the books > > one's not aloud to check out of the New York Public > > Library), but the introduction to Patricia Rae's Modernism > > and Mourning makes some interesting points about the > > politics of grief and writing about grief. I found it > > helpful alongside Ramazini, though I can't claim to have > > read all of that, either. > > > > Lauren Russell > > > > Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:12:15 -0600 > > From: Scott Howard > > Subject: mourning & poetics > > > > Hi, Mary Jo, > > > > Here are a few recommendations, re: mourning & > > poetics. > > > > 1. Inventions of Farewell, edited by Sandra Gilbert. > > That's an anthology of elegies and elegiac poetics/poetry. > > > > 2. Poetry of Mourning, by Jahan Ramazani. Scholarly > > study. > > > > 3. > > Both of the above are v. good for twentieth-century > > Anglo-American > > poetry & poetics of loss, but neither really begins to > > address > > postmodern poetics. If you're interested, you could also > > consider this > > book chapter: "'The Brevities': Formal Mourning, > > Transgression & > > Postmodern American Elegies", in _The World in Time and > > Space_ > > (Talisman House, 2002), 122-46. > > > > Best wishes, > > Scott Howard > > > > /// > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Mary Jo Malo > > Date: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 10:52 am > > Subject: mourning & poetics > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > > > > > > I've been sympathetically following the tragic death > > of Emma Bernstein > > > and wonder why "quietist" poetry (and prose, I > > suppose) seem/s to > > > better express grief. The one exception I've > > discovered so far is Mary > > > Jo Bang's "Elegy." Who else am I missing? > > > > > > Additionally, reflecting only slightly upon Ron > > Silliman's > > > post-avant/quietist dichotomy, I find the only way > > for me to > > > categorize poetry is via my own poor pedantic: > > Poetry I Like vs. > > > Poetry I Don't Like. Does > > > > > > > > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all > > posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 21:04:06 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Ruth Lepson Subject: July 25 & 26 Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Hi, all, If you=B9re around NYC Sat July 25 come join us at Cornelia St Cafe at 6 to hear my jazz/poetry group, low road. We are Noah Preminger, one of the hottest young musicians in the country, on sax; Eric Lane, an eclectic keyboard player who does hip-hop, afro beat and jazz; and me. On Sun, July 26 at 3, Tim Peterson, Joel Sloman, Kate Broad and I are reading at Unnamable Books in Park Slope, Brooklyn. (See website for new location.) If weather permits, we=B9ll be in the garden. Hope to see you. Ruth Lepson =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 5 Jul 2009 14:05:45 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Charles Bernstein Subject: Zolf at EPC & my early audio works MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit new at EPC: Rachel Zolf author page http://epc.buffalo.edu/authors/zolf/ new at PennSound: My early recorded audiotape works, 1975-1976 http://writing.upenn.edu/pennsound/x/Bernstein-1975-76.html ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 4 Jul 2009 11:52:48 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Murat Nemet-Nejat Subject: Re: mourning & poetics In-Reply-To: <741378.57313.qm@web36106.mail.mud.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lauren, Yes, A lot of Mysterios of Old Houses is about mourning and recovery from it. Two people die in it. As far as I know Poe also uses the term "quietist); but the intensely negative term "quietist" hads come to mean in our day is, In my view, utterly Ron Silliman's invention. Ciao, Murat On Fri, Jul 3, 2009 at 3:40 PM, Lauren Russell wrote: > It seems to me like a lot of Notley's work is about grief--starting with a > number of the poems in Mysteries of Small Houses, including "Towards a > Definition" and "The Person That You Were Will Be Replaced," the longer poem > "From the Beginning," which was published as a chapbook by Owl Press, and > the epic The Descent of Alette. Actually, every time I hear Notley read, I > hear grieving in her work. What's really remarkable is how many different > ways she's found of engaging with it in her poems. > > Lauren Russell > > > Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:12:05 -0700 > From: Mary Kasimor > Subject: Re: mourning & poetics > > Lauren, Yes, the poem "White Phosphorus" is a beautiful poem about > mourning= > for her brother. Is that the Alice Notley poem you were thinking about? > > > > * > > > > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 4 Jul 2009 10:55:36 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Maria Damon Subject: Re: mourning & poetics In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit thank you for pointing this out. ron silliman's term (the school of quietude or something like that) seems to take no account of this earlier usage, so i find it very misleading; i wish he'd use something else, if he has to use anything at all. i find terms like this and also bernstein's "official verse culture" somewhat overly general," though at least the latter addresses institutional processes rather than poetry "itself," if there is such a thing. on the topic of mourning: has someone already mentioned Peter Sacks's work on elegy? Scott Howard wrote: > * Quietist poetry . . . ? Well, Quietism seems to have emerged in the seventeenth century as a form of religious mysticism, but the term has occasionally been used to describe various works (philosophical, poetic, political) that advocate a middle way between ideology and indifference. Sir Thomas Browne (also 17th c.) was called a 'quietist', but he was really more of a skeptical essayist (in the trad. of Montaigne). Rae Armantrout's recent work strikes me as quietist in mood/tone. > > * Prevallet's Afterlife: Essay in Mourning Time is very good. The literature on mourning and poetics is diverse and extensive. See Ramazani's bibliography, for example. See also: Beyond Consolation by Melissa Zeiger for a post-Freudian take on things. Ramazani's book works well for the modernist paradigm, but to get beyond that framework, one needs to reconfigure the whole notion of resistance. On that note, see: "'The Brevities': Formal Mourning, Transgression & Postmodern American Elegies", in _The World in Time and Space_ (Talisman House, 2002), 122-46, which covers a lot of ground. > > * Fragments and grief/mourning? . . . Have you read Mallarme's "Pour un tombeau d'Anatole"? Paul Auster's translation (North Point, 1983) is great. A classic. > > /// > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Lauren Russell > Date: Thursday, July 2, 2009 11:07 am > Subject: Re: mourning & poetics > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > > >> What is quietist poetry? I'm really curious; I've never heard the term. >> >> I tend to think of fragmented poetry (and prose) as best articulating >> grief. Have you ever read Kristin Prevallet's I, Afterlife: Essay in >> Mourning Time? And part of what I love about Alice Notley's work is >> that her poems have engaged with grief in so many different ways. I >> can't claim to have read the whole book (it's one of the books one's >> not aloud to check out of the New York Public Library), but the >> introduction to Patricia Rae's Modernism and Mourning makes some >> interesting points about the politics of grief and writing about >> grief. I found it helpful alongside Ramazini, though I can't claim to >> have read all of that, either. >> >> Lauren Russell >> >> > /// > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 4 Jul 2009 22:21:26 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Lauren Russell Subject: Re: mourning & poetics MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thanks for the recommendations, Scott.=A0 I'll keep an eye out for the Mall= arme.=A0 And thanks for the definition and long history of "quietism," Davi= d, though I'm still not really sure what it is.=A0 Maybe one has to follow = Siliman's blog to understand the current usage? What happened to the original poster of this query?=A0 I'd be interested in= her thoughts on the matter. Lauren=A0 Russell =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 5 Jul 2009 03:09:57 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Andrew Lundwall Subject: scantily clad update! Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain new titles: Interests by Nada Gordon The Empire by Mark Leidner Last New Death by Rob MacDonald The Sin Sonnets (A Redouble) by Amy Newman All My Poems by Nate Pritts The Execution of Little Maude by Jeffrey Skinner Take 11 Wolf Teeth and Call Me in the Morning by Abraham Smith A Series of Ad Hoc Permutations, or RUBY Love-Songs by Joshua Ware read these & other SCP e-chaps at http://scantilycladpress.blogspot.c= om =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 5 Jul 2009 11:22:19 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Aryanil Mukherjee Organization: KAURAB Subject: Kaurab International Poetry Reading Series:: Event #4 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear All 12th July is Chilean myth Pablo Neruda's 105th birthday. While more is perhaps yet to be excavated from Neruda's ignored and forgotten work, his known work has become mythical over the years. And sadly, like all mythical walls, it often stands in the way to language-wide cross-sections of innovative and explorative poets, wildflower and mushroom collectors of all linguistic sorts, in all of Ibero-America today. Kaurab International Poetry Reading Series proudly presents an exclusive Chilean reading in Kolkata, India on the evening of July 12, 2009. The main reader of the evening will be Madrid based young Chilean poet Violeta Medina. Subhro Bandopadhyay, a polyglotic young Bengali poet who writes simultaneously in Bangla and Espanol and lives in both Spain and India, will introduce the poet. The event is organized by Santanu Bandopadhyay, on behalf of Kaurab. English Announcement - http://www.kaurab.com/kabita_camp/kaurabshaal/violeta-reading.pdf Bangla Announcement - http://www.kaurab.com/kabita_camp/kaurabshaal/ A documentary film on forgotten Chilean poetic genious Gonzalo Rojas made by Violeta Media will also be screened that evening. Space is limited, but we would still like to extend an invitation to everyone staying/living in Kolkata on 12th July, 2009. Aryanil Mukherjee KAURAB www.kaurab.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 5 Jul 2009 08:48:23 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve russell Subject: Re: mourning & poetics MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable beautiful essay, David. In D.C., mourning goes public with memorials to tee= ns gunned down as a result of drug violence. Around a tree or a street lamp= , photos, diary entries, notes from the bereaved, and other assorted moment= oes. --- On Fri, 7/3/09, David Chirot wrote: > From: David Chirot > Subject: Re: mourning & poetics > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Friday, July 3, 2009, 5:46 PM > When i first heard of quietest poetry > i thought it meant the language and > post language writers as they=E2=80=99re so quiet &=C2=A0 > absent from everything > happening off the page of their work >=20 > (Ironically if not a =E2=80=9Clyric self=E2=80=9D perhaps more like the > lyric ego??---I > don=E2=80=99t know-though involvement with writer and words on > page to the exclusion > of the world in many ways beyond the immediate self=E2=80=94seems > to be a major part > of both language and what siliman calls quietist poetry >=20 >=20 >=20 > Actually there is a real Quietist Poetry, and a historical > Roman Catholic > heresy called Quietism, which is the practice and belief in > attainting a > state of perfection during life, a state which is sinless > and is found > through a passivity and contemplation in which the emptying > of the mind and > annihilation of the self make possible a perfect union with > God.=C2=A0 Quietism > as a movement was very strong and widespread in Italy, > Spain and France in > the 17th Century and its influence has been found in > writers who weren=E2=80=99t > directly Quietist yet share many of the beliefs and express > them in their > writings=E2=80=94St Theresa of Avila and St John of the cross for > example. >=20 >=20 >=20 > There are also besides this 17th century existence of > Quietist that had to > be violently executed so to speak extracted from the main > body of the > Catholic Church=E2=80=94other much earlier strains of a Quietist > form which did > influence and grow into the Christian Quietism.=C2=A0 The > earliest forms are > along the lines of the Stoic Philosophy and later its Roman > descendents, > which is how it must have =E2=80=9Chooked up=E2=80=9D with the > Christian version. >=20 >=20 >=20 > A Quietist in a Christian sense then and not necessarily be > a Christian, but > is a Mystic, one who attains the union with God, or the > Cloud of unknowing, > the Spirit, and this occurs while the person is alive; it > is no a heaven > above but one here below=E2=80=94that is one of the heretical > aspects of it as well > as the idea that one may fuse with God in the manner of a > personal > individual contact as is the mystic experience, called > Quietist or not. >=20 >=20 >=20 > In Louis the XIV=E2=80=99s time, many prominent persons became > Quietist, so it was > under the protection of the king, and at the same time > considered outlawed. >=20 >=20 >=20 > A poet like Gerard Manley Hopkins of r example might be > thought of as a > Quietist and d also the poets whose work involves a deep > fusing with Nature > as an energy of (Inscape) spiritual power outside the human > self before > which that self must be sacrificed to break down the > barriers between the > human being and the Divine being. >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > (In other words Quietism and Quietist poetry is > transgressive, is about the > attainment of non-self, which might be accept by Siliman > after a fashion, > yet the fusion with a Divine Spirit , something far greater > than human > being=E2=80=94perhaps wd not be so much accepted.)=C2=A0 Though > of course it is pretty > idiotic of me to pretend to speak for Mr Siliman! O I > apologize if the > speculation =E2=80=9Ccrosses the line.=E2=80=9D!--) >=20 >=20 > I don=E2=80=99t see much difference between siliman and a > quietist of the kind he > describes, which is quite different fro the heretical form > of Quietism. > (Robert Grenier might be considered a Quietist poet of the > heretical kind--) >=20 >=20 > and just wrote a piece re a poem by nada Gordon and one by > James Levine > being pretty much the same despite one of them being Flarf > and the other > supposedly conventional >=20 > (each form, movement, style, establishes its own > conventions and then has > conventions to hear them discussed in the conventional > manners--) >=20 > re grief i think the greatest line i read in English is the > last line of > Faulkner=E2=80=99s the wild palms > "between grief and nothing i take grief." >=20 > Edgar Allan Poe, whose bi-centenary it is,=C2=A0 wrote an > immense amount on grief > throughout his work and it is really his main theme, > subject--source of > energy--"mournful and never ending remembrance' as he > wrote-- > "death looked gigantically down" >=20 > a language of mourning and "working through it" in the > sense of Freud=E2=80=99s the > work of mourning (which could also be thought of as the > work of morning, in > the way that Poe's morning on the Wissihican puns on > Mourning on the > Wissihican--) > is Robert Smithson=E2=80=99s work and writings with earthworks, > in which the > mourning for the destruction of landscapes and earlier > earthworks such as > Indian mounds--is "worked through" by bringing Earthworks > art to collaborate > with the landscape itself using technology and yes also the > corporations > responsible for the disasters--to work together to create a > new landscape as > it were "out of the shell of the old" as the Wobblies > say-- >=20 > the mourning of the earth and the Morning of Time--in > conjunction --the > mourning of the Goddess, Mother earth, the creation--and > how to work with > the earth in "working through it together' with the humans > who have brought > the mourning about-- >=20 > Mohamed Choukri=E2=80=99s great work For Bread Alone is a work of > mourning re his > brother, killed y their father --and at the same time a > morning as the > twenty year old illiterate Mohamed Choukri decides to learn > to read and > write and become a writer--in classical Arabic, too--very > difficult for an > educated person let alone an illiterate street person-- > i know it is not poetry but then prose is often just as or > more poetic than > much poetry-so i=E2=80=99d include the novel by the great Catalan > writer Merce > Rodorede, Camellia Street >=20 > Whitman wrote many mourning poems including the famous one > for Lincoln-- > and Robert Frost's Death of a Hired hand though dirge like > is certainly a > mourning expressed throughout without intruding-- > Shakespeare has many a fine farewell in his poetry and > plays-- > mourning and grief--and the ancient Greek dramas and poetry > have some of the > greatest-- > in the western languages that have read >=20 > "At five o'clock in the afternoon" the famous Lorca poem re > a bullfighter > killed in the ring-- >=20 > (a lot of Dylan Thomas' poems are the refusal to mourn, > which is > paradoxically form of mourning----"Do not go gentle into > that good > night=E2=80=99,=C2=A0 =E2=80=9CRefusal > to mourn the death by fire of child in London=E2=80=9D etc=E2=80=94 >=20 >=20 >=20 > One moment of grief I recall very specifically is the last > few lines of Toni > Morrison=E2=80=99s Sula=E2=80=94 >=20 >=20 >=20 > And the horrific killing of the children in Jude obscure by > their own > parents=E2=80=94 >=20 >=20 >=20 > And the greatest one I know >=20 > =E2=80=9CDeath letter=E2=80=9D by Son House=E2=80=94you can find him sing= ing > it in various versions > on you tube >=20 > It=E2=80=99s very good to hear from you! >=20 > And =E2=80=9Cglory Fourth=E2=80=9D-! >=20 > --david > On Fri, Jul 3, 2009 at 7:54 AM, steve russell wro= te: >=20 > >=C2=A0 Quietist poetry: I've never heard of the term. A > whimper, I suppose, is > > more nuanced than a shout, but some very good not so > quiet poems have been > > poems of mourning. Consider Kaddish. Ginsberg isn't > exaclty quiet. Nor is > > Sylvia Plath, or any of the confessional poets. > Perhaps quietist poetry is a > > way of whispering with a megaphone. > > > > --- On Thu, 7/2/09, Lauren Russell > wrote: > > > > > From: Lauren Russell > > > Subject: Re: mourning & poetics > > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > > Date: Thursday, July 2, 2009, 12:52 AM > > > What is quietist poetry?=C2=A0 I'm really > > > curious; I've never heard the term. > > > > > > I tend to think of fragmented poetry (and prose) > as best > > > articulating grief.=C2=A0 Have you ever read > Kristin Prevallet's > > > I, Afterlife: Essay in Mourning Time?=C2=A0 And > part of what I > > > love about Alice Notley's work is that her poems > have > > > engaged with grief in so many different > ways.=C2=A0 I can't > > > claim to have read the whole book (it's one of > the books > > > one's not aloud to check out of the New York > Public > > > Library), but the introduction to Patricia Rae's > Modernism > > > and Mourning makes some interesting points about > the > > > politics of grief and writing about grief. I > found it > > > helpful alongside Ramazini, though I can't claim > to have > > > read all of that, either. > > > > > > Lauren Russell > > > > > > Date:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:12:15 > -0600 > > > From:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Scott Howard > > > Subject: mourning & poetics > > > > > > Hi, Mary Jo, > > > > > > Here are a few recommendations, re: mourning > & > > > poetics. > > > > > > 1. Inventions of Farewell, edited by Sandra > Gilbert. > > > That's an anthology of elegies and elegiac > poetics/poetry. > > > > > > 2. Poetry of Mourning, by Jahan Ramazani.=C2=A0 > Scholarly > > > study. > > > > > > 3. > > > Both of the above are v. good for > twentieth-century > > > Anglo-American > > > poetry & poetics of loss, but neither really > begins to > > > address > > > postmodern poetics.=C2=A0 If you're interested, > you could also > > > consider this > > > book chapter: "'The Brevities': Formal Mourning, > > > Transgression & > > > Postmodern American Elegies", in _The World in > Time and > > > Space_ > > > (Talisman House, 2002), 122-46. > > > > > > Best wishes, > > > Scott Howard > > > > > > /// > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: Mary Jo Malo > > > Date: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 10:52 am > > > Subject: mourning & poetics > > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > > > > > > > > > I've been sympathetically following the > tragic death > > > of Emma Bernstein > > > >=C2=A0 and wonder why "quietist" poetry (and > prose, I > > > suppose) seem/s to > > > >=C2=A0 better express grief. The one > exception I've > > > discovered so far is Mary > > > >=C2=A0 Jo Bang's "Elegy." Who else am I > missing? > > > > > > > >=C2=A0 Additionally, reflecting only slightly > upon Ron > > > Silliman's > > > >=C2=A0 post-avant/quietist dichotomy, I find > the only way > > > for me to > > > >=C2=A0 categorize poetry is via my own poor > pedantic: > > > Poetry I Like vs. > > > >=C2=A0 Poetry I Don't Like. Does > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not > accept all > > > posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: > > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept > all posts. Check guidelines > > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all > posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/= welcome.html > =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 4 Jul 2009 17:33:04 +0000 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Mark Prejsnar Subject: Re: mourning & poetics Comments: cc: David Chirot In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =20 it seems appropriate, even necessary, to respond to this coincidence:=20=20 announcing, for all those who will be in or near north Georgia next weekend= , a poetry event that makes clear the distinction between quietIST and qu= ietNESS ... it's the latest in the bi-monthly series of performance events, Language Ha= rm, perpetrated by the Atlanta Poets Group; and this month there is (or ar= e) a dual theme (or dual themes): quietness / economic downturn Friday, July 10 at: Eyedrum 290 Martin Luther King Jr. Drive Atlanta 8:00 pm $5 free for Eyedrum members for directions to Eyedrum: http://eyedrum.org/ for further disruptive adventures of the APG: http://atlantapoetsgroup.blogspot.com/ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ be there or be mainstream! --mark prejsnar =20 =20 "Whenthey say nonsense, it's usually an accusation." =20 --Randy Prunty =20 =20 -------------- Original message from David Chirot = : -------------- > When i first heard of quietest poetry i thought it meant the language and > post language writers as they=E2=80=99re so quiet & absent from everythi= ng > happening off the page of their work >=20 > (Ironically if not a =E2=80=9Clyric self=E2=80=9D perhaps more like the l= yric ego??---I > don=E2=80=99t know-though involvement with writer and words on page to th= e exclusion > of the world in many ways beyond the immediate self=E2=80=94seems to be a= major part > of both language and what siliman calls quietist poetry >=20 >=20 >=20 > Actually there is a real Quietist Poetry, and a historical Roman Catholic > heresy called Quietism, which is the practice and belief in attainting a > state of perfection during life, a state which is sinless and is found > through a passivity and contemplation in which the emptying of the mind a= nd > annihilation of the self make possible a perfect union with God. Quietis= m > as a movement was very strong and widespread in Italy, Spain and France i= n > the 17th Century and its influence has been found in writers who weren=E2= =80=99t > directly Quietist yet share many of the beliefs and express them in their > writings=E2=80=94St Theresa of Avila and St John of the cross for example= . >=20 >=20 >=20 > There are also besides this 17th century existence of Quietist that had t= o > be violently executed so to speak extracted from the main body of the > Catholic Church=E2=80=94other much earlier strains of a Quietist form whi= ch did > influence and grow into the Christian Quietism. The earliest forms are > along the lines of the Stoic Philosophy and later its Roman descendents, > which is how it must have =E2=80=9Chooked up=E2=80=9D with the Christian = version. >=20 >=20 >=20 > A Quietist in a Christian sense then and not necessarily be a Christian, = but > is a Mystic, one who attains the union with God, or the Cloud of unknowin= g, > the Spirit, and this occurs while the person is alive; it is no a heaven > above but one here below=E2=80=94that is one of the heretical aspects of = it as well > as the idea that one may fuse with God in the manner of a personal > individual contact as is the mystic experience, called Quietist or not. >=20 >=20 >=20 > In Louis the XIV=E2=80=99s time, many prominent persons became Quietist, = so it was > under the protection of the king, and at the same time considered outlawe= d. >=20 >=20 >=20 > A poet like Gerard Manley Hopkins of r example might be thought of as a > Quietist and d also the poets whose work involves a deep fusing with Natu= re > as an energy of (Inscape) spiritual power outside the human self before > which that self must be sacrificed to break down the barriers between the > human being and the Divine being. >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > (In other words Quietism and Quietist poetry is transgressive, is about t= he > attainment of non-self, which might be accept by Siliman after a fashion, > yet the fusion with a Divine Spirit , something far greater than human > being=E2=80=94perhaps wd not be so much accepted.) Though of course it i= s pretty > idiotic of me to pretend to speak for Mr Siliman! O I apologize if the > speculation =E2=80=9Ccrosses the line.=E2=80=9D!--) >=20 >=20 > I don=E2=80=99t see much difference between siliman and a quietist of the= kind he > describes, which is quite different fro the heretical form of Quietism. > (Robert Grenier might be considered a Quietist poet of the heretical kind= --) >=20 >=20 > and just wrote a piece re a poem by nada Gordon and one by James Levine > being pretty much the same despite one of them being Flarf and the other > supposedly conventional >=20 > (each form, movement, style, establishes its own conventions and then has > conventions to hear them discussed in the conventional manners--) >=20 > re grief i think the greatest line i read in English is the last line of > Faulkner=E2=80=99s the wild palms > "between grief and nothing i take grief." >=20 > Edgar Allan Poe, whose bi-centenary it is, wrote an immense amount on gr= ief > throughout his work and it is really his main theme, subject--source of > energy--"mournful and never ending remembrance' as he wrote-- > "death looked gigantically down" >=20 > a language of mourning and "working through it" in the sense of Freud=E2= =80=99s the > work of mourning (which could also be thought of as the work of morning, = in > the way that Poe's morning on the Wissihican puns on Mourning on the > Wissihican--) > is Robert Smithson=E2=80=99s work and writings with earthworks, in which = the > mourning for the destruction of landscapes and earlier earthworks such as > Indian mounds--is "worked through" by bringing Earthworks art to collabor= ate > with the landscape itself using technology and yes also the corporations > responsible for the disasters--to work together to create a new landscape= as > it were "out of the shell of the old" as the Wobblies say-- >=20 > the mourning of the earth and the Morning of Time--in conjunction --the > mourning of the Goddess, Mother earth, the creation--and how to work with > the earth in "working through it together' with the humans who have broug= ht > the mourning about-- >=20 > Mohamed Choukri=E2=80=99s great work For Bread Alone is a work of mournin= g re his > brother, killed y their father --and at the same time a morning as the > twenty year old illiterate Mohamed Choukri decides to learn to read and > write and become a writer--in classical Arabic, too--very difficult for a= n > educated person let alone an illiterate street person-- > i know it is not poetry but then prose is often just as or more poetic th= an > much poetry-so i=E2=80=99d include the novel by the great Catalan writer = Merce > Rodorede, Camellia Street >=20 > Whitman wrote many mourning poems including the famous one for Lincoln-- > and Robert Frost's Death of a Hired hand though dirge like is certainly a > mourning expressed throughout without intruding-- > Shakespeare has many a fine farewell in his poetry and plays-- > mourning and grief--and the ancient Greek dramas and poetry have some of = the > greatest-- > in the western languages that have read >=20 > "At five o'clock in the afternoon" the famous Lorca poem re a bullfighter > killed in the ring-- >=20 > (a lot of Dylan Thomas' poems are the refusal to mourn, which is > paradoxically form of mourning----"Do not go gentle into that good > night=E2=80=99, =E2=80=9CRefusal > to mourn the death by fire of child in London=E2=80=9D etc=E2=80=94 >=20 >=20 >=20 > One moment of grief I recall very specifically is the last few lines of T= oni > Morrison=E2=80=99s Sula=E2=80=94 >=20 >=20 >=20 > And the horrific killing of the children in Jude obscure by their own > parents=E2=80=94 >=20 >=20 >=20 > And the greatest one I know >=20 > =E2=80=9CDeath letter=E2=80=9D by Son House=E2=80=94you can find him sing= ing it in various versions > on you tube >=20 > It=E2=80=99s very good to hear from you! >=20 > And =E2=80=9Cglory Fourth=E2=80=9D-! >=20 > --david > On Fri, Jul 3, 2009 at 7:54 AM, steve russell=20 wrote: >=20 > > Quietist poetry: I've never heard of the term. A whimper, I suppose, i= s > > more nuanced than a shout, but some very good not so quiet poems have b= een > > poems of mourning. Consider Kaddish. Ginsberg isn't exaclty quiet. Nor = is > > Sylvia Plath, or any of the confessional poets. Perhaps quietist poetry= is a > > way of whispering with a megaphone. > > > > --- On Thu, 7/2/09, Lauren Russell wrote: > > > > > From: Lauren Russell=20 > > > Subject: Re: mourning & poetics > > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > > Date: Thursday, July 2, 2009, 12:52 AM > > > What is quietist poetry? I'm really > > > curious; I've never heard the term. > > > > > > I tend to think of fragmented poetry (and prose) as best > > > articulating grief. Have you ever read Kristin Prevallet's > > > I, Afterlife: Essay in Mourning Time? And part of what I > > > love about Alice Notley's work is that her poems have > > > engaged with grief in so many different ways. I can't > > > claim to have read the whole book (it's one of the books > > > one's not aloud to check out of the New York Public > > > Library), but the introduction to Patricia Rae's Modernism > > > and Mourning makes some interesting points about the > > > politics of grief and writing about grief. I found it > > > helpful alongside Ramazini, though I can't claim to have > > > read all of that, either. > > > > > > Lauren Russell > > > > > > Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:12:15 -0600 > > > From: Scott Howard=20 > > > Subject: mourning & poetics > > > > > > Hi, Mary Jo, > > > > > > Here are a few recommendations, re: mourning & > > > poetics. > > > > > > 1. Inventions of Farewell, edited by Sandra Gilbert. > > > That's an anthology of elegies and elegiac poetics/poetry. > > > > > > 2. Poetry of Mourning, by Jahan Ramazani. Scholarly > > > study. > > > > > > 3. > > > Both of the above are v. good for twentieth-century > > > Anglo-American > > > poetry & poetics of loss, but neither really begins to > > > address > > > postmodern poetics. If you're interested, you could also > > > consider this > > > book chapter: "'The Brevities': Formal Mourning, > > > Transgression & > > > Postmodern American Elegies", in _The World in Time and > > > Space_ > > > (Talisman House, 2002), 122-46. > > > > > > Best wishes, > > > Scott Howard > > > > > > /// > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: Mary Jo Malo=20 > > > Date: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 10:52 am > > > Subject: mourning & poetics > > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > > > > > > > > > I've been sympathetically following the tragic death > > > of Emma Bernstein > > > > and wonder why "quietist" poetry (and prose, I > > > suppose) seem/s to > > > > better express grief. The one exception I've > > > discovered so far is Mary > > > > Jo Bang's "Elegy." Who else am I missing? > > > > > > > > Additionally, reflecting only slightly upon Ron > > > Silliman's > > > > post-avant/quietist dichotomy, I find the only way > > > for me to > > > > categorize poetry is via my own poor pedantic: > > > Poetry I Like vs. > > > > Poetry I Don't Like. Does > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all > > > posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: > > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidel= ines > > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es &=20 > sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 5 Jul 2009 12:41:01 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jim Andrews Subject: spiritual materialism MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit it is commonly observed that a great deal of contemporary art/writing involves a double sense of 'the material'. the term is understood to refer not only to the subject matter (the 'standard' understanding in writing) but also the matter of the media in the piece, the material embodiment of the piece. it's also commonly observed that the latter awareness of and approach to composition not solely by ideation, meditation on the subject matter, but also through operation on the material embodiment, has come to be much more widely understood as a part of reading than it was a generation ago. when we encounter work that does not follow the grammars and approaches traditionally associated with work, we inquire into the methods of composition, the approach to materiality, and look for relations between those methods and approaches and the subject matter, or look for the subject matter in the light of those things. and so read differently, thereby. and in this way, we now read some literary work in ways that are closer to how we approach a great deal of visual art. but what i want to get at is something that isn't so commonly observed, at the moment, but may be in the next generation. and that's the relation of awareness of the materiality of writing/art to our ideas of who and what we are. that's erm awkwardly stated. what i'm trying to get at is this. the whole emphasis on materiality is involved in a larger movement to explore how things like ideation, imagination, the spiritual, beauty, truth, goodness, justice--all our ideals and things normally associated with the immaterial--operate in the material world. in this sense, we might say that the whole contemporary awareness of materiality in art is part of a larger ah spiritual materialism. i googled that term, after it occurred to me, and i assure you i'm using it in a different sense than chögyam trungpa, who uses it "to describe mistakes spiritual seekers commit which turn the pursuit of spiritualism into an ego building and confusion creating endeavor" (wikipedia). instead, i'm refering to a relatively common sort of philosophy in which the material substrate of ideation and even the spiritual is affirmed and its relations with even the flightiest of fancies are explored. not to denigrate or dismiss things like spirituality but to explore how they operate materially. perhaps more evidently, now, this is also related to philosophies of mind in which the materiality of thought itself is affirmed--as a chemical and informational process, however emergent--and the brain and the mind that emerge from its processes are conceived as fully embodied in the material. so that the idea of being able to create thinking machines (however unlike us) becomes a real possibility. and we are conceptualized as nature's (near?) ultimate machines. and machines are conceptualized not as the simple things we once thought they must be but as often very complex biological creatures that, nonetheless, are embodied in the material world and are, therefore, subject to the constraints and possibilities of machines in the material world. to wrap it up, we now see the relation between contemporary artistic emphasis on the materiality of writing/art and the larger moment of 'spiritual materialism'. ja http://vispo.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 5 Jul 2009 19:06:33 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Paul Nelson Subject: Re: mourning & poetics In-Reply-To: <4A4F7B78.5060007@umn.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ________________________________ From: Maria Damon =0ATo: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU=0ASent: Saturday, July 4, 2009 8:55:3= 6 AM=0ASubject: Re: mourning & poetics=0A=0Athank=0Ayou for pointing this o= ut. ron silliman's term (the school of quietude=0Aor something like that) s= eems to take no account of this earlier usage,=0Aso i find it very misleadi= ng; i wish he'd use something else, if he has=0Ato use anything at all. =0A= =0AMaria,=0A=0ARon Silliman, from his blog in January 2004:=0A=0A=0ASchool = of Quietude is more complex, I think. The phrase itself was coined=0Aby Edg= ar Allen Poe in the 1840s to note the inherent caution=0Athat dominates the= conservative institutional traditions in American=0Awriting. I=EF=BF=BDve = resurrected the term for a=0Acouple of reasons: =0AIt acknowledges the hist= orical nature of literary reaction in this country.=0AAs an institutional t= radition that has=0Aproduced writers of significance only at its margins = =EF=BF=BD Hart Crane, Marianne Moore =EF=BF=BD the SoQ=0Acontinues to posse= ss something of a death grip on financial resources for writing in America= =0Awhile denying its own existence as a literary movement, a denial that th= e=0ASoQ enacts by permitting=0Aits practitioners largely to be forgotten on= ce they=EF=BF=BDve died. That=EF=BF=BDs a=0AFaustian bargain with a heavy= =0Adownside, if you ask me, but one that is seldom explored precisely becau= se of the SoQ=EF=BF=BDs=0Arefusal to admit that it exists in the first plac= e. =0A=0APaul Nelson=0A=0A=0A Paul E. Nelson =0A=0AGlobal Voices Radio=0ASP= LAB!=0AAmerican Sentences=0AOrganic Poetry=0APoetry Postcard Blog=0A=0AIlal= qo, WA 253.735.6328=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________= =0AFrom: Maria Damon =0ATo: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU= =0ASent: Saturday, July 4, 2009 8:55:36 AM=0ASubject: Re: mourning & poetic= s=0A=0Athank you for pointing this out. ron silliman's term (the school of = quietude or something like that) seems to take no account of this earlier u= sage, so i find it very misleading; i wish he'd use something else, if he h= as to use anything at all. i find terms like this and also bernstein's "off= icial verse culture" somewhat overly general," though at least the latter a= ddresses institutional processes rather than poetry "itself," if there is s= uch a thing.=0A=0Aon the topic of mourning: has someone already mentioned P= eter Sacks's work on elegy?=0A=0AScott Howard wrote:=0A> * Quietist poetry = . . . ? Well, Quietism seems to have emerged in the seventeenth century as= a form of religious mysticism, but the term has occasionally been used to = describe various works (philosophical, poetic, political) that advocate a m= iddle way between ideology and indifference. Sir Thomas Browne (also 17th = c.) was called a 'quietist', but he was really more of a skeptical essayist= (in the trad. of Montaigne). Rae Armantrout's recent work strikes me as q= uietist in mood/tone.=0A> =0A> * Prevallet's Afterlife: Essay in Mourning T= ime is very good. The literature on mourning and poetics is diverse and ex= tensive. See Ramazani's bibliography, for example. See also: Beyond Conso= lation by Melissa Zeiger for a post-Freudian take on things. Ramazani's bo= ok works well for the modernist paradigm, but to get beyond that framework,= one needs to reconfigure the whole notion of resistance. On that note, se= e: "'The Brevities': Formal Mourning, Transgression & Postmodern American E= legies", in _The World in Time and Space_ (Talisman House, 2002), 122-46, w= hich covers a lot of ground.=0A> =0A> * Fragments and grief/mourning? . . .= Have you read Mallarme's "Pour un tombeau d'Anatole"? Paul Auster's trans= lation (North Point, 1983) is great. A classic.=0A> =0A> ///=0A> =0A> =0A>= =0A> ----- Original Message -----=0A> From: Lauren Russell =0A> Date: Thursday, July 2, 2009 11:07 am=0A> Subject: Re: mournin= g & poetics=0A> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU=0A> =0A> =0A> =0A>> What = is quietist poetry? I'm really curious; I've never heard the term.=0A>> = I tend to think of fragmented poetry (and prose) as best articulating grief= . Have you ever read Kristin Prevallet's I, Afterlife: Essay in Mourning T= ime? And part of what I love about Alice Notley's work is that her poems h= ave engaged with grief in so many different ways. I can't claim to have re= ad the whole book (it's one of the books one's not aloud to check out of th= e New York Public Library), but the introduction to Patricia Rae's Modernis= m and Mourning makes some interesting points about the politics of grief an= d writing about grief. I found it helpful alongside Ramazini, though I can'= t claim to have read all of that, either.=0A>> Lauren Russell=0A>> = =0A> ///=0A> =0A> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A> The Poetics List is moder= ated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http:/= /epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=0A> =0A=0A=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=0AThe Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guid= elines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 5 Jul 2009 13:27:07 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: "E. J. McAdams" Subject: Marcella Durand Reading on July 15 in NYC MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable *SEA Poetry Series, No. 2, featuring Marcella Durand* *Wednesday, July 15, 2009* *7:30-9pm* EXIT ART, 475 10th Avenue *Marcella Durand* will read a selection of her poems and present a talk on in conjunction with the SEA exhibition, The End of Oil. Durand=92s recent books are Traffic & Weather (Futurepoem, 2008), AREA (Belladonna, 2008), and The Anatomy of Oil (Belladonna, 2005). Other books include Western Capital Rhapsodies, City of Ports, and Lapsus Linguae. Her poems and essays have appeared in Conjunctions, The Canary, Denver Quarterly, Chain, The Poker, Verse, NYFA Current, and other journals. She has given talks on the intersections of poetry and ecology at Kelly Writers House, Small Press Traffic, Dactyl Foundation, Stella Adler Studio of Acting, and other venues. Excerpts from her ongoing collaboration with Tina Darragh, based on environmental science, Deep Ecology and Francis Ponge, have appeared in Anomaly, How(2), and Ecopoetics. She was a writer-in-residence at the Lower Manhattan Cultural Council in 2006, and in 2005 organized a reading and panel on the inter-relations between astronomy and poetry as part of the Inspiration of Astronomical Phenomena Conference at the Adler Planetarium in Chicago. Currently, she is translating Mich=E8l= e M=E9tail=92s Les horizons du sol/Earth=92s Horizons, a history of the geolo= gical formation of Marseille written within a Oulipian formal constraint; a section of her translation appeared last year in The Nation. She lives in New York City=92s East Village with her husband Richard O=92Russa and son I= smael Toussaint Durand O=92Russa. All readings are* FREE* and take place at *Exit Art, 475 10th Avenue*, between 36th and 37th Street. Following each reading there will Q&A and a cash bar reception. The SEA Poetry Series is curated by E.J. McAdams. For info on future readings visit: www.seareadingseries.blogspot.com =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 00:01:43 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Murat Nemet-Nejat Subject: Re: spiritual materialism In-Reply-To: <9D76042120CA4EEC9D4328020E8EE964@OwnerPC> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Jim, Coincidentally, I just finished a long poem entitled "The Spiritual Life of Replicants." Ciao, Murat On Sun, Jul 5, 2009 at 3:41 PM, Jim Andrews wrote: > it is commonly observed that a great deal of contemporary art/writing > involves a double sense of 'the material'. the term is understood to refe= r > not only to the subject matter (the 'standard' understanding in writing) = but > also the matter of the media in the piece, the material embodiment of the > piece. it's also commonly observed that the latter awareness of and appro= ach > to composition not solely by ideation, meditation on the subject matter, = but > also through operation on the material embodiment, has come to be much mo= re > widely understood as a part of reading than it was a generation ago. when= we > encounter work that does not follow the grammars and approaches > traditionally associated with work, we inquire into the methods of > composition, the approach to materiality, and look for relations between > those methods and approaches and the subject matter, or look for the subj= ect > matter in the light of those things. and so read differently, thereby. an= d > in this way, we now read some literary work in ways that are closer to ho= w > we approach a great deal of visual art. > > but what i want to get at is something that isn't so commonly observed, a= t > the moment, but may be in the next generation. and that's the relation of > awareness of the materiality of writing/art to our ideas of who and what = we > are. that's erm awkwardly stated. what i'm trying to get at is this. the > whole emphasis on materiality is involved in a larger movement to explore > how things like ideation, imagination, the spiritual, beauty, truth, > goodness, justice--all our ideals and things normally associated with the > immaterial--operate in the material world. > > in this sense, we might say that the whole contemporary awareness of > materiality in art is part of a larger ah spiritual materialism. i google= d > that term, after it occurred to me, and i assure you i'm using it in a > different sense than ch=F6gyam trungpa, who uses it "to describe mistakes > spiritual seekers commit which turn the pursuit of spiritualism into an e= go > building and confusion creating endeavor" (wikipedia). instead, i'm refer= ing > to a relatively common sort of philosophy in which the material substrate= of > ideation and even the spiritual is affirmed and its relations with even t= he > flightiest of fancies are explored. not to denigrate or dismiss things li= ke > spirituality but to explore how they operate materially. > > perhaps more evidently, now, this is also related to philosophies of mind > in which the materiality of thought itself is affirmed--as a chemical and > informational process, however emergent--and the brain and the mind that > emerge from its processes are conceived as fully embodied in the material= . > so that the idea of being able to create thinking machines (however unlik= e > us) becomes a real possibility. and we are conceptualized as nature's > (near?) ultimate machines. and machines are conceptualized not as the sim= ple > things we once thought they must be but as often very complex biological > creatures that, nonetheless, are embodied in the material world and are, > therefore, subject to the constraints and possibilities of machines in th= e > material world. > > to wrap it up, we now see the relation between contemporary artistic > emphasis on the materiality of writing/art and the larger moment of > 'spiritual materialism'. > > ja > http://vispo.com > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 03:07:47 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Maria Damon Subject: Re: mourning & poetics In-Reply-To: <121091.56404.qm@web111516.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit thanks for this, paul. i wonder where Poe uses it? i'd be curious. any poe scholars out there? ben friedlander? Paul Nelson wrote: > ________________________________ > From: Maria Damon > > ________________________________ > From: Maria Damon > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Sent: Saturday, July 4, 2009 8:55:36 AM > Subject: Re: mourning & poetics > > thank > you for pointing this out. ron silliman's term (the school of quietude > or something like that) seems to take no account of this earlier usage, > so i find it very misleading; i wish he'd use something else, if he has > to use anything at all. > > Maria, > > Ron Silliman, from his blog in January 2004: > > > School of Quietude is more complex, I think. The phrase itself was coined > by Edgar Allen Poe in the 1840s to note the inherent caution > that dominates the conservative institutional traditions in American > writing. I�ve resurrected the term for a > couple of reasons: > It acknowledges the historical nature of literary reaction in this country. > As an institutional tradition that has > produced writers of significance only at its margins � Hart Crane, Marianne Moore � the SoQ > continues to possess something of a death grip on financial resources for writing in America > while denying its own existence as a literary movement, a denial that the > SoQ enacts by permitting > its practitioners largely to be forgotten once they�ve died. That�s a > Faustian bargain with a heavy > downside, if you ask me, but one that is seldom explored precisely because of the SoQ�s > refusal to admit that it exists in the first place. > > Paul Nelson > > > Paul E. Nelson > > Global Voices Radio > SPLAB! > American Sentences > Organic Poetry > Poetry Postcard Blog > > Ilalqo, WA 253.735.6328 > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > From: Maria Damon > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Sent: Saturday, July 4, 2009 8:55:36 AM > Subject: Re: mourning & poetics > > thank you for pointing this out. ron silliman's term (the school of quietude or something like that) seems to take no account of this earlier usage, so i find it very misleading; i wish he'd use something else, if he has to use anything at all. i find terms like this and also bernstein's "official verse culture" somewhat overly general," though at least the latter addresses institutional processes rather than poetry "itself," if there is such a thing. > > on the topic of mourning: has someone already mentioned Peter Sacks's work on elegy? > > Scott Howard wrote: > >> * Quietist poetry . . . ? Well, Quietism seems to have emerged in the seventeenth century as a form of religious mysticism, but the term has occasionally been used to describe various works (philosophical, poetic, political) that advocate a middle way between ideology and indifference. Sir Thomas Browne (also 17th c.) was called a 'quietist', but he was really more of a skeptical essayist (in the trad. of Montaigne). Rae Armantrout's recent work strikes me as quietist in mood/tone. >> >> * Prevallet's Afterlife: Essay in Mourning Time is very good. The literature on mourning and poetics is diverse and extensive. See Ramazani's bibliography, for example. See also: Beyond Consolation by Melissa Zeiger for a post-Freudian take on things. Ramazani's book works well for the modernist paradigm, but to get beyond that framework, one needs to reconfigure the whole notion of resistance. On that note, see: "'The Brevities': Formal Mourning, Transgression & Postmodern American Elegies", in _The World in Time and Space_ (Talisman House, 2002), 122-46, which covers a lot of ground. >> >> * Fragments and grief/mourning? . . . Have you read Mallarme's "Pour un tombeau d'Anatole"? Paul Auster's translation (North Point, 1983) is great. A classic. >> >> /// >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Lauren Russell >> Date: Thursday, July 2, 2009 11:07 am >> Subject: Re: mourning & poetics >> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >> >> >> >> >>> What is quietist poetry? I'm really curious; I've never heard the term. >>> I tend to think of fragmented poetry (and prose) as best articulating grief. Have you ever read Kristin Prevallet's I, Afterlife: Essay in Mourning Time? And part of what I love about Alice Notley's work is that her poems have engaged with grief in so many different ways. I can't claim to have read the whole book (it's one of the books one's not aloud to check out of the New York Public Library), but the introduction to Patricia Rae's Modernism and Mourning makes some interesting points about the politics of grief and writing about grief. I found it helpful alongside Ramazini, though I can't claim to have read all of that, either. >>> Lauren Russell >>> >>> >> /// >> >> ================================== >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >> >> > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 00:29:36 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Christopher Rizzo Subject: Re: spiritual materialism In-Reply-To: <9D76042120CA4EEC9D4328020E8EE964@OwnerPC> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Jim, Interesting post. Are you familiar with Charles Olson's work? In a conversation with Herbert Kenny, 1969, Olson says "I mean something I believe we possess crucially. I think our body is our soul. And if you don'= t have your body as a factor of creation, you don't have a soul." Olson articulates the same idea at other times, too. In any event, an explanation of the above would prove lengthy, so please feel free to backchannel me if you're so inclined. I'm writing two books on Olson at the moment. c.rizzo@gmail.com Bests, Chris On Sun, Jul 5, 2009 at 3:41 PM, Jim Andrews wrote: > it is commonly observed that a great deal of contemporary art/writing > involves a double sense of 'the material'. the term is understood to refe= r > not only to the subject matter (the 'standard' understanding in writing) = but > also the matter of the media in the piece, the material embodiment of the > piece. it's also commonly observed that the latter awareness of and appro= ach > to composition not solely by ideation, meditation on the subject matter, = but > also through operation on the material embodiment, has come to be much mo= re > widely understood as a part of reading than it was a generation ago. when= we > encounter work that does not follow the grammars and approaches > traditionally associated with work, we inquire into the methods of > composition, the approach to materiality, and look for relations between > those methods and approaches and the subject matter, or look for the subj= ect > matter in the light of those things. and so read differently, thereby. an= d > in this way, we now read some literary work in ways that are closer to ho= w > we approach a great deal of visual art. > > but what i want to get at is something that isn't so commonly observed, a= t > the moment, but may be in the next generation. and that's the relation of > awareness of the materiality of writing/art to our ideas of who and what = we > are. that's erm awkwardly stated. what i'm trying to get at is this. the > whole emphasis on materiality is involved in a larger movement to explore > how things like ideation, imagination, the spiritual, beauty, truth, > goodness, justice--all our ideals and things normally associated with the > immaterial--operate in the material world. > > in this sense, we might say that the whole contemporary awareness of > materiality in art is part of a larger ah spiritual materialism. i google= d > that term, after it occurred to me, and i assure you i'm using it in a > different sense than ch=C3=B6gyam trungpa, who uses it "to describe mista= kes > spiritual seekers commit which turn the pursuit of spiritualism into an e= go > building and confusion creating endeavor" (wikipedia). instead, i'm refer= ing > to a relatively common sort of philosophy in which the material substrate= of > ideation and even the spiritual is affirmed and its relations with even t= he > flightiest of fancies are explored. not to denigrate or dismiss things li= ke > spirituality but to explore how they operate materially. > > perhaps more evidently, now, this is also related to philosophies of mind > in which the materiality of thought itself is affirmed--as a chemical and > informational process, however emergent--and the brain and the mind that > emerge from its processes are conceived as fully embodied in the material= . > so that the idea of being able to create thinking machines (however unlik= e > us) becomes a real possibility. and we are conceptualized as nature's > (near?) ultimate machines. and machines are conceptualized not as the sim= ple > things we once thought they must be but as often very complex biological > creatures that, nonetheless, are embodied in the material world and are, > therefore, subject to the constraints and possibilities of machines in th= e > material world. > > to wrap it up, we now see the relation between contemporary artistic > emphasis on the materiality of writing/art and the larger moment of > 'spiritual materialism'. > > ja > http://vispo.com > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 08:25:53 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Chris Chapman Subject: Re: spiritual materialism In-Reply-To: <9D76042120CA4EEC9D4328020E8EE964@OwnerPC> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable interesting post. I wonder if you've considered the letter to Adorno in Benjamin's writings concerning 'Materialist Theology'. In particcular his response to Adorno's refrain that one's attitude is made manifest in the styles with which an artist composes her material . (Adorno finds cigarette smoking to be a striking exemplar.) Benjamin rejects the idea - launched by Adorno from his dissertation on Kierkegaard's 'Diary of a Seducer' - that attitude, bearing, grace, and 'comportment' are objects that can only be displayed. Benjamin, in simple, argues that the unconscious is already 'attitude.' ... I'm interested in what you might say about the need to worry about thinking machines that reflect Benjamin's mentholation of the unconscious. On 7/5/09, Jim Andrews wrote: > it is commonly observed that a great deal of contemporary art/writing > involves a double sense of 'the material'. the term is understood to refe= r > not only to the subject matter (the 'standard' understanding in writing) = but > also the matter of the media in the piece, the material embodiment of the > piece. it's also commonly observed that the latter awareness of and appro= ach > to composition not solely by ideation, meditation on the subject matter, = but > also through operation on the material embodiment, has come to be much mo= re > widely understood as a part of reading than it was a generation ago. when= we > encounter work that does not follow the grammars and approaches > traditionally associated with work, we inquire into the methods of > composition, the approach to materiality, and look for relations between > those methods and approaches and the subject matter, or look for the subj= ect > matter in the light of those things. and so read differently, thereby. an= d > in this way, we now read some literary work in ways that are closer to ho= w > we approach a great deal of visual art. > > but what i want to get at is something that isn't so commonly observed, a= t > the moment, but may be in the next generation. and that's the relation of > awareness of the materiality of writing/art to our ideas of who and what = we > are. that's erm awkwardly stated. what i'm trying to get at is this. the > whole emphasis on materiality is involved in a larger movement to explore > how things like ideation, imagination, the spiritual, beauty, truth, > goodness, justice--all our ideals and things normally associated with the > immaterial--operate in the material world. > > in this sense, we might say that the whole contemporary awareness of > materiality in art is part of a larger ah spiritual materialism. i google= d > that term, after it occurred to me, and i assure you i'm using it in a > different sense than ch=F6gyam trungpa, who uses it "to describe mistakes > spiritual seekers commit which turn the pursuit of spiritualism into an e= go > building and confusion creating endeavor" (wikipedia). instead, i'm refer= ing > to a relatively common sort of philosophy in which the material substrate= of > ideation and even the spiritual is affirmed and its relations with even t= he > flightiest of fancies are explored. not to denigrate or dismiss things li= ke > spirituality but to explore how they operate materially. > > perhaps more evidently, now, this is also related to philosophies of mind= in > which the materiality of thought itself is affirmed--as a chemical and > informational process, however emergent--and the brain and the mind that > emerge from its processes are conceived as fully embodied in the material= . > so that the idea of being able to create thinking machines (however unlik= e > us) becomes a real possibility. and we are conceptualized as nature's > (near?) ultimate machines. and machines are conceptualized not as the sim= ple > things we once thought they must be but as often very complex biological > creatures that, nonetheless, are embodied in the material world and are, > therefore, subject to the constraints and possibilities of machines in th= e > material world. > > to wrap it up, we now see the relation between contemporary artistic > emphasis on the materiality of writing/art and the larger moment of > 'spiritual materialism'. > > ja > http://vispo.com > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 09:25:57 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Mary Jo Malo Subject: Re: mourning & poetics MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit What happened to the original poster of this query? I'd be interested in her thoughts on the matter. (Lauren Russell) Lauren et al. Thank you for all your references and comments. What prompted my query is my observation (subjective perspective) that in the initial shock and grief of loss we tend to turn to classical, lyrical, and SoQ poetry rather than post-avant and other named postmodern poetry. Either it is because we are truly at a loss for words; and these poems are the most accessible and easily shared, or we haven't the intellectual and emotional resources to engage more abstract poetry. After a "suitable" period of time, when we've had time to process the grief, the creative process ignites, and we're able to craft and read postmodern or existential poetry which more accurately portrays the loss itself. In other words, words fail, but the art of them doesn't. Regarding the SoQ/Post-Avant dichotomy itself, what I've managed to glean from casual reading, is the criticism is aimed at ending what Mr. Silliman's considers a hegemony in traditional publishing and academia. My impression (again, subjective and lacking in pedantics) is that among the small press and internet poetics community, the hegemony is strictly post-avant. Mary -- http://thisshiningwound.blogspot.com/ http://apophisdeconstructingabsurdity.blogspot.com/ ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 10:41:26 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Sharon Dolin Subject: Reading this Friday Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v753.1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Dear Friends, I'll be part of a group reading celebrating the Tenth Anniversary issue of the online journal Drunken Boat on Friday, July 10th at: SoHo20 Chelsea Gallery 511 West 25th Street, Suite 605. 6-8pm. Free. The other poets are: Derek beaulieu, Sommer Browning, Rand Richards Cooper, Ram Devineni, Elizabeth Kadetsky, Harriet Levin, and Elisabeth Subrin. Hope you can make it. Sharon Sharon Dolin sdolin@earthlink.net www.sdolin@earthlink.net ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 5 Jul 2009 11:28:49 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Aryanil Mukherjee Organization: KAURAB Subject: Kaurab International Poetry Reading Series:: Event 4 Comments: To: editor@kaurab.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear All 12th July is Chilean myth Pablo Neruda's 105th birthday. While more is = perhaps yet to be excavated from Neruda's ignored and forgotten work, = his known work has become mythical over the years. And sadly, like all = mythical walls, it often stands in the way to language-wide = cross-sections of innovative and explorative poets, wildflower and = mushroom collectors of all linguistic sorts, in all of Ibero-America = today.=20 Kaurab International Poetry Reading Series proudly presents an = exclusive Chilean reading in Kolkata, India on the evening of July 12, = 2009. The main reader of the evening will be Madrid based young Chilean = poet Violeta Medina. Subhro Bandopadhyay, a polyglotic young Bengali = poet who writes simultaneously in Bangla and Espanol and lives in both = Spain and India, will introduce the poet.=20 The event is organized by Santanu Bandopadhyay, on behalf of Kaurab. English Announcement - http://www.kaurab.com/kabita_camp/kaurabshaal/violeta-reading.pdf Bangla Announcement - http://www.kaurab.com/kabita_camp/kaurabshaal/ A documentary film on forgotten Chilean poetic genious Gonzalo Rojas = made by Violeta Media will also be screened that evening. Space is limited, but we would still like to extend an invitation to = everyone staying/living in Kolkata on 12th July, 2009. Aryanil Mukherjee KAURAB www.kaurab.com =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 10:44:41 -0500 Reply-To: dgodston@gmail.com Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Daniel Godston Organization: Borderbend Arts Collective Subject: The Bauhaus: 90 Years / 90 Days MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit "The Bauhaus: 90 Years / 90 Days" is a new project which commemorates the Bauhaus movement, which celebrates its 90th anniversary this year. Every day during this 90-day project (from July till October 2009), at least one project will happen which creatively plays around with and pays homage to an aspect of the Bauhaus movement. Examples of those projects might include a dance performance inspired by Oskar Schlemmer's ballet, a musical performance that uses a Kandinsky painting as a graphic score, a fiber art project inspired by Anni Albers' work, a poem inspired by Walter Gropius' architecture, a short story inspired by Marianne Brandt's work, an essay reflecting on an aspect of the Bauhaus movement, and so on. Today is the starting date of "The Bauhaus: 90 Years / 90 Days." Grahm Balkany, Director of the Gropius in Chicago Coalition, reads selections of Gropius' speeches -- 12:30 p.m. in Chicago's Federal Plaza (50 W. Adams, Chicago, IL). These events will be presented at different locations around the world. Information about this project's day-to-day developments will be posted at http://www.bauhaus9090.org. "The Bauhaus: 90 Years / 90 Days" is being organized by the Borderbend Arts Collective and the Gropius in Chicago Coalition. http://www.bauhaus-dessau.de/index.php?en http://www.dezignare.com/newsletter/bauhausmovement.html http://www.chicagobauhausbeyond.org http://www.gropiuschicago.org http://tinyurl.com/mcsg2m http://tinyurl.com/ndsvqd http://tinyurl.com/m5m73b ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 09:18:23 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jennifer Karmin Subject: Red Rover Series / Experiment #31 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Red Rover Series {readings that play with reading} Experiment #31: Talk Walk Talk - Peripatetic Writing SATURDAY, JULY 11 7pm Featuring: A D Jameson & Michelle Tupko NEW LOCATION at the Orientation Center 2129 N. Rockwell -- Chicago, IL corner of Milwaukee/Rockwell left side of the Congress Theater building http://orientationcenter.wordpress.com suggested donation $4 A D JAMESON is a writer, performer, and video artist. His fiction and reviews have appeared in the Denver Quarterly, Fiction International, the Mississippi Review Online, the Review of Contemporary Fiction, American Book Review, and elsewhere. He's also directed music videos for the Kill Rock Stars bands Xiu Xiu and Mecca Normal. MICHELLE TUPKO received her MFA in Sculpture from the School of the Art Institute of Chicago and holds a BA in Photography and Filmmaking. Her writing is published in Performance Research and White Walls journals. She is currently writing a book about mountains and the way the foot moves. Red Rover Series is curated by Lisa Janssen and Jennifer Karmin. Each event is designed as a reading experiment with participation by local, national, and international writers, artists, and performers. The series was founded in 2005 by Amina Cain and Jennifer Karmin. UPCOMING August 29: Krista Franklin & Adam Rose September 26: Kate Greenstreet & Gina Myers Email ideas for reading experiments to us at redroverseries@yahoogroups.com The schedule for events is listed at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/redroverseries ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 17:54:09 +0100 Reply-To: vertor@gmail.com Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Trevor Joyce Subject: SoundEye Festival - final lineup - starts Wednesday Comments: To: UK Poetry MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable *[Apologies for cross-posting]* Here's the final line-up (except for the Cabaret and the open-mic event, both of which will be finalised on the night, though they're already full t= o bursting) for this year's SoundEye Festival. Come and join us in Cork where the drink, conversation and weather are great, and the poetry is even better. *SoundEye #13 8-12 July 2009 Cork, Ireland (www.soundeye.org) * Wed July 8 =95 18:00 =95 admission free Firkin Crane, Shandon, Cork Reading: Sean Bonney (UK) + Mair=E9ad Byrne (Irl/USA) + Keith Tuma (USA) Thu July 9 =95 18:00 =95 admission free Firkin Crane, Shandon, Cork Reading: James Cummins (Irl) + Frances Kruk (UK) + Keston Sutherland (UK) Thu July 9 =95 20:30 =95 admission =805 The Other Place Club, St. Augustine St. (just off Paradise Place / Western Rd.), Cork SoundEye Cabaret (Programmed by Fergal Gaynor) With Isabella Oberlander (dancer AUT) + Boiled String (performance poetry CYM) + Mathematical Muse (poetry / performance / music) + Retorika Quartet with Camilla Griehsel (baroque and renaissance strings with soprano) + many more Fri July 10 =95 14:00 =95 admission free The Guesthouse, 10 Chapel Street, Shandon, Cork Reading: Swantje Lichtenstein (Ger) + Kevin Perryman (Ire/Ger) + Stephen Rodefer (USA/Fr) + Michael Smith (Ire) Fri July 10 =95 17:30 =95 admission free Firkin Crane, Shandon, Cork Reading: Jerome Rothenberg (USA) + Geoffrey Squires (Ire/UK) + Christine Wertheim (Aus/UK/USA) Fri July 10 =95 21:00 =95 admission free Meade's Wine Bar, 126 Oliver Plunkett Street, Cork Couscous@Meade's with M/C Mair=E9ad Byrne (Pre-programmed open-mic) Sat July 11 =95 11:30 =95 admission free Firkin Crane, Shandon, Cork Poetry by Default programmed by Jimmy Cummins Reading: Jim Goar (USA) + Marcus Slease (NIre) + David Toms (Ire) Sat July 11 =95 17:00 =95 admission =803 (towards the upkeep of the buildin= g) (Sonic Vigil runs continuously 12:00 - 18:00) St. Fin Barre's Cathedral, Cork SoundEye/Sonic Vigil sound event Performance: Jaap Blonk (Nl) + Jerome Rothenberg (USA) + Christine Wertheim (UK/USA) Sat July 11 =95 20:00 =95 admission free Eason's Hill Community Centre, Eason's Hill, Shandon, Cork Reading: Peter Manson (UK) + Maggie O'Sullivan (UK) + Tom Raworth (UK/Ire) [Tom Raworth's reading is generously supported by Poetry Ireland] Sun July 12 =95 11:00 =95 admission free Firkin Crane, Shandon, Cork Reading: Thomas McCarthy (Ire) + Mark Mallon (Ger/Fin) + Luke Roberts (UK) Sun July 12 =95 13:00 =95 admission free The Guesthouse, 10 Chapel Street, Shandon, Cork Reading: Billy Mills (Ire) + Martin Corless-Smith (UK/USA) + Catherine Wals= h (Ire) [The SoundEye Festival is made possible thanks to the Small Festivals Schem= e of The Irish Arts Council] =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 13:58:58 -0400 Reply-To: Aryanil Mukherjee Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Aryanil Mukherjee Subject: Re: spiritual materialism In-Reply-To: <16448875.102851246903102495.JavaMail.root@dom-zbox1.bo3.lycos.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable If we go even further back to Leaves of Grass, Whitman writes "if body is n= ot soul, what is soul ?"=20 To me, that's the=C2=A0essence of the material, of Western aesthetics.=20 On body, and=C2=A0completely ignorant of the existence of Leaves of Grass,= =C2=A0Rabindranath Thakur (Tagore) writes -" if body is not soul, what is b= ody?" (very rough translation ....tailored a little to exactly reverse Whit= man)=20 That is the essence of the spirit, of the East...=20 And of course, one could argue today, that they are one and the same, one a= residence , the other=C2=A0its resident and it doesn't really matter which= is which...=20 Aryanil=20 ----- Original Message -----=20 From: "Christopher Rizzo" =20 To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU=20 Sent: Monday, July 6, 2009 12:29:36 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern=20 Subject: Re: spiritual materialism=20 Jim,=20 Interesting post. Are you familiar with Charles Olson's work? In a=20 conversation with Herbert Kenny, 1969, Olson says "I mean something I=20 believe we possess crucially. I think our body is our soul. And if you don'= t=20 have your body as a factor of creation, you don't have a soul." Olson=20 articulates the same idea at other times, too.=20 In any event, an explanation of the above would prove lengthy, so please=20 feel free to backchannel me if you're so inclined. I'm writing two books on= =20 Olson at the moment.=20 c.rizzo@gmail.com=20 Bests,=20 Chris=20 On Sun, Jul 5, 2009 at 3:41 PM, Jim Andrews wrote:=20 > it is commonly observed that a great deal of contemporary art/writing=20 > involves a double sense of 'the material'. the term is understood to refe= r=20 > not only to the subject matter (the 'standard' understanding in writing) = but=20 > also the matter of the media in the piece, the material embodiment of the= =20 > piece. it's also commonly observed that the latter awareness of and appro= ach=20 > to composition not solely by ideation, meditation on the subject matter, = but=20 > also through operation on the material embodiment, has come to be much mo= re=20 > widely understood as a part of reading than it was a generation ago. when= we=20 > encounter work that does not follow the grammars and approaches=20 > traditionally associated with work, we inquire into the methods of=20 > composition, the approach to materiality, and look for relations between= =20 > those methods and approaches and the subject matter, or look for the subj= ect=20 > matter in the light of those things. and so read differently, thereby. an= d=20 > in this way, we now read some literary work in ways that are closer to ho= w=20 > we approach a great deal of visual art.=20 >=20 > but what i want to get at is something that isn't so commonly observed, a= t=20 > the moment, but may be in the next generation. and that's the relation of= =20 > awareness of the materiality of writing/art to our ideas of who and what = we=20 > are. that's erm awkwardly stated. what i'm trying to get at is this. the= =20 > whole emphasis on materiality is involved in a larger movement to explore= =20 > how things like ideation, imagination, the spiritual, beauty, truth,=20 > goodness, justice--all our ideals and things normally associated with the= =20 > immaterial--operate in the material world.=20 >=20 > in this sense, we might say that the whole contemporary awareness of=20 > materiality in art is part of a larger ah spiritual materialism. i google= d=20 > that term, after it occurred to me, and i assure you i'm using it in a=20 > different sense than ch=C3=B6gyam trungpa, who uses it "to describe mista= kes=20 > spiritual seekers commit which turn the pursuit of spiritualism into an e= go=20 > building and confusion creating endeavor" (wikipedia). instead, i'm refer= ing=20 > to a relatively common sort of philosophy in which the material substrate= of=20 > ideation and even the spiritual is affirmed and its relations with even t= he=20 > flightiest of fancies are explored. not to denigrate or dismiss things li= ke=20 > spirituality but to explore how they operate materially.=20 >=20 > perhaps more evidently, now, this is also related to philosophies of mind= =20 > in which the materiality of thought itself is affirmed--as a chemical and= =20 > informational process, however emergent--and the brain and the mind that= =20 > emerge from its processes are conceived as fully embodied in the material= .=20 > so that the idea of being able to create thinking machines (however unlik= e=20 > us) becomes a real possibility. and we are conceptualized as nature's=20 > (near?) ultimate machines. and machines are conceptualized not as the sim= ple=20 > things we once thought they must be but as often very complex biological= =20 > creatures that, nonetheless, are embodied in the material world and are,= =20 > therefore, subject to the constraints and possibilities of machines in th= e=20 > material world.=20 >=20 > to wrap it up, we now see the relation between contemporary artistic=20 > emphasis on the materiality of writing/art and the larger moment of=20 > 'spiritual materialism'.=20 >=20 > ja=20 > http://vispo.com=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=20 > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es=20 > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=20 >=20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=20 The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 4 Jul 2009 12:05:08 -0400 Reply-To: az421@FreeNet.Carleton.CA Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Rob McLennan Subject: a compact of words, rob mclennan my fifteenth trade poetry title, a compact of words, is apparently out now, with Irish publisher, Salmon; http://www.salmonpoetry.com/acompactofwords.html with parts of it appearing previously in such places as Jacket magazine, here; http://jacketmagazine.com/18/c-mclenn.html check the publisher for ordering and/or review copies; i should have copies myself in a week or so, hopefully, for anyone else; rob -- writer/editor/publisher ...STANZAS mag, above/ground press & Chaudiere Books (www.chaudierebooks.com) ...coord.,SPAN-O + ottawa small press fair ...14th poetry coll'n - gifts (Talon) ...2nd novel - missing persons www.abovegroundpress.blogspot.com * http://robmclennan.blogspot.com/ ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 11:47:59 -0600 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jonathan Ball Subject: Re: spiritual materialism In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Some of these ideas might approach the way Slavoj Zizek reads the Hegelian paradox that "the spirit is a bone" .... I am travelling without any books and so I can't say much more or even verify my quote etc but your the Olson quote brings this idea to mind, in light of the previous email. Jonathan Ball On Sun, Jul 5, 2009 at 10:29 PM, Christopher Rizzo wrote= : > Jim, > > Interesting post. Are you familiar with Charles Olson's work? In a > conversation with Herbert Kenny, 1969, Olson says "I mean something I > believe we possess crucially. I think our body is our soul. And if you > don't > have your body as a factor of creation, you don't have a soul." Olson > articulates the same idea at other times, too. > > In any event, an explanation of the above would prove lengthy, so please > feel free to backchannel me if you're so inclined. I'm writing two books = on > Olson at the moment. > > c.rizzo@gmail.com > > Bests, > Chris > > On Sun, Jul 5, 2009 at 3:41 PM, Jim Andrews wrote: > > > it is commonly observed that a great deal of contemporary art/writing > > involves a double sense of 'the material'. the term is understood to > refer > > not only to the subject matter (the 'standard' understanding in writing= ) > but > > also the matter of the media in the piece, the material embodiment of t= he > > piece. it's also commonly observed that the latter awareness of and > approach > > to composition not solely by ideation, meditation on the subject matter= , > but > > also through operation on the material embodiment, has come to be much > more > > widely understood as a part of reading than it was a generation ago. wh= en > we > > encounter work that does not follow the grammars and approaches > > traditionally associated with work, we inquire into the methods of > > composition, the approach to materiality, and look for relations betwee= n > > those methods and approaches and the subject matter, or look for the > subject > > matter in the light of those things. and so read differently, thereby. > and > > in this way, we now read some literary work in ways that are closer to > how > > we approach a great deal of visual art. > > > > but what i want to get at is something that isn't so commonly observed, > at > > the moment, but may be in the next generation. and that's the relation = of > > awareness of the materiality of writing/art to our ideas of who and wha= t > we > > are. that's erm awkwardly stated. what i'm trying to get at is this. th= e > > whole emphasis on materiality is involved in a larger movement to explo= re > > how things like ideation, imagination, the spiritual, beauty, truth, > > goodness, justice--all our ideals and things normally associated with t= he > > immaterial--operate in the material world. > > > > in this sense, we might say that the whole contemporary awareness of > > materiality in art is part of a larger ah spiritual materialism. i > googled > > that term, after it occurred to me, and i assure you i'm using it in a > > different sense than ch=F6gyam trungpa, who uses it "to describe mistak= es > > spiritual seekers commit which turn the pursuit of spiritualism into an > ego > > building and confusion creating endeavor" (wikipedia). instead, i'm > refering > > to a relatively common sort of philosophy in which the material substra= te > of > > ideation and even the spiritual is affirmed and its relations with even > the > > flightiest of fancies are explored. not to denigrate or dismiss things > like > > spirituality but to explore how they operate materially. > > > > perhaps more evidently, now, this is also related to philosophies of mi= nd > > in which the materiality of thought itself is affirmed--as a chemical a= nd > > informational process, however emergent--and the brain and the mind tha= t > > emerge from its processes are conceived as fully embodied in the > material. > > so that the idea of being able to create thinking machines (however > unlike > > us) becomes a real possibility. and we are conceptualized as nature's > > (near?) ultimate machines. and machines are conceptualized not as the > simple > > things we once thought they must be but as often very complex biologica= l > > creatures that, nonetheless, are embodied in the material world and are= , > > therefore, subject to the constraints and possibilities of machines in > the > > material world. > > > > to wrap it up, we now see the relation between contemporary artistic > > emphasis on the materiality of writing/art and the larger moment of > > 'spiritual materialism'. > > > > ja > > http://vispo.com > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines > > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > --=20 www.jonathanball.com www.jonathanball.blogspot.com www.haikuhoroscopes.com =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 12:00:48 -0700 Reply-To: editor@pavementsaw.org Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: David Baratier Subject: Save our Ohio Libraries MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Libraries in Ohio are in danger of losing at least 20% and as high as 50% of funding from the State of Ohio if the cuts proposed by Governor Strickland are approved. This vote is still not solidified, and I ask that you immediately take action yourself as well as sending this e-mail to all other friends, families, and relatives living in Ohio. Cuts in Library hours, programs, materials, and all services libraries currently provide will especially hurt our rural cultural center here, and some libraries may even close. In order to keep funding, please write notes and call the following people this week: Senator Steve Buehrer 614-466-8150 SD01@senate.state.oh.us Representative Bruce Goodwin 614-644-5091 District74@ohr.state.oh.us Governor Ted Strickland 614-466-3555 or write him a note right one the web http://www.governor.ohio.gov/Assistance/ContacttheGovernor/tabid/150/Default.aspx Thank you for your time in this matter. Be well David Baratier, Editor Pavement Saw Press 321 Empire Street Montpelier OH 43543 http://pavementsaw.org Subscribe to our e-mail listserv at http://pavementsaw.org/list/?p=subscribe&id=1 Be well David Baratier, Editor Pavement Saw Press 321 Empire Street Montpelier OH 43543 http://pavementsaw.org Subscribe to our e-mail listserv at http://pavementsaw.org/list/?p=subscribe&id=1 ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 15:18:24 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Mark Weiss Subject: Re: SoundEye Festival - final lineup - starts Wednesday Comments: To: vertor@gmail.com In-Reply-To: <7204e7c50907060954v61b0abadu3d5c84ea94668974@mail.gmail.co m> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Trevor: You've done it again! A great lineup. Wish I could be there. Mark At 12:54 PM 7/6/2009, Trevor Joyce wrote: >*[Apologies for cross-posting]* > >Here's the final line-up (except for the Cabaret and the open-mic event, >both of which will be finalised on the night, though they're already full= to >bursting) for this year's SoundEye Festival. Come and join us in Cork where >the drink, conversation and weather are great, and the poetry is even >better. > >*SoundEye #13 >8-12 July 2009 >Cork, Ireland >(www.soundeye.org) >* >Wed July 8 =95 18:00 =95 admission free >Firkin Crane, Shandon, Cork >Reading: Sean Bonney (UK) + Mair=E9ad Byrne (Irl/USA) + Keith Tuma (USA) > >Thu July 9 =95 18:00 =95 admission free >Firkin Crane, Shandon, Cork >Reading: James Cummins (Irl) + Frances Kruk (UK) + Keston Sutherland (UK) > >Thu July 9 =95 20:30 =95 admission =805 >The Other Place Club, St. Augustine St. (just off Paradise Place / Western >Rd.), Cork >SoundEye Cabaret (Programmed by Fergal Gaynor) >With Isabella Oberlander (dancer AUT) + Boiled String (performance poetry >CYM) + Mathematical Muse (poetry / performance / music) + Retorika Quartet >with Camilla Griehsel (baroque and renaissance strings with soprano) + many >more > >Fri July 10 =95 14:00 =95 admission free >The Guesthouse, 10 Chapel Street, Shandon, Cork >Reading: Swantje Lichtenstein (Ger) + Kevin Perryman (Ire/Ger) + Stephen >Rodefer (USA/Fr) + Michael Smith (Ire) > >Fri July 10 =95 17:30 =95 admission free >Firkin Crane, Shandon, Cork >Reading: Jerome Rothenberg (USA) + Geoffrey Squires (Ire/UK) + Christine >Wertheim (Aus/UK/USA) > >Fri July 10 =95 21:00 =95 admission free >Meade's Wine Bar, 126 Oliver Plunkett Street, Cork >Couscous@Meade's with M/C Mair=E9ad Byrne >(Pre-programmed open-mic) > >Sat July 11 =95 11:30 =95 admission free >Firkin Crane, Shandon, Cork >Poetry by Default programmed by Jimmy Cummins >Reading: Jim Goar (USA) + Marcus Slease (NIre) + David Toms (Ire) > >Sat July 11 =95 17:00 =95 admission =803 (towards the upkeep of the= building) >(Sonic Vigil runs continuously 12:00 - 18:00) >St. Fin Barre's Cathedral, Cork >SoundEye/Sonic Vigil sound event >Performance: Jaap Blonk (Nl) + Jerome Rothenberg (USA) + Christine Wertheim >(UK/USA) > >Sat July 11 =95 20:00 =95 admission free >Eason's Hill Community Centre, Eason's Hill, Shandon, Cork >Reading: Peter Manson (UK) + Maggie O'Sullivan (UK) + Tom Raworth (UK/Ire) >[Tom Raworth's reading is generously supported by Poetry Ireland] > >Sun July 12 =95 11:00 =95 admission free >Firkin Crane, Shandon, Cork >Reading: Thomas McCarthy (Ire) + Mark Mallon (Ger/Fin) + Luke Roberts (UK) > >Sun July 12 =95 13:00 =95 admission free >The Guesthouse, 10 Chapel Street, Shandon, Cork >Reading: Billy Mills (Ire) + Martin Corless-Smith (UK/USA) + Catherine= Walsh >(Ire) > >[The SoundEye Festival is made possible thanks to the Small Festivals= Scheme >of The Irish Arts Council] > >=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept=20 >all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info:=20 >http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 14:26:58 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: David-Baptiste Chirot Subject: Re: spiritual materialism In-Reply-To: <1dec21ae0907052101x322f65cak8d2476c50fe3cf0a@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear Jim=97 =20 Actually the materialism of the spiritual and spiritual materialism is probably the oldest ideas of =93spiritual/material=94 interrelationships From Cave Paintings=2C pictograms to the most highly evolved human scripts like the Mayan=2C carved into stones and arranged=97as well a= s Mayan Cave writing=97these are the oldest forms of works which grew into the huge number of religions and belief systems in which the spiritual materialism i= s one of the major points of difference between them and religions where this belief in the power of the materiality does not exist. The current ideas o= f =93materiality of the word=94 go back to the writings of the Russian Futurists in 1913 (The Word = as Such=2C) writings and to many of the forms of writing developed from the Dadas Haussmann=2C Schwitters (The Letter as Such) =2C H= ugo Ball to the Lettristes to Sound Poetry. The spiritual need not be and mostly is not the =93dogmatic religious form=94 at all =2C but that related throughout history to speaking in tongues=2C mystical expe= riences=2C visions and the sense that all existing things persons everything are themselves spiritual materialism.=20 =20 The material of the works that is used with writing is at the very start and through the entire history of writing. Often to make so= mething seem =93new=2C=94 like spiritual materialism or more directly=2C the effect of their materiasl on = the arts and their reception=2C is a rebranded version of the "old=2C" on order to market what is actually =93old wine in new bottles." =20 For example=97the uses of stone and caves wall were used because they ENDURE THROUGH TIME much better than other writing materials. = Tens of thousand year old works by having existed so long through time have lost their message in terms of the presen= t day reading=97yet at the same time one immediately recognizes them AS WRING= =97and that they are communicating=2C transmitting still out into the cosmos=2C an= d that communication one may see hear read in the present=2C beyond meaning=2C yet material that is present and effecting one greatly. =20 All my work made with found objects stones grass broken branches machine parts plastic etc=97are working together with=2C collabora= ting with =2Cthe material and its limits=2C its demand and its questions back an= d forth when one works=97and that is the reason I call my works =93rubBEings=94=97f= or me they are as alive s anyone and as myself=2C and communicating=2C working with on= e=2C especially as in my works with paintings and rubBEings both=2C I touch the = paper on one side and directly pressing back from the other are the materials. =20 Sometimes to heighten this=2C emphasize it=2C I have images fragments letters or words =96facing towards the viewer on one side=97and facing away= from the viewer for those =93on the other side=94 to see. =20 Many contemporary works that emphasize the materials used as presences in the work and also indicate the presence of an other presence= =97are made by hand. (In fact it is just announced today the world=92s oldest Bible found so far is of course handwritten=97I am not sure why Yahoo News thought=97what=97that it might b= e typewritten??)=97 Book artists of today work much as the transcribers of the Book of Kells did and those in other cultures and timtes even earlier throughout the world. The use of papyrus birch bark=2C stone=2C al maner of materials=2C where deeply part of the spiritual. Oneof ht ideas of The Book most prevalent in American culture is that it does matter which form of The Book one uses=2C which material one in terms of binding=2C the kinds of illustrations or not=2C the types of the fonts and their changing sizes etc= The spiritual materialism can be read and seen and touched in all versions=2C editions=2C=20 al manner f Books and the editions of the bible through time have been one method of this=2C or the Torah=2C Kabala=2C the Gospels=2C the book of = Psalms=97handmade editions which =93speak=94 with the very materials used=97 =20 Despite the existence of the =93material word=94 of the last roughly thrity years in =93experimental=94 writing=2C out of Russian Futurism=2C t= he trend is in the opposite direction=97to the virtual. That is spirit in a sense is displacing matter. This is one of the crucial changes that virtuality is working in society=97the transference of the =93= real=94 to the virtual=2C while the real itself is becoming ever more often effectivel= y =93deleted.=94 =20 During the recent protests in Iran and their grim suppression=2C how did the world follow the events? Via twitter=2C cell phone cameras=2C Facebook=2C cam corder hook ups and other = electronic digital virtual transmissions and receptions.=20 The protests themselves were by students and urban white collar workers and others with access to the electrically plugged in communications system= s. (Battery operated devices do after al need to be plugged in at some point to recharge as do lap tops and others electronics.) Where= and who were the rest of the Iranians? As far as the (observing) world was concerned=2C they did not exist=97they had been left behind in th= e darkness of the unrecorded=2C unremitted=2C =93backward=94 zones. Effectiv= ely=2C these Iranians were deleted in order that the focus be solely on the higher educated and tech-savvy primar= ily young urbanites These Iranians then=2C do exist and via Neda=2C have become part of the world=92s consciou= s. American TV carried persons throwing stones at advancing armed police and army force= s=2C and Americans were cheering for them.=20 For decades exposed to stone throwing Palestinians as =93bad=94 =93terroris= ts=94 as they face the world=92s fourth largest military=2C Americans for the mos= t part aere suposed to feel hatred and fear=2C and wishing =93they would just go away.=94 The change in the meaning of the same image (one could just as well use stock footage as =93real=92) is so e= asily manipulated by simply changing the title=2C caption and media-created =93co= ntext=94 that it is very easy to imagine that al events are =93staged=94 for the cam= eras=2C while the real events take place off screen.=20 Since =93the world sees=94 the staged or not events=97that is what exists a= s the real=2C the spiritual material of spiritual materialism.=20 In contrast are event s which are specifically intended to as mush as possible if not completely take place =93off screen=2C=94 so that events are =93over with= =94 and what remains is the new=2C cleansed arena of the media=92s presentations of the = staged events celebrating =93victory=94 or =93war crimes=2C genocides=2C ethnic cl= eanings. Even though Gaza has been deprived for long time of electricity except on rare occasions and very tiny amounts=2C the entire area was effectively made =93= off limits=94 by the banning of all media until after the events had made possi= ble what is in effect =93un fait accompli.=94 The genocides in Rwanda happend in the same manner=97al contact with the outside=2C electrical=2C via cable=2C phones= =97was cut off and then the killings began. In Cambodia also=2C the American bombings and the Khmer Rouge Regime=2C which banned al =93modern=94 devices=2C created a =93black hole=94 in terms of media=2C and= so millions died =93off screen.=94=20 Even within the USA the same =93set up=94 is used=97here on the bulk of the American Indian Reservations. Currently the American Indian health care is hitting a disastrous low point=2C with large drops in= life expectancey and large gains in infant motility.=20 Despair is rampant=2C and drugs and alcohol as always are there to help numb it. Entire peoples are again experiencing being =93the Vanishing American Indian.=94 Why isn=92t this c= overed except sporadically? According to the Federal employees in charge of many of these wide spread populations=2C the problem is one of distance=2C and also of the Indians not having computers. The Government f= eels it has done al it needs to do about getting information and registration forms for benefits and assistance=2C because it has created a special web site just for this speci= fic purposes. The commentary on this =93black out=94 of Indians from the media=2C virtual vie= w=2C is that well=2C it's their fault=2C because if they would just come to a Federal st= aion they could use a computer and find al this stuff. But they won=92t come in= =2C being Indians and al the ugly stereotypes attached to this. No one seems to find it strange the Agents in charge of the people=92s welfare= aren=92t at al motivated or interested in going out as they are supposed to and find= ing out what is going on. Why bother? Who cares about the persons vanishing i= nto a black hole? =20 =93Spiritual materialism=94 in a sense is a rediscovery process for those with the acces= s and time and safety and comfort to do so.=20 Peoples who have always known of it are =93left out in the cold.=94 The gr= owing gaps between the rich and poor manifest themselves as the spiritual materialism of who is visible=2C paid attention to=2C made a Cause=2C and who is left off screen=2C in the dark= =2C to vanish. =20 The world is not only fighting for oil to continue its polluting of the world and slaugh= ters of person=2C but in a sense already fighting for who has access to the web= =2C to electricity=2C to access and visibility as =93spiritual materials=94 on scr= een while its opposites=2C the immaterial=2C vanish. =20 =93Spiritual materialism is paradoxically the transference of the actuality of materiali= sm into its philosophical and spiritual manifestations as abstract=2C distance= d=2C as observing events and beings without being present. Those things and Beings not present as abstractions=2C symbols for Causes=2C Propaganda=2C manipulation= and advertising-entertainment=2C are being =93disappeared=94 by the materialism= of Drones which are "spiritual" in that they are being guided by non-present persons on the other side of the world=2C who only see the things that are present on a screen as targets of focused techno-perception and massacre. =20 =20 =20 =20 =20 =20 =20 =20 n Sun=2C Jul 5=2C 2009 at 3:41 PM=2C Jim Andrews wrote: >=20 > > it is commonly observed that a great deal of contemporary art/writing > > involves a double sense of 'the material'. the term is understood to refer > > not only to the subject matter (the 'standard' understanding in writing) but > > also the matter of the media in the piece=2C the material embodiment of the > > piece. it's also commonly observed that the latter awareness of and approach > > to composition not solely by ideation=2C meditation on the subject matter=2C but > > also through operation on the material embodiment=2C has come to be much more > > widely understood as a part of reading than it was a generation ago. Wh= en we > > encounter work that does not follow the grammars and approaches > > traditionally associated with work=2C we inquire into the methods of > > composition=2C the approach to materiality=2C and look for relations between > > those methods and approaches and the subject matter=2C or look for the subject > > matter in the light of those things. and so read differently=2C thereby. and > > in this way=2C we now read some literary work in ways that are closer to how > > we approach a great deal of visual art. > > > > but what i want to get at is something that isn't so commonly observed=2C at > > the moment=2C but may be in the next generation. and that's the relation of > > awareness of the materiality of writing/art to our ideas of who and what we > > are. that's erm awkwardly stated. what i'm trying to get at is this. the > > whole emphasis on materiality is involved in a larger movement to explore > > how things like ideation=2C imagination=2C the spiritual=2C beauty=2C t= ruth=2C > > goodness=2C justice--all our ideals and things normally associated with the > > immaterial--operate in the material world. > > > > in this sense=2C we might say that the whole contemporary awareness of > > materiality in art is part of a larger ah spiritual materialism. i googled > > that term=2C after it occurred to me=2C and i assure you i'm using it i= n a > > different sense than ch=F6gyam trungpa=2C who uses it "to describe mistakes > > spiritual seekers commit which turn the pursuit of spiritualism into an ego > > building and confusion creating endeavor" (wikipedia). instead=2C i'm refering > > to a relatively common sort of philosophy in which the material substrate of > > ideation and even the spiritual is affirmed and its relations with even the > > flightiest of fancies are explored. not to denigrate or dismiss things like > > spirituality but to explore how they operate materially. > > > > perhaps more evidently=2C now=2C this is also related to philosophies o= f mind > > in which the materiality of thought itself is affirmed--as a chemical and > > informational process=2C however emergent--and the brain and the mind that > > emerge from its processes are conceived as fully embodied in the material. > > so that the idea of being able to create thinking machines (however unlike > > us) becomes a real possibility. and we are conceptualized as nature's > > (near?) ultimate machines. and machines are conceptualized not as the simple > > things we once thought they must be but as often very complex biological > > creatures that=2C nonetheless=2C are embodied in the material world and are=2C > > therefore=2C subject to the constraints and possibilities of machines in the > > material world. > > > > to wrap it up=2C we now see the relation between contemporary artistic > > emphasis on the materiality of writing/art and the larger moment of > > 'spiritual materialism'. > > > > ja > > http://vispo.com > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines > > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info > Date: Mon=2C 6 Jul 2009 00:01:43 -0400 > From: muratnn@GMAIL.COM > Subject: Re: spiritual materialism > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >=20 > Jim=2C >=20 > Coincidentally=2C I just finished a long poem entitled "The Spiritual Lif= e of > Replicants." >=20 > Ciao=2C >=20 > Murat >=20 >=20 > On Sun=2C Jul 5=2C 2009 at 3:41 PM=2C Jim Andrews wrote: >=20 > > it is commonly observed that a great deal of contemporary art/writing > > involves a double sense of 'the material'. the term is understood to re= fer > > not only to the subject matter (the 'standard' understanding in writing= ) but > > also the matter of the media in the piece=2C the material embodiment of= the > > piece. it's also commonly observed that the latter awareness of and app= roach > > to composition not solely by ideation=2C meditation on the subject matt= er=2C but > > also through operation on the material embodiment=2C has come to be muc= h more > > widely understood as a part of reading than it was a generation ago. wh= en we > > encounter work that does not follow the grammars and approaches > > traditionally associated with work=2C we inquire into the methods of > > composition=2C the approach to materiality=2C and look for relations be= tween > > those methods and approaches and the subject matter=2C or look for the = subject > > matter in the light of those things. and so read differently=2C thereby= . and > > in this way=2C we now read some literary work in ways that are closer t= o how > > we approach a great deal of visual art. > > > > but what i want to get at is something that isn't so commonly observed= =2C at > > the moment=2C but may be in the next generation. and that's the relatio= n of > > awareness of the materiality of writing/art to our ideas of who and wha= t we > > are. that's erm awkwardly stated. what i'm trying to get at is this. th= e > > whole emphasis on materiality is involved in a larger movement to explo= re > > how things like ideation=2C imagination=2C the spiritual=2C beauty=2C t= ruth=2C > > goodness=2C justice--all our ideals and things normally associated with= the > > immaterial--operate in the material world. > > > > in this sense=2C we might say that the whole contemporary awareness of > > materiality in art is part of a larger ah spiritual materialism. i goog= led > > that term=2C after it occurred to me=2C and i assure you i'm using it i= n a > > different sense than ch=F6gyam trungpa=2C who uses it "to describe mist= akes > > spiritual seekers commit which turn the pursuit of spiritualism into an= ego > > building and confusion creating endeavor" (wikipedia). instead=2C i'm r= efering > > to a relatively common sort of philosophy in which the material substra= te of > > ideation and even the spiritual is affirmed and its relations with even= the > > flightiest of fancies are explored. not to denigrate or dismiss things = like > > spirituality but to explore how they operate materially. > > > > perhaps more evidently=2C now=2C this is also related to philosophies o= f mind > > in which the materiality of thought itself is affirmed--as a chemical a= nd > > informational process=2C however emergent--and the brain and the mind t= hat > > emerge from its processes are conceived as fully embodied in the materi= al. > > so that the idea of being able to create thinking machines (however unl= ike > > us) becomes a real possibility. and we are conceptualized as nature's > > (near?) ultimate machines. and machines are conceptualized not as the s= imple > > things we once thought they must be but as often very complex biologica= l > > creatures that=2C nonetheless=2C are embodied in the material world and= are=2C > > therefore=2C subject to the constraints and possibilities of machines i= n the > > material world. > > > > to wrap it up=2C we now see the relation between contemporary artistic > > emphasis on the materiality of writing/art and the larger moment of > > 'spiritual materialism'. > > > > ja > > http://vispo.com > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidel= ines > > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html _________________________________________________________________ Insert movie times and more without leaving Hotmail=AE.=20 http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/QuickAdd?ocid=3DTXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tut= orial_QuickAdd_062009= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 14:29:55 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: David-Baptiste Chirot Subject: Re: spiritual materialism In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Virtuality as Transcendentalism in Reverse . . .=20 =20 From the Transparent Eyeball to the All Seeing Panopticonic Eye =20 In his monumental five decade-long labor of love=2C the 18th Century Natural History=2C Buffon writes that perhaps the scaly tail of the beaver is due to its eating fish.= =20 Which=2C "quite naturally=2C" prompted some wag to query in that case=2C how long might be M Buffon's tail?--if=2C of cours= e=2C he did eat fish!-- In the "Language" section of "Nature" Emerson writes:=20 1. Words are signs of natural facts. =20 =20 ("And ain't that a natural born fact=2C Jack=2C" as the saying goes.) 2. Particular natural facts are symbols of particular spiritual facts. =20 =20 (The fish in Peter's image being=2C say=2C Pisces=2C or the Christian symb= ol of the fish=2C St Peter as a fisher of men=2C or an allegory of the fish dying= of polluted waters=2C or a sign for Fish Fry Fridays--)=20 3. Nature is the symbol of spirit.=20 =20 (Completing Emerson's Transcendental and redeeming version of the dreaded Jesuitical machinations known as the syllogism.)=20 Very quickly one moves from natural facts to words as their signs=2C to "particular" natural facts being symbols of spiritual facts and then to nature as a symb= ol of spirit.=20 The movement from the natural to the spiritual=2C from signs to symbols in a peculiar way see= ms not unlike what one might call a "Transcendentalism of the Virtual." Or=2C perhaps=2C Transcendentalism in Reverse=2C in the way that Robert Smithson=2C after Nabokov=2C wrote of construction sites as "ruins i= n reverse."=20 One begins--in this reversal-- from the Transcendental "spirit"--the Virtual Image--Virtuality being not unlike "spirit" in the sense that is "there" via symbols (digital codes)--and since particular spiritual facts are symbols of particular natural facts--(whose signs are words)--then--"nature is the symbol of spirit."=20 In other words=2C the world is a symbol of the virtual. Words as "signs of natural facts" which are "spiritual facts" which are the turning of nature into the symbol of the spiritual--are both "signs of natural facts" and symbols of the spirit. Language and nature are symbols of spirit--or=2C Virtuality.=20 Spirit is Virtuality. Virtuality is spirituality=2C and so=2C in a way=2C becomes=2C is=2C also virtue (The shared etymology of the Latin virtus.) Virtuality as virtue=2C as another form of the spirituality which redeems the "fallen world" by turning it into a "symbol."=20 This has a strange effect on the experience of=2C perception of=2C the world=2C as it no longer exists= =2C but is now world-as-symbol. For=2C if it is a symbol=2C this means the world is not "real." The world-as-symbol becomes a place of tourism for the "virtual eye"-- taking the Surrealists' trips to the flea markets to new heights.=20 There are tours now for persons to take in which they are shown the "signage" and other "symbols" of the virtual that exist in their neighborhoods. This form of perception is considered a "virtue."=20 The poet Charles Bernstein goes to China and comes back with --what else--but a great many photos of signs and "symbols." The disconnect between the English "mistranslations" from the Chinese is a=94symbolic joke" and illustrative of one's own virtue as a perceiver of signs and symbols. (Though I always wonder if the Chinese might not actually be saying something like--well=2C we shall leave that to the reade= r's imagination.)=20 By virtue=2C so to speak=2C of this effect of the Virtual=2C what is seen in the world are only those things which are signs = and symbols of the symbolic world of the Virtual. What one sees in the world is a reflection of the Virtual. That is=2C one recognizes as "real" only those things which one knows from the Virtual. In a sense the tours of one's neighborhood as a trove of signage and symbols are a form of training in th= is recognition of the Virtual "real" and its virtues.=20 Yet what of those who live=2C pagans=2C beyond the pale of the virtues of Virtual "access?" =20 One speaks of the "dependence on foreign oil"--one hears little about the "dependence on electricity" in terms of access to the "real" as it is realized in the Virtual.=20 Are those who exist beyond electricity's reach those are without virtue? This would seem to be the case for those affected by the following events: in Rwanda=2C when the massacres we= re to being=2C all cables=2C telephone lines=2C any electric access=2C was comple= tely cut off. Once sealed from the real Virtual world=2C the now Virtual "disappeareds" were removed from the world as being without virtue. In Myanmar=2C protests were followed by the cut-off with the outside world of cable and p= hone access. In the world's largest ever prison=2C already Walled off from the world=2C a "refugee Camp=2C" the Palestinians of Gaza are disappearing from virtue by virtue of the cut off of electricity. When all the lights go out--where will they be?=20 If one were to go about cutting off electricity=2C chopping off cables=2C pulling plugs=2C denying on line acce= ss to citizens for various reasons--controlling who is part of the Virtual and virtuous world--one might wonder if part of the possibility of this is to inculcate ever more "willing suspension of disbelief" in the Virtual and its virtues in the denizens of the Virtual.=20 For then will they not ever more willingly accede to the "transparency" of a new Transparent Eyeball in reverse=2C the Panoptical Eye of instantaneous "real time" surveillance of everyone and access to everyone's files=2C images=2C messages=2C transactio= ns in order to keep "secure" the virtue of the Virtual?=20 The threat of the loss of the Virtual=2C of being a part of the virtues of = the Virtual=2C may become a new form of discipline. And=2C desirous to not los= e one's sense of Virtual Reality=2C might not one then accede to entering int= o a world wide prison?=20 To "die" outside the Virtual--or to "Live" as a prisoner. Along those cheerful lines--Drew Kunz recently invited me to a group involv= ed with thinking on the artistic developments through time taking the grid as = a proposition for work. Personally I don't like grids at all (even though one benefits much of course from the virtues of the electronic grids--) and personal experience of them has done nothing to tarnish the dislike.=20 Yet paradoxically=2C due to this dislike of grids and what they may men in various circumstances=2C a great deal of my work has made use of the= m=2C far more than one realized. This flickr gallery includes works made with overt and explicit as well as more covert and implicit grids. Many are from a series of "Walls" which will be forthcoming in a book from Otoliths. The examples here are often of language that is affected by violence=2C fire=2C the wear and tear of Time=2C the "dirtiness" of non-Virtual and virtuous existence.=20 Attached is an essay "Hidden in Plain Sight" which appeared in Otoliths which discuss the impact since childhood of construction sites=2C crow's nests and found materials on my work and me= thods. The essay has a link to another short piece re Bob Cobbing=2C my friend and mentor. Of the two of us jw curry wro= te that=2C outside the division of "Clean" and "Dirty" Schools of Visual Poetry=2C there was the "Quick'nDirty" School of Cobbing and Chirot. Bob Cobbing was one of the great geniuses and artists of the 20th Century. He and Kurt Schwitters=2C with Dubuffet=2C are for me the th= ree most important artists of their times.=20 I see their work and what I continue on with as a kind of guerilla art of survival in the hidden in plain site/sigh= t/cite of the real world=2C as opposed to existing solely in the Virtual world whi= ch is not real=2C but a reflection=2C though its effects are real.=20 This kind of work can be done anytime any where with next to nothing at all except the everything that is here and there=2C there=2C there--found all around one=2C right at hand. It= is "born" of necessity=2C the Motherfucker of Invention.=20 Here is the link for the essay: the-otolith.blogspot.com/2006/07/david-baptiste-chirot- hidden -in-plain.html=20 and here the flickr link http://www.flickr.com/send?nsid=3D8237952@N06&set=3D72157603474988121 > Date: Mon=2C 6 Jul 2009 11:47:59 -0600 > From: azreel1138@GMAIL.COM > Subject: Re: spiritual materialism > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >=20 > Some of these ideas might approach the way Slavoj Zizek reads the Hegelia= n > paradox that "the spirit is a bone" .... I am travelling without any book= s > and so I can't say much more or even verify my quote etc but your the Ols= on > quote brings this idea to mind=2C in light of the previous email. >=20 > Jonathan Ball >=20 > On Sun=2C Jul 5=2C 2009 at 10:29 PM=2C Christopher Rizzo wrote: >=20 > > Jim=2C > > > > Interesting post. Are you familiar with Charles Olson's work? In a > > conversation with Herbert Kenny=2C 1969=2C Olson says "I mean something= I > > believe we possess crucially. I think our body is our soul. And if you > > don't > > have your body as a factor of creation=2C you don't have a soul." Olson > > articulates the same idea at other times=2C too. > > > > In any event=2C an explanation of the above would prove lengthy=2C so p= lease > > feel free to backchannel me if you're so inclined. I'm writing two book= s on > > Olson at the moment. > > > > c.rizzo@gmail.com > > > > Bests=2C > > Chris > > > > On Sun=2C Jul 5=2C 2009 at 3:41 PM=2C Jim Andrews wrote= : > > > > > it is commonly observed that a great deal of contemporary art/writin= g > > > involves a double sense of 'the material'. the term is understood to > > refer > > > not only to the subject matter (the 'standard' understanding in writi= ng) > > but > > > also the matter of the media in the piece=2C the material embodiment = of the > > > piece. it's also commonly observed that the latter awareness of and > > approach > > > to composition not solely by ideation=2C meditation on the subject ma= tter=2C > > but > > > also through operation on the material embodiment=2C has come to be m= uch > > more > > > widely understood as a part of reading than it was a generation ago. = when > > we > > > encounter work that does not follow the grammars and approaches > > > traditionally associated with work=2C we inquire into the methods of > > > composition=2C the approach to materiality=2C and look for relations = between > > > those methods and approaches and the subject matter=2C or look for th= e > > subject > > > matter in the light of those things. and so read differently=2C there= by. > > and > > > in this way=2C we now read some literary work in ways that are closer= to > > how > > > we approach a great deal of visual art. > > > > > > but what i want to get at is something that isn't so commonly observe= d=2C > > at > > > the moment=2C but may be in the next generation. and that's the relat= ion of > > > awareness of the materiality of writing/art to our ideas of who and w= hat > > we > > > are. that's erm awkwardly stated. what i'm trying to get at is this. = the > > > whole emphasis on materiality is involved in a larger movement to exp= lore > > > how things like ideation=2C imagination=2C the spiritual=2C beauty=2C= truth=2C > > > goodness=2C justice--all our ideals and things normally associated wi= th the > > > immaterial--operate in the material world. > > > > > > in this sense=2C we might say that the whole contemporary awareness o= f > > > materiality in art is part of a larger ah spiritual materialism. i > > googled > > > that term=2C after it occurred to me=2C and i assure you i'm using it= in a > > > different sense than ch=F6gyam trungpa=2C who uses it "to describe mi= stakes > > > spiritual seekers commit which turn the pursuit of spiritualism into = an > > ego > > > building and confusion creating endeavor" (wikipedia). instead=2C i'm > > refering > > > to a relatively common sort of philosophy in which the material subst= rate > > of > > > ideation and even the spiritual is affirmed and its relations with ev= en > > the > > > flightiest of fancies are explored. not to denigrate or dismiss thing= s > > like > > > spirituality but to explore how they operate materially. > > > > > > perhaps more evidently=2C now=2C this is also related to philosophies= of mind > > > in which the materiality of thought itself is affirmed--as a chemical= and > > > informational process=2C however emergent--and the brain and the mind= that > > > emerge from its processes are conceived as fully embodied in the > > material. > > > so that the idea of being able to create thinking machines (however > > unlike > > > us) becomes a real possibility. and we are conceptualized as nature's > > > (near?) ultimate machines. and machines are conceptualized not as the > > simple > > > things we once thought they must be but as often very complex biologi= cal > > > creatures that=2C nonetheless=2C are embodied in the material world a= nd are=2C > > > therefore=2C subject to the constraints and possibilities of machines= in > > the > > > material world. > > > > > > to wrap it up=2C we now see the relation between contemporary artisti= c > > > emphasis on the materiality of writing/art and the larger moment of > > > 'spiritual materialism'. > > > > > > ja > > > http://vispo.com > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > > guidelines > > > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidel= ines > > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > >=20 >=20 >=20 > --=20 > www.jonathanball.com > www.jonathanball.blogspot.com > www.haikuhoroscopes.com >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live=99 SkyDrive=99: Get 25 GB of free online storage. http://windowslive.com/online/skydrive?ocid=3DTXT_TAGLM_WL_SD_25GB_062009= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 16:08:12 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Christopher Rizzo Subject: Re: spiritual materialism In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I'm finding this string really quite interesting. Glad to hear evidence of such a wide-ranging interest. Aryanil, much thanks for reminding me of Whitman and Tagore. I'm tempted to add Pound to that set, too. There are a few significant differences between, say, Olson and Whitman. Briefly, Olson's cosmology took the philosophy of mathematics, quantum mechanics, and Cybernetic theory (which turns into information theory, really) into account, as well as the phenomenology of Merleau-Ponty, etc. For sure, there are similarities to Whitman, but I figured (perhaps too hastily?) that a post-Heisenberg view of reality might key into Jim's ideas a bit more readily. As for Eastern approaches to spirituality, perhaps one of the more interesting bits in Olson is his use of the first line from Wilhelm's translation of The Secret of the Golden Flower: "That which exists through itself is what is called meaning." And it is useful to note that Whilhelm translates "meaning" with a capital "M" (suggesting Tao), whereas Olson use= s the term in lower-case. Simply (and reductively), Olson uses the line to indicate something closer to autopoiesis than Logos, or rather the One. Creeley explains that one consequence of all this is that language is not "importantly" referential. Still provocative, I think. And, Chris, as for Benjamin, I'm thinking of his use of "nunc stans," in particular, and what uses it may have in this context.... Anyway, just a few thoughts. Bests, Chris On Mon, Jul 6, 2009 at 1:47 PM, Jonathan Ball wrote: > Some of these ideas might approach the way Slavoj Zizek reads the Hegelia= n > paradox that "the spirit is a bone" .... I am travelling without any book= s > and so I can't say much more or even verify my quote etc but your the Ols= on > quote brings this idea to mind, in light of the previous email. > > Jonathan Ball > > On Sun, Jul 5, 2009 at 10:29 PM, Christopher Rizzo >wrote: > > > Jim, > > > > Interesting post. Are you familiar with Charles Olson's work? In a > > conversation with Herbert Kenny, 1969, Olson says "I mean something I > > believe we possess crucially. I think our body is our soul. And if you > > don't > > have your body as a factor of creation, you don't have a soul." Olson > > articulates the same idea at other times, too. > > > > In any event, an explanation of the above would prove lengthy, so pleas= e > > feel free to backchannel me if you're so inclined. I'm writing two book= s > on > > Olson at the moment. > > > > c.rizzo@gmail.com > > > > Bests, > > Chris > > > > On Sun, Jul 5, 2009 at 3:41 PM, Jim Andrews wrote: > > > > > it is commonly observed that a great deal of contemporary art/writin= g > > > involves a double sense of 'the material'. the term is understood to > > refer > > > not only to the subject matter (the 'standard' understanding in > writing) > > but > > > also the matter of the media in the piece, the material embodiment of > the > > > piece. it's also commonly observed that the latter awareness of and > > approach > > > to composition not solely by ideation, meditation on the subject > matter, > > but > > > also through operation on the material embodiment, has come to be muc= h > > more > > > widely understood as a part of reading than it was a generation ago. > when > > we > > > encounter work that does not follow the grammars and approaches > > > traditionally associated with work, we inquire into the methods of > > > composition, the approach to materiality, and look for relations > between > > > those methods and approaches and the subject matter, or look for the > > subject > > > matter in the light of those things. and so read differently, thereby= . > > and > > > in this way, we now read some literary work in ways that are closer t= o > > how > > > we approach a great deal of visual art. > > > > > > but what i want to get at is something that isn't so commonly observe= d, > > at > > > the moment, but may be in the next generation. and that's the relatio= n > of > > > awareness of the materiality of writing/art to our ideas of who and > what > > we > > > are. that's erm awkwardly stated. what i'm trying to get at is this. > the > > > whole emphasis on materiality is involved in a larger movement to > explore > > > how things like ideation, imagination, the spiritual, beauty, truth, > > > goodness, justice--all our ideals and things normally associated with > the > > > immaterial--operate in the material world. > > > > > > in this sense, we might say that the whole contemporary awareness of > > > materiality in art is part of a larger ah spiritual materialism. i > > googled > > > that term, after it occurred to me, and i assure you i'm using it in = a > > > different sense than ch=C3=B6gyam trungpa, who uses it "to describe m= istakes > > > spiritual seekers commit which turn the pursuit of spiritualism into = an > > ego > > > building and confusion creating endeavor" (wikipedia). instead, i'm > > refering > > > to a relatively common sort of philosophy in which the material > substrate > > of > > > ideation and even the spiritual is affirmed and its relations with ev= en > > the > > > flightiest of fancies are explored. not to denigrate or dismiss thing= s > > like > > > spirituality but to explore how they operate materially. > > > > > > perhaps more evidently, now, this is also related to philosophies of > mind > > > in which the materiality of thought itself is affirmed--as a chemical > and > > > informational process, however emergent--and the brain and the mind > that > > > emerge from its processes are conceived as fully embodied in the > > material. > > > so that the idea of being able to create thinking machines (however > > unlike > > > us) becomes a real possibility. and we are conceptualized as nature's > > > (near?) ultimate machines. and machines are conceptualized not as the > > simple > > > things we once thought they must be but as often very complex > biological > > > creatures that, nonetheless, are embodied in the material world and > are, > > > therefore, subject to the constraints and possibilities of machines i= n > > the > > > material world. > > > > > > to wrap it up, we now see the relation between contemporary artistic > > > emphasis on the materiality of writing/art and the larger moment of > > > 'spiritual materialism'. > > > > > > ja > > > http://vispo.com > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > > guidelines > > > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines > > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > -- > www.jonathanball.com > www.jonathanball.blogspot.com > www.haikuhoroscopes.com > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 16:42:43 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: carol dorf Subject: Reading on July 11, Cafe Nefali, Berkeley MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi everyone, Carol Dorf will be reading on Saturday, July 11, 6:30-8:30 at Cafe Nefali in Berkeley (on Euclid) with Autumn Stephens and Judy Bebelar. Best, Carol ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 7 Jul 2009 13:22:24 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: William Allegrezza Subject: Series A in Chicago--Hunter and Kasimor MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Series A, July 8th Series A: Mary Kasimor and Carrie Hunter July 8, 2009=A0] Hyde Park Art Center Come to Series A on July 8th at the Hyde Park Art Center in Chicago to hear Mary Kasimor and Carrie Hunter. The reading takes place from 7-8. The HPAC is at 5020 S. Cornell. Parking is easy, and it's easy to get to on public transportation. BYOB. http://www.moriapoetry.com/seriesa.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 7 Jul 2009 18:52:12 +0000 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: twshaner@COMCAST.NET Subject: Farrah Field & Jared White Reading in Eugene 7/11 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable The DIVA Center's New Poetry Series presents an evening of poetry with=20 Farrah Field and Jared White who will be reading from their work at=20 7:30 PM on Saturday, July 11th. Admission: donation.=20 Farrah Field lives in Brooklyn , New York , and earned her MFA at=20 Columbia University . =C2=A0Her poems have appeared in Chelsea, Harp &=20 Altar, Harpur Palate, Margie, Massachusetts Review, Mississippi=20 Review, Pool, and Typo.=20 Field's first book of poems, Rising, won Four Way Books=E2=80=99 2007 Levis= =20 Prize (selected by Tony Hoagland). Rising is a gripping debut collection=20 that offers a new Southern poetry in which Field re-thinks Southern storyte= lling,=20 turning away from narratives of proud heritage to show that what is=20 alive is closest and most important.=20 Jared White was born in Boston and has lived in Brooklyn for about=20 eight years during which time he received an MFA in poetry from=20 Columbia . His poems have appeared in previous issues of Barrow Street ,=20 Cannibal, Coconut, Fulcrum, Harp & Altar, Horse Less Review, The=20 Modern Review, Sawbuck, and Word For/Word, among other journals. A=20 chapbook of poems entitled Yellowcake appears in the upcoming chapbook=20 collection, Narwhal, from Cannibal Books.=20 White was awarded a University Writing prize from the Academy of=20 American Poets . He maintains an occasional blog, No No Yes No Yes, at=20 jaredswhite.blogspot.com.=20 =C2=A0=20 For an interview with the two poets, see:=20 http://pshares.blogspot.com/2008/06/new-voices-2-and-3-farrah-field-and.htm= l=20 =C2=A0=20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 7 Jul 2009 07:05:49 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: mIEKAL aND Subject: appalling, redacted, pulchritude Comments: To: British & Irish poets , Theory and Writing Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v935.3) Which words make you wince? Poets have been asked for their most hated words. What are yours? 'What word do you hate and why?' is the intriguing question put to a =20 selection of poets by the Ledbury festival. Philip Wells's reply is =20 the winner for me - 'pulchritude' is certainly up there on my =20 blacklist. He even explains his animosity in suitably poetic terms: "it violates all the magical impulses of balanced onomatopoeic =20 language - it of course means "beautiful", but its meaning is nothing =20= of the sort, being stuffed to the brim with a brutally latinate cudgel =20= of barbaric consonants. If consonants represent riverbanks and vowels =20= the river's flow, this is the word equivalent of the bottomless abyss =20= of dry bones, where demons gather to spit acid." For Geraldine Monk, "it's got to be 'redacted' which makes me feel =20 totally sick. It's a brutish sounding word. It doesn't flow, it prods =20= at you in a nasty manner." Both these poets understand that the key to words that make you feel =20 nauseous is not the meaning - it's easy, after all, to hate the word =20 'torture' =96 but something else entirely. Something idiosyncratic, =20 something about the way the word feels in your mouth as you say it. =20 The horrors of 'membrane', for instance. Or the eccentricity of =20 'gusset'. Having said that, I'm still trying to get my head around Paul =20 Batchelor's explanation that "I've always hated the word 'APPAL' (or =20 'appalled' or 'appalling') because I dislike hearing the sound of my =20 name inside other words." I can't work out if there's a case of =20 extreme ego or extreme self-hatred going on there. And I can't help feeling that Ros Barber misses the point with her =20 rather po-faced reply. "Words are to be loved. Their associations may =20= be unpleasant but words themselves are full of poetry (and history, =20 and geography)," she says. "Delicious vowel sounds and tongue-tickling =20= consonants. There isn't a word in the English language that doesn't =20 excite me if I think about it long enough." Sorry, Ros, I can't agree. I'm with Rhian Edwards on 'chillax' - "the =20= most unnecessary and obnoxious linguistic blend to have ever been =20 coined". Except possibly for 'no-brainer'... Whether it's 'hubby' or 'sassy' or 'webinar' =96 what are the words that = =20 make you wince? (many folks are posting their most hated words in the comments) = http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/booksblog/2009/jul/07/words-wince-hated-po= ets= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 7 Jul 2009 13:28:55 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Lauren Russell Subject: Re: mourning & poetics MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mary, thanks for this observation.=A0 I wonder if it is really true that pe= ople (or poets specifically?)=A0 are more likely to turn to classical or ly= ric works in the midst of grief.=A0 In my experience it is not.=A0 At a tim= e in my life when I was grieving deeply, I read Alice Notley's From the Beg= inning literary dozens of times, carried it around with me in my bag, read = and reread it without really thinking about its poetics but finding some pu= rely emotional validation in the work that I wasn't finding elsewhere.=A0 I= t was only later, when I wrote an essay on From the Beginning, that I even = noticed that there was a narrative.=A0 So I don't=A0 think that reading it = as a griever required more intellectual resources than reading a lyric work= would have, because I wasn't reading on an intellectual level at that time= .=A0 Does that make sense? Lauren=20 Date:=A0 =A0 Mon, 6 Jul 2009 09:25:57 -0400 From:=A0 =A0 Mary Jo Malo Subject: Re: mourning & poetics What happened to the original poster of this query?=A0 I'd be interested in her thoughts on the matter. (Lauren=A0 Russell) Lauren et al. Thank you for all your references and comments. What prompted my query is my observation (subjective perspective) that in the initial shock and grief of loss we tend to turn to classical, lyrical, and SoQ poetry rather than post-avant and other named postmodern poetry. Either it is because we are truly at a loss for words; and these poems are the most accessible and easily shared, or we haven't the intellectual and emotional resources to engage more abstract poetry. After a "suitable" period of time, when we've had time to process the grief, the creative process ignites, and we're able to craft and read postmodern or existential poetry which more accurately portrays the loss itself. In other words, words fail, but the art of them doesn't. Regarding the SoQ/Post-Avant dichotomy itself, what I've managed to glean from casual reading, is the criticism is aimed at ending what Mr. Silliman's considers a hegemony in traditional publishing and academia. My impression (again, subjective and lacking in pedantics) is that among the small press and internet poetics community, the hegemony is strictly post-avant. Mary --=20 http://thisshiningwound.blogspot.com/ http://apophisdeconstructingabsurdity.blogspot.com/ =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 7 Jul 2009 18:34:12 -0400 Reply-To: dbuuck@mindspring.com Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: David Buuck Subject: David Buuck & Alli Warren @ Books & Bookshelves 7/16 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Alli Warren & David Buuck reading at B&B Thursday, July 16, 730pm Books & Bookshelves 99 Sanchez, SF http://booksandbookshelves.blogspot.com/ Alli Warren is the author of the chapbooks Schema, Yoke, Hounds, Cousins, No Can Do, and with Michael Nicoloff, Bruised Dick. Mitzvah Chaps will soon a publish a work variously known as That's What She Said, To From Where, What Kinds of Flutes We Should Use, and Alienated Beaver. She works in Berkeley and lives in Oakland. David Buuck lives in Oakland. He is the author of The Shunt & several booklets of cross-genre writing. He is the founder of BARGE (the Bay Area Research Group in Enviro-aesthetics) & a writing teacher. (apologies for cross-posting) ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 7 Jul 2009 18:36:58 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Al Filreis Subject: PoemTalk #19 released: learn the language Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v935.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit We are pleased to announce the release of PoemTalk #19, a discussion by Tom Mandel, Sarah Dowling and Rodrigo Toscano of Bob Perelman's "The Unruly Child": http://www.poemtalk.org PoemTalk programs are also available at the Poetry Foundation (http://www.poetryfoundation.org ) and in iTunes. In your iTunes music store, type "PoemTalk" in the searchbox. Al Filreis http://www.writing.upenn.edu/~afilreis ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 7 Jul 2009 09:29:00 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Nicholas Piombino Subject: Re: mourning & poetics In-Reply-To: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit This is one of those threads that gets me thinking, and I've been looking forward to every post. I've not read them all, so I apologize if I am repeating anything. Eight years ago when someone I felt particularly close to died, almost literally in my arms, I needed some poetry that would help. What met my need at the time was Lynn Dreyer's book The White Museum (Roof,1986). Here's a sample: http://poetryproject.org/wp-content/uploads/v124-kimberly-lyons-lynne-dreyer .pdf. Something about its heartbeat, its wave-like backbeat, soothed me, the way a mother might rock a child during a stricken moment. That episode of choice in reading pushed me towards thinking about writing as healing, an issue that's been on my mind ever since. Much of post-avant writing, obviously, employs parody, often of a particularly biting kind. It's no surprise that at a time of ear splitting, mind smashing hypocrisies and assaults on a social/political level that some of our best minds might want to address such grotesque realties in ways that accurately reflect them when modes of earnestness or literal or symbolic or abstract statement, what I once called writing below the din, won't suffice. At a time of personal crisis, what one might want, what I wanted as I said, are truthful yet gentle words, singing, compassionate, and yes, even quiet words. Still, such occasional personal needs probably do not justify a dominant poetics of quietism in an ongoing way. There is something reassuring and stimulating about experiencing a number of relatively newer voices work to invent and persist with new forms that convincingly reflect the impossibility of accepting as such the eco-socio-political realities we are forced to live in right now. The post avant employs a biting, confrontational voice that says, to me anyway, don't give up trying to dispassionately recognize and reveal what that reality is, as painfully traumatic, as incessantly quotidian as it is coming to be. Forms that meet that continuous nightmare face to face, as unimaginable as it is, or was. Is the most relevant issue in contemporary poetics hegemony, or power, or is it which model, the quietist or the post-avant, suggests the more apropos interpretation of current reality as it actually presents itself? Either way, life's needs are inordinately complex, and issues of poetic movement aside, one size will not always fit all. On 7/6/09 9:25 AM, "Mary Jo Malo" wrote: > What happened to the original poster of this query? I'd be interested > in her thoughts on the matter. (Lauren Russell) > > Lauren et al. Thank you for all your references and comments. > > What prompted my query is my observation (subjective perspective) that > in the initial shock and grief of loss we tend to turn to classical, > lyrical, and SoQ poetry rather than post-avant and other named > postmodern poetry. Either it is because we are truly at a loss for > words; and these poems are the most accessible and easily shared, or > we haven't the intellectual and emotional resources to engage more > abstract poetry. After a "suitable" period of time, when we've had > time to process the grief, the creative process ignites, and we're > able to craft and read postmodern or existential poetry which more > accurately portrays the loss itself. In other words, words fail, but > the art of them doesn't. > > Regarding the SoQ/Post-Avant dichotomy itself, what I've managed to > glean from casual reading, is the criticism is aimed at ending what > Mr. Silliman's considers a hegemony in traditional publishing and > academia. My impression (again, subjective and lacking in pedantics) > is that among the small press and internet poetics community, the > hegemony is strictly post-avant. > > Mary ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 8 Jul 2009 00:11:36 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Ruth Lepson Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude In-Reply-To: <597B39FE-1FB9-4BA0-938A-C5601C921CB0@gmail.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable 'indeed' On 7/7/09 8:05 AM, "mIEKAL aND" wrote: > Which words make you wince? > Poets have been asked for their most hated words. What are yours? >=20 > 'What word do you hate and why?' is the intriguing question put to a > selection of poets by the Ledbury festival. Philip Wells's reply is > the winner for me - 'pulchritude' is certainly up there on my > blacklist. He even explains his animosity in suitably poetic terms: >=20 > "it violates all the magical impulses of balanced onomatopoeic > language - it of course means "beautiful", but its meaning is nothing > of the sort, being stuffed to the brim with a brutally latinate cudgel > of barbaric consonants. If consonants represent riverbanks and vowels > the river's flow, this is the word equivalent of the bottomless abyss > of dry bones, where demons gather to spit acid." >=20 > For Geraldine Monk, "it's got to be 'redacted' which makes me feel > totally sick. It's a brutish sounding word. It doesn't flow, it prods > at you in a nasty manner." >=20 > Both these poets understand that the key to words that make you feel > nauseous is not the meaning - it's easy, after all, to hate the word > 'torture' =AD but something else entirely. Something idiosyncratic, > something about the way the word feels in your mouth as you say it. > The horrors of 'membrane', for instance. Or the eccentricity of > 'gusset'. >=20 > Having said that, I'm still trying to get my head around Paul > Batchelor's explanation that "I've always hated the word 'APPAL' (or > 'appalled' or 'appalling') because I dislike hearing the sound of my > name inside other words." I can't work out if there's a case of > extreme ego or extreme self-hatred going on there. >=20 > And I can't help feeling that Ros Barber misses the point with her > rather po-faced reply. "Words are to be loved. Their associations may > be unpleasant but words themselves are full of poetry (and history, > and geography)," she says. "Delicious vowel sounds and tongue-tickling > consonants. There isn't a word in the English language that doesn't > excite me if I think about it long enough." >=20 > Sorry, Ros, I can't agree. I'm with Rhian Edwards on 'chillax' - "the > most unnecessary and obnoxious linguistic blend to have ever been > coined". Except possibly for 'no-brainer'... >=20 > Whether it's 'hubby' or 'sassy' or 'webinar' =AD what are the words that > make you wince? >=20 > (many folks are posting their most hated words in the comments) >=20 > http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/booksblog/2009/jul/07/words-wince-hated-p= oets > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es & > sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 8 Jul 2009 00:11:59 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Murat Nemet-Nejat Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude In-Reply-To: <597B39FE-1FB9-4BA0-938A-C5601C921CB0@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Ever since I read Catcher on the Rye almost fifty years ago, I hate the wor= d "grand" -in the sense of something being grand- which was also Caulfield's least favorite word. Ciao, Murat On Tue, Jul 7, 2009 at 8:05 AM, mIEKAL aND wrote: > Which words make you wince? > Poets have been asked for their most hated words. What are yours? > > 'What word do you hate and why?' is the intriguing question put to a > selection of poets by the Ledbury festival. Philip Wells's reply is the > winner for me - 'pulchritude' is certainly up there on my blacklist. He e= ven > explains his animosity in suitably poetic terms: > > "it violates all the magical impulses of balanced onomatopoeic language - > it of course means "beautiful", but its meaning is nothing of the sort, > being stuffed to the brim with a brutally latinate cudgel of barbaric > consonants. If consonants represent riverbanks and vowels the river's flo= w, > this is the word equivalent of the bottomless abyss of dry bones, where > demons gather to spit acid." > > For Geraldine Monk, "it's got to be 'redacted' which makes me feel totall= y > sick. It's a brutish sounding word. It doesn't flow, it prods at you in a > nasty manner." > > Both these poets understand that the key to words that make you feel > nauseous is not the meaning - it's easy, after all, to hate the word > 'torture' =96 but something else entirely. Something idiosyncratic, somet= hing > about the way the word feels in your mouth as you say it. The horrors of > 'membrane', for instance. Or the eccentricity of 'gusset'. > > Having said that, I'm still trying to get my head around Paul Batchelor's > explanation that "I've always hated the word 'APPAL' (or 'appalled' or > 'appalling') because I dislike hearing the sound of my name inside other > words." I can't work out if there's a case of extreme ego or extreme > self-hatred going on there. > > And I can't help feeling that Ros Barber misses the point with her rather > po-faced reply. "Words are to be loved. Their associations may be unpleas= ant > but words themselves are full of poetry (and history, and geography)," sh= e > says. "Delicious vowel sounds and tongue-tickling consonants. There isn't= a > word in the English language that doesn't excite me if I think about it l= ong > enough." > > Sorry, Ros, I can't agree. I'm with Rhian Edwards on 'chillax' - "the mos= t > unnecessary and obnoxious linguistic blend to have ever been coined". Exc= ept > possibly for 'no-brainer'... > > Whether it's 'hubby' or 'sassy' or 'webinar' =96 what are the words that = make > you wince? > > (many folks are posting their most hated words in the comments) > > > http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/booksblog/2009/jul/07/words-wince-hated-p= oets > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 8 Jul 2009 09:03:21 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: "Shankar, Ravi (English)" Subject: Drunken Boat's special tenth anniversary issue is live! MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Drunken Boat, international online journal of the arts, celebrates its = tenth anniversary with Issue#10, featuring ten folios and over three hundred writers and artists. Including archival items from the Black Mountain School(1933-1957), 100 contemporary poets, Conceptual Fiction, = Electronic Arts, MisTranslation, Visual and Video Poetry, Nonfiction, arts from = Asia and by Tribal Peoples, and our Best in Show, a look back at the last 10 years of Drunken Boat. Now live online and featuring a new blog at: http://www.drunkenboat.com=20 Join us on Friday, July 10th at the SoHo20 Gallery in NYC to celebrate = the launch of this extraordinary issue. Friday, July 10th 6:00 pm to 8:00 pm SoHo20 Gallery 511 West 25th St. Suite 605 NEW YORK, NY 10001 Thanks for your continued support! The Editors, http://www.drunkenboat.com=20 ***************=20 Ravi Shankar=20 Ed., http://www.drunkenboat.com=20 Poet-in-Residence=20 Associate Professor=20 CCSU - English Dept.=20 860-832-2766=20 shankarr@ccsu.edu=20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 8 Jul 2009 07:37:35 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Dan Glass Subject: Re: mourning & poetics In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I wrote on some of these issues in a piece on Charles Bernstein's Girly Man for Jacket a couple years ago, here: http://jacketmagazine.com/33/thomas-glass-bernstein.shtml Specifically, how the poet's poet's response to 9/11, his grief around the event, creates a lyric (and even, as Lauren puts it, a classical, in fact explicitly Romantic) turn in the book. That lyric turn turns out to make the collection 'accessible' according to the majority of reviews. Seconding the interest in this thread,,, Dan On Tue, Jul 7, 2009 at 6:29 AM, Nicholas Piombino wrote: > This is one of those threads that gets me thinking, and I've been looking > forward to every post. I've not read them all, so I apologize if I am > repeating anything. Eight years ago when someone I felt particularly close > to died, almost literally in my arms, I needed some poetry that would help. > What met my need at the time was Lynn Dreyer's book The White Museum > (Roof,1986). Here's a sample: > > http://poetryproject.org/wp-content/uploads/v124-kimberly-lyons-lynne-dreyer > .pdf. > Something about its heartbeat, its wave-like backbeat, soothed me, the > way a mother might rock a child during a stricken moment. That episode of > choice in reading pushed me towards thinking about writing as healing, an > issue that's been on my mind ever since. > > Much of post-avant writing, obviously, employs parody, often of a > particularly biting kind. It's no surprise that at a time of ear splitting, > mind smashing hypocrisies and assaults on a social/political level that > some > of our best minds might want to address such grotesque realties in ways > that > accurately reflect them when modes of earnestness or literal or symbolic or > abstract statement, what I once called writing below the din, won't > suffice. > > At a time of personal crisis, what one might want, what I wanted as I said, > are truthful yet gentle words, singing, compassionate, and yes, even quiet > words. Still, such occasional personal needs probably do not justify a > dominant poetics of quietism in an ongoing way. There is something > reassuring and stimulating about experiencing a number of relatively newer > voices work to invent and persist with new forms that convincingly reflect > the impossibility of accepting as such the eco-socio-political realities we > are forced to live in right now. The post avant employs a biting, > confrontational voice that says, to me anyway, don't give up trying to > dispassionately recognize and reveal what that reality is, as painfully > traumatic, as incessantly quotidian as it is coming to be. Forms that meet > that continuous nightmare face to face, as unimaginable as it is, or was. > Is > the most relevant issue in contemporary poetics hegemony, or power, or is > it > which model, the quietist or the post-avant, suggests the more apropos > interpretation of current reality as it actually presents itself? > > Either way, life's needs are inordinately complex, and issues of poetic > movement aside, one size will not always fit all. > > > On 7/6/09 9:25 AM, "Mary Jo Malo" wrote: > > > What happened to the original poster of this query? I'd be interested > > in her thoughts on the matter. (Lauren Russell) > > > > Lauren et al. Thank you for all your references and comments. > > > > What prompted my query is my observation (subjective perspective) that > > in the initial shock and grief of loss we tend to turn to classical, > > lyrical, and SoQ poetry rather than post-avant and other named > > postmodern poetry. Either it is because we are truly at a loss for > > words; and these poems are the most accessible and easily shared, or > > we haven't the intellectual and emotional resources to engage more > > abstract poetry. After a "suitable" period of time, when we've had > > time to process the grief, the creative process ignites, and we're > > able to craft and read postmodern or existential poetry which more > > accurately portrays the loss itself. In other words, words fail, but > > the art of them doesn't. > > > > Regarding the SoQ/Post-Avant dichotomy itself, what I've managed to > > glean from casual reading, is the criticism is aimed at ending what > > Mr. Silliman's considers a hegemony in traditional publishing and > > academia. My impression (again, subjective and lacking in pedantics) > > is that among the small press and internet poetics community, the > > hegemony is strictly post-avant. > > > > Mary > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 8 Jul 2009 13:59:21 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: amy king Subject: Stain's Hunter College MFA Spectacular in a new space! Comments: To: new-poetry@wiz.cath.vt.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hunter College MFA Spectacular in a new space! =0ABanias, Colic, Funaro, Hoffman, Joblin & Kearns =0AThe Stain of Poetry: A Reading Series =0ASaturday, July 11, 2009, 6:00pm - 8:00pm =0Asouth 4th bar =0A90 South 4th Street at Berry St =0ABrooklyn, NY (L Train to Bedford) =0A =0AIn a Very Special Issue of Stain, we're test-driving a friendly new =0Aspace in Williamsburg and celebrating Hunter's finest. =0A =0AAri Banias has poems in recent or upcoming issues of Literary =0AImagination, EOAGH, The Cincinnati Review, Field, Aufgabe, The =0APortable Boog Reader, and elsewhere. He sometimes teaches writing and =0Aliterature at Hunter College, and often sells books and hosts readings =0Aat Unnameable Books, in Prospect Heights. =0A =0ADanica Colic lives in Brooklyn and teaches writing at Hunter College, =0Awhere she also received her MFA. Her poems have appeared in Terrain, =0ARealPoetik, Arts & Letters, and Pebble Lake Review. =0A =0AMaya Funaro's chapbook Setting in Motion was released this spring by =0AFox Point Press. She completed her MFA in poetry at Hunter College in =0AMay of 2008. She holds a B.A. in Visual Art from Brown University and =0Ahas studied printmaking, bookbinding and letterpress printing in =0AProvidence, Bologna and New York. Born and raised in South Jersey, she =0Acurrently makes her home in Sunset Park, Brooklyn. =0A =0AColie Hoffman lives and writes in New York, though she also calls =0ANorth Carolina home. She received her MFA from Hunter College in 2009. =0AHer work has appeared in Blood Orange Review, The Furnace Review and =0AObsidian. =0A =0AAlana Joblin grew up in Philadelphia. Prior to making New York City =0Aher home eight years ago, she earned her B.A. at Oberlin College, =0Astudying English and Religion, followed by seven months of writing =0Apoems in Israel's desert, as part of the Arad Arts Project. Alana =0Aearned her MFA in poetry at Hunter College, where she also teaches =0Aundergraduate creative writing. Her work has appeared in Quarterly =0AWest, Crab Orchard Review, Womens Collaborative Circle and RealPoetik. =0A =0ACaledonia Kearns lives in Brooklyn with her daughter and is the editor =0Aof two anthologies of Irish American women's writing. A proud graduate =0Aof Hunter College's MFA program, a selection of her poems were =0Arecently published in The New Haven Review. =0A =0AAnd we're proud to introduce you to South 4th Bar: =0Ahttp://www.south4thbar.com/, a laid-back neighborhood haunt supportive =0Aof local art! Excellent brews & cocktails await. =0A =0ASouth 4th Bar =0A90 South 4th St =0A(between Wythe Ave & Berry St) =0AWilliamsburg, Brooklyn =0ATake L to Bedford Ave or J, M, Z trains to Marcy Ave =0A =0A =0Ahttp://stainofpoetry.com _______ =0A =0AAmy's Alias =0Ahttp://amyking.org/=0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 8 Jul 2009 19:05:48 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: amy king Subject: CFW - Call for Essays/Stories: Voices Through the Wall: Prisoners Write About Prisons [on behalf of Annie Finch] Comments: To: Women's Poetry Listserve , new-poetry@wiz.cath.vt.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Call for Essays/StoriesVoices Through the=0AWall: Prisoners Write About Pri= sons=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0 The=0Aeditors seek non-fiction essays and prose fiction by men and wome= n currently=0Aincarcerated in American prisons. We believe that inmates con= stitute a rich but=0Auntapped intellectual and cultural resource.=C2=A0 We = hope to create a collection that mines the experience and=0Awisdom of inmat= es, in order to offer a better understanding of the prison=E2=80=99s=0Aplac= e in society.=C2=A0 We seek authors=0Awho write with the authority that onl= y incarceration can bring.=C2=A0 We want their voices to become part of=0Aa= public dialogue about the prison system, its culture, the environment of= =0Atoday=E2=80=99s facilities, etc.=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 We are open to=0Amany styles, but all submitted essays/prose=0Amust draw on= first-hand experience.Some topics of interest to us are: conditions; copin= g; visions of=0Aa better way to operate (both personally and institutionall= y); self-reflection=0Aon the work of dealing with time inside; the challeng= es of physical and=0Apsychological survival; personal histories; what works= and why it works; what=0Adoesn=E2=80=99t work and why it doesn=E2=80=99t w= ork, etc. =C2=A0We are also very open to seeing what we hadn't looked=0Afor= .=C2=A0=20 =C2=A0=C2=A0 Voices Through the Wall will showcase what the incarcerated ha= ve to=0Aoffer to the public.=C2=A0 We value=0Apolished, quality writing tha= t takes thoughtful positions even on the most=0Apassionately felt ideas. *** Word Limit: 5,000 words (approximately 15 double-spaced=0Apages).=C2=A0 Ple= ase number pages.=C2=A0 Clearly composed handwritten=0Amanuscripts are also= acceptable.=C2=A0 There=0Ais no reading fee. =C2=A0Authors should not send= the sole copies of their work.=C2=A0 (Keep a copy of your own.)=C2=A0 Plea= se include sufficient contact=0Ainformation (direct or through a program su= pervisor) so that we can inform=0Aauthors of our decisions.=C2=A0 All=0Acon= tributors will be notified of results.=C2=A0=0AIf possible, include postage= (44-cent stamp) so we can mail our decision.=C2=A0 We cannot return manusc= ripts (which=0Awill be recycled).=20 Program supervisors are encouraged to solicit high-quality work=0Aand submi= t essays together in a single mailing. The editors may request revisions of promising work. ***Send work to:=C2=A0=E2=80=9CVoices Through the Wall=E2=80=9D198 College = Hill RoadClinton, NY 13323 Submission=0Adeadline: March 1, 2010=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A _______ =0A =0AAmy's Alias =0Ahttp://amyking.org/=0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 8 Jul 2009 10:33:00 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Mary Kasimor Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I really hate words that have a corporate efficiency purpose,=A0usually wor= ds that were nouns but have become verbs. --- On Tue, 7/7/09, Ruth Lepson wrote: From: Ruth Lepson Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Tuesday, July 7, 2009, 11:11 PM 'indeed' On 7/7/09 8:05 AM, "mIEKAL aND" wrote: > Which words make you wince? > Poets have been asked for their most hated words. What are yours? >=20 > 'What word do you hate and why?' is the intriguing question put to a > selection of poets by the Ledbury festival. Philip Wells's reply is > the winner for me - 'pulchritude' is certainly up there on my > blacklist. He even explains his animosity in suitably poetic terms: >=20 > "it violates all the magical impulses of balanced onomatopoeic > language - it of course means "beautiful", but its meaning is nothing > of the sort, being stuffed to the brim with a brutally latinate cudgel > of barbaric consonants. If consonants represent riverbanks and vowels > the river's flow, this is the word equivalent of the bottomless abyss > of dry bones, where demons gather to spit acid." >=20 > For Geraldine Monk, "it's got to be 'redacted' which makes me feel > totally sick. It's a brutish sounding word. It doesn't flow, it prods > at you in a nasty manner." >=20 > Both these poets understand that the key to words that make you feel > nauseous is not the meaning - it's easy, after all, to hate the word > 'torture' =AD but something else entirely. Something idiosyncratic, > something about the way the word feels in your mouth as you say it. > The horrors of 'membrane', for instance. Or the eccentricity of > 'gusset'. >=20 > Having said that, I'm still trying to get my head around Paul > Batchelor's explanation that "I've always hated the word 'APPAL' (or > 'appalled' or 'appalling') because I dislike hearing the sound of my > name inside other words." I can't work out if there's a case of > extreme ego or extreme self-hatred going on there. >=20 > And I can't help feeling that Ros Barber misses the point with her > rather po-faced reply. "Words are to be loved. Their associations may > be unpleasant but words themselves are full of poetry (and history, > and geography)," she says. "Delicious vowel sounds and tongue-tickling > consonants. There isn't a word in the English language that doesn't > excite me if I think about it long enough." >=20 > Sorry, Ros, I can't agree. I'm with Rhian Edwards on 'chillax' - "the > most unnecessary and obnoxious linguistic blend to have ever been > coined". Except possibly for 'no-brainer'... >=20 > Whether it's 'hubby' or 'sassy' or 'webinar' =AD what are the words that > make you wince? >=20 > (many folks are posting their most hated words in the comments) >=20 > http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/booksblog/2009/jul/07/words-wince-hated-p= oets > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es & > sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 8 Jul 2009 13:39:47 +0530 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve dalachinsky Subject: harold norse MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit the poet harold norse passed recently and we will be doing a reading etc in his honor at the cornelia st cafe in manhattan july 20th 6 pm if anyone knows a good source of where i can find info about norse's paintings please let me know thanks steve ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 8 Jul 2009 13:45:39 +0530 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve dalachinsky Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit catcher IN the rye On Wed, 8 Jul 2009 00:11:59 -0400 Murat Nemet-Nejat writes: > Ever since I read Catcher on the Rye almost fifty years ago, I hate > the word > "grand" -in the sense of something being grand- which was also > Caulfield's > least favorite word. > > Ciao, > > Murat > > > On Tue, Jul 7, 2009 at 8:05 AM, mIEKAL aND > wrote: > > > Which words make you wince? > > Poets have been asked for their most hated words. What are yours? > > > > 'What word do you hate and why?' is the intriguing question put to > a > > selection of poets by the Ledbury festival. Philip Wells's reply > is the > > winner for me - 'pulchritude' is certainly up there on my > blacklist. He even > > explains his animosity in suitably poetic terms: > > > > "it violates all the magical impulses of balanced onomatopoeic > language - > > it of course means "beautiful", but its meaning is nothing of the > sort, > > being stuffed to the brim with a brutally latinate cudgel of > barbaric > > consonants. If consonants represent riverbanks and vowels the > river's flow, > > this is the word equivalent of the bottomless abyss of dry bones, > where > > demons gather to spit acid." > > > > For Geraldine Monk, "it's got to be 'redacted' which makes me feel > totally > > sick. It's a brutish sounding word. It doesn't flow, it prods at > you in a > > nasty manner." > > > > Both these poets understand that the key to words that make you > feel > > nauseous is not the meaning - it's easy, after all, to hate the > word > > 'torture' – but something else entirely. Something idiosyncratic, > something > > about the way the word feels in your mouth as you say it. The > horrors of > > 'membrane', for instance. Or the eccentricity of 'gusset'. > > > > Having said that, I'm still trying to get my head around Paul > Batchelor's > > explanation that "I've always hated the word 'APPAL' (or > 'appalled' or > > 'appalling') because I dislike hearing the sound of my name inside > other > > words." I can't work out if there's a case of extreme ego or > extreme > > self-hatred going on there. > > > > And I can't help feeling that Ros Barber misses the point with her > rather > > po-faced reply. "Words are to be loved. Their associations may be > unpleasant > > but words themselves are full of poetry (and history, and > geography)," she > > says. "Delicious vowel sounds and tongue-tickling consonants. > There isn't a > > word in the English language that doesn't excite me if I think > about it long > > enough." > > > > Sorry, Ros, I can't agree. I'm with Rhian Edwards on 'chillax' - > "the most > > unnecessary and obnoxious linguistic blend to have ever been > coined". Except > > possibly for 'no-brainer'... > > > > Whether it's 'hubby' or 'sassy' or 'webinar' – what are the words > that make > > you wince? > > > > (many folks are posting their most hated words in the comments) > > > > > > > http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/booksblog/2009/jul/07/words-wince-hated-p oets > > ================================== > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines > > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 8 Jul 2009 11:02:34 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Mary Kasimor Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable The word that I was looking for that I just HATE is "impacted." Mary --- On Tue, 7/7/09, Ruth Lepson wrote: From: Ruth Lepson Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Tuesday, July 7, 2009, 11:11 PM 'indeed' On 7/7/09 8:05 AM, "mIEKAL aND" wrote: > Which words make you wince? > Poets have been asked for their most hated words. What are yours? >=20 > 'What word do you hate and why?' is the intriguing question put to a > selection of poets by the Ledbury festival. Philip Wells's reply is > the winner for me - 'pulchritude' is certainly up there on my > blacklist. He even explains his animosity in suitably poetic terms: >=20 > "it violates all the magical impulses of balanced onomatopoeic > language - it of course means "beautiful", but its meaning is nothing > of the sort, being stuffed to the brim with a brutally latinate cudgel > of barbaric consonants. If consonants represent riverbanks and vowels > the river's flow, this is the word equivalent of the bottomless abyss > of dry bones, where demons gather to spit acid." >=20 > For Geraldine Monk, "it's got to be 'redacted' which makes me feel > totally sick. It's a brutish sounding word. It doesn't flow, it prods > at you in a nasty manner." >=20 > Both these poets understand that the key to words that make you feel > nauseous is not the meaning - it's easy, after all, to hate the word > 'torture' =AD but something else entirely. Something idiosyncratic, > something about the way the word feels in your mouth as you say it. > The horrors of 'membrane', for instance. Or the eccentricity of > 'gusset'. >=20 > Having said that, I'm still trying to get my head around Paul > Batchelor's explanation that "I've always hated the word 'APPAL' (or > 'appalled' or 'appalling') because I dislike hearing the sound of my > name inside other words." I can't work out if there's a case of > extreme ego or extreme self-hatred going on there. >=20 > And I can't help feeling that Ros Barber misses the point with her > rather po-faced reply. "Words are to be loved. Their associations may > be unpleasant but words themselves are full of poetry (and history, > and geography)," she says. "Delicious vowel sounds and tongue-tickling > consonants. There isn't a word in the English language that doesn't > excite me if I think about it long enough." >=20 > Sorry, Ros, I can't agree. I'm with Rhian Edwards on 'chillax' - "the > most unnecessary and obnoxious linguistic blend to have ever been > coined". Except possibly for 'no-brainer'... >=20 > Whether it's 'hubby' or 'sassy' or 'webinar' =AD what are the words that > make you wince? >=20 > (many folks are posting their most hated words in the comments) >=20 > http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/booksblog/2009/jul/07/words-wince-hated-p= oets > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es & > sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 8 Jul 2009 16:46:09 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Camille Martin Subject: rogue embryo's blog Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Hi, please visit the blog of the last person in the world to get one: http://www.rogueembryo.wordpress.com Camille Martin =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 8 Jul 2009 12:34:28 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: David Chirot Subject: Re: mourning & poetics In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I apologize i neglected before recommend a very great contemporary work on grief and mourning, the best in poetry i am aware of personally, --though i like also much alice notley's-- and the most interesting, experimental and engaging one--is THE LIGHT SANG AS IT LEFT YOUR EYES Our Autobiography as it is the lives of both Eileen and her father during the their life times and interrelationships before and after his dying. (The word Sang is on the cover in red while the the others are in black=--as "sang" in French means blood"--so--a blood song, the two, father and daughter "being of the same blood," as family and also as Filipinos.) TOf all books on this subject i know of, this one is the most beautiful arcing , aching and joyful presentations of what Freud called "The Work of Mourning." The books uses a great many different forms and genres of poerey, including the visual, ekphrasis, hay(na)ku, blog posts and a series of "Cantos which has redacted and blank Cantos among them. There are also "playing a part" the translations by contemporary poets of other poets and poems created in English out of Eileen's collaboration's with other poets still. There are also translation by the author, as well as some poetry that simply appears untranslated,. History and place play a large role also--the Marcos Regime Era that Eileen grew up in, the Independence documents of the Philippines, and events real and fictional in the world outside the Philippines which are used as "narrative devices" as it were in creating a book long series of "songs" and "cantos" which chart the movement of emotions through time, preceding the old age, illness and death of the poet's father, and those which are in flux before and after death, with a theme of reconciliation. (Even with Ferdinand Marcos--whose Martial law created in Eileen's child a kindof mixed Being of half God and half God the Father as Dictator. (one interpretation of this--). On Wed, Jul 8, 2009 at 7:37 AM, Dan Glass wrote: > I wrote on some of these issues in a piece on Charles Bernstein's Girly Man > for Jacket a couple years ago, here: > > http://jacketmagazine.com/33/thomas-glass-bernstein.shtml > > Specifically, how the poet's poet's response to 9/11, his grief around the > event, creates a lyric (and even, as Lauren puts it, a classical, in fact > explicitly Romantic) turn in the book. That lyric turn turns out to make > the > collection 'accessible' according to the majority of reviews. > > Seconding the interest in this thread,,, > > Dan > > On Tue, Jul 7, 2009 at 6:29 AM, Nicholas Piombino > wrote: > > > This is one of those threads that gets me thinking, and I've been looking > > forward to every post. I've not read them all, so I apologize if I am > > repeating anything. Eight years ago when someone I felt particularly > close > > to died, almost literally in my arms, I needed some poetry that would > help. > > What met my need at the time was Lynn Dreyer's book The White Museum > > (Roof,1986). Here's a sample: > > > > > http://poetryproject.org/wp-content/uploads/v124-kimberly-lyons-lynne-dreyer > > .pdf< > http://poetryproject.org/wp-content/uploads/v124-kimberly-lyons-lynne-dreyer%0A.pdf > >. > > Something about its heartbeat, its wave-like backbeat, soothed me, the > > way a mother might rock a child during a stricken moment. That episode of > > choice in reading pushed me towards thinking about writing as healing, an > > issue that's been on my mind ever since. > > > > Much of post-avant writing, obviously, employs parody, often of a > > particularly biting kind. It's no surprise that at a time of ear > splitting, > > mind smashing hypocrisies and assaults on a social/political level that > > some > > of our best minds might want to address such grotesque realties in ways > > that > > accurately reflect them when modes of earnestness or literal or symbolic > or > > abstract statement, what I once called writing below the din, won't > > suffice. > > > > At a time of personal crisis, what one might want, what I wanted as I > said, > > are truthful yet gentle words, singing, compassionate, and yes, even > quiet > > words. Still, such occasional personal needs probably do not justify a > > dominant poetics of quietism in an ongoing way. There is something > > reassuring and stimulating about experiencing a number of relatively > newer > > voices work to invent and persist with new forms that convincingly > reflect > > the impossibility of accepting as such the eco-socio-political realities > we > > are forced to live in right now. The post avant employs a biting, > > confrontational voice that says, to me anyway, don't give up trying to > > dispassionately recognize and reveal what that reality is, as painfully > > traumatic, as incessantly quotidian as it is coming to be. Forms that > meet > > that continuous nightmare face to face, as unimaginable as it is, or was. > > Is > > the most relevant issue in contemporary poetics hegemony, or power, or is > > it > > which model, the quietist or the post-avant, suggests the more apropos > > interpretation of current reality as it actually presents itself? > > > > Either way, life's needs are inordinately complex, and issues of poetic > > movement aside, one size will not always fit all. > > > > > > On 7/6/09 9:25 AM, "Mary Jo Malo" wrote: > > > > > What happened to the original poster of this query? I'd be interested > > > in her thoughts on the matter. (Lauren Russell) > > > > > > Lauren et al. Thank you for all your references and comments. > > > > > > What prompted my query is my observation (subjective perspective) that > > > in the initial shock and grief of loss we tend to turn to classical, > > > lyrical, and SoQ poetry rather than post-avant and other named > > > postmodern poetry. Either it is because we are truly at a loss for > > > words; and these poems are the most accessible and easily shared, or > > > we haven't the intellectual and emotional resources to engage more > > > abstract poetry. After a "suitable" period of time, when we've had > > > time to process the grief, the creative process ignites, and we're > > > able to craft and read postmodern or existential poetry which more > > > accurately portrays the loss itself. In other words, words fail, but > > > the art of them doesn't. > > > > > > Regarding the SoQ/Post-Avant dichotomy itself, what I've managed to > > > glean from casual reading, is the criticism is aimed at ending what > > > Mr. Silliman's considers a hegemony in traditional publishing and > > > academia. My impression (again, subjective and lacking in pedantics) > > > is that among the small press and internet poetics community, the > > > hegemony is strictly post-avant. > > > > > > Mary > > > > ================================== > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines > > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 8 Jul 2009 15:55:40 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve russell Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable The perfect word is the ugliest word: EAT. --- On Wed, 7/8/09, Murat Nemet-Nejat wrote: From: Murat Nemet-Nejat Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Wednesday, July 8, 2009, 12:11 AM Ever since I read Catcher on the Rye almost fifty years ago, I hate the wor= d "grand" -in the sense of something being grand- which was also Caulfield's least favorite word. Ciao, Murat On Tue, Jul 7, 2009 at 8:05 AM, mIEKAL aND wrote: > Which words make you wince? > Poets have been asked for their most hated words. What are yours? > > 'What word do you hate and why?' is the intriguing question put to a > selection of poets by the Ledbury festival. Philip Wells's reply is the > winner for me - 'pulchritude' is certainly up there on my blacklist. He e= ven > explains his animosity in suitably poetic terms: > > "it violates all the magical impulses of balanced onomatopoeic language - > it of course means "beautiful", but its meaning is nothing of the sort, > being stuffed to the brim with a brutally latinate cudgel of barbaric > consonants. If consonants represent riverbanks and vowels the river's flo= w, > this is the word equivalent of the bottomless abyss of dry bones, where > demons gather to spit acid." > > For Geraldine Monk, "it's got to be 'redacted' which makes me feel totall= y > sick. It's a brutish sounding word. It doesn't flow, it prods at you in a > nasty manner." > > Both these poets understand that the key to words that make you feel > nauseous is not the meaning - it's easy, after all, to hate the word > 'torture' =E2=80=93 but something else entirely. Something idiosyncratic,= something > about the way the word feels in your mouth as you say it. The horrors of > 'membrane', for instance. Or the eccentricity of 'gusset'. > > Having said that, I'm still trying to get my head around Paul Batchelor's > explanation that "I've always hated the word 'APPAL' (or 'appalled' or > 'appalling') because I dislike hearing the sound of my name inside other > words." I can't work out if there's a case of extreme ego or extreme > self-hatred going on there. > > And I can't help feeling that Ros Barber misses the point with her rather > po-faced reply. "Words are to be loved. Their associations may be unpleas= ant > but words themselves are full of poetry (and history, and geography)," sh= e > says. "Delicious vowel sounds and tongue-tickling consonants. There isn't= a > word in the English language that doesn't excite me if I think about it l= ong > enough." > > Sorry, Ros, I can't agree. I'm with Rhian Edwards on 'chillax' - "the mos= t > unnecessary and obnoxious linguistic blend to have ever been coined". Exc= ept > possibly for 'no-brainer'... > > Whether it's 'hubby' or 'sassy' or 'webinar' =E2=80=93 what are the words= that make > you wince? > > (many folks are posting their most hated words in the comments) > > > http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/booksblog/2009/jul/07/words-wince-hated-p= oets > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 8 Jul 2009 18:30:55 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Lauren Russell Subject: Re: mourning & poetics MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This is wonderfully stated.=A0 Thanks. Lauren Date:=A0 =A0 Tue, 7 Jul 2009 09:29:00 -0400 From:=A0 =A0 Nicholas Piombino Subject: Re: mourning & poetics This is one of those threads that gets me thinking, and I've been looking forward to every post. I've not read them all, so I apologize if I am repeating anything. Eight years ago when someone I felt particularly close to died, almost literally in my arms, I needed some poetry that would help. What met my need at the time was Lynn Dreyer's book The White Museum (Roof,1986). Here's a sample: http://poetryproject.org/wp-content/uploads/v124-kimberly-lyons-lynne-dreye= r .pdf. Something about its heartbeat, its wave-like backbeat, soothed me, th= e way a mother might rock a child during a stricken moment. That episode of choice in reading pushed me towards thinking about writing as healing, an issue that's been on my mind ever since. Much of post-avant writing, obviously, employs parody, often of a particularly biting kind. It's no surprise that at a time of ear splitting, mind smashing hypocrisies and assaults on a social/political level that som= e of our best minds might want to address such grotesque realties in ways tha= t accurately reflect them when modes of earnestness or literal or symbolic or abstract statement, what I once called writing below the din, won't suffice= . At a time of personal crisis, what one might want, what I wanted as I said, are truthful yet gentle words, singing, compassionate, and yes, even quiet words. Still, such occasional personal needs probably do not justify a dominant poetics of quietism in an ongoing way. There is something reassuring and stimulating about experiencing a number of relatively newer voices work to invent and persist with new forms that convincingly reflect the impossibility of accepting as such the eco-socio-political realities we are forced to live in right now. The post avant employs a biting, confrontational voice that says, to me anyway, don't give up trying to dispassionately recognize and reveal what that reality is, as painfully traumatic, as incessantly quotidian as it is coming to be. Forms that meet that continuous nightmare face to face, as unimaginable as it is, or was. I= s the most relevant issue in contemporary poetics hegemony, or power, or is i= t which model, the quietist or the post-avant, suggests the more apropos interpretation of current reality as it actually presents itself? Either way, life's needs are inordinately complex, and issues of poetic movement aside, one size will not always fit all. =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 8 Jul 2009 23:11:09 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Camille Martin Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" wuss =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 8 Jul 2009 21:09:11 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: charles alexander Subject: chax press now Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v935.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Chax Press is doing its best to get through a hot summer of publishing 7 books! Also creating new handprinted works, planning classes, youth programs, planning for the long range. And Chax Press needs help! Wouldn't it be great if every local friend, long-distance friend, personal friend, poetry friend, poetics friend, pog friend, & every facebook friend, & friends on other lists, donated $10 or $5?! Yes! that's what we need, that's what it takes. Or $11 or $6 to more than make up for the cut paypal takes. Our goal is 1000 contributions of $10 or $11 or $5 or $6. Go to http://chax.org/donate and DO IT NOW, please! We are nonprofit and it IS tax deductible. Go! more poems, please. If you've already given this spring or summer, then this message really isn't for you, unless you want it to be. We're also creating a new electronic newsletter, and a donation will definitely put you on the list to receive it. Of course, if you don't want to receive it, just let us know. In a few days we'll announce one new book, and two more in a few weeks, and several more at the end of the summer! This is the beginning. A leap is now! Ready: 1, 2, 3, contribute! Charles Alexander Chax Press 411 N 7th Ave Ste 103 Tucson, AZ 85705-8388 chax@theriver.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 9 Jul 2009 00:35:45 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: "David A. Kirschenbaum" Subject: This Wed../Douglas Rothschild Book Party & Stop Making Sense Live MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; DelSp="Yes"; format="flowed" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable please forward ------------------ Boog City?s Classic Albums Live presents Douglas Rothschild Book Party & Talking Heads' Stop Making Sense Live Wed., July 15, 7:00 p.m. Free with a two-drink minimum Sidewalk Caf=E9 94 Ave. A NYC *Doug reads from His Book Theogony plus sets from his hand-picked readers: ?Jim Behrle ?John Coletti ?Arlo Quint *and Doug's album pick, Talking Heads' Stop Making Sense performed live by (and with solo sets from): ?Dibson T. Hoffweiler ?I feel tractor ?Bob Kerr ?Limp Richard Hosted and curated by Boog City editor and publisher David Kirschenbaum Directions: F/V to 2nd Ave., L to 1st Ave. Venue is at E. 6th St. For further information: 212-842-BOOG (2664), editor@boogcity.com **Boog City http://www.welcometoboogcity.com Boog City is a New York City-based small press now in its 18th year =20 and East Village community newspaper of the same name. It has also =20 published 35 volumes of poetry and various magazines, featuring work =20 by Allen Ginsberg and Lawrence Ferlinghetti among others, and theme =20 issues on baseball, women?s writing, and Louisville, Ky. It hosts and =20 curates two regular performance series?d.a. levy lives: celebrating =20 the renegade press, where each month a non-NYC small press and its =20 writers and a musical act of their choosing is hosted at Chelsea?s ACA =20 Galleries; and Classic Albums Live, where up to 13 local musical acts =20 perform a classic album live at venues including The Bowery Poetry =20 Club, Cake Shop, CBGB?s, and The Knitting Factory. Past albums have =20 included Elvis Costello, My Aim is True; Nirvana, Nevermind; and Liz =20 Phair, Exile in Guyville. **Jim Behrle http://americanpoetry.biz Jim Behrle lives in Brooklyn. **John Coletti John Coletti is the author of The New Normalcy (Boog Literature), =20 Physical Kind (Yo-Yo-Labs), and Same Enemy Rainbow (fewer & further). **Dibson T. Hoffweiler http://www.myspace.com/dibson The latest in a long line of quirky anti-folk ingenues, including =20 Beck, Adam Green and Jeffrey Lewis, Dibs applies that time-honored =20 tradition of off-beat songwriting to his own private world of sugar =20 factories, laundry baskets and ducks. With a low voice, both sweet and =20 deadpan, and a guitar-style both virtuosic and sloppy, Dibson =20 Hoffweiler carves out a space of compassion and intelligence in a =20 landscape of boring love songs and thinly-veiled songwriterly misogyny. **I feel tractor http://www.myspace.com/ifeeltractor I feel tractor performs music to "make your children feel funky like a =20 donkey." **Bob Kerr Bob Kerr was a founding member of the Minneapolis band Alien Detector. =20 He has written songs for his plays Meet Uncle Casper, Kingdom Gone, =20 and End Times, and wrote the book and lyrics for the 10-minute musical =20 The Sticky-Fingered Fianc=E9e. **Limp Richard http://www.myspace.com/toddcarlstrom Limp Richard's alter ego, Todd Carlstrom, has played in NYC bands for =20 years (The Domestics, Heroes of the Alamo, Dirty Vicars, and =20 currently, Todd Carlstrom and the Clamour). Limp rarely performs live, =20 preferring to wait until Boog City presses him into service. His =20 influences include, but are not limited to, squid, bacon, epilepsy =20 medication, and the guy sitting next to you as you read this. He is =20 managed by the beautiful, but criminally pathological, Remorah. **Arlo Quint http://www.puppyflowers.com/9/quint.html Arlo Quint is the author of Days On End (Open 24 Hours) and Photogenic =20 Memory (Lame House). **Douglas Rothschild Douglas Rothschild's life has been one long miasma of failure, =20 disappointment, coffee, and overarching desire. Though he has not yet =20 accomplished anything of note, Mr. Rothschild intends to continue on =20 for some time yet. Some of this life, such as it is, has been =20 chronicled in Bill Luoma's Works & Days and Jennifer Moxley's The =20 Middle Room. -- David A. Kirschenbaum, editor and publisher Boog City 330 W.28th St., Suite 6H NY, NY 10001-4754 For event and publication information: http://welcometoboogcity.com/ T: (212) 842-BOOG (2664) F: (212) 842-2429 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 9 Jul 2009 12:25:05 +0530 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve dalachinsky Subject: haiku reading MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The Living Theater Poetry Series presents SUMMER PLUMS FESTIVAL OF HAIKU On Wednesday, July 22, 2009, 8pm featuring: Ernie Conrick, Steve Dalachinsky, John Farris, Tsaurah Litzky, Eve Packer, Tony Pupello, Cor Van Den Heuvel & Yuko Otomo plus: Haiku Writing Contest/Haiku Open Reading curated by Tsaurah Litzky & Yuko Otomo series director: Dorothy Friedman August $ 5 The Living Theater 19-21 Clinton St. (between Houston & Stanton Sts.) NYC ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 9 Jul 2009 12:32:54 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Kyle Schlesinger Subject: ED SANDERS : GLYPHS 1962-2009 opens Friday July 10th at 6pm Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="EUC-KR" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable One final reminder... KS=20 ED SANDERS : GLYPHS 1962-2009 A rare exhibition of nearly half a century of Ed Sanders?s glyph-poems produced between 1962 and 2009 will be on display at The Arm in Williamsbur= g [Brooklyn, NY] from July 10 through July 31. An opening reception will be held on July 10th at 6PM. Building on a long history of utilizing a highly visible language that continues into the present, Sanders?s glyph-poems fuse image with text, and image as text. Political, personal, ephemeral, historical, uncanny, and humorous=A1=AAthe glyph-poems on display at The Arm appear in several different mediums, including original drawings, collages, mimeographed pages from Fuc= k You/ A Magazine of the Arts (1962-'65), plus a number featuring color images, and an artist?s book. Over 200 Glyph-works will be featured in the show. In addition, Glyphs 1962-2009 will feature new letterpress prints and a limited edition catalogue produced on location at The Arm. Edward Sanders is a poet, historian and musician. He is at work, since 1998= , on a 9-volume America, a History in Verse. The first five volumes, tracing the history of the 20th century, have been completed and published in a fully indexed CD format, over 2,000 pages in length, by Blake Route Press. Another recent writing project is Poems for New Orleans, a book and CD on the history of that great city, and its tribulations during and after hurricane Katrina. He has been granted a Guggenheim fellowship in poetry, a National Endowment for the Arts fellowship in verse, an American Book Award for his collected poems, and other awards for his writing. Other books in print include Tales of Beatnik Glory (4 volumes published in a single edition), 1968, a History in Verse; The Poetry and Life of Allen Ginsberg, The Family, a history of the Charles Manson murder group, and Chekhov, a biography in verse of Anton Chekhov. Sanders was the founder of the satiric folk/rock group, The Fugs, which has released many albums and CDs during its 45 year history. The Fugs have recently completed a CD, Be Free, The Fugs Final CD (Part 2), featuring 14 new tunes. Be Free will be released in late summer. Two of Sanders' books, The Family and Tales of Beatnik Glory, are under option to be made into movies. His selected poems, 1986-2008, Let?s Not Keep Fighting the Trojan War will be published by Coffee House Press in the fall of 2009. He lives i= n Woodstock, New York with his wife, the essayist and painter Miriam Sanders, and both are active in environmental and other social issues. Sanders will perform a section of America, the 17th Century, tracing the voyage of Henry Hudson up the Hudson River in 1609, at the Byrdcliffe Art Colony in Woodstock on August 8, as part of the 400th anniversary celebration of Hudson?s discoveries. Opening reception for Glyphs 1962-2009 on Friday, July 10th from 6PM. All inquiries may be addressed to: Daniel Morris The Arm 281 North 7th Street Brooklyn, NY 11211 dan at thearmnyc dot com =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 8 Jul 2009 13:52:17 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Allan Revich Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude In-Reply-To: <597B39FE-1FB9-4BA0-938A-C5601C921CB0@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit What = "poetics" Why = it's a word than makes me wince. -----Original Message----- From: Poetics List (UPenn, UB) [mailto:POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU] On Behalf Of mIEKAL aND Sent: Tuesday, July 07, 2009 8:06 AM To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: appalling, redacted, pulchritude Which words make you wince? Poets have been asked for their most hated words. What are yours? 'What word do you hate and why?' is the intriguing question put to a selection of poets by the Ledbury festival. Philip Wells's reply is the winner for me - 'pulchritude' is certainly up there on my blacklist. He even explains his animosity in suitably poetic terms: "it violates all the magical impulses of balanced onomatopoeic language - it of course means "beautiful", but its meaning is nothing of the sort, being stuffed to the brim with a brutally latinate cudgel of barbaric consonants. If consonants represent riverbanks and vowels the river's flow, this is the word equivalent of the bottomless abyss of dry bones, where demons gather to spit acid." For Geraldine Monk, "it's got to be 'redacted' which makes me feel totally sick. It's a brutish sounding word. It doesn't flow, it prods at you in a nasty manner." Both these poets understand that the key to words that make you feel nauseous is not the meaning - it's easy, after all, to hate the word 'torture' - but something else entirely. Something idiosyncratic, something about the way the word feels in your mouth as you say it. The horrors of 'membrane', for instance. Or the eccentricity of 'gusset'. Having said that, I'm still trying to get my head around Paul Batchelor's explanation that "I've always hated the word 'APPAL' (or 'appalled' or 'appalling') because I dislike hearing the sound of my name inside other words." I can't work out if there's a case of extreme ego or extreme self-hatred going on there. And I can't help feeling that Ros Barber misses the point with her rather po-faced reply. "Words are to be loved. Their associations may be unpleasant but words themselves are full of poetry (and history, and geography)," she says. "Delicious vowel sounds and tongue-tickling consonants. There isn't a word in the English language that doesn't excite me if I think about it long enough." Sorry, Ros, I can't agree. I'm with Rhian Edwards on 'chillax' - "the most unnecessary and obnoxious linguistic blend to have ever been coined". Except possibly for 'no-brainer'... Whether it's 'hubby' or 'sassy' or 'webinar' - what are the words that make you wince? (many folks are posting their most hated words in the comments) http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/booksblog/2009/jul/07/words-wince-hated-poet s ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 9 Jul 2009 11:06:20 -0700 Reply-To: gfrym@earthlink.net Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Gloria Frym Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude In-Reply-To: <236784.11296.qm@web51803.mail.re2.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit such as "workshopped" a verb that rivals "outsourced Mary Kasimor wrote: > I really hate words that have a corporate efficiency purpose, usually words that were nouns but have become verbs. > > --- On Tue, 7/7/09, Ruth Lepson wrote: > > > From: Ruth Lepson > Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Tuesday, July 7, 2009, 11:11 PM > > > 'indeed' > > > On 7/7/09 8:05 AM, "mIEKAL aND" wrote: > > >> Which words make you wince? >> Poets have been asked for their most hated words. What are yours? >> >> 'What word do you hate and why?' is the intriguing question put to a >> selection of poets by the Ledbury festival. Philip Wells's reply is >> the winner for me - 'pulchritude' is certainly up there on my >> blacklist. He even explains his animosity in suitably poetic terms: >> >> "it violates all the magical impulses of balanced onomatopoeic >> language - it of course means "beautiful", but its meaning is nothing >> of the sort, being stuffed to the brim with a brutally latinate cudgel >> of barbaric consonants. If consonants represent riverbanks and vowels >> the river's flow, this is the word equivalent of the bottomless abyss >> of dry bones, where demons gather to spit acid." >> >> For Geraldine Monk, "it's got to be 'redacted' which makes me feel >> totally sick. It's a brutish sounding word. It doesn't flow, it prods >> at you in a nasty manner." >> >> Both these poets understand that the key to words that make you feel >> nauseous is not the meaning - it's easy, after all, to hate the word >> 'torture' ­ but something else entirely. Something idiosyncratic, >> something about the way the word feels in your mouth as you say it. >> The horrors of 'membrane', for instance. Or the eccentricity of >> 'gusset'. >> >> Having said that, I'm still trying to get my head around Paul >> Batchelor's explanation that "I've always hated the word 'APPAL' (or >> 'appalled' or 'appalling') because I dislike hearing the sound of my >> name inside other words." I can't work out if there's a case of >> extreme ego or extreme self-hatred going on there. >> >> And I can't help feeling that Ros Barber misses the point with her >> rather po-faced reply. "Words are to be loved. Their associations may >> be unpleasant but words themselves are full of poetry (and history, >> and geography)," she says. "Delicious vowel sounds and tongue-tickling >> consonants. There isn't a word in the English language that doesn't >> excite me if I think about it long enough." >> >> Sorry, Ros, I can't agree. I'm with Rhian Edwards on 'chillax' - "the >> most unnecessary and obnoxious linguistic blend to have ever been >> coined". Except possibly for 'no-brainer'... >> >> Whether it's 'hubby' or 'sassy' or 'webinar' ­ what are the words that >> make you wince? >> >> (many folks are posting their most hated words in the comments) >> >> http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/booksblog/2009/jul/07/words-wince-hated-poets >> ================================== >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & >> sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >> > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.8/2227 - Release Date: 07/09/09 05:55:00 > > -- Gloria Frym Associate Professor Writing & Literature Programs California College of the Arts ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 9 Jul 2009 11:23:57 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: amy king Subject: Your city's / town's poetry reading calendar? Comments: To: new-poetry@wiz.cath.vt.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I found this great one for Chicago (updated daily) -- http://www.chicagopoe= trycalendar.org/ And always reference this one for New York --=A0 http://www.poetz.com/calen= dar/ But I recently discovered in my web searches a sad lack of other city / tow= n poetry reading sites.=A0 Perhaps my skills are lacking.=A0 Portland, OR o= nly has one site about the police making poetry...? Please send me your poetry reading sites so that I might update my list -- = I'll post it here and on my blog for future reference when all seems comple= te!=A0 That way, whenever intrepid poets travel, they'll be able to check t= he sites and see what's what in your town! Thanks, Amy _______ =0A =0AAmy's Alias =0Ahttp://amyking.org/=0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 9 Jul 2009 15:22:51 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Skip Fox Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude In-Reply-To: <737844.87177.qm@web52409.mail.re2.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit "creative writing" is the language of a bureaucrat, not a writer. ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 9 Jul 2009 13:36:10 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: David Chirot Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude In-Reply-To: <4A56319C.4050907@earthlink.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "THE AMERICAN PEOPLE" WHEN SAID BY ANY PERSON IN POLITICS "radical,innovative poetry"--is always being asked for; meaning it is conventional, safe, dull "native; native american" its patronizing and makes one think of "the natives are getting restless" in twenty million movies with Bwana aka Bwana Devil; it's American Indian as Russell Means pointed out everyone else is a something-American, Chinese-American, Irish-Americanm, African American; only Indians have America first--because the First Peoples--American Indian of course "American" is named for an Italian-- and then why is chef boy-ar-dee making "franco american spagetti"! a real puzzler since childhood On Thu, Jul 9, 2009 at 11:06 AM, Gloria Frym wrote: > such as "workshopped" > a verb that rivals "outsourced > > > Mary Kasimor wrote: > >> I really hate words that have a corporate efficiency purpose, usually >> words that were nouns but have become verbs. >> >> --- On Tue, 7/7/09, Ruth Lepson wrote: >> >> >> From: Ruth Lepson >> Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude >> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >> Date: Tuesday, July 7, 2009, 11:11 PM >> >> >> 'indeed' >> >> >> On 7/7/09 8:05 AM, "mIEKAL aND" wrote: >> >> >> >>> Which words make you wince? >>> Poets have been asked for their most hated words. What are yours? >>> >>> 'What word do you hate and why?' is the intriguing question put to a >>> selection of poets by the Ledbury festival. Philip Wells's reply is >>> the winner for me - 'pulchritude' is certainly up there on my >>> blacklist. He even explains his animosity in suitably poetic terms: >>> >>> "it violates all the magical impulses of balanced onomatopoeic >>> language - it of course means "beautiful", but its meaning is nothing >>> of the sort, being stuffed to the brim with a brutally latinate cudgel >>> of barbaric consonants. If consonants represent riverbanks and vowels >>> the river's flow, this is the word equivalent of the bottomless abyss >>> of dry bones, where demons gather to spit acid." >>> >>> For Geraldine Monk, "it's got to be 'redacted' which makes me feel >>> totally sick. It's a brutish sounding word. It doesn't flow, it prods >>> at you in a nasty manner." >>> >>> Both these poets understand that the key to words that make you feel >>> nauseous is not the meaning - it's easy, after all, to hate the word >>> 'torture' =AD but something else entirely. Something idiosyncratic, >>> something about the way the word feels in your mouth as you say it. >>> The horrors of 'membrane', for instance. Or the eccentricity of >>> 'gusset'. >>> >>> Having said that, I'm still trying to get my head around Paul >>> Batchelor's explanation that "I've always hated the word 'APPAL' (or >>> 'appalled' or 'appalling') because I dislike hearing the sound of my >>> name inside other words." I can't work out if there's a case of >>> extreme ego or extreme self-hatred going on there. >>> >>> And I can't help feeling that Ros Barber misses the point with her >>> rather po-faced reply. "Words are to be loved. Their associations may >>> be unpleasant but words themselves are full of poetry (and history, >>> and geography)," she says. "Delicious vowel sounds and tongue-tickling >>> consonants. There isn't a word in the English language that doesn't >>> excite me if I think about it long enough." >>> >>> Sorry, Ros, I can't agree. I'm with Rhian Edwards on 'chillax' - "the >>> most unnecessary and obnoxious linguistic blend to have ever been >>> coined". Except possibly for 'no-brainer'... >>> >>> Whether it's 'hubby' or 'sassy' or 'webinar' =AD what are the words tha= t >>> make you wince? >>> >>> (many folks are posting their most hated words in the comments) >>> >>> >>> http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/booksblog/2009/jul/07/words-wince-hated= -poets >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >>> guidelines & >>> sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >>> >>> >> >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >> >> >> >> >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: >> 270.13.8/2227 - Release Date: 07/09/09 05:55:00 >> >> >> > > -- > Gloria Frym > Associate Professor > Writing & Literature Programs > California College of the Arts > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 9 Jul 2009 14:00:22 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Martha Deed Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Do not like "No" and "can't" But really can't stand "at the end of the day" a combination of acceptable = words far worse than its parts. Martha --- On Wed, 7/8/09, Allan Revich wrote: From: Allan Revich Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Wednesday, July 8, 2009, 1:52 PM What =3D "poetics" Why =3D it's a word than makes me wince. -----Original Message----- From: Poetics List (UPenn, UB) [mailto:POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU] On Behalf Of mIEKAL aND Sent: Tuesday, July 07, 2009 8:06 AM To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: appalling, redacted, pulchritude Which words make you wince? Poets have been asked for their most hated words. What are yours? 'What word do you hate and why?' is the intriguing question put to a=A0=20 selection of poets by the Ledbury festival. Philip Wells's reply is=A0=20 the winner for me - 'pulchritude' is certainly up there on my=A0=20 blacklist. He even explains his animosity in suitably poetic terms: "it violates all the magical impulses of balanced onomatopoeic=A0=20 language - it of course means "beautiful", but its meaning is nothing=A0=20 of the sort, being stuffed to the brim with a brutally latinate cudgel=A0= =20 of barbaric consonants. If consonants represent riverbanks and vowels=A0=20 the river's flow, this is the word equivalent of the bottomless abyss=A0=20 of dry bones, where demons gather to spit acid." For Geraldine Monk, "it's got to be 'redacted' which makes me feel=A0=20 totally sick. It's a brutish sounding word. It doesn't flow, it prods=A0=20 at you in a nasty manner." Both these poets understand that the key to words that make you feel=A0=20 nauseous is not the meaning - it's easy, after all, to hate the word=A0=20 'torture' - but something else entirely. Something idiosyncratic,=A0=20 something about the way the word feels in your mouth as you say it.=A0=20 The horrors of 'membrane', for instance. Or the eccentricity of=A0=20 'gusset'. Having said that, I'm still trying to get my head around Paul=A0=20 Batchelor's explanation that "I've always hated the word 'APPAL' (or=A0=20 'appalled' or 'appalling') because I dislike hearing the sound of my=A0=20 name inside other words." I can't work out if there's a case of=A0=20 extreme ego or extreme self-hatred going on there. And I can't help feeling that Ros Barber misses the point with her=A0=20 rather po-faced reply. "Words are to be loved. Their associations may=A0=20 be unpleasant but words themselves are full of poetry (and history,=A0=20 and geography)," she says. "Delicious vowel sounds and tongue-tickling=A0= =20 consonants. There isn't a word in the English language that doesn't=A0=20 excite me if I think about it long enough." Sorry, Ros, I can't agree. I'm with Rhian Edwards on 'chillax' - "the=A0=20 most unnecessary and obnoxious linguistic blend to have ever been=A0=20 coined". Except possibly for 'no-brainer'... Whether it's 'hubby' or 'sassy' or 'webinar' - what are the words that=A0= =20 make you wince? (many folks are posting their most hated words in the comments) http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/booksblog/2009/jul/07/words-wince-hated-poe= t s =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 9 Jul 2009 17:10:42 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: gabriel siegel Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable country. snigger. On Thu, Jul 9, 2009 at 4:36 PM, David Chirot wrote= : > "THE AMERICAN PEOPLE" WHEN SAID BY ANY PERSON IN POLITICS > > "radical,innovative poetry"--is always being asked for; meaning it is > conventional, safe, dull > > "native; native american" its patronizing and makes one think of "the > natives are getting restless" in twenty million movies with Bwana aka Bwa= na > Devil; it's American Indian as Russell Means pointed out everyone else is= a > something-American, Chinese-American, Irish-Americanm, African American; > only Indians have America first--because the First Peoples--American Indi= an > of course "American" is named for an Italian-- > and then why is chef boy-ar-dee making "franco american spagetti"! > a real puzzler since childhood > > > On Thu, Jul 9, 2009 at 11:06 AM, Gloria Frym wrote: > > > such as "workshopped" > > a verb that rivals "outsourced > > > > > > Mary Kasimor wrote: > > > >> I really hate words that have a corporate efficiency purpose, usually > >> words that were nouns but have become verbs. > >> > >> --- On Tue, 7/7/09, Ruth Lepson wrote: > >> > >> > >> From: Ruth Lepson > >> Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude > >> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > >> Date: Tuesday, July 7, 2009, 11:11 PM > >> > >> > >> 'indeed' > >> > >> > >> On 7/7/09 8:05 AM, "mIEKAL aND" wrote: > >> > >> > >> > >>> Which words make you wince? > >>> Poets have been asked for their most hated words. What are yours? > >>> > >>> 'What word do you hate and why?' is the intriguing question put to a > >>> selection of poets by the Ledbury festival. Philip Wells's reply is > >>> the winner for me - 'pulchritude' is certainly up there on my > >>> blacklist. He even explains his animosity in suitably poetic terms: > >>> > >>> "it violates all the magical impulses of balanced onomatopoeic > >>> language - it of course means "beautiful", but its meaning is nothing > >>> of the sort, being stuffed to the brim with a brutally latinate cudge= l > >>> of barbaric consonants. If consonants represent riverbanks and vowels > >>> the river's flow, this is the word equivalent of the bottomless abyss > >>> of dry bones, where demons gather to spit acid." > >>> > >>> For Geraldine Monk, "it's got to be 'redacted' which makes me feel > >>> totally sick. It's a brutish sounding word. It doesn't flow, it prods > >>> at you in a nasty manner." > >>> > >>> Both these poets understand that the key to words that make you feel > >>> nauseous is not the meaning - it's easy, after all, to hate the word > >>> 'torture' =AD but something else entirely. Something idiosyncratic, > >>> something about the way the word feels in your mouth as you say it. > >>> The horrors of 'membrane', for instance. Or the eccentricity of > >>> 'gusset'. > >>> > >>> Having said that, I'm still trying to get my head around Paul > >>> Batchelor's explanation that "I've always hated the word 'APPAL' (or > >>> 'appalled' or 'appalling') because I dislike hearing the sound of my > >>> name inside other words." I can't work out if there's a case of > >>> extreme ego or extreme self-hatred going on there. > >>> > >>> And I can't help feeling that Ros Barber misses the point with her > >>> rather po-faced reply. "Words are to be loved. Their associations may > >>> be unpleasant but words themselves are full of poetry (and history, > >>> and geography)," she says. "Delicious vowel sounds and tongue-ticklin= g > >>> consonants. There isn't a word in the English language that doesn't > >>> excite me if I think about it long enough." > >>> > >>> Sorry, Ros, I can't agree. I'm with Rhian Edwards on 'chillax' - "the > >>> most unnecessary and obnoxious linguistic blend to have ever been > >>> coined". Except possibly for 'no-brainer'... > >>> > >>> Whether it's 'hubby' or 'sassy' or 'webinar' =AD what are the words t= hat > >>> make you wince? > >>> > >>> (many folks are posting their most hated words in the comments) > >>> > >>> > >>> > http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/booksblog/2009/jul/07/words-wince-hated-p= oets > >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > >>> guidelines & > >>> sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >>> > >>> > >> > >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >> ----------------------------------------------------------------------= -- > >> > >> > >> No virus found in this incoming message. > >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: > >> 270.13.8/2227 - Release Date: 07/09/09 05:55:00 > >> > >> > >> > > > > -- > > Gloria Frym > > Associate Professor > > Writing & Literature Programs > > California College of the Arts > > > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines > > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 9 Jul 2009 14:24:13 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jennifer Karmin Subject: July 10 & 12: Printers' Ball Events in Chicago MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable **FRIDAY, = In Celebration of the 5th Annual Printers=E2=80=99 Ball!=0A=0A=0A**FRIDAY, = JULY 10**=0AThe Science of Obscurity=0A7-10pm=0A=0Aat the Jupiter Outpost= =0A1139 W. Fulton Market=0AChicago, IL=0Afree=0A=0AThe Chicago Underground = Library celebrates =E2=80=9CThe Science of Obscurity,=E2=80=9D an evening o= f new, unpublished, and in-progress writing presented as science fair exper= iments. The night will also feature a public book launch via catapult and t= he mass purging of rejection letters=E2=80=94community literary rituals in = need of revival!=0Ahttp://underground-library.org=0A=0A=0A**SUNDAY, JULY 12= **=0ACollaboration Reading=0A2-4pm=0A=0Aat Woman Made Gallery=0A675 N. Milw= aukee Avenue=0AChicago, IL=0Afree=0A=0AFor this event, writers=E2=80=99 wor= k and/or performance will involve interaction with other writers, performer= s, art forms, media, and maybe even with the audience. Participants in the = event include Simone Muench and Philip Jenks, presenting collaboratively wr= itten poetry; Mars Gamba-Adisa Caulton, working with her own music; perform= ance poetry duo Marty McConnell and Andi Strickland; Jennifer Karmin, in a = live improvised collaborative performance of her text-sound epic Aaaaaaaaaa= alice with Chicago writers Carrie Olivia Adams, Daniel Godston, Laura Golds= tein, Amira Hanafi, and Larry Sawyer; and curator Nina Corwin in collaborat= ion with Janice Misurell-Mitchell, internationally known improvisational fl= autist.=0Ahttp://www.womanmade.org/poetry.html=0A=0A=0AABOUT THE PRINTERS' = BALL=0AThe fifth annual Printers=E2=80=99 Ball is set to take place on Frid= ay, July 31st (5-11pm), at Columbia College Chicago in the college=E2=80=99= s historic Ludington Building, at 1104 S. Wabash. Founded by Poetry magazin= e and the Poetry Foundation with Chicago literary organizations, the Printe= rs=E2=80=99 Ball is an annual celebration of print culture, featuring thous= ands of magazines, books, and broadsides available free of charge; live rea= dings and music; letterpress, offset, and paper-making demonstrations; and = much more. =0A=0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 9 Jul 2009 15:29:25 -0600 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jonathan Ball Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude In-Reply-To: <817EDF968EFE42DA8296A2B04F2A900D@win.louisiana.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit along those lines: "Creative Non-Fiction" On Thu, Jul 9, 2009 at 2:22 PM, Skip Fox wrote: > "creative writing" is the language of a bureaucrat, not a writer. > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > -- www.jonathanball.com www.jonathanball.blogspot.com www.haikuhoroscopes.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 9 Jul 2009 15:46:40 -0600 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jonathan Penton Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cerulean. It's the literary equivalent of pretending that you're gay at a strip club. ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 9 Jul 2009 21:44:28 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: David Seaman Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude In-Reply-To: <165632.88041.qm@web51808.mail.re2.yahoo.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Semen, since my family name is Seaman. And students ask me if spelling coun= ts..... David W. Seaman, Ph.D. http://personal.georgiasouthern.edu/~dseaman/Welcome.html =20 On Wednesday, July 08, 2009, at 02:02PM, "Mary Kasimor" wrote: >The word that I was looking for that I just HATE is "impacted." >Mary > >--- On Tue, 7/7/09, Ruth Lepson wrote: > > >From: Ruth Lepson >Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude >To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >Date: Tuesday, July 7, 2009, 11:11 PM > > >'indeed' > > >On 7/7/09 8:05 AM, "mIEKAL aND" wrote: > >> Which words make you wince? >> Poets have been asked for their most hated words. What are yours? >>=20 >> 'What word do you hate and why?' is the intriguing question put to a >> selection of poets by the Ledbury festival. Philip Wells's reply is >> the winner for me - 'pulchritude' is certainly up there on my >> blacklist. He even explains his animosity in suitably poetic terms: >>=20 >> "it violates all the magical impulses of balanced onomatopoeic >> language - it of course means "beautiful", but its meaning is nothing >> of the sort, being stuffed to the brim with a brutally latinate cudgel >> of barbaric consonants. If consonants represent riverbanks and vowels >> the river's flow, this is the word equivalent of the bottomless abyss >> of dry bones, where demons gather to spit acid." >>=20 >> For Geraldine Monk, "it's got to be 'redacted' which makes me feel >> totally sick. It's a brutish sounding word. It doesn't flow, it prods >> at you in a nasty manner." >>=20 >> Both these poets understand that the key to words that make you feel >> nauseous is not the meaning - it's easy, after all, to hate the word >> 'torture' =AD but something else entirely. Something idiosyncratic, >> something about the way the word feels in your mouth as you say it. >> The horrors of 'membrane', for instance. Or the eccentricity of >> 'gusset'. >>=20 >> Having said that, I'm still trying to get my head around Paul >> Batchelor's explanation that "I've always hated the word 'APPAL' (or >> 'appalled' or 'appalling') because I dislike hearing the sound of my >> name inside other words." I can't work out if there's a case of >> extreme ego or extreme self-hatred going on there. >>=20 >> And I can't help feeling that Ros Barber misses the point with her >> rather po-faced reply. "Words are to be loved. Their associations may >> be unpleasant but words themselves are full of poetry (and history, >> and geography)," she says. "Delicious vowel sounds and tongue-tickling >> consonants. There isn't a word in the English language that doesn't >> excite me if I think about it long enough." >>=20 >> Sorry, Ros, I can't agree. I'm with Rhian Edwards on 'chillax' - "the >> most unnecessary and obnoxious linguistic blend to have ever been >> coined". Except possibly for 'no-brainer'... >>=20 >> Whether it's 'hubby' or 'sassy' or 'webinar' =AD what are the words that >> make you wince? >>=20 >> (many folks are posting their most hated words in the comments) >>=20 >> http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/booksblog/2009/jul/07/words-wince-hated-= poets >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guideli= nes & >> sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guideline= s & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > >=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guideline= s & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 9 Jul 2009 20:54:47 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jim Andrews Subject: Writing Post-Person: Poetics, Literacy and Sustainability in the Age of Disposable Discourse by Kedrick James MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Writing Post-Person: Poetics, Literacy and Sustainability in the Age of Disposable Discourse is Kedrick James's 2009 doctoral dissertation. It's a terrific look at the history of automated spam and how spoets (spam poets) are situated in that environment. He also develops very useful perspectives on informational garbage and recycling toward a poetics of sustainability and informational environmentalism. How do writers and and how does writing move forward in the age of automated, disposable discourse when writing is devalued by automated excess, and the proliferation of other, competing media? Kedrick James's thesis is hopeful, actually, in what many perceive to be a dark time for literary writing and education, and that hope is partly in what he sees arising from active engagement by writers in these issues. What I've done at http://vispo.com/dbcinema/kedrick/slideshow.htm is to take four samples of writing from his thesis, together with photos of Kedrick and some of his graphical collages, and collage them in dbCinema in appreciation of what he's doing. I've also created a stir fry text at http://vispo.com/StirFryTexts/kedrick.htm from those samples of his thesis. You can read the quotations themselves by clicking on the rectangle in the stir fry or mix them together by mousing over the text. I think his thesis is significant to contemporary writing and encourage you to visit his website, http://kedrickjames.net and his band's site http://disciplineofchaos.com -- he's in a collaging/sampling band. The thesis is not available online but if you want to read it, contact him. ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 9 Jul 2009 21:19:13 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: charles alexander Subject: chax press now Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v935.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sorry I miffed the donate web address when I sent this yesterday. Thanks to all who found it anyway. The correct address is http://chax.org/donate.htm (now corrected below, too) cheers to all, Charles / Chax Press Chax Press is doing its best to get through a hot summer of publishing 7 books! Also creating new handprinted works, planning classes, youth programs, planning for the long range. And Chax Press needs help! Wouldn't it be great if every local friend, long-distance friend, personal friend, poetry friend, poetics friend, pog friend, & every facebook friend, & friends on other lists, donated $10 or $5?! Yes! that's what we need, that's what it takes. Or $11 or $6 to more than make up for the cut paypal takes. Our goal is 1000 contributions of $10 or $11 or $5 or $6. Go to http://chax.org/donate.htm and DO IT NOW, please! We are nonprofit and it IS tax deductible. Go! more poems, please. If you've already given this spring or summer, then this message really isn't for you, unless you want it to be. We're also creating a new electronic newsletter, and a donation will definitely put you on the list to receive it. Of course, if you don't want to receive it, just let us know. In a few days we'll announce one new book, and two more in a few weeks, and several more at the end of the summer! This is the beginning. A leap is now! Ready: 1, 2, 3, contribute! Charles Alexander Chax Press 411 N 7th Ave Ste 103 Tucson, AZ 85705-8388 chax@theriver.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 00:44:52 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: CA Conrad Subject: WHITE HELIUM MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit WHITE HELIUM for Sharon Mesmer is here: http://somaticpoetryexercises.blogspot.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 00:48:15 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: CA Conrad Subject: MARK(S) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit in Ted Pearson's MARK(S) zine online: http://www.markszine.net ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 9 Jul 2009 22:42:22 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Lauren Russell Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I hate the word "community," as in "The Black Community," "The LGBT Communi= ty," "The Jewish Community," etc., because it advances an oversimplified vi= ew of the world in asserting the existence of these enormous "communities" = that do not actually exist.=A0 I mean, what is the often-discussed Black Co= mmunity, anyway?=A0 There are many black communities, and there are black p= eople who do not belong to any community, and there are black people who be= long to communities that consist primarily of people who are not black.=A0 = There is no single, homogenous "Black Community" as that misuse of the word= seems to suggest. Lauren =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 07:07:43 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: peter ganick Subject: 3 new books from a new press Comments: To: Jim Leftwich , thomas lowe taylor MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit chalk editions is the name of a new press concentrating on experimental writing. published by jukka-pekka kervinen and peter ganick, the press has its first three publications ready for view. all texts are free of charge and can be downloaded easily. http://chalkeditions.co.cc we are accepting submissions of new writing now. please send to: < pganickz@gmail.com> and/or ... digital files in the pdf, doc, or rtf format only. all manuscripts will receive a response. ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 09:27:47 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Nick Carbo Subject: Polyverse Poetry Festival MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" EVENT: POLYVERSE POETRY FESTIVAL http://www.lboro.ac.uk/service/publ icity/news-releases/2009/87_PoetLau reate.html WHEN: Friday July 24th, through to Sunday July 26th, 2009. VENUE: English & Drama Department of Loughborough University, Leicestershi= re, LE11 3TT, England, UK=C2=A0 http://www.lboro.ac.uk/departments/ ea/ TICKETS NOW ON SALE: =C2=A320 covers whole festival, including all events= and a workshop. Alternatively, you can buy a =C2=A310 ticket for Carol An= n Duffy and the 'Dreams of May' event (both are included in the price). Concessionary rates: =C2=A315 and =C2=A37 respectively. All ticket enquiries to Helen Relf, telephone 01509 222 967 (overseas: +44= 1509 222 967) between 9am-5pm BST, or e-mail h.l.relf@lboro.ac.uk. (Any= enquiries already made to other staff will be dealt with.) HOW TO GET THERE: http://www.lboro.ac.uk/about/map/pa ges/finding-lborouni.html It would help if you could please RSVP on here to help us gauge projected= ticket sales:=C2=A0http://www.facebook.com/group.php?g id=3D9528966169#/event.php?eid=3D480543 76182 For details of courses at Loughborough, seehttp://www.lboro.ac.uk/=C2=A0 or telephone +44 (0)1509 263171. SPECIAL EVENTS at the festival: *********************************** ************ SATURDAY EVENING:=C2=A0 CAROL ANN DUFFY, first ever female Poet Laureate. Reading, question-and-answer session with the audience, and signing (eveni= ng, Saturday 25th July). Please note that Carol Ann Duffy's appearance will be preceded by the crit= ically acclaimed play-in-poetry 'Dreams of May' takes place on the evenin g of Saturday 25th July.=C2=A0 You have a choice: buy a =C2=A310 ticket to cover both of the above, or = =C2=A320 for a full festival ticket, which covers the entire weekend, the= above two performances, and a free workshop. (Concessionary rates: =C2=A3= 7 and =C2=A315 respectively.) Visit Carol Ann Duffy's web site to learn more about her writing and other= work:=C2=A0http://www.carolannduffy.co.uk/ Polyverse Poetry Festival and the English and Drama Department of Loughbor= ough University are very grateful to the Literature Network for supporting= Carol Ann Duffy's appearance.=C2=A0 http://www.literaturenetwork.org/ Carol Ann Duffy's performance is preceded by Panel of top young Leicesters= hire Poets (authors to be announced) *********************************** ************ DREAMS OF MAY - first public performance of this critically acclaimed play= outside London. It is a one woman play in poetry about loss and transition. The play takes= place on a train where the woman=E2=80=99s memory is triggered by objects= causing her to look over her life and confront her demons. This internal= conversation is revealed to the audience through poetry and music, ultima= tely expressing a life of growth, and the discovery of a hope which allows= the character to find her way forward. Written by SUE GUINEY=C2=A0http://www.sueguiney.com/ Interview: http://www.bookdepository.co.uk/WEB SITE/WWW/WEBPAGES/viewarticle.php?t ype=3Dinterview&id=3D129 Starring ROSALIND CRESSY=C2=A0http://www.thelionspart.co.uk/about us/rosalindcressy.html The performance will be followed by a 15-minute question-and-answer session, which will allow the audience to interact directly with author= Sue Guiney, and the actress Rosalind Cressy. ----------------------------------- ----------------------------------- PLANET YOUNG byaward-winning poet Gerry Potter (aka Chloe Poems). Author= of 'Miracle, Gerry's new show companion book, 'Planet Young' is released= in the summer.=C2=A0 He is providing a free workshop at the festival. http://www.studiosalford.com/ ----------------------------------- ----------------------------------- STORIES DRUMMED TO POLAR SKIES by Siobhan Logan. Exclusive and specially rewritten version of the dazzling fusion of poetry= and science spectacular. The original version of 'Stories Drummed to Pola= r Skies' was performed at the National Science Museum and the Richard Atte= nborough Centre. Siobhan's first book is now available to order: Firebridg= e to Skyshore: A Northern Lights Journey (published by Original Press,http= ://www.freewebs.com/thesamsmith /originalplusbooks.htm). http://homepage.ntlworld.com/siobha n.logan1/ Siobhan is also offering a post-performance question-and-answer session to= the audience. ----------------------------------- ----------------------------------- POETS CONFIRMED TO READ/PERFORM GAIL ASHTON, author of "Ghost Songs" (Cinnamon) http://www.amazon.co.uk/Ghost-Songs -Gail-Ashton/dp/1905614195 CAROLE BALDOCK (editor of "Orbis"), author of "Bitching" (poetry, publishe= r: Sound), widely anthologised, and also the author of numerous non-fictio= n books, including "How to Make Money from Writing" and "How to Succeed as= a Single Parent".http://www.dublinwriters.org/eacorn /features/deadg oodfeature.html DAVID BIRCUMSHAW, "The Ghost Machine," "A Chide's Alphabet" and "The Anima= l Subsidies" (Arrowhead) http://homepage.ntlworld.com/david. bircumshaw/ JULIE BODEN, Birmingham Poet Laureate (2002/3), Poet-in-residence at Symph= ony Hall and Town Hall in Birmingham, amongst other highly poetic things!= Author of "Beyond the Bullring"," Cut on the Bias", "Through the Eye of= a Crow", "Wasted Lives", and "Bluebeard's Wife" (Pontefract Press). http://www.julieboden.co.uk/ J.BROOKES: "The Dresden Cantata", "Dusting the Bin" and "Deafening the Nos= e". http://pure-poetry.co.uk/otherpoets /guestpoet2/jbrookes.htm WAYNE BURROWS, editor of Staple, and author of "Marginalia" (Peterloo)=C2= =A0 http://wayneburrows.wordpress.com/ NICK CARBO, "Chinese, Japanese, What are These?", Andalusian Dawn" and "Se= cret Asian Man"=C2=A0 http://www.cherry-grove.com/carbo.h tml SALLY CLARK, anthologised by Templar (2007-8), and placed in the Bridport= 2005) and BBC Wildlife Poet (2005). http://www.myspace.com/sallyclarkpo et JANE COMMANE: anthologised in "Gists and Piths", "Bluebeard's Wives", et= cetera; co-editor of "Under the Radar"; co-founder of Nine Arches Press= (with Matt Nunn). http://www.saltpublishing.com/horiz on/issues/01/text/commane_jane.htm ROSEMARY DUN, "Lorelei Gets it on" and "Born Lippy", plus the new CD "Me= and My Big Mouth" (Big Mouth Productions) http://www.rosemarydun.co.uk/ ANDY FLETCHER http://raggedraven.co.uk/collection s.htm ANGELA FRANCE, "Occupation" (Ragged Raven, released July 1st); runner-up= 2009 Torbay Festival Competition, and recently shortlisted for a major li= terary prize . http: //www.facebook.com/l/;http://w ww.raggedraven.co.uk/collections.ht m#Occupation MARK GOODWIN, "Else" (Shearsman), anthologised in "Coffee House", etc. http://www.amazon.co.uk/Else-Mark-G oodwin/dp/1905700970 RADCLIFF GREGORY: "Oscar Wilde: Decadent by Design" (forthcoming, in 'Schi= smogenesis academic publication). Anthologised in Chroma, Coffee House, Po= emata, et cetera. http://www.crystalclearcreators.org .uk/content/9/Rad-Gregory.html BRENDAN HAWTHORNE, editor of 'Read the Music' and Poet Laureate on=C2=A0ht= tp://www.thestirrer.com.=C2=A0 Publications: Station Fifteen (2008, Limited 1st edition, ISBN: 978-0-9554= 467-1-9); Slide (Poetry Monthly Press, 2007); Urban Dawn (bluechrome, 2004= ); The All Night Cafe and Other Dives (with Geoff Stevens, The Poetry Wednesbury Imprint, 2006). http://www.poetrywednesbury.co.uk/h tml/brendan_hawthorne.html SONIA HENDY-ISAAC, "Flesh" (forthcoming, bluechrome)http://homepages.nildr= am.co.uk/~sim mers/142eleven.html MARTIN HOLROYD, editor of 'Poetry Monthly'=C2=A0 http://www.poetrymonth.com/ CHRISTOPHER JAMES - WINNER: NATIONAL POETRY COMPETITION 2009 http://www.raggedraven.co.uk/collec tions.htm#The%20Invention%20of%20Bu tterfly PAT JOURDAN, award-winning poet, "The Cast-Iron Shore", "Turpentine", and= "The Bedsit" (poetry), plus the new short story anthology "Rainy Pavement= s".=C2=A0 http://patjourdan.co.uk/ CHRIS KINSEY: BBC Wildlife Poet of the Year in 2008. She received an Arts= Council of Wales Writer=E2=80=99s Bursary in 2000. Her collection, Kung= Fu Lullabies, Ragged Raven Press, came out in 2004. A second collection,= Cure for a Crooked Smile, is also forthcoming from Ragged Raven, and=3D2 0a third, Swarf, from Smokestack Books. Interviewed by BBC Radio Wales (Ju= ne 7, 2009). http://leafbooks.co.uk/New/Leaf%20A uthors/Kinsey,Chris.html EMMA LEE, "Yellow Torchlight and the Blues" (Original Plus)http://homepage= .ntlworld.com/teamle e/index.html PAUL LEE, "The Light Forecast" (Original Plus)http://homepage.ntlworld.com= /teamle e/index.html BOB MEE: The Maker of Glass Eyes (Cinnamon, 2009) and Paradise Road (2003)= . http://raggedraven.co.uk/ MATT MERRITT: "Troy Town" (Arrowhead Press, 2008) http://polyolbion.blogspot.com/ IAN MORGAN, "The Flesh Suite" (forthcoming, bluechrome). Hyperlink to foll= ow. MATT NUNN: "Happy Cos I'm Blue" (Heaventree Press) http://www.mattthepoet.co.uk/ TONY PETCH=C2=A0 http://raggedraven.co.uk/collection s.htm SUSAN RICHARDSON: "Creatures of the Intertidal Zone", and also one of the= resident poets on BBC Radio 4's 'Saturday Live'.http://www.susanrichardso= nwriter.co .uk/ STEVE ROONEY=C2=A0 http://www.myspace.com/sgrooney GILLIAN SPRAGGS, author of "Outlaws & Highwaymen", editor of "Love Shook= my Senses: Lesbian Love Poems". http://www.gillianspraggs.com/ BEN STAINTON, "The Jealousies" (BeWrite) http://www.amazon.co.uk/Jealousies- Benjamin-Stainton/dp/1905202962 GEOFF STEVENS, 2009 Ted Slade Award winner, "The Phrenology of Anaglypta"= (bluechrome) et cetera; also editor of "The Purple Patch". http://www.geoffstevens.co.uk/ JON STONE=C2=A0 http://www.bandijcat.com/ CAROL THISTLETHWAITE=C2=A0http://www.bewrite.net/merchant2/4. 00/merchant.mv?Screen=3DPROD&Store_Co de=3DB&Product_Code=3D978-1-905202-76-8 PAM THOMPSON, author of 'The Japan Quiz' (forthcoming, Redbeck Press), Spi= n (Waldean P ress) and Parting the Ghosts of Salt (Redbeck Press); also widely antholog= ised. http://pamthompsonpoetry.wordpress. com/ LYDIA TOWSEY=C2=A0http://secretagentartist.wordpress. com/about/ DEBORAH TYLER-BENNETT, "Clark Gable in Mansfield", 'Pavilions', and editor= of "Coffee House" . http://www.poetrypf.co.uk/deborahty lerbennettpage.html TONY WILLIAMS: 'The Corner of Arundel Lane and Charles Street' (forthcomin= g, Salt Publishing). http://aye-lass.blogspot.com/ MIKE WILSON: Desperanto (forthcoming) http://www.amazon.co.uk/Desperanto- Mike-Wilson/dp/0955402875/ref=3Dsr_1_ 1?ie=3DUTF8&s=3Dbooks&qid=3D1209494460&sr =3D8-1 * IMPORTANT NOTE: Programme subject to change. If a writer needs to withdr= aw from the festival, I will work to find a suitable replacement, and refl= ect the changes here as soon as they occur. Please bear in mind that if th= ere are late withdrawals, this will mean a late change to the schedule. We= are committed to ensuring that this quantity and quality of entertainment= will be delivered during the course of the festival. ----------------------------------- -------------------------------- ALL WORKSHOPS ARE COMPLETELY FREE! That's right, completely free, no catches. However, you will need to buy= a ticket for the festival to be eligible. You will need book your worksho= p space in advance if you want to be guaranteed a place.=C2=A0 At present, you can only attend one free workshop, although this may chang= e, depending on demand. To book a workshop, contact Helen Relf (details be= low) by e-mail or telephone, and let her know your three most preferred20c= hoices. You will then be allocated to your most preferred workshop(s) with= spaces left. All workshop enquiries to Helen Relf, telephone 01509 222 967 (overseas:= +44 1509 222 967) between 9am-5pm BST, or e-mail H.L.Relf@lboro.ac.uk. CONFIRMED TO GIVE WORKSHOPS: CAROLE BALDOCK: CINNAMON PRESS: Small Press Publishing (no maximum place limit) SALLY CLARK: "A Hole to See The Sky Through And Find a Poem In." Led by Sally Clark this writing workshop will explore holes: from black ho= les, bolt holes, man holes to holes in your socks. Holes can be both a tra= p and an escape, framing what we experience of the world. With examples of= views through holes from poets, philosophers, journalists, and sculptors= plus a chance to make and use a few holes of your own, just bring pen and= paper and let the holes provide the inspiration. ANGELA FRANCE: 'Speaking through the Mask' - writing as persona. (20 places) NICK CARBO: Writing With Chi: How to Harness the Energy of the Universe to= Produce Poems. JANE COMMANE & MATT NUNN: 'The Library & Museum of Imagination' ROSEMARY DUN: Poetry From Nowhere - how to write poetry when you're uninspired. You've= got a deadline, or you have a nub of an idea which won't develop, or you= just want to write a poem, and your muse appears to have deserted you. Co= me along and discover how to bring forth your poetry. Prepare to be bold= and have fun. Workshop led by Rosemary Dun, lecturer, poet, writer and pe= rformer, MA Creative Writing. (15 places) SONIA HENDY-ISAAC: Perfor mance Poetry & Performing Poetry This workshop aims to explore the distinct differences between page and st= age poetry; offering advice to those who may wish to move from one medium= to the other. There will also be an opportunity for page poets to improve= their reading skills and stage presence. MATT MERRITT: Poetry and Place: look at making poetry from your immediate locality, taki= ng in geography, local history, etc. (15 - 20 places available) GERRY POTTER: Looking at the origins of the participants and evoking those= very early memories as a platform for work. CHILDREN'S WORKSHOP - KERRY ORANGE: 'How to Write about Cheese or Sausages= ' ADDITIONAL WORKSHOPS/ROUNDTABLES: How to perform and where Where to publish and how=C2=A0 What to write about and why Who to ask and what about ----------------------------------- ---------------------------------- The event aims to offer a diverse array of poets and other contributors,= ranging from the literary, through to the comic. Hopefully, there will be= something for everyone. Apart from the poets reading, some author authors will be available to mee= t in person and sign copies of their books on sale. One already confirmed= is Louise Pymerhttp://chipmunkapublishing.co.uk/sh op/index.php?main_page=3Dproduct_info &products_id=3D86. The event will also be attended by some poetry publishers/magazines, and= some press, including: BeWrite Books:=C2=A0http://www.bewrite.net/merchant2/me rchant.mv bluechrome=C2=A0http://www.bluechrome.co.uk/store/s hop/ Cinnamon Press=C2=A0http://www.cinnamonpress.com/index. htm Coffee House Original Plus Books / The Journal http://www.freewebs.com/thesamsmith / Poetry Monthly=C2=A0http://www.poetrymonthly.com/ Polluto=C2=A0http://www.polluto.com/ Ragged Raven Press=C2=A0http://raggedraven.co.uk/ Staple=C2=A0http://staplemagazine.wordpress.com / Some of these publishers will be presenting exclusive showcases featuring= cutting-edge modern poetry from some of their finest authors. More details will be released as they are confirmed. Please send any enqui= ries or offers of help (organising, printing leaflets, promoting, et ceter= a) should be send to the creator of this site. ----------------------------------- ----------------------------------- ACCOMMODATION Warning: if you are thinking of booking accommodation in or around Loughbo= rough this summer, you should do so as soon as you possibly can, particula= rly for Burleigh Court. Loughborough University has signed a contract with= Japan's 2012 Olympic team, who will be visiting the campus from this summ= er. Don't risk not securing your accommodation! Off-campus (hotels, b & b):http://www.smoothhound.co.uk/loughb or.html Budget on-campus accommodation:http://www.welcometoimago.com/accom modation/budget-accommodation/ Basic single room with wash hand basin To book contact Tel: 01509 223914 Single en-suite - kitchen facilities To book contact Tel: 01509 223803 Four-star accommodation is also available on-campus at Burleigh Court Hote= l. Accommodation is subject to availability. Accommodation can be booked= directly with Loughborough University's Reservation Teams on (01509) 22= 8104/8122. Accommodation=3D2 0and any extras will be payable on departure. Accommodation charges will be as follows: Bed & Breakfast Rates =C2=A368.00 inc vat lodge accommodation for sole occupancy =C2=A379.00 inc vat executive accommodation for sole occupancy =C2=A399.00 inc vat executive accommodation for double occupancy Dinner, Bed & Breakfast Rates =C2=A389.00 inc vat lodge accommodation for sole occupancy =C2=A3100.00 inc vat executive accommodation for sole occupancy =C2=A3149.00 inc vat executive accommodation for double occupancy Please note that the charges for Burleigh Court are per room, per night.= If you prefer a greater choice of accommodation type, please click the li= nk for off-campus accommodation. There is a good bus service between Lough= borough town and the university campus, many local taxi services, and plen= ty of parking space at the university. Contact Details Email: Website: http://artisanslibrary.ning.com/eve nts/e... Location: Leicester, United Kingdom Recent news =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 10:09:34 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: amy king Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Communities seem to actually be occasions, occasional or frequent occasions= , and not, as you note, unified homogeneous (or static) groups.=A0 Akin to = Wittgenstein's theory family resemblance and games.=A0 They appear as a sol= id front when they come together in the name of community to respond to som= ething, typically an affront on people who, intentionally or not, carry the= political label assigned or find themselves in circumstances that they vol= untarily entered based on a loose premise -- and then dissolve again, unawa= re of each member's "community" status, until the next affront or call to o= ccasion arises ...=20 Amy _______ =0A =0A =0AAmy's Alias =0Ahttp://amyking.org/ --- On Fri, 7/10/09, Lauren Russell wrote: I hate the word "community," as in "The Black Community," "The LGBT Communi= ty," "The Jewish Community," etc., because it advances an oversimplified vi= ew of the world in asserting the existence of these enormous "communities" = that do not actually exist.=A0 I mean, what is the often-discussed Black Co= mmunity, anyway?=A0 There are many black communities, and there are black p= eople who do not belong to any community, and there are black people who be= long to communities that consist primarily of people who are not black.=A0 = There is no single, homogenous "Black Community" as that misuse of the word= seems to suggest. Lauren =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 09:59:14 +0530 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve dalachinsky Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit creative poo poo - to creates wha's important to write what's inmportant work shos jerk shops - doo do do On Thu, 9 Jul 2009 15:22:51 -0500 Skip Fox writes: > "creative writing" is the language of a bureaucrat, not a writer. > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 09:12:53 -0500 Reply-To: dgodston@gmail.com Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Daniel Godston Organization: Borderbend Arts Collective Subject: The Bauhaus: 90 Years / 90 Days MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi all, Updates regarding "The Bauhaus: 90 Years / 90 Days" can be accessed at http://bauhaus9090.org/. Please feel free to contact me if you are interested in participating in this project. Thanks, Dan ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 12:56:54 -0400 Reply-To: tyrone williams Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: tyrone williams Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Agree wholeheartedly, Lauren. Tyrone -----Original Message----- >From: Lauren Russell >Sent: Jul 10, 2009 1:42 AM >To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude > >I hate the word "community," as in "The Black Community," "The LGBT Commun= ity," "The Jewish Community," etc., because it advances an oversimplified v= iew of the world in asserting the existence of these enormous "communities"= that do not actually exist.=C2=A0 I mean, what is the often-discussed Blac= k Community, anyway?=C2=A0 There are many black communities, and there are = black people who do not belong to any community, and there are black people= who belong to communities that consist primarily of people who are not bla= ck.=C2=A0 There is no single, homogenous "Black Community" as that misuse o= f the word seems to suggest. > >Lauren > > > > > >=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guideline= s & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html Tyrone Williams =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 10:01:34 +0530 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve dalachinsky Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit yes franco amwerican me too what a puzzle french spaghetti or fascist spaghetti On Thu, 9 Jul 2009 13:36:10 -0700 David Chirot writes: > "THE AMERICAN PEOPLE" WHEN SAID BY ANY PERSON IN POLITICS > > "radical,innovative poetry"--is always being asked for; meaning it > is > conventional, safe, dull > > "native; native american" its patronizing and makes one think of > "the > natives are getting restless" in twenty million movies with Bwana > aka Bwana > Devil; it's American Indian as Russell Means pointed out everyone > else is a > something-American, Chinese-American, Irish-Americanm, African > American; > only Indians have America first--because the First Peoples--American > Indian > of course "American" is named for an Italian-- > and then why is chef boy-ar-dee making "franco american spagetti"! > a real puzzler since childhood > > > On Thu, Jul 9, 2009 at 11:06 AM, Gloria Frym > wrote: > > > such as "workshopped" > > a verb that rivals "outsourced > > > > > > Mary Kasimor wrote: > > > >> I really hate words that have a corporate efficiency purpose, > usually > >> words that were nouns but have become verbs. > >> > >> --- On Tue, 7/7/09, Ruth Lepson wrote: > >> > >> > >> From: Ruth Lepson > >> Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude > >> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > >> Date: Tuesday, July 7, 2009, 11:11 PM > >> > >> > >> 'indeed' > >> > >> > >> On 7/7/09 8:05 AM, "mIEKAL aND" wrote: > >> > >> > >> > >>> Which words make you wince? > >>> Poets have been asked for their most hated words. What are > yours? > >>> > >>> 'What word do you hate and why?' is the intriguing question put > to a > >>> selection of poets by the Ledbury festival. Philip Wells's reply > is > >>> the winner for me - 'pulchritude' is certainly up there on my > >>> blacklist. He even explains his animosity in suitably poetic > terms: > >>> > >>> "it violates all the magical impulses of balanced onomatopoeic > language - it of course means "beautiful", but its meaning is > nothing > >>> of the sort, being stuffed to the brim with a brutally latinate > cudgel > >>> of barbaric consonants. If consonants represent riverbanks and > vowels > >>> the river's flow, this is the word equivalent of the bottomless > abyss > >>> of dry bones, where demons gather to spit acid." > >>> > >>> For Geraldine Monk, "it's got to be 'redacted' which makes me > feel > >>> totally sick. It's a brutish sounding word. It doesn't flow, it > prods > >>> at you in a nasty manner." > >>> > >>> Both these poets understand that the key to words that make you > feel > >>> nauseous is not the meaning - it's easy, after all, to hate the > word > >>> 'torture' ­ but something else entirely. Something > idiosyncratic, > >>> something about the way the word feels in your mouth as you say > it. > >>> The horrors of 'membrane', for instance. Or the eccentricity of > >>> 'gusset'. > >>> > >>> Having said that, I'm still trying to get my head around Paul > >>> Batchelor's explanation that "I've always hated the word 'APPAL' > (or > >>> 'appalled' or 'appalling') because I dislike hearing the sound > of my > >>> name inside other words." I can't work out if there's a case of > >>> extreme ego or extreme self-hatred going on there. > >>> > >>> And I can't help feeling that Ros Barber misses the point with > her > >>> rather po-faced reply. "Words are to be loved. Their > associations may > >>> be unpleasant but words themselves are full of poetry (and > history, > >>> and geography)," she says. "Delicious vowel sounds and > tongue-tickling > >>> consonants. There isn't a word in the English language that > doesn't > >>> excite me if I think about it long enough." > >>> > >>> Sorry, Ros, I can't agree. I'm with Rhian Edwards on 'chillax' - > "the > >>> most unnecessary and obnoxious linguistic blend to have ever > been > >>> coined". Except possibly for 'no-brainer'... > >>> > >>> Whether it's 'hubby' or 'sassy' or 'webinar' ­ what are the > words that > >>> make you wince? > >>> > >>> (many folks are posting their most hated words in the comments) > >>> > >>> > >>> > http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/booksblog/2009/jul/07/words-wince-hated-p oets > >>> ================================== > >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. > Check > >>> guidelines & > >>> sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >>> > >>> > >> > >> ================================== > >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> ================================== > >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >> > >> > >> No virus found in this incoming message. > >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: > >> 270.13.8/2227 - Release Date: 07/09/09 05:55:00 > >> > >> > >> > > > > -- > > Gloria Frym > > Associate Professor > > Writing & Literature Programs > > California College of the Arts > > > > > > > > ================================== > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines > > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 13:06:18 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Murat Nemet-Nejat Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude In-Reply-To: <20090708.134540.2756.5.skyplums@juno.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Steve, Right you are. Ciao, Murat On Wed, Jul 8, 2009 at 4:15 AM, steve dalachinsky wrote= : > catcher IN the rye > > > On Wed, 8 Jul 2009 00:11:59 -0400 Murat Nemet-Nejat > writes: > > Ever since I read Catcher on the Rye almost fifty years ago, I hate > > the word > > "grand" -in the sense of something being grand- which was also > > Caulfield's > > least favorite word. > > > > Ciao, > > > > Murat > > > > > > On Tue, Jul 7, 2009 at 8:05 AM, mIEKAL aND > > wrote: > > > > > Which words make you wince? > > > Poets have been asked for their most hated words. What are yours? > > > > > > 'What word do you hate and why?' is the intriguing question put to > > a > > > selection of poets by the Ledbury festival. Philip Wells's reply > > is the > > > winner for me - 'pulchritude' is certainly up there on my > > blacklist. He even > > > explains his animosity in suitably poetic terms: > > > > > > "it violates all the magical impulses of balanced onomatopoeic > > language - > > > it of course means "beautiful", but its meaning is nothing of the > > sort, > > > being stuffed to the brim with a brutally latinate cudgel of > > barbaric > > > consonants. If consonants represent riverbanks and vowels the > > river's flow, > > > this is the word equivalent of the bottomless abyss of dry bones, > > where > > > demons gather to spit acid." > > > > > > For Geraldine Monk, "it's got to be 'redacted' which makes me feel > > totally > > > sick. It's a brutish sounding word. It doesn't flow, it prods at > > you in a > > > nasty manner." > > > > > > Both these poets understand that the key to words that make you > > feel > > > nauseous is not the meaning - it's easy, after all, to hate the > > word > > > 'torture' =96 but something else entirely. Something idiosyncratic, > > something > > > about the way the word feels in your mouth as you say it. The > > horrors of > > > 'membrane', for instance. Or the eccentricity of 'gusset'. > > > > > > Having said that, I'm still trying to get my head around Paul > > Batchelor's > > > explanation that "I've always hated the word 'APPAL' (or > > 'appalled' or > > > 'appalling') because I dislike hearing the sound of my name inside > > other > > > words." I can't work out if there's a case of extreme ego or > > extreme > > > self-hatred going on there. > > > > > > And I can't help feeling that Ros Barber misses the point with her > > rather > > > po-faced reply. "Words are to be loved. Their associations may be > > unpleasant > > > but words themselves are full of poetry (and history, and > > geography)," she > > > says. "Delicious vowel sounds and tongue-tickling consonants. > > There isn't a > > > word in the English language that doesn't excite me if I think > > about it long > > > enough." > > > > > > Sorry, Ros, I can't agree. I'm with Rhian Edwards on 'chillax' - > > "the most > > > unnecessary and obnoxious linguistic blend to have ever been > > coined". Except > > > possibly for 'no-brainer'... > > > > > > Whether it's 'hubby' or 'sassy' or 'webinar' =96 what are the words > > that make > > > you wince? > > > > > > (many folks are posting their most hated words in the comments) > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/booksblog/2009/jul/07/words-wince-hated-p > oets > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > > guidelines > > > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 10:27:58 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: amy king Subject: I want to write fiction but ... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable but poetry always stops me.=C2=A0=20 Just wondering, so thought I'd ask a bunch of poets who might have the same= itch, why can't you scratch it?=C2=A0=C2=A0 Why this hurdle in making the = transition?=C2=A0=20 John Ashbery -- "...every time I sit down and try to write some fiction I e= nd up writing a=0Apoem instead, so it gets continually postponed. In fact I= often think=0Ait=E2=80=99s become for me a device for tricking myself into= writing poetry." Kristy Bowen -- "While one of the coolest things about poetry for me is the= ability to=0Atwist language in all sorts of ways, fiction depends far too = much on=0Ameaning, on conveyance, to allow too much twisting or prodding be= fore=0Ayou lose your reader. Even in my own reading exploits, the point fro= m=0Awhich I enter a piece of fiction is entirely different from the state= =0Aof mind in which I enter a poem. Anything can happen in a poem, jumps=0A= of logic, of image, of meaning, and I'm ..."=C2=A0 cont'd here:=C2=A0 http:= //tiny.cc/fiction502 http://tiny.cc/fiction502 Amy _______ =0A =0A =0AAmy's Alias =0Ahttp://amyking.org/=0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 09:04:03 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Michael Subject: The new ROCKPILE Blog at Big Bridge Online Comments: To: Michael Comments: cc: Michael MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear Big Bridge Readers,=20 Please check out the new ROCKPILE Website & Blog at Big Bridge, = www.bigbridge.org/rockpile/ ROCKPILE is a collaboration between David Meltzer - poet, musician, = essayist, and more - and Michael Rothenberg of Big Bridge Press. David = and Michael will journey through eight cities in the U.S. to perform = poetry and prose, composed while on the road, with local musicians and = artists in each city. ROCKPILE will serve to educate and preserve as = well as to create a history of collaboration. It will help to reinforce = the tradition of the troubadour of all generations, central to the = cultural upheaval and identity politics that reawakened poets, artists, = musicians, and songwriters in the mid-1960s through the 1970s. The = project will end with a final multimedia performance celebration in San = Francisco. The ROCKPILE Website & Blog will tell you all you need to know about the = ROCKPILE project including performance dates, venues, artist bios and = performance clips of some of the musicians we will be meeting and = performing with in each of the cities.=20 Once we hit the road, we will be posting travel photos, journal = entries, performance videos, interviews and more, daily, on the ROCKPILE = Blog, so log on and join us as we travel around the country. Write us, = comment on the blog, and let us know you are with us, let us know you = care!=20 And of course, we hope to see you on the road! Best,=20 Michael Rothenberg, David Meltzer, Terri Carrion & Ziggy. ROCKPILE www.bigbridge.org/rockpile/ Made possible by a grant from the Creative Work Fund, a program of the = Walter and Elise Haas Fund,=20 also supported by generous grants from The William and Flora Hewlett = Foundation and The James Irvine Foundation, and support from the = Committee on Poetry. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 10:54:58 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Mary Kasimor Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Well...I have attempted to write fiction, but it takes so long. I don't thi= nk that is the reason, though. I know many poets write fiction and non-fict= ion. I find that my brain works with short bursts of thoughts, not prolonge= d bursts of thoughts. It is a shame. Maybe those of us who would like to wr= ite fiction should start an online workshop of sorts. (I was reading the be= low post, and yes, poetry is word acrobatics, certainly more than fiction. Mary --- On Fri, 7/10/09, amy king wrote: From: amy king Subject: I want to write fiction but ... To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 12:27 PM but poetry always stops me.=C2=A0=20 Just wondering, so thought I'd ask a bunch of poets who might have the same= itch, why can't you scratch it?=C2=A0=C2=A0 Why this hurdle in making the = transition?=C2=A0=20 John Ashbery -- "...every time I sit down and try to write some fiction I e= nd up writing a poem instead, so it gets continually postponed. In fact I often think it=E2=80=99s become for me a device for tricking myself into writing poetry= ." Kristy Bowen -- "While one of the coolest things about poetry for me is the= ability to twist language in all sorts of ways, fiction depends far too much on meaning, on conveyance, to allow too much twisting or prodding before you lose your reader. Even in my own reading exploits, the point from which I enter a piece of fiction is entirely different from the state of mind in which I enter a poem. Anything can happen in a poem, jumps of logic, of image, of meaning, and I'm ..."=C2=A0 cont'd here:=C2=A0 http:= //tiny.cc/fiction502 http://tiny.cc/fiction502 Amy _______ Amy's Alias http://amyking.org/ =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 13:56:29 -0400 Reply-To: Aryanil Mukherjee Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Aryanil Mukherjee Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <13209771.18331247248507056.JavaMail.root@dom-zbox1.bo3.lycos.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable delighted to join the team. same itch. scratched it too...=20 and the scratch has given me time and again what I call=C2=A0hybrid or mult= idiciplinary=C2=A0text where fiction, film writing, reportage and poetry ha= ve performed a fast merry-go-round so as to remain undistinguishable...=20 I think poets have a great advantage here compared to fiction writers - the= y are more ambidextrous than their counterparts.=20 Aryanil=20 ----- Forwarded Message -----=20 From: "amy king" =20 To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU=20 Sent: Friday, July 10, 2009 1:27:58 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern=20 Subject: I want to write fiction but ...=20 but poetry always stops me.=C2=A0=20 Just wondering, so thought I'd ask a bunch of poets who might have the same= itch, why can't you scratch it?=C2=A0=C2=A0 Why this hurdle in making the = transition?=C2=A0=20 John Ashbery -- "...every time I sit down and try to write some fiction I e= nd up writing a=20 poem instead, so it gets continually postponed. In fact I often think=20 it=E2=80=99s become for me a device for tricking myself into writing poetry= ."=20 Kristy Bowen -- "While one of the coolest things about poetry for me is the= ability to=20 twist language in all sorts of ways, fiction depends far too much on=20 meaning, on conveyance, to allow too much twisting or prodding before=20 you lose your reader. Even in my own reading exploits, the point from=20 which I enter a piece of fiction is entirely different from the state=20 of mind in which I enter a poem. Anything can happen in a poem, jumps=20 of logic, of image, of meaning, and I'm ..."=C2=A0 cont'd here:=C2=A0 http:= //tiny.cc/fiction502=20 http://tiny.cc/fiction502=20 Amy=20 _______=20 Amy's Alias=20 http://amyking.org/=20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=20 The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 11:01:44 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: David Chirot Subject: fw new soundscape / performed text - buds have spoken b(l)ack - from sean burn MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable one of the best multi media artists there is and with political/human right= s & awareness work and conscience ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: sean burn Date: Fri, Jul 10, 2009 at 9:48 AM dear all just to let you know i have a new soundscape / performed text *buds have spoken b(l)ack *premi=E8red at this years carlisles arts festival. details below Arcade Arts Exhibition, Unit 2-4 Lowther Arcade, Carlisle, Cumbria CA3. 11a= m - 5pm. Friday 17th =96 Sat 25th July. for full program contact Caroline Dal= ton 07856820680 / *arcadearts@hotmail.co.uk* *buds have spoken b(l)ack. 5'38''. 2009. *a soundscape / performed text in tribute to the work of lorna graves, visual artist whose work came from the land, and was produced outdoors if possible, allowing the elements to leave their traces on her work. in response i have made a soundmap overlayered with a text spoken / whispered / chanted etc to create a landscape that transcends the recognisable, to find the magical. *sean burn *is a writer, performer & outsider artist with a growing international reputation. the maker of fifteen poetry films which* *have no= w received many screenings worldwide, as well as at tate modern and national film theatre studios, london.* *his performance for non-theatre spaces - *bastilles englan* concerned with 'escaping all our asylums' is currently touring. his latest spoken word cd was *speaksong *with gareth mitchell, musician*. *skr= ev press (*www.skrevpress.com* ) are publishing a third full collection of his writing =96 *wings are giving out *=96 shortly= . more at ***www.gobscure.info* if you are unable to attend in person you are welcome to download this work for free as an mp3 file (5'38'' / 6mb) from *www.sendspace.com/file/ti3uuo* best wishes sean burn =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 11:19:26 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Stephen Vincent Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Yes, as a definable, factual, actual group, 'community' is/was probably alw= ays a fiction.=A0 Yet,=A0 'community' particularly as a word representing g= roup fiction(s) back circa 196_ - 197_ was in many ways a very effective on= e in terms of uniting people and giving power to create, support, pass and = enforce legislation (new laws) that overturned discriminatory practices, fu= rthering job training and promotion, opening up kinds of scholarship, no ma= tter what any individual of any color or sexual or ethnic persuasion though= t about their actual relationship (or not) to to such within their own ascr= ibed 'community'.=A0=A0 I suspect nothing would have ever changed without m= ultiple 'communities ' , fictitious, or momentary,=A0 or we would be still = stuck with our white fore-present-future white fathers who might have been = quite happy to be still in charge of the 'community at large.' (Think Chene= y for starters, et al!).=20 By the way, the Souther Poverty Law Center needs your contributions. Phone = call last night tells me the Center is tracking 87 hate groups in Californi= a alone, and that, across the country, hate crimes are on a big rise - attr= ibuting part of that to portions of the population who cannot tolerate havi= ng an African-American President.=20 Stephen Vincent =A0http://stephenvincent.net/blog/ --- On Fri, 7/10/09, tyrone williams wrote: From: tyrone williams Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 9:56 AM Agree wholeheartedly, Lauren. Tyrone -----Original Message----- >From: Lauren Russell >Sent: Jul 10, 2009 1:42 AM >To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude > >I hate the word "community," as in "The Black Community," "The LGBT Commun= ity," "The Jewish Community," etc., because it advances an oversimplified v= iew of the world in asserting the existence of these enormous "communities"= that do not actually exist.=A0 I mean, what is the often-discussed Black C= ommunity, anyway?=A0 There are many black communities, and there are black = people who do not belong to any community, and there are black people who b= elong to communities that consist primarily of people who are not black.=A0= There is no single, homogenous "Black Community" as that misuse of the wor= d seems to suggest. > >Lauren > > > > > >=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guideline= s & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html Tyrone Williams =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 15:01:58 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Carol Novack Subject: Performance by Iranian-born author Amir Parsa et al., including me: Weds., July 15, Purdah 2.0: Body Matters, Engendered 09 Festival, closing night MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable *Closing Night Engendered 09, Purdah 2.0: Body Matters* July 15, Halvai Gallery, 75 Grand St, NY, 7pm Onwards * * "Now, Then, and Forever: *revolutions, politics, literature, contestation * * * * Creative-Critical-Contemporary* *C*ome to see, hear and discuss the works of some of the leading avant-garde writers of our time Canto XIV - Dusk's Ether with Ashes the bassadiga Interactive Readings and Discussions Amir Parsa With Joe Brent=E2=80=A8& Amir ElSaffar Kaveh Bassiri Sarah Husain Carol Novack Rodrigo Toscano July 15, 200, Halvai Gallery , (Grand@Wooster in Soho) *7 Prelude | 7:30 Bassa | 8 Fragments | 9 Party* Canto XIV - Dusk's Ether with Ashes Parafrags (parallel fragments) to Canto XIV at Halvai Gallery unfolding on: 1. Engendered.org: Canto XIV Narraflow 2. Twitter (amparsa): Canto XIV Narratweet 3. Bassadiga: Canto XIV Oralities/Readation, 4. + A bassadiga is a short interventionist interlude with minimal props meant to present inroads into artistic and/or literary innovations and alternatives. The bassadiga consists of readings, oral expressions and, occasionally, brief mini-lectures and minimalistically performative interactions and discussions. *About Amir Parsa:* An internationally acclaimed writer and poet, Amir Parsa is the author of over ten literary books, most recently* Drive-by Cannibalism in the Baroque Tradition*, and *Erre*. An uncategorizable body of work, Mr. Parsa's literary oeuvre - written in English, French and Persian - constitutes a radical polyphonic enterprise that puts into question national, cultural and aesthetic attachments and discourses while fashioning new genres, forms and even species of literary artifacts (*Fragm= ent *and *Ifs & Co.*). He was included in the anthology of new French and Francophone poets (Ed. Huguet 2004). Born in Tehran, Mr. Parsa holds degree= s from Princeton and Columbia and currently lives in New York, where he is a Lecturer and Educator at the Museum of Modern Art. His work is featured in Purdah 2.0: Body Matters as a site specific installation and constitutes on= e fragment of canto XIV. [image: mailto:] [image: Engendered] [image: Pardah 2.0] [image: Engendered] [image: Purdah 2.0 Body Matters] Purdah 2.0: Body Matters *The Second Annual Arts Exhibition at Engendered* June 25th-July 16th, 2009 | Halvai Gallery, 75 Grand Street, NY *Opening Reception: June 30, 2009 7 p.m.* After the inaugural edition of Purdah - the unprecedented transcultural exhibition on art, gender and sexuality last year, Engendered presents Purdah 2.0: Body Matters. Curated In Two Parts by: *Amina Begum Ahmed & Priyanka Mathew* Exhibition Director : *Myna Mukherjee* Body Matters is a contemporary & provocative exploration both of why the body matters and what matters of the body are, have been and could become. Across cultures, how do we find a visual and aesthetic language to engage with the body as simultaneously a site of refuge, resistance, tradition, freedom, sorrow, solace, desire, pain, rebellion, and rage? Body Matters investigates the body as a site for contestations of power & violence, perception & reality, memory & loss, and finally, station & displacement - especially within urban ecologies and the ever morphous shifting boundaries of personal and political geographies. Ahmed brings together diverse artists whose stories and experiences form a narrative that excavates, personalizes and reclaims the 'body' that has bee= n subsumed by the dominant normative . On the other hand, Mathew's curation o= f artists explores the human form as an agent/catalyst to dissect political, social and metaphysical dialogues on sexuality, gender and the relationship= s in the grey areas that don't qualify neatly in either category. Body Matters brings together figurative, conceptual, experiential and also site specific works by some of the most leading, iconic and emergent transcultural artists from India, Pakistan, Iran, U.S & China. For more info: admin@engendered.org visit www.engendered.org Sunil Gupta along with - Performance Poetry Talks Screenings Education Anwar Saeed Marcus Leatherdale Ayesha Durrani Abir Karmarkar Raghava KK Fareeda Batool Khal= il Chishtee Dong Ming Guang Shailja Gupta Amita Bhatt Srinivas Kuruganti Amir Parsa Pritika Chowdhry Noelle Williams Salman Toor Ariane Lopez-Huici Mar= co Guerra & Yasmina Alaoui In collaboration with [image: Tucker Robbins] [image: Halvai] --=20 Latest Publications http://www.drunkenboat.com/db10/10vis/novack/beginning.html http://necessaryfiction.com/2009/07/carol-novack-four-variations.html http://fr.calameo.com/read/000007739c1b68f2a353f http://www.wheelhousemagazine.com/prose/Execution_All_Fall_Down.mp3 http://www.wheelhousemagazine.com/poetry/Desire.mp3 http://www.the-chimaera.com/Feb2009/Theme/Poems/Novack.html http://www.crossingchaos.com/WHAT_TO_DO_WITH_THE_BABIES_by_CAROL_NOVACK.htm= l Blog: http://carolnovack.blogspot.com/ Coming in 2010: The illustrated collection "Giraffes in Hiding: The Mythica= l Memoirs of Carol Novack," from Crossing Chaos Enigmatic Ink. CD: INVENTIONS II: Fictions, Fusions & Poems is available for purchase at http://cdbaby.com/cd/cnwdcmbrm FILM: http://www.vudici.net/movies/Civil_War/Civil_War_1.html MAD HATTERS' REVIEW: edgy & enlightened art, literature, & music in the Age of Dementia: http://www.madhattersreview.com "Mapquest If you walk swiftly to reach deadlines, you may miss the turn. If you walk slowly to arrive at specific places, you may miss the turn. Walk without point past the playgrounds and cemeteries, wedding rotunda= s and taverns. Walk only toward possibility without thought and reflection without light." - CN c. 2008 from "Gated Communities" =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 10:16:06 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Catherine Daly Subject: Re: MARK(S) In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit so should the filter words be words you love or words you hate? or should they be some sort of allergen related words, like "tissue" and "histamine"? On Thu, Jul 9, 2009 at 9:48 PM, CA Conrad wrote: > in Ted Pearson's MARK(S) zine online: > http://www.markszine.net > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > -- All best, Catherine Daly c.a.b.daly@gmail.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 12:05:07 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: David Chirot Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <23028242.18351247248589740.JavaMail.root@dom-zbox1.bo3.lycos.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "The blank and ruin we see in Nature {prose here on poetics} is in our own eye. R W Emerson i've never really understood why this endless setting against each other of two different things is supposed to be so important; are Americans too hooked on the US vs THEM mentality---? do poets feel so insecure they have to keep attacking prose? a good deal of what a piece of writing is is what is there not only on the part of the writer, but the reader also people write of wanting "open work" yet isn't there a narrowness rather than openness on the part of the reader who demands openness but only of a certain kind? how open is the reader to openness--? does it justt end at a narrow point--or, before even reading, judge a piece as "unopen" --because prose say is "never open?"-- i.e. if one approaches a "poem" as always superior to "dull, functional narrative unloved unwanted prose"--then of course poetry will come out, no matter if it is good or bad-- i think it is a lack of imagiantion; perhaps a form of lack of corage to--keep the doors and windows open to find among what blows in rains in snows --has to offer-to make use of and find interest in- doesn't everyone i a sense when they get tiredof the poem or prose infront of them start writing it in some other way--? (the French writer Pierre bayard brings this up in his book on How to tlak about books one has never read--) as Aryanil wrote--one is really as a writer multi disclinipary--i've been a reorter, a reviewer, an essaysist, a traanslator, a visua/sound/lecial poet= , a collage artoist, a griffiti maker, maker of ruBEings, of clay impression spray paintings vbideo maker fiklm maker actor screen play writer . .. et= c from each kind of writing both as writer and reader one always find materials of interest and use--there is always something to "pick up on" in one media or grnre for a completely different one; so as not to be creating the "expected unexpected" dictated bythe set of rules one adhers to, or "school, type, group, community" of writers adheres to no, one takes and learns from every method continually because they are al interrelated--al are writing and reading written and read silent or aloud-o= r with other materials than pen and ink, pencil and eraser-- prose does la lot of things far better than poetry and often times may be poetry of a kind only the very best of poems can touch and poetry does things prose doesn't do-though it can rise to the heights o= f the best prose-- one takes note that many poets write both good poems and good prose--good radio or film scripts--good drama--good short stories (dylan thomas for example-) Felix Feneon demostarted that one may make both novellas and peotry out of the from of the 3 line faits divers, "Nouvelles en trois lignes" (Nouvelle= s are both short stories and 'the news"--) perhaps what Amy notes is poetry as a specialization, in which case it becomes separate, and even elitist in its view of other forms of writing, and constructs a hierarchy within itself, in which only certain forms are permitted, only certain words, only certain distortions dis uptures transgressions and so on, the more specialized it becomes- if more writings are viewed as interconnected by being simply different forms of the same underlying act,writing, then they are writing al of them and each has a lot to give to each-- unlike Aranil, i don't think anyone kind of writer has an advantage over th= e other, such as poets over prose writers, in making the ulti-disciplinary ar= t adfer all, a poet is writing this! isn't the poet going to do their best to "sell the idea of poetry's superiority?" the idea of one kind of humans, one kind of writers, being better than another (poets better than prose writers)--the world's too ful of "superiority" and "us vs them" as it is-- and whatabout greatreporters journalist--?? "why i have believed as many as 5 impossible things before breakfast!" says the Red Queen in Alice through the Lookingglass-- writers of the world unite!!!! nothing to lose but the chains that divide one kind of writer from another On Fri, Jul 10, 2009 at 10:56 AM, Aryanil Mukherjee wro= te: > delighted to join the team. same itch. scratched it too... > > > > and the scratch has given me time and again what I call hybrid or > multidiciplinary text where fiction, film writing, reportage and poetry h= ave > performed a fast merry-go-round so as to remain undistinguishable... > > I think poets have a great advantage here compared to fiction writers - > they are more ambidextrous than their counterparts. > > > > Aryanil > > > > ----- Forwarded Message ----- > From: "amy king" > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Sent: Friday, July 10, 2009 1:27:58 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: I want to write fiction but ... > > but poetry always stops me. > > > Just wondering, so thought I'd ask a bunch of poets who might have the sa= me > itch, why can't you scratch it? Why this hurdle in making the transitio= n? > > > John Ashbery -- "...every time I sit down and try to write some fiction I > end up writing a > poem instead, so it gets continually postponed. In fact I often think > it=92s become for me a device for tricking myself into writing poetry." > > > Kristy Bowen -- "While one of the coolest things about poetry for me is t= he > ability to > twist language in all sorts of ways, fiction depends far too much on > meaning, on conveyance, to allow too much twisting or prodding before > you lose your reader. Even in my own reading exploits, the point from > which I enter a piece of fiction is entirely different from the state > of mind in which I enter a poem. Anything can happen in a poem, jumps > of logic, of image, of meaning, and I'm ..." cont'd here: > http://tiny.cc/fiction502 > > http://tiny.cc/fiction502 > > > Amy > > _______ > > > > > > Amy's Alias > > http://amyking.org/ > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 12:34:08 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: George Bowering Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <563663.57662.qm@web83306.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v753.1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes; format=flowed I have never found it to be a problem. I have managed a lot of novels and books of stories. I think that that is not all that uncommon in Canada. Kroetsch, Atwood, MacEwen, Ondaatje, McFadden, Cohen, etc. gb On Jul 10, 2009, at 10:27 AM, amy king wrote: > but poetry always stops me. > > > Just wondering, so thought I'd ask a bunch of poets who might have =20 > the same itch, why can't you scratch it? Why this hurdle in =20 > making the transition? > > > John Ashbery -- "...every time I sit down and try to write some =20 > fiction I end up writing a > poem instead, so it gets continually postponed. In fact I often think > it=92s become for me a device for tricking myself into writing = poetry." > > > Kristy Bowen -- "While one of the coolest things about poetry for =20 > me is the ability to > twist language in all sorts of ways, fiction depends far too much on > meaning, on conveyance, to allow too much twisting or prodding before > you lose your reader. Even in my own reading exploits, the point from > which I enter a piece of fiction is entirely different from the state > of mind in which I enter a poem. Anything can happen in a poem, jumps > of logic, of image, of meaning, and I'm ..." cont'd here: http://=20 > tiny.cc/fiction502 > > http://tiny.cc/fiction502 > > > Amy > > _______ > > > > > > Amy's Alias > > http://amyking.org/ > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 > welcome.html Geo. Bowering, RCAF 227498 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 16:03:04 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Charlotte Mandel Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <563663.57662.qm@web83306.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Well, I have published some short fiction, but stopped after =20 struggling with one piece that wanted to become a novel. It would =20 have required research and mind-attention for too long a time. And =20 in fiction, I have to deal with people - often stubbornly insistent =20 on having their own way. Poetry gives me greater joy of language. And I can go anywhere, =20 discover music in rhythm and thought. Charlotte On Jul 10, 2009, at 1:27 PM, amy king wrote: but poetry always stops me. Just wondering, so thought I'd ask a bunch of poets who might have =20 the same itch, why can't you scratch it? Why this hurdle in making =20 the transition? John Ashbery -- "...every time I sit down and try to write some =20 fiction I end up writing a poem instead, so it gets continually postponed. In fact I often think it=92s become for me a device for tricking myself into writing poetry." Kristy Bowen -- "While one of the coolest things about poetry for me =20 is the ability to twist language in all sorts of ways, fiction depends far too much on meaning, on conveyance, to allow too much twisting or prodding before you lose your reader. Even in my own reading exploits, the point from which I enter a piece of fiction is entirely different from the state of mind in which I enter a poem. Anything can happen in a poem, jumps of logic, of image, of meaning, and I'm ..." cont'd here: http://=20 tiny.cc/fiction502 http://tiny.cc/fiction502 Amy _______ Amy's Alias http://amyking.org/ =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 15:04:14 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: mIEKAL aND Subject: "Locavores," "staycations" get official in dictionary MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable (speaking of words to despise=97staycation makes me want to forget the neologisms ever existed) "Locavores," "staycations" get official in dictionary http://www.reuters.com/article/lifestyleMolt/idUSTRE5690LE20090710 "Locavores" can officially take a "staycation" this year, being among 100 new words to feature in the 2009 edition of a leading U.S. dictionary, Merriam-Webster's Collegiate Dictionary. John Morse, president and publisher of Merriam-Webster Inc., said staycation -- meaning a vacation spent at home or nearby -- was a good example of a word meeting a need and establishing itself in the language very quickly, having first appeared in 2005 but taken off in use in 2007. He said people enjoyed blending existing words. "Another example of this kind of creative wordplay from this year's list is frenemy: one who pretends to be a friend but is actually an enemy," said Morse in a statement. "But, in addition to these 'portmanteau words', we have added new words from more predictable categories, like science, health, technology, and popular culture, which have also seen widespread use across a variety of publications." Many of the new words which appear in the 11th updated print edition and online version of the dictionary reflected the importance of the environment, such a "carbon footprint," which is a measure of carbon emissions, and "green-collar," referring to jobs that help the environment. Words relating to health and medicine were also featured such as "locavore," or a person eating foods grown locally, and "cardioprotective," meaning serving to protect the heart. The list included "waterboarding," an interrogation technique decried by human rights groups in which water is poured into the detainee's mouth and nose to give the sensation of drowning. Pop culture gave rise to a list of new words, with this year's edition featuring "docusoap," "fan fiction," and "reggaeton" -- a popular music of Puerto Rico that combines rap with Caribbean rhythms. Words from online activities were also making their way into the mainstream, some of which have come back into popular use, such as "sock puppet," which can mean a hand puppet made of a sock or a false online identity used to deceive. "Vlog," a blog containing video material, makes its first appearance in the dictionary as does "webisode," a TV show that can be seen through a website. New eating trends were also highlighted by first-time entries such as "acai" and "goji," both berries that can used in drinks or as juice, and "shawarma," meaning a sandwich of sliced lamb or chicken with vegetables, and often tahini, wrapped in pita bread. Merriam-Webster Inc. has been revising and publishing dictionaries since 18= 43. Here's the link to the list of 100 new words: http://www.merriam-webster.com/info/newwords09.htm =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 04:06:20 +0800 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Christophe Casamassima Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" MIME-Version: 1.0 i am currently in the transition, working on longish prose. my advise to my= self was, make prose theatrical. if poetry, in some sense, the lyric, is mu= sical, then prose should at least be as musical - but with such great bulk = and hulk the best it can do is be theatrical. what do i mean? here's the fi= rst bit, from the temporarily titled "The Rose" =E2=80=9CAbout that kiss,=E2=80=9D she said, bending toward the Basin: =E2= =80=9Ctoo pluperfect=E2=80=A6 not preternatural enough.=E2=80=9D Everyone a= t that time had exhausted their own causality, insipience being the modern = c=C3=B6urap, the engendered benevolence doled out at the fraternal order of= single mothers reunion, and sunbleached in a stylized fruit basket. She to= ok another sip of Warm Tea: =E2=80=9CRice planters: Ogden, Bertram, Daly an= d Francesco ripped her in two for a sandbagfull.=E2=80=9D The Sign, the Ros= e, Three Horses, the Cattle =E2=80=93 even the investigation meant nothing = to her. Their names, hers, was a trifle =E2=80=93 no one knew who or what c= ame next. An old woman, and grieving flesh made a corpulent plow, divulging= the scars of languid hygiene: =E2=80=9CI said =E2=80=98lascivivious,=E2=80= =99=E2=80=9D she said at her reflection in the Warm Tea. =E2=80=9CIt is an = incongruous fallacy to believe anything more, that a horse could make tepid= an incongruous force =E2=80=93 that of the mind over a trifle. Who can bar= e it? Who should want to?=E2=80=9D The Warm Tea gurgled at the disparity = =E2=80=93 she lunged again: =E2=80=9CAfter eight long, hard earned and a fo= rcep =E2=80=93 that=E2=80=99s the total bigamy.=E2=80=9D=20 > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "amy king" > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: I want to write fiction but ... > Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 10:27:58 -0700 >=20 >=20 > but poetry always stops me.=C2=A0 >=20 >=20 > Just wondering, so thought I'd ask a bunch of poets who might have=20 > the same itch, why can't you scratch it?=C2=A0=C2=A0 Why this hurdle in= =20 > making the transition?=C2=A0 >=20 >=20 > John Ashbery -- "...every time I sit down and try to write some=20 > fiction I end up writing a > poem instead, so it gets continually postponed. In fact I often think > it=E2=80=99s become for me a device for tricking myself into writing poet= ry." >=20 >=20 > Kristy Bowen -- "While one of the coolest things about poetry for=20 > me is the ability to > twist language in all sorts of ways, fiction depends far too much on > meaning, on conveyance, to allow too much twisting or prodding before > you lose your reader. Even in my own reading exploits, the point from > which I enter a piece of fiction is entirely different from the state > of mind in which I enter a poem. Anything can happen in a poem, jumps > of logic, of image, of meaning, and I'm ..."=C2=A0 cont'd here:=C2=A0=20 > http://tiny.cc/fiction502 >=20 > http://tiny.cc/fiction502 >=20 >=20 > Amy >=20 > _______ >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > Amy's Alias >=20 > http://amyking.org/ >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check=20 > guidelines & sub/unsub info:=20 > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > --=20 Powered By Outblaze =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 16:25:48 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Allan Revich Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude In-Reply-To: <136002033177800386226078805634798568183-Webmail@me.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ouch! In my high school days I probably would have asked you if your family lived in a submarine (courtesy of a joke that was popular with us pubescent boys)... Q: What's long and hard and full of se(a)men? A: A submarine. I suspect that the word "submarine" may now join your personal list of wince-words! Sorry :) Allan -----Original Message----- From: Poetics List (UPenn, UB) [mailto:POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU] On Behalf Of David Seaman Sent: Thursday, July 09, 2009 9:44 PM To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude Semen, since my family name is Seaman. And students ask me if spelling counts..... David W. Seaman, Ph.D. http://personal.georgiasouthern.edu/~dseaman/Welcome.html On Wednesday, July 08, 2009, at 02:02PM, "Mary Kasimor" wrote: >The word that I was looking for that I just HATE is "impacted." >Mary > >--- On Tue, 7/7/09, Ruth Lepson wrote: > > >From: Ruth Lepson >Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude >To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >Date: Tuesday, July 7, 2009, 11:11 PM > > >'indeed' > > >On 7/7/09 8:05 AM, "mIEKAL aND" wrote: > >> Which words make you wince? >> Poets have been asked for their most hated words. What are yours? >> >> 'What word do you hate and why?' is the intriguing question put to a >> selection of poets by the Ledbury festival. Philip Wells's reply is >> the winner for me - 'pulchritude' is certainly up there on my >> blacklist. He even explains his animosity in suitably poetic terms: >> >> "it violates all the magical impulses of balanced onomatopoeic >> language - it of course means "beautiful", but its meaning is nothing >> of the sort, being stuffed to the brim with a brutally latinate cudgel >> of barbaric consonants. If consonants represent riverbanks and vowels >> the river's flow, this is the word equivalent of the bottomless abyss >> of dry bones, where demons gather to spit acid." >> >> For Geraldine Monk, "it's got to be 'redacted' which makes me feel >> totally sick. It's a brutish sounding word. It doesn't flow, it prods >> at you in a nasty manner." >> >> Both these poets understand that the key to words that make you feel >> nauseous is not the meaning - it's easy, after all, to hate the word >> 'torture' - but something else entirely. Something idiosyncratic, >> something about the way the word feels in your mouth as you say it. >> The horrors of 'membrane', for instance. Or the eccentricity of >> 'gusset'. >> >> Having said that, I'm still trying to get my head around Paul >> Batchelor's explanation that "I've always hated the word 'APPAL' (or >> 'appalled' or 'appalling') because I dislike hearing the sound of my >> name inside other words." I can't work out if there's a case of >> extreme ego or extreme self-hatred going on there. >> >> And I can't help feeling that Ros Barber misses the point with her >> rather po-faced reply. "Words are to be loved. Their associations may >> be unpleasant but words themselves are full of poetry (and history, >> and geography)," she says. "Delicious vowel sounds and tongue-tickling >> consonants. There isn't a word in the English language that doesn't >> excite me if I think about it long enough." >> >> Sorry, Ros, I can't agree. I'm with Rhian Edwards on 'chillax' - "the >> most unnecessary and obnoxious linguistic blend to have ever been >> coined". Except possibly for 'no-brainer'... >> >> Whether it's 'hubby' or 'sassy' or 'webinar' - what are the words that >> make you wince? >> >> (many folks are posting their most hated words in the comments) >> >> http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/booksblog/2009/jul/07/words-wince-hated-poet s >> ================================== >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & >> sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >================================== >The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > >================================== >The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 15:40:38 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Skip Fox Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <563663.57662.qm@web83306.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I sat down almost three years ago and began writing something I thought totally worthless, beyond publication possibilities (on purpose), etc. = and have to date written an ungodly amount of revisions of a 150-page = novella. Can't stop going back in. (Even this morning, after submitting it to a publisher yesterday.) Before that, only little, single-impulse stories. "Flasher fictions" as = one editor described them.=20 Now I feel the sense that the difference in poetry/fiction from the = writing standpoint is vibrant and real, but also protean and (sorry Bob) not the = use beyond taxonomy that people would normally consider.=20 I remember Creeley writing that he wanted to be considered a "writer" = rather than a "poet." I certainly see what he means (having written poetry for nearly four decades), but I also see the draw in my engagement with = fiction is just a winsome, compelling, alluring, etc. as that within the writing = of poetry. In both, a luminous fleshy presence. I won't trade any of my various experiences (and in writing all types of poetry as well) for any of the others. (Thankfully, one doesn't have = to.) =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 15:51:08 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Mary Kasimor Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I figure that those who can write both fiction and poetry are either more t= alented or more tenacious. What are your thoughts on that? --- On Fri, 7/10/09, George Bowering wrote: From: George Bowering Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 2:34 PM I have never found it to be a problem. I have managed a lot of novels and books of stories. I think that that is not all that uncommon in Canada. Kroetsch, Atwood, MacEwen, Ondaatje, McFadden, Cohen, etc. gb On Jul 10, 2009, at 10:27 AM, amy king wrote: > but poetry always stops me. >=20 >=20 > Just wondering, so thought I'd ask a bunch of poets who might have the sa= me itch, why can't you scratch it?=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0Why this hurdle in maki= ng the transition? >=20 >=20 > John Ashbery -- "...every time I sit down and try to write some fiction I= end up writing a > poem instead, so it gets continually postponed. In fact I often think > it=E2=80=99s become for me a device for tricking myself into writing poet= ry." >=20 >=20 > Kristy Bowen -- "While one of the coolest things about poetry for me is t= he ability to > twist language in all sorts of ways, fiction depends far too much on > meaning, on conveyance, to allow too much twisting or prodding before > you lose your reader. Even in my own reading exploits, the point from > which I enter a piece of fiction is entirely different from the state > of mind in which I enter a poem. Anything can happen in a poem, jumps > of logic, of image, of meaning, and I'm ..."=C2=A0 cont'd here:=C2=A0 htt= p://tiny.cc/fiction502 >=20 > http://tiny.cc/fiction502 >=20 >=20 > Amy >=20 > _______ >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > Amy's Alias >=20 > http://amyking.org/ >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html Geo. Bowering, RCAF=C2=A0 227498 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 15:17:09 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jade Hudson Subject: ToxicPoetry.com Call for Submissions MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear Poets, I have had the pleasure of taking part in the creation of a new independent online publication for experimental mp3 poetry ( www.toxicpoetry.com ). We are in the process of constructing our first issue and are calling for submissions. Everyone who does mp3 format poetry is welcome to submit. Check out our guidelines at www.toxicpoetry.com Thank you, --Jade Hudson ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 18:15:16 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Peter Subject: hidden poem with brain scans and chairs MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit hidden poem with brain scans and chairs Peter Ciccariello http://invisiblenotes.blogspot.com/ http://uncommonvision.blogspot.com/ http://poemsfromprovidence.blogspot.com/ http://uncommon-vision.blogspot.com/ You can find my art and writing updates on Twitter https://twitter.com/ciccariello ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 16:58:00 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: George Bowering Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <345146.68398.qm@web51805.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v753.1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed On Jul 10, 2009, at 3:51 PM, Mary Kasimor wrote: > I figure that those who can write both fiction and poetry are > either more talented or more tenacious. What are your thoughts on > that? > > Have observed without being able to analyse--- That is, George Stanley is a superb and form-inventing poet, but he could never write two pages of prose fiction. On the other hand the good poet Gilbert Sorrentino became one of the US's very best novelists. In reading him it is a lot more work to read the novels than to read the poems. I expect that such was also true of the writing. George Henry Bowering Once saw Alexis Smith plain. ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 17:40:38 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve russell Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable there are a few singular talents who've managed to create 1st rate work in = fiction, poetry, and drama as well as the essay. Consider Denis Johnson, or= Jim Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. & of course we have the Buk, as wel= l as Raymond Carver. I blame the so-called creative writing programs for th= e unfortunate distinction between fiction and prose. Jeanette Winterson doe= sn't make such distinctions when she discusses her work.=20 --- On Fri, 7/10/09, Mary Kasimor wrote: From: Mary Kasimor Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 6:51 PM I figure that those who can write both fiction and poetry are either more t= alented or more tenacious. What are your thoughts on that? --- On Fri, 7/10/09, George Bowering wrote: From: George Bowering Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 2:34 PM I have never found it to be a problem. I have managed a lot of novels and books of stories. I think that that is not all that uncommon in Canada. Kroetsch, Atwood, MacEwen, Ondaatje, McFadden, Cohen, etc. gb On Jul 10, 2009, at 10:27 AM, amy king wrote: > but poetry always stops me. >=20 >=20 > Just wondering, so thought I'd ask a bunch of poets who might have the sa= me itch, why can't you scratch it?=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0Why this hurdle in maki= ng the transition? >=20 >=20 > John Ashbery -- "...every time I sit down and try to write some fiction I= end up writing a > poem instead, so it gets continually postponed. In fact I often think > it=E2=80=99s become for me a device for tricking myself into writing poet= ry." >=20 >=20 > Kristy Bowen -- "While one of the coolest things about poetry for me is t= he ability to > twist language in all sorts of ways, fiction depends far too much on > meaning, on conveyance, to allow too much twisting or prodding before > you lose your reader. Even in my own reading exploits, the point from > which I enter a piece of fiction is entirely different from the state > of mind in which I enter a poem. Anything can happen in a poem, jumps > of logic, of image, of meaning, and I'm ..."=C2=A0 cont'd here:=C2=A0 htt= p://tiny.cc/fiction502 >=20 > http://tiny.cc/fiction502 >=20 >=20 > Amy >=20 > _______ >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > Amy's Alias >=20 > http://amyking.org/ >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html Geo. Bowering, RCAF=C2=A0 227498 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 20:06:35 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Nicholas Piombino Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable When I was looking at Ashbery's Selected recently (I've been a fan for over 40 years) I had the thought: there is real coloring of fiction about this writing, only the "episodes" and "interior monologues" are very brief and evanescent. Yet a particular and recognizable attitude, "voice", whatever, and a sense of a specific life, with its relationships, big and petty issues, disappointments, revelations, worries, surprises, dejections being reflected on, is continuous. On 7/10/09 4:03 PM, "Charlotte Mandel" wrote: > John Ashbery -- "...every time I sit down and try to write some > fiction I end up writing a > poem instead, so it gets continually postponed. In fact I often think > it=B9s become for me a device for tricking myself into writing poetry." =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 17:29:57 -0800 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: carol dorf Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude In-Reply-To: <001201ca019c$9d4a0400$d7de0c00$@com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit fungible labor force sounds like a fungus but actually means workers without any rights to their jobs ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 15:30:54 -1000 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Susan Webster Schultz Subject: recent Tinfish Editor blog posts MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Please have a look: * "The angel at the center of this rind": Wallace Stevens and Hawai's Pineapple Culture * The Connections Between Things: Gary Y. Okihiro, Ledward Kaapana and the Centrality of Hawaiian Culture * "I AM SURPRISED WHEN THE SAME SEASON RETURNS": Albert Saijo in Volcano http://tinfisheditor.blogspot.com aloha, Susan ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 21:24:47 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Lauren Russell Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable You make a good point, Stephen, and I can accept that this (mis)use of "com= munity" may have served a purpose, though I don't think I like the term any= better, or the tendency of politicians and the media to invoke "Community"= in order to make sweeping generalizations. And thanks, Tyrone.=A0 I'm glad to know that I'm not alone in feeling this = way. Lauren Date:=A0 =A0 Fri, 10 Jul 2009 11:19:26 -0700 From:=A0 =A0 Stephen Vincent Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude Yes, as a definable, factual, actual group, 'community' is/was probably alw= =3D ays a fiction.=3DA0 Yet,=3DA0 'community' particularly as a word representi= ng g=3D roup fiction(s) back circa 196_ - 197_ was in many ways a very effective on= =3D e in terms of uniting people and giving power to create, support, pass and = =3D enforce legislation (new laws) that overturned discriminatory practices, fu= =3D rthering job training and promotion, opening up kinds of scholarship, no ma= =3D tter what any individual of any color or sexual or ethnic persuasion though= =3D t about their actual relationship (or not) to to such within their own ascr= =3D ibed 'community'.=3DA0=3DA0 I suspect nothing would have ever changed witho= ut m=3D ultiple 'communities ' , fictitious, or momentary,=3DA0 or we would be stil= l =3D stuck with our white fore-present-future white fathers who might have been = =3D quite happy to be still in charge of the 'community at large.' (Think Chene= =3D y for starters, et al!).=3D20 By the way, the Souther Poverty Law Center needs your contributions. Phone = =3D call last night tells me the Center is tracking 87 hate groups in Californi= =3D a alone, and that, across the country, hate crimes are on a big rise - attr= =3D ibuting part of that to portions of the population who cannot tolerate havi= =3D ng an African-American President.=3D20 Stephen Vincent =3DA0http://stephenvincent.net/blog/ --- On Fri, 7/10/09, tyrone williams wrote: From: tyrone williams Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 9:56 AM Agree wholeheartedly, Lauren. Tyrone -----Original Message----- >From: Lauren Russell >Sent: Jul 10, 2009 1:42 AM >To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude > >I hate the word "community," as in "The Black Community," "The LGBT Commun= =3D ity," "The Jewish Community," etc., because it advances an oversimplified v= =3D iew of the world in asserting the existence of these enormous "communities"= =3D that do not actually exist.=3DA0 I mean, what is the often-discussed Black= C=3D ommunity, anyway?=3DA0 There are many black communities, and there are blac= k =3D people who do not belong to any community, and there are black people who b= =3D elong to communities that consist primarily of people who are not black.=3D= A0=3D There is no single, homogenous "Black Community" as that misuse of the wor= =3D d seems to suggest. > >Lauren >=0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 21:51:15 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Wallis Leslie Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "to die for" What terrible inattention to the words coming out of our mouths leads us to= say we would die for whatever delectable morsel coming into our mouths. Ho= w the misuse of that phrase=A0 diminishes what people have died for or what= people are willing to die for. Wallis Leslie --- On Thu, 7/9/09, Lauren Russell wrote: From: Lauren Russell Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Thursday, July 9, 2009, 10:42 PM I hate the word "community," as in "The Black Community," "The LGBT Communi= ty," "The Jewish Community," etc., because it advances an oversimplified vi= ew of the world in asserting the existence of these enormous "communities" = that do not actually exist.=A0 I mean, what is the often-discussed Black Co= mmunity, anyway?=A0 There are many black communities, and there are black p= eople who do not belong to any community, and there are black people who be= long to communities that consist primarily of people who are not black.=A0 = There is no single, homogenous "Black Community" as that misuse of the word= seems to suggest. Lauren =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 06:34:13 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Asian Cha Subject: Cha: An Asian Literary Journal seeks "Lost Teas" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" We at CHA realise that sadly online journals often fold leaving countless= works=20 without a home. If you have lost a work in this way, CHA may be intereste= d in=20 republishing your work in our new regular section, "Lost Teas". Please se= e our=20 submission guidelines for more details: http://www.asiancha.com/guideline= s. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 08:12:06 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Daniel Subject: Reading in New Jersey MIME-version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I will read, along with some=20 contributors to Arsenal,=20 a new magazine I edit, at EXHALE YOGA STUDIO 223 rt. 18 south East Brunswick, NJ on Friday, July 24th, from 8:00-11:00 p.m. An open reading will follow. ~ Daniel Zimmerman =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 08:03:32 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: amy king Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Skip, From what little I've seen lately, it seems some of the most recent collect= ions of short stories are beginning to resemble "flash fiction."=A0 I wonde= r if this is indicative of some sort of general waning of our communal atte= ntion spans, or what book publishers see as such. Best, Amy=20 _______ =0A =0A =0AAmy's Alias =0Ahttp://amyking.org/ --- On Fri, 7/10/09, Skip Fox wrote: From: Skip Fox Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 4:40 PM I sat down almost three years ago and began writing something I thought totally worthless, beyond publication possibilities (on purpose), etc. and have to date written an ungodly amount of revisions of a 150-page novella. Can't stop going back in. (Even this morning, after submitting it to a publisher yesterday.) Before that, only little, single-impulse stories. "Flasher fictions" as one editor described them.=20 Now I feel the sense that the difference in poetry/fiction from the writing standpoint is vibrant and real, but also protean and (sorry Bob) not the us= e beyond taxonomy that people would normally consider.=20 I remember Creeley writing that he wanted to be considered a "writer" rathe= r than a "poet." I certainly see what he means (having written poetry for nearly four decades), but I also see the draw in my engagement with fiction is just a winsome, compelling, alluring, etc. as that within the writing of poetry. In both, a luminous fleshy presence. I won't trade any of my various experiences (and in writing all types of poetry as well) for any of the others. (Thankfully, one doesn't have to.) =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 15:36:47 -1000 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jonathan Morse Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <466931.98797.qm@web52405.mail.re2.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit steve russell wrote: > there are a few singular talents who've managed to create 1st rate work in fiction, poetry, and drama as well as the essay. Consider Denis Johnson, or Jim Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. Goethe. Rilke. Hardy. Hugo. If you'll accept non-fiction, you can add Yeats and Dryden. If you count letters as imaginative literature, and why shouldn't you?, you can add Keats and Dickinson. Think big. Jonathan Morse ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 08:26:58 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Mary Kasimor Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I am waiting for Roberto Bolano's collection of poetry. I think that it will be out in November. His fiction is amazing and my understanding is that he wanted to write poetry, but fiction brought in the money. --- On Fri, 7/10/09, Jonathan Morse wrote: From: Jonathan Morse Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 8:36 PM steve russell wrote: > there are a few singular talents who've managed to create 1st rate work in fiction, poetry, and drama as well as the essay. Consider Denis Johnson, or Jim Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. Goethe. Rilke. Hardy. Hugo. If you'll accept non-fiction, you can add Yeats and Dryden. If you count letters as imaginative literature, and why shouldn't you?, you can add Keats and Dickinson. Think big. Jonathan Morse ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 10:20:02 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve russell Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable & I neglected to mention Gilbert Sorrentino or Paul Auster. Reginald Gibbon= s, too, another excellent poet/fiction writer and critic, and translator. T= here's a rather large list of very inventive, versatile writer/poets .... M= ark Strand .... --- On Fri, 7/10/09, steve russell wrote: From: steve russell Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 8:40 PM there are a few singular talents who've managed to create 1st rate work in = fiction, poetry, and drama as well as the essay. Consider Denis Johnson, or= Jim Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. & of course we have the Buk, as wel= l as Raymond Carver. I blame the so-called creative writing programs for th= e unfortunate distinction between fiction and prose. Jeanette Winterson doe= sn't make such distinctions when she discusses her work.=20 --- On Fri, 7/10/09, Mary Kasimor wrote: From: Mary Kasimor Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 6:51 PM I figure that those who can write both fiction and poetry are either more t= alented or more tenacious. What are your thoughts on that? --- On Fri, 7/10/09, George Bowering wrote: From: George Bowering Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 2:34 PM I have never found it to be a problem. I have managed a lot of novels and books of stories. I think that that is not all that uncommon in Canada. Kroetsch, Atwood, MacEwen, Ondaatje, McFadden, Cohen, etc. gb On Jul 10, 2009, at 10:27 AM, amy king wrote: > but poetry always stops me. >=20 >=20 > Just wondering, so thought I'd ask a bunch of poets who might have the sa= me itch, why can't you scratch it?=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0Why this hurdle in maki= ng the transition? >=20 >=20 > John Ashbery -- "...every time I sit down and try to write some fiction I= end up writing a > poem instead, so it gets continually postponed. In fact I often think > it=E2=80=99s become for me a device for tricking myself into writing poet= ry." >=20 >=20 > Kristy Bowen -- "While one of the coolest things about poetry for me is t= he ability to > twist language in all sorts of ways, fiction depends far too much on > meaning, on conveyance, to allow too much twisting or prodding before > you lose your reader. Even in my own reading exploits, the point from > which I enter a piece of fiction is entirely different from the state > of mind in which I enter a poem. Anything can happen in a poem, jumps > of logic, of image, of meaning, and I'm ..."=C2=A0 cont'd here:=C2=A0 htt= p://tiny.cc/fiction502 >=20 > http://tiny.cc/fiction502 >=20 >=20 > Amy >=20 > _______ >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > Amy's Alias >=20 > http://amyking.org/ >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html Geo. Bowering, RCAF=C2=A0 227498 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 11:22:10 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Nicholas Piombino Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <4A57ECAF.5090004@hawaii.edu> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Exploringfictions Douglas Messerli's fiction blog http://exploringfictions.blogspot.com/2009/07/douglas-messerli-seven-stories -from.html On 7/10/09 9:36 PM, "Jonathan Morse" wrote: > steve russell wrote: >> there are a few singular talents who've managed to create 1st rate work in >> fiction, poetry, and drama as well as the essay. Consider Denis Johnson, or >> Jim Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. > Goethe. Rilke. Hardy. Hugo. If you'll accept non-fiction, you can add > Yeats and Dryden. If you count letters as imaginative literature, and > why shouldn't you?, you can add Keats and Dickinson. Think big. > > Jonathan Morse > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & > sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 13:46:14 +0530 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve dalachinsky Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit lighten up it's a ny thing to die for or that dress is just to die for anyay what else is there worth dying for if not fashion or a good cupcake On Fri, 10 Jul 2009 21:51:15 -0700 Wallis Leslie writes: > "to die for" > > What terrible inattention to the words coming out of our mouths > leads us to say we would die for whatever delectable morsel coming > into our mouths. How the misuse of that phrase diminishes what > people have died for or what people are willing to die for. > > Wallis Leslie > > --- On Thu, 7/9/09, Lauren Russell wrote: > > > From: Lauren Russell > Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Thursday, July 9, 2009, 10:42 PM > > > I hate the word "community," as in "The Black Community," "The LGBT > Community," "The Jewish Community," etc., because it advances an > oversimplified view of the world in asserting the existence of these > enormous "communities" that do not actually exist. I mean, what is > the often-discussed Black Community, anyway? There are many black > communities, and there are black people who do not belong to any > community, and there are black people who belong to communities that > consist primarily of people who are not black. There is no single, > homogenous "Black Community" as that misuse of the word seems to > suggest. > > Lauren > > > > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 13:01:09 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: George Bowering Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <4A57ECAF.5090004@hawaii.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v753.1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Here we go; the usual widening and widening of the topic until we can include everything, such as L'il Abner and,oh, The Wire. gb On Jul 10, 2009, at 6:36 PM, Jonathan Morse wrote: > steve russell wrote: >> there are a few singular talents who've managed to create 1st rate >> work in fiction, poetry, and drama as well as the essay. Consider >> Denis Johnson, or Jim Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. > Goethe. Rilke. Hardy. Hugo. If you'll accept non-fiction, you can > add Yeats and Dryden. If you count letters as imaginative > literature, and why shouldn't you?, you can add Keats and > Dickinson. Think big. > > Jonathan Morse > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ > welcome.html George B. Author of his own misfortunes. ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 13:04:36 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: George Bowering Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <581353.21970.qm@web52406.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v753.1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes; format=flowed Didn't that guy that lived on the Olympic Peninsula and was imitated =20 by all the Creative Writhing students skip from poetry to short fiction? Can't remember his name. Wrote a =20 book called something like What Do We Talk About When we Talk about Love or some such topic. gb On Jul 11, 2009, at 10:20 AM, steve russell wrote: > & I neglected to mention Gilbert Sorrentino or Paul Auster. =20 > Reginald Gibbons, too, another excellent poet/fiction writer and =20 > critic, and translator. There's a rather large list of very =20 > inventive, versatile writer/poets .... Mark Strand .... > > --- On Fri, 7/10/09, steve russell wrote: > > From: steve russell > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 8:40 PM > > there are a few singular talents who've managed to create 1st rate =20 > work in fiction, poetry, and drama as well as the essay. Consider =20 > Denis Johnson, or Jim Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. & of =20 > course we have the Buk, as well as Raymond Carver. I blame the so-=20 > called creative writing programs for the unfortunate distinction =20 > between fiction and prose. Jeanette Winterson doesn't make such =20 > distinctions when she discusses her work. > > --- On Fri, 7/10/09, Mary Kasimor wrote: > > From: Mary Kasimor > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 6:51 PM > > I figure that those who can write both fiction and poetry are =20 > either more talented or more tenacious. What are your thoughts on =20 > that? > > --- On Fri, 7/10/09, George Bowering wrote: > > > From: George Bowering > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 2:34 PM > > > I have never found it to be a problem. > I have managed a lot of novels and books of stories. > > I think that that is not all that uncommon in Canada. > Kroetsch, Atwood, MacEwen, Ondaatje, McFadden, Cohen, etc. > > gb > > > On Jul 10, 2009, at 10:27 AM, amy king wrote: > >> but poetry always stops me. >> >> >> Just wondering, so thought I'd ask a bunch of poets who might have =20= >> the same itch, why can't you scratch it? Why this hurdle in =20 >> making the transition? >> >> >> John Ashbery -- "...every time I sit down and try to write some =20 >> fiction I end up writing a >> poem instead, so it gets continually postponed. In fact I often think >> it=92s become for me a device for tricking myself into writing = poetry." >> >> >> Kristy Bowen -- "While one of the coolest things about poetry for =20 >> me is the ability to >> twist language in all sorts of ways, fiction depends far too much on >> meaning, on conveyance, to allow too much twisting or prodding before >> you lose your reader. Even in my own reading exploits, the point from >> which I enter a piece of fiction is entirely different from the state >> of mind in which I enter a poem. Anything can happen in a poem, jumps >> of logic, of image, of meaning, and I'm ..." cont'd here: http://=20= >> tiny.cc/fiction502 >> >> http://tiny.cc/fiction502 >> >> >> Amy >> >> _______ >> >> >> >> >> >> Amy's Alias >> >> http://amyking.org/ >> >> >> >> >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 >> welcome.html > > Geo. Bowering, > RCAF 227498 > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 > welcome.html > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 > welcome.html > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 > welcome.html > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 > welcome.html George Bowering, esq. Not a morning kind of guy. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 13:40:18 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Catherine Daly Subject: Chaparral--Summer, 2009 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit new la poetry 'zine The summer issue of Chaparral is here! The new edition features an interview with Maggie Nelson and work by Dinah Lenney, Marsha de la O, Lynne Thompson, Leilani Hall, Gail Wronsky and others. http://www.chaparralpoetry.net/ -- All best, Catherine Daly c.a.b.daly@gmail.com -- All best, Catherine Daly c.a.b.daly@gmail.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 18:05:27 -0600 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Mark DuCharme Subject: REMINDER: Robinson, Fleisher & Amato This Thursday, Stratford Park Reading Series In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Please join us at the STRATFORD PARK READING SERIES as three extraordinary = writers present readings of their work: ELIZABETH ROBINSON=2C KASS FLEISHER= & JOE AMATO. It all happens THIS THURSDAY=2C JULY 16th at 7:30 p.m. Address: 3030 O=92NEAL PARKWAY=2C Boulder=2C Colorado (across the street from Naropa University=92s Paramita campus & the Boulder= Cork restaurant) http://www.mapquest.com/maps?city=3DBoulder&state=3DCO&address=3D3030+O=92n= eal+Parkway&zipcode=3D80301 A Donation is requested=97 but All are welcome! A reception will follow the reading =A7 DIRECTIONS: O=92Neal Parkway is off 30th Street in north Boulder between Va= lmont & Iris. Turn East at the signs for STRATFORD PARK WEST. The communi= ty house is the one-story building with a fence leading down to the street= =2C half a block from 30th. Please park ONLY on O=92Neal Parkway=2C O=92Ne= al Circle=2C or in VISITOR spaces in the Stratford Park West lots. Please = do not park in any other nearby lots. Thank you. =A7 Elizabeth Robinson's most recent books are Inaudible Trumpeters and The Orp= han & its Relations. She has been a recipient of grants from the Fund for = Poetry and the Foundation for Contemporary Arts=2C and has also been a winn= er of the Fence Modern Poets Series and the National Poetry Series. She sp= ends money that she does not have as a co-editor with Colleen Lookingbil of= EtherDome Chapbooks=2C and co-editor with Beth Anderson and Laura Sims of = Instance Press. =20 Kass Fleisher authored Talking Out of School: Memoir of an Educated Woman (= Dalkey Archive Press=2C 2008)=3B The Adventurous (experimental prose=3B Fac= tory School=2C 2007)=3B Accidental Species: A Reproduction (experimental pr= ose=3B Chax Press=2C 2005)=3B and The Bear River Massacre and the Making of= History (nonfiction=3B SUNY Press=2C 2004). Her work has appeared in The I= owa Review=2C Denver Quarterly=2C Mandorla=2C Notre Dame Review=2C Postmode= rn Culture=2C and Z Magazine=2C and she writes screenplays with her partner= =2C Joe Amato. =20 Joe Amato's most recent volume of poetry=2C Pain Plus Thyme=2C was released= by Factory School last summer. His memoir=2C Once an Engineer: A Song of t= he Salt City=2C is due out from SUNY Press in September=2C and his first no= vel=2C Big Man with a Shovel=2C is due out from Chax Press later this year.= He's completed a second novel=2C Samuel Taylor's Last Night=2C and is curr= ently at work on a third novel=2C which takes its title from a 1938 sci-fi = novella=2C Who Goes There? =20 =A7 UPCOMING IN THE STRATFORD PARK READING SERIES: Thursday=2C October 8th at 7:30 p.m.=97 Jack Collom & Amy Catanzano. =A7 If you no longer wish to receive email announcements of upcoming events in = the Stratford Park Reading Series=2C please email markducharme@hotmail.com = with the subject line "SPRS: REMOVE." _________________________________________________________________ Insert movie times and more without leaving Hotmail=AE.=20 http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/QuickAdd?ocid=3DTXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tut= orial_QuickAdd_062009= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 03:22:09 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Sarah Sarai Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain I wanted to create a perfect cheese souffl=E9 but I wrote a poem. I wanted wings of wax but a broken kite was left in my stocking. I wanted boundaries pushed but was told that would stretch the fabric. I wanted to write a bestseller but penned a dazzling laundry list. I imagined I wanted imagination but got a paisley scarf. I wanted to write myself silly but started where I ended near the top ove= r the right corner=20 beside the doorway, no, not that one, there, yes, to the pantry and would= you mind getting=20 a can of Campbell=92s Chicken =91n Noodle soup (it=92s a classic). I wanted to write an obituary but the idiot wouldn=92t die. I wanted a week with Javier Bardem but he is a novel. I wanted another week with Penelope Cruz but she is a toaster oven. I wanted God to show me some love. Sun, rain and a glowing moon. Uneventfully yours, Sarah Sarai Popinjay in the Court of Louis Vuitton (& valise to the stars) =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 10:55:15 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Dan Wilcox Subject: Third Thursday Poetry Night, July 16 - Dominick Rizzo Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes; format=flowed the Poetry Motel Foundation presents Third Thursday Poetry Night at the Social Justice Center 33 Central Ave., Albany, NY Thursday, July 16 7:00 sign up; 7:30 start Featured Poet: Dominick Rizzo Dominick Rizzo is the author of the poetry collection =93The Spiral =20 Staircase of my Life=94 (Authorhouse), a portion of the proceeds of the =20= sales of which go to suicide prevention organizations. -- with an open mic for community poets before & after the feature: =20 $3.00 donation, suggested; more if you got it, less if you can=92t.=20 Your summertime host: Dan Wilcox. =20= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 09:17:58 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Paul Nelson Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <5E161C1E-DAB1-407E-BB1C-5C37F3994EA2@sfu.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Paul E. Nelson Global Voices Radio SPLAB! A= Raymond Carver.=0A=0A Paul E. Nelson =0A=0AGlobal Voices Radio=0ASPLAB!=0AA= merican Sentences=0AOrganic Poetry=0APoetry Postcard Blog=0A=0AIlalqo, WA 2= 53.735.6328=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0AFrom:= George Bowering =0ATo: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU=0ASen= t: Saturday, July 11, 2009 1:04:36 PM=0ASubject: Re: I want to write fictio= n but ...=0A=0ADidn't that guy that lived on the Olympic Peninsula and was = imitated by all the Creative Writhing students=0Askip from poetry to short = fiction? Can't remember his name. Wrote a book called something like What D= o=0AWe Talk About When we Talk about Love or some such topic.=0A=0Agb=0A=0A= On Jul 11, 2009, at 10:20 AM, steve russell wrote:=0A=0A> & I neglected to = mention Gilbert Sorrentino or Paul Auster. Reginald Gibbons, too, another e= xcellent poet/fiction writer and critic, and translator. There's a rather l= arge list of very inventive, versatile writer/poets .... Mark Strand ....= =0A> =0A> --- On Fri, 7/10/09, steve russell wrote= :=0A> =0A> From: steve russell =0A> Subject: Re: I = want to write fiction but ...=0A> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU=0A> Date= : Friday, July 10, 2009, 8:40 PM=0A> =0A> there are a few singular talents = who've managed to create 1st rate work in fiction, poetry, and drama as wel= l as the essay. Consider Denis Johnson, or Jim Harrison, or the late Thomas= Dish. & of course we have the Buk, as well as Raymond Carver. I blame the = so-called creative writing programs for the unfortunate distinction between= fiction and prose. Jeanette Winterson doesn't make such distinctions when = she discusses her work.=0A> =0A> --- On Fri, 7/10/09, Mary Kasimor wrote:=0A> =0A> From: Mary Kasimor =0A> Su= bject: Re: I want to write fiction but ...=0A> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO= .EDU=0A> Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 6:51 PM=0A> =0A> I figure that those = who can write both fiction and poetry are either more talented or more tena= cious. What are your thoughts on that?=0A> =0A> --- On Fri, 7/10/09, George= Bowering wrote:=0A> =0A> =0A> From: George Bowering =0A> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ...=0A> To: POET= ICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU=0A> Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 2:34 PM=0A> =0A> = =0A> I have never found it to be a problem.=0A> I have managed a lot of nov= els and books of stories.=0A> =0A> I think that that is not all that uncomm= on in Canada.=0A> Kroetsch, Atwood, MacEwen, Ondaatje, McFadden, Cohen, etc= .=0A> =0A> gb=0A> =0A> =0A> On Jul 10, 2009, at 10:27 AM, amy king wrote:= =0A> =0A>> but poetry always stops me.=0A>> =0A>> =0A>> Just wondering, so = thought I'd ask a bunch of poets who might have the same itch, why can't yo= u scratch it? Why this hurdle in making the transition?=0A>> =0A>> =0A>> = John Ashbery -- "...every time I sit down and try to write some fiction I e= nd up writing a=0A>> poem instead, so it gets continually postponed. In fac= t I often think=0A>> it=E2=80=99s become for me a device for tricking mysel= f into writing poetry."=0A>> =0A>> =0A>> Kristy Bowen -- "While one of the = coolest things about poetry for me is the ability to=0A>> twist language in= all sorts of ways, fiction depends far too much on=0A>> meaning, on convey= ance, to allow too much twisting or prodding before=0A>> you lose your read= er. Even in my own reading exploits, the point from=0A>> which I enter a pi= ece of fiction is entirely different from the state=0A>> of mind in which I= enter a poem. Anything can happen in a poem, jumps=0A>> of logic, of image= , of meaning, and I'm ..." cont'd here: http://tiny.cc/fiction502=0A>> = =0A>> http://tiny.cc/fiction502=0A>> =0A>> =0A>> Amy=0A>> =0A>> _______=0A>= > =0A>> =0A>> =0A>> =0A>> =0A>> Amy's Alias=0A>> =0A>> http://amyking.org/= =0A>> =0A>> =0A>> =0A>> =0A>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A>> The Poetics = List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub= info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=0A> =0A> Geo. Bowering,= =0A> RCAF 227498=0A> =0A> =0A> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A> The Poetic= s List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/uns= ub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A= > =0A> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A> The Poetics List is moderated & do= es not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buff= alo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=0A> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts.= Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.= html=0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A> The Poe= tics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/= unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=0A=0AGeorge Bowerin= g, esq.=0ANot a morning kind of guy.=0A=0A=0A=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A= The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 09:23:48 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Mary Kasimor Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Creative writhing! --- On Sat, 7/11/09, George Bowering wrote: From: George Bowering Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Saturday, July 11, 2009, 3:04 PM Didn't that guy that lived on the Olympic Peninsula and was imitated by all= the Creative Writhing students skip from poetry to short fiction? Can't remember his name. Wrote a book ca= lled something like What Do We Talk About When we Talk about Love or some such topic. gb On Jul 11, 2009, at 10:20 AM, steve russell wrote: > & I neglected to mention Gilbert Sorrentino or Paul Auster. Reginald Gibb= ons, too, another excellent poet/fiction writer and critic, and translator.= There's a rather large list of very inventive, versatile writer/poets ....= Mark Strand .... >=20 > --- On Fri, 7/10/09, steve russell wrote: >=20 > From: steve russell > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 8:40 PM >=20 > there are a few singular talents who've managed to create 1st rate work i= n fiction, poetry, and drama as well as the essay. Consider Denis Johnson, = or Jim Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. & of course we have the Buk, as w= ell as Raymond Carver. I blame the so-called creative writing programs for = the unfortunate distinction between fiction and prose. Jeanette Winterson d= oesn't make such distinctions when she discusses her work. >=20 > --- On Fri, 7/10/09, Mary Kasimor wrote: >=20 > From: Mary Kasimor > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 6:51 PM >=20 > I figure that those who can write both fiction and poetry are either more= talented or more tenacious. What are your thoughts on that? >=20 > --- On Fri, 7/10/09, George Bowering wrote: >=20 >=20 > From: George Bowering > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 2:34 PM >=20 >=20 > I have never found it to be a problem. > I have managed a lot of novels and books of stories. >=20 > I think that that is not all that uncommon in Canada. > Kroetsch, Atwood, MacEwen, Ondaatje, McFadden, Cohen, etc. >=20 > gb >=20 >=20 > On Jul 10, 2009, at 10:27 AM, amy king wrote: >=20 >> but poetry always stops me. >>=20 >>=20 >> Just wondering, so thought I'd ask a bunch of poets who might have the s= ame itch, why can't you scratch it?=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0Why this hurdle in mak= ing the transition? >>=20 >>=20 >> John Ashbery -- "...every time I sit down and try to write some fiction = I end up writing a >> poem instead, so it gets continually postponed. In fact I often think >> it=E2=80=99s become for me a device for tricking myself into writing poe= try." >>=20 >>=20 >> Kristy Bowen -- "While one of the coolest things about poetry for me is = the ability to >> twist language in all sorts of ways, fiction depends far too much on >> meaning, on conveyance, to allow too much twisting or prodding before >> you lose your reader. Even in my own reading exploits, the point from >> which I enter a piece of fiction is entirely different from the state >> of mind in which I enter a poem. Anything can happen in a poem, jumps >> of logic, of image, of meaning, and I'm ..."=C2=A0 cont'd here:=C2=A0 ht= tp://tiny.cc/fiction502 >>=20 >> http://tiny.cc/fiction502 >>=20 >>=20 >> Amy >>=20 >> _______ >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> Amy's Alias >>=20 >> http://amyking.org/ >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guideli= nes & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >=20 > Geo. Bowering, > RCAF=C2=A0 227498 >=20 >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html George Bowering, esq. Not a morning kind of guy. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 12:22:52 +0530 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve dalachinsky Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit raymond carver On Sat, 11 Jul 2009 13:04:36 -0700 George Bowering writes: > Didn't that guy that lived on the Olympic Peninsula and was imitated > > by all the Creative Writhing students > skip from poetry to short fiction? Can't remember his name. Wrote a > > book called something like What Do > We Talk About When we Talk about Love or some such topic. > > gb > > On Jul 11, 2009, at 10:20 AM, steve russell wrote: > > > & I neglected to mention Gilbert Sorrentino or Paul Auster. > > Reginald Gibbons, too, another excellent poet/fiction writer and > > > critic, and translator. There's a rather large list of very > > inventive, versatile writer/poets .... Mark Strand .... > > > > --- On Fri, 7/10/09, steve russell > wrote: > > > > From: steve russell > > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 8:40 PM > > > > there are a few singular talents who've managed to create 1st rate > > > work in fiction, poetry, and drama as well as the essay. Consider > > > Denis Johnson, or Jim Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. & of > > course we have the Buk, as well as Raymond Carver. I blame the so- > > > called creative writing programs for the unfortunate distinction > > > between fiction and prose. Jeanette Winterson doesn't make such > > distinctions when she discusses her work. > > > > --- On Fri, 7/10/09, Mary Kasimor wrote: > > > > From: Mary Kasimor > > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 6:51 PM > > > > I figure that those who can write both fiction and poetry are > > either more talented or more tenacious. What are your thoughts on > > > that? > > > > --- On Fri, 7/10/09, George Bowering wrote: > > > > > > From: George Bowering > > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 2:34 PM > > > > > > I have never found it to be a problem. > > I have managed a lot of novels and books of stories. > > > > I think that that is not all that uncommon in Canada. > > Kroetsch, Atwood, MacEwen, Ondaatje, McFadden, Cohen, etc. > > > > gb > > > > > > On Jul 10, 2009, at 10:27 AM, amy king wrote: > > > >> but poetry always stops me. > >> > >> > >> Just wondering, so thought I'd ask a bunch of poets who might > have > >> the same itch, why can't you scratch it? Why this hurdle in > >> making the transition? > >> > >> > >> John Ashbery -- "...every time I sit down and try to write some > > >> fiction I end up writing a > >> poem instead, so it gets continually postponed. In fact I often > think > >> it’s become for me a device for tricking myself into writing > poetry." > >> > >> > >> Kristy Bowen -- "While one of the coolest things about poetry for > > >> me is the ability to > >> twist language in all sorts of ways, fiction depends far too much > on > >> meaning, on conveyance, to allow too much twisting or prodding > before > >> you lose your reader. Even in my own reading exploits, the point > from > >> which I enter a piece of fiction is entirely different from the > state > >> of mind in which I enter a poem. Anything can happen in a poem, > jumps > >> of logic, of image, of meaning, and I'm ..." cont'd here: > http:// > >> tiny.cc/fiction502 > >> > >> http://tiny.cc/fiction502 > >> > >> > >> Amy > >> > >> _______ > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> Amy's Alias > >> > >> http://amyking.org/ > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> ================================== > >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > > >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ > >> welcome.html > > > > Geo. Bowering, > > RCAF 227498 > > > > > > ================================== > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > > > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ > > welcome.html > > > > > > > > > > > > ================================== > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > > > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ > > welcome.html > > > > > > > > > > > > ================================== > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > > > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ > > welcome.html > > > > > > > > > > > > ================================== > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > > > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ > > welcome.html > > George Bowering, esq. > Not a morning kind of guy. > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 12:29:40 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Murat Nemet-Nejat Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable David, "constructs a hierarchy within itself, in which only certain forms are permitted, only certain words, only certain distortions dis uptures transgressions and so on, the more specialized it becomes-" such "permitted" disruptions or transgressions are no disruptions/ transgressions at all, but the reverse, the very definition of conventional thought. It becomes a hierarchy convinced in its own superiority, the other= s merely "quietists." Ciao, Murat On Fri, Jul 10, 2009 at 3:05 PM, David Chirot wrote= : > "The blank and ruin we see in Nature {prose here on poetics} is in our ow= n > eye. > R W Emerson > > i've never really understood why this endless setting against each other = of > two different things is supposed to be so important; are Americans too > hooked on the US vs THEM mentality---? > do poets feel so insecure they have to keep attacking prose? > > a good deal of what a piece of writing is is what is there not only on th= e > part of the writer, but the reader also > people write of wanting "open work" > yet isn't there a narrowness rather than openness on the part of the read= er > who demands openness but only of a certain kind? > how open is the reader to openness--? > does it justt end at a narrow point--or, before even reading, judge a pie= ce > as "unopen" --because prose say is "never open?"-- > > i.e. if one approaches a "poem" as always superior to "dull, functional > narrative unloved unwanted prose"--then of course poetry will come out, n= o > matter if it is good or bad-- > i think it is a lack of imagiantion; perhaps a form of lack of corage > to--keep the doors and windows open to find among what blows in rains in > snows --has to offer-to make use of and find interest in- > doesn't everyone i a sense when they get tiredof the poem or prose infron= t > of them start writing it in some other way--? > (the French writer Pierre bayard brings this up in his book on How to tla= k > about books one has never read--) > as Aryanil wrote--one is really as a writer multi disclinipary--i've been= a > reorter, a reviewer, an essaysist, a traanslator, a visua/sound/lecial > poet, > a collage artoist, a griffiti maker, maker of ruBEings, of clay impressio= n > spray paintings vbideo maker fiklm maker actor screen play writer . .. > etc > from each kind of writing both as writer and reader one always find > materials of interest and use--there is always something to "pick up on" = in > one media or grnre for a completely different one; so as not to be creati= ng > the "expected unexpected" dictated bythe set of rules one adhers to, or > "school, type, group, community" of writers adheres to > no, one takes and learns from every method continually because they are a= l > interrelated--al are writing and reading written and read silent or > aloud-or > with other materials than pen and ink, pencil and eraser-- > prose does la lot of things far better than poetry and often times may be > poetry of a kind only the very best of poems can touch > and poetry does things prose doesn't do-though it can rise to the heights > of > the best prose-- > > one takes note that many poets write both good poems and good prose--goo= d > radio or film scripts--good drama--good short stories (dylan thomas for > example-) > > Felix Feneon demostarted that one may make both novellas and peotry out o= f > the from of the 3 line faits divers, "Nouvelles en trois lignes" > (Nouvelles > are both short stories and 'the news"--) > > perhaps what Amy notes is poetry as a specialization, in which case it > becomes separate, and even elitist in its view of other forms of writing, > and constructs a hierarchy within itself, in which only certain forms are > permitted, only certain words, only certain distortions dis uptures > transgressions and so on, the more specialized it becomes- > > if more writings are viewed as interconnected by being simply different > forms of the same underlying act,writing, then they are writing al of th= em > and each has a lot to give to each-- > > unlike Aranil, i don't think anyone kind of writer has an advantage over > the > other, such as poets over prose writers, in making the ulti-disciplinary > art > > adfer all, a poet is writing this! > > isn't the poet going to do their best to "sell the idea of poetry's > superiority?" > > the idea of one kind of humans, one kind of writers, being better than > another (poets better than prose writers)--the world's too ful of > "superiority" and "us vs them" as it is-- > and whatabout greatreporters journalist--?? > "why i have believed as many as 5 impossible things before breakfast!" sa= ys > the Red Queen in Alice through the Lookingglass-- > writers of the world unite!!!! > nothing to lose but the chains that divide one kind of writer from anoth= er > > > > > > > > On Fri, Jul 10, 2009 at 10:56 AM, Aryanil Mukherjee >wrote: > > > delighted to join the team. same itch. scratched it too... > > > > > > > > and the scratch has given me time and again what I call hybrid or > > multidiciplinary text where fiction, film writing, reportage and poetry > have > > performed a fast merry-go-round so as to remain undistinguishable... > > > > I think poets have a great advantage here compared to fiction writers - > > they are more ambidextrous than their counterparts. > > > > > > > > Aryanil > > > > > > > > ----- Forwarded Message ----- > > From: "amy king" > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > Sent: Friday, July 10, 2009 1:27:58 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > > Subject: I want to write fiction but ... > > > > but poetry always stops me. > > > > > > Just wondering, so thought I'd ask a bunch of poets who might have the > same > > itch, why can't you scratch it? Why this hurdle in making the > transition? > > > > > > John Ashbery -- "...every time I sit down and try to write some fiction= I > > end up writing a > > poem instead, so it gets continually postponed. In fact I often think > > it=92s become for me a device for tricking myself into writing poetry." > > > > > > Kristy Bowen -- "While one of the coolest things about poetry for me is > the > > ability to > > twist language in all sorts of ways, fiction depends far too much on > > meaning, on conveyance, to allow too much twisting or prodding before > > you lose your reader. Even in my own reading exploits, the point from > > which I enter a piece of fiction is entirely different from the state > > of mind in which I enter a poem. Anything can happen in a poem, jumps > > of logic, of image, of meaning, and I'm ..." cont'd here: > > http://tiny.cc/fiction502 > > > > http://tiny.cc/fiction502 > > > > > > Amy > > > > _______ > > > > > > > > > > > > Amy's Alias > > > > http://amyking.org/ > > > > > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines > > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines > > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 09:40:52 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Matt Henriksen Subject: Autumn it gestures. by Thomas Hummel from Cannibal Books MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Now Available: Autumn it gestures. by Thomas Hummel 32 pages, hand-sewn $8 flesheatingpoems.blogspot.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 12:43:05 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Nick Carbo Subject: Last poetry book by Nick Carb=?utf-8?Q?=C3=B3?= MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" CHINESE, JAPANESE, WHAT ARE THESE? (Pecan Grove Press, 2009) Just released:?http://tinyurl.com/mm5sz2 Nick Carbo http://www.npr.org/features/feature.php?wfId=1667164 ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 12:44:50 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Charlotte Mandel Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <5E161C1E-DAB1-407E-BB1C-5C37F3994EA2@sfu.ca> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Yes, Raymond Carver - as steve russell included in his listing. On Jul 11, 2009, at 4:04 PM, George Bowering wrote: Didn't that guy that lived on the Olympic Peninsula and was imitated =20 by all the Creative Writhing students skip from poetry to short fiction? Can't remember his name. Wrote a =20 book called something like What Do We Talk About When we Talk about Love or some such topic. gb On Jul 11, 2009, at 10:20 AM, steve russell wrote: > & I neglected to mention Gilbert Sorrentino or Paul Auster. =20 > Reginald Gibbons, too, another excellent poet/fiction writer and =20 > critic, and translator. There's a rather large list of very =20 > inventive, versatile writer/poets .... Mark Strand .... > > --- On Fri, 7/10/09, steve russell wrote: > > From: steve russell > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 8:40 PM > > there are a few singular talents who've managed to create 1st rate =20 > work in fiction, poetry, and drama as well as the essay. Consider =20 > Denis Johnson, or Jim Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. & of =20 > course we have the Buk, as well as Raymond Carver. I blame the so-=20 > called creative writing programs for the unfortunate distinction =20 > between fiction and prose. Jeanette Winterson doesn't make such =20 > distinctions when she discusses her work. > > --- On Fri, 7/10/09, Mary Kasimor wrote: > > From: Mary Kasimor > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 6:51 PM > > I figure that those who can write both fiction and poetry are =20 > either more talented or more tenacious. What are your thoughts on =20 > that? > > --- On Fri, 7/10/09, George Bowering wrote: > > > From: George Bowering > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 2:34 PM > > > I have never found it to be a problem. > I have managed a lot of novels and books of stories. > > I think that that is not all that uncommon in Canada. > Kroetsch, Atwood, MacEwen, Ondaatje, McFadden, Cohen, etc. > > gb > > > On Jul 10, 2009, at 10:27 AM, amy king wrote: > >> but poetry always stops me. >> >> >> Just wondering, so thought I'd ask a bunch of poets who might have =20= >> the same itch, why can't you scratch it? Why this hurdle in =20 >> making the transition? >> >> >> John Ashbery -- "...every time I sit down and try to write some =20 >> fiction I end up writing a >> poem instead, so it gets continually postponed. In fact I often think >> it=92s become for me a device for tricking myself into writing = poetry." >> >> >> Kristy Bowen -- "While one of the coolest things about poetry for =20 >> me is the ability to >> twist language in all sorts of ways, fiction depends far too much on >> meaning, on conveyance, to allow too much twisting or prodding before >> you lose your reader. Even in my own reading exploits, the point from >> which I enter a piece of fiction is entirely different from the state >> of mind in which I enter a poem. Anything can happen in a poem, jumps >> of logic, of image, of meaning, and I'm ..." cont'd here: http://=20= >> tiny.cc/fiction502 >> >> http://tiny.cc/fiction502 >> >> >> Amy >> >> _______ >> >> >> >> >> >> Amy's Alias >> >> http://amyking.org/ >> >> >> >> >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 >> welcome.html > > Geo. Bowering, > RCAF 227498 > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 > welcome.html > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 > welcome.html > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 > welcome.html > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 > welcome.html George Bowering, esq. Not a morning kind of guy. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 12:46:20 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Charlotte Mandel Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Thanks, Sarah - great lines, and story of my life too. Charlotte On Jul 12, 2009, at 3:22 AM, Sarah Sarai wrote: I wanted to create a perfect cheese souffl=E9 but I wrote a poem. I wanted wings of wax but a broken kite was left in my stocking. I wanted boundaries pushed but was told that would stretch the fabric. I wanted to write a bestseller but penned a dazzling laundry list. I imagined I wanted imagination but got a paisley scarf. I wanted to write myself silly but started where I ended near the top =20= over the right corner beside the doorway, no, not that one, there, yes, to the pantry and =20 would you mind getting a can of Campbell=92s Chicken =91n Noodle soup (it=92s a classic). I wanted to write an obituary but the idiot wouldn=92t die. I wanted a week with Javier Bardem but he is a novel. I wanted another week with Penelope Cruz but she is a toaster oven. I wanted God to show me some love. Sun, rain and a glowing moon. Uneventfully yours, Sarah Sarai Popinjay in the Court of Louis Vuitton (& valise to the stars) =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 13:17:11 -0400 Reply-To: tyrone williams Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: tyrone williams Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable George, Yes--you mean Raymond Carver... Tyrone -----Original Message----- >From: George Bowering >Sent: Jul 11, 2009 4:04 PM >To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > >Didn't that guy that lived on the Olympic Peninsula and was imitated =20 >by all the Creative Writhing students >skip from poetry to short fiction? Can't remember his name. Wrote a =20 >book called something like What Do >We Talk About When we Talk about Love or some such topic. > >gb > >On Jul 11, 2009, at 10:20 AM, steve russell wrote: > >> & I neglected to mention Gilbert Sorrentino or Paul Auster. =20 >> Reginald Gibbons, too, another excellent poet/fiction writer and =20 >> critic, and translator. There's a rather large list of very =20 >> inventive, versatile writer/poets .... Mark Strand .... >> >> --- On Fri, 7/10/09, steve russell wrote: >> >> From: steve russell >> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... >> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >> Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 8:40 PM >> >> there are a few singular talents who've managed to create 1st rate =20 >> work in fiction, poetry, and drama as well as the essay. Consider =20 >> Denis Johnson, or Jim Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. & of =20 >> course we have the Buk, as well as Raymond Carver. I blame the so-=20 >> called creative writing programs for the unfortunate distinction =20 >> between fiction and prose. Jeanette Winterson doesn't make such =20 >> distinctions when she discusses her work. >> >> --- On Fri, 7/10/09, Mary Kasimor wrote: >> >> From: Mary Kasimor >> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... >> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >> Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 6:51 PM >> >> I figure that those who can write both fiction and poetry are =20 >> either more talented or more tenacious. What are your thoughts on =20 >> that? >> >> --- On Fri, 7/10/09, George Bowering wrote: >> >> >> From: George Bowering >> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... >> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >> Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 2:34 PM >> >> >> I have never found it to be a problem. >> I have managed a lot of novels and books of stories. >> >> I think that that is not all that uncommon in Canada. >> Kroetsch, Atwood, MacEwen, Ondaatje, McFadden, Cohen, etc. >> >> gb >> >> >> On Jul 10, 2009, at 10:27 AM, amy king wrote: >> >>> but poetry always stops me. >>> >>> >>> Just wondering, so thought I'd ask a bunch of poets who might have =20 >>> the same itch, why can't you scratch it? Why this hurdle in =20 >>> making the transition? >>> >>> >>> John Ashbery -- "...every time I sit down and try to write some =20 >>> fiction I end up writing a >>> poem instead, so it gets continually postponed. In fact I often think >>> it=E2=80=99s become for me a device for tricking myself into writing po= etry." >>> >>> >>> Kristy Bowen -- "While one of the coolest things about poetry for =20 >>> me is the ability to >>> twist language in all sorts of ways, fiction depends far too much on >>> meaning, on conveyance, to allow too much twisting or prodding before >>> you lose your reader. Even in my own reading exploits, the point from >>> which I enter a piece of fiction is entirely different from the state >>> of mind in which I enter a poem. Anything can happen in a poem, jumps >>> of logic, of image, of meaning, and I'm ..." cont'd here: http://=20 >>> tiny.cc/fiction502 >>> >>> http://tiny.cc/fiction502 >>> >>> >>> Amy >>> >>> _______ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Amy's Alias >>> >>> http://amyking.org/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 >>> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 >>> welcome.html >> >> Geo. Bowering, >> RCAF 227498 >> >> >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 >> welcome.html >> >> >> >> >> >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 >> welcome.html >> >> >> >> >> >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 >> welcome.html >> >> >> >> >> >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 >> welcome.html > >George Bowering, esq. >Not a morning kind of guy. > > >=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guideline= s & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html Tyrone Williams =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 13:17:16 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Mark Weiss Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <1D309C69-8F3A-4BC2-A31C-4497828D148B@sfu.ca> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Yeats wrote short fiction. The Stories of Red Hanrahan. And there are stories embedded in the intros to the two editions of A Vision. At 04:01 PM 7/11/2009, you wrote: >Here we go; >the usual widening and widening of the topic >until we can include everything, such as L'il Abner and,oh, The Wire. > >gb > > >On Jul 10, 2009, at 6:36 PM, Jonathan Morse wrote: > >>steve russell wrote: >>>there are a few singular talents who've managed to create 1st rate >>>work in fiction, poetry, and drama as well as the essay. Consider >>>Denis Johnson, or Jim Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. >>Goethe. Rilke. Hardy. Hugo. If you'll accept non-fiction, you can >>add Yeats and Dryden. If you count letters as imaginative >>literature, and why shouldn't you?, you can add Keats and >>Dickinson. Think big. >> >>Jonathan Morse >> >>================================== >>The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >>guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ welcome.html > >George B. >Author of his own misfortunes. > > >================================== >The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 11:04:16 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve russell Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sure, and why not throw in the Goddamn bible. I mean, hell, what is the bib= le? Narrative? Epic poetry? I'm thinking mostly of the Old Testament, of co= urse.=A0 As for "The Wire, " I'm a big fan of crime fiction, and George Pel= acanos is the main producer of "The Wire." Indeed, in the broad sense of th= e term (...poet...), why not include Pelacanos as a poet of the streets of = Washington, D.C.? Perhaps Q Taratino is the poet of video store clerks, if = not their saint. Why not talk about failed poets who turned to fiction afte= r their bout with poetry. Consider William Faulkner. As for cartoonist, I h= ave no problem calling E Gorey, or even=A0 Mr. peanuts Schultz, a poet. Ugh= , what was the topic??? --- On Sat, 7/11/09, George Bowering wrote: From: George Bowering Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Saturday, July 11, 2009, 4:01 PM Here we go; the usual widening and widening of the topic until we can include everything, such as L'il Abner and,oh, The Wire. gb On Jul 10, 2009, at 6:36 PM, Jonathan Morse wrote: > steve russell wrote: >> there are a few singular talents who've managed to create 1st rate work = in fiction, poetry, and drama as well as the essay. Consider Denis Johnson,= or Jim Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. > Goethe. Rilke. Hardy. Hugo. If you'll accept non-fiction, you can add Yea= ts and Dryden. If you count letters as imaginative literature, and why shou= ldn't you?, you can add Keats and Dickinson. Think big. >=20 > Jonathan Morse >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html George B. Author of his own misfortunes. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 14:43:09 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Camille Martin Subject: new on Rogue Embryo Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 New on Rogue Embryo http://rogueembryo.wordpress.com - A False Start: T. S. Eliot, Snoopy, and the Artist's Statement - Rae Armantrout=92s Waves of Punchlines - Anselm Hollo=92s Heavy Jars: =93Hard to say whether the jars=92ve gotten = any lighter.=94 - e.ratio Sonnets: Nathan Thompson and Camille Martin - Camille Martin=92s upcoming events - If the needle is a poem, then what is the fang? - Laura Jensen: Degrees of Separation from Bad Boats - Serendipity and the Felon: Jiri Kolar, Emmet Gowin, and the Cortical Iceb= erg and more . . . Camille Martin http://www.camillemartin.ca http://rogueembryo.wordpress.com= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 13:01:07 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Murat Nemet-Nejat Subject: Re: hidden poem with brain scans and chairs In-Reply-To: <8f3fdbad0907101515kd6f3a65r4dc18ac5985b583f@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit A response to Peter's "brain scan and chairs" poem: immense pool ro! or of sadness o r o p in an inner o r! o r waveless o r deep o p because soundnest because airless O! Ciao, Murat On Fri, Jul 10, 2009 at 6:15 PM, Peter wrote: > hidden poem with brain scans and > chairs > > > > > > > > Peter Ciccariello > http://invisiblenotes.blogspot.com/ > http://uncommonvision.blogspot.com/ > http://poemsfromprovidence.blogspot.com/ > http://uncommon-vision.blogspot.com/ > You can find my art and writing updates on Twitter > https://twitter.com/ciccariello > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 17:37:42 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Sarah Sarai Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain UTILIZE=20 =20 Sarah Sarai knows Steve Dalchinsky as a ny thing and a thing to die for (and agrees w= /him but only=20 this once) <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< lighten up=20 it's a ny thing to die for=20 or that dress is just to die for=20 anyay what else is there worth dying for if not fashion=20 or a good cupcake On Fri, 10 Jul 2009 21:51:15 -0700 Wallis Leslie writes: > "to die for" >=20 > What terrible inattention to the words coming out of our mouths=20 > leads us to say we would die for whatever delectable morsel coming=20 > into our mouths. How the misuse of that phrase diminishes what=20 > people have died for or what people are willing to die for. >=20 > Wallis Leslie > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 22:25:14 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Camille Martin Subject: Re: hidden poem with brain scans and chairs In-Reply-To: <8f3fdbad0907101515kd6f3a65r4dc18ac5985b583f@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Love this! Camille ________________________________________ From: Poetics List (UPenn, UB) [POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU] On Behalf Of = Peter [ciccariello@GMAIL.COM] Sent: Friday, July 10, 2009 6:15 PM To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: hidden poem with brain scans and chairs hidden poem with brain scans and chairs Peter Ciccariello http://invisiblenotes.blogspot.com/ http://uncommonvision.blogspot.com/ http://poemsfromprovidence.blogspot.com/ http://uncommon-vision.blogspot.com/ You can find my art and writing updates on Twitter https://twitter.com/ciccariello =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 08:46:52 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Sara Wintz Subject: paging duriel harris MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit hi! looking for duriel harris... any info please contact me backchannel at sara.wintz@gmail.com thanks! sara ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 05:58:29 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: { brad brace } Subject: 1984 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII July 7, 2009: The MetaConstruct These are scans, in no particular order, of an installation proposal packet ignored by galleries all over the world (but mostly in Canada.) Twenty-five years later, there is still no support for this work. In fact, it's been clearly denied and suppressed. Given a choice between another installation and seeing art-institutions burn to the ground along with all their attendant curatorial neophytes -- it wouldn't take more than two seconds to decide. To hell with government arts-funding! http://bbrace.net/Metaconstruct.html http://bbrace.laughingsquid.net/Metaconstruct.html http://www.bbrace.net/M-scans/M-scans.html http://www.lulu.com/content/e-book/installation-proposal-packet-1984/7391264 http://www.scribd.com/doc/17303459/installation-proposalpacket-1984 ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 11:47:37 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Michael Kelleher Subject: Literary Buffalo Newsletter 07.13.09-07.19.09 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII LITERARY BUFFALO 07.13.09-07.19.09 MEMBER EVENT: JUST BUFFALO GOES TO THE BALLPARK=21 FRIDAY AUGUST 14TH, 7:35 P.M. COCA COLA FIELD SECTION 106 (FIRST BASE SIDE, BEHIND HOME PLATE) 275 WASHINGTON STREET BUFFALO, NY ADMISSION FREE FOR CURRENT JUST BUFFALO MEMBERS=21 Guests and children =2410 Children under 3 FREE 35 Seats Available RSVP REQUIRED=21 Please call 832-5400 to reserve yours=21 I see great things in baseball. It's our game - the American game. -Walt Whitman, poet This isn't a poetry reading. This is baseball. -Ed Adamczyk, writer & village historian of Kenmore BABEL 'Most Innovative Arts Programming (Any Artform)' -Buffalo Spree Magazine Best of Buffalo 2009 BABEL 2009-2010 SEASON SUBSCRIPTIONS ON SALE NOW=21 October 9, A.S. Byatt November 20, Ha Jin March 5, Azar Nafisi April 16, Salman Rushdie Previous Subscriber: =2485 New Subscriber: =24110 These subscriptions include general admission seating at all 4 events. Patron: =24275 Patron Pair: =24450 Patron level subscriptions include VIP reserved seating and admission to al= l pre-event author receptions. Purchase subscriptions now at http://www.justbuffalo.org/babel or by phone = at 716.832.5400. __________________________________________________________________________= EVENTS THIS WEEK All events free and open to the public unless otherwise noted. For more detailed information and a complete listing of furute events, plea= se visit the Literary Buffalo web calendar: http://www.justbuffalo.org/index.php?task=3Dview&id=3D22 07.16.09 Talking Leaves Books, Just Buffalo, Hallwalls Contemporary Arts Center Reading/Signing for: April and Oliver Thursday, July 16, 7:00 PM Talking Leaves Books, 3158 Main St. 07.18.09 Stop, Look, and Listen Poetry Irene Sipos and Open Mic Saturday, July 18 2:00 PM Impact Artists' Gallery, Suite 545, Tri-Main Center =7C 2495 Main Street ___________________________________________________________________________ JUST BUFFALO MEMBERS? WRITER CRITIQUE GROUP The member writer critique group meets 1st and 3rd Tuesdays at the Market A= rcade. The critique group WILL continue to meet all summer long. Click here for more info: http://www.justbuffalo.org/media/pdf/CritiqueGroup0409.pdf ___________________________________________________________________________ UNSUBSCRIBE If you would like to unsubscribe from this list, just say so and you will i= mmediately be removed. _______________________________ Michael Kelleher Artistic Director Just Buffalo Literary Center Market Arcade 617 Main St., Ste. 202A Buffalo, NY 14203 716.832.5400 716.270.0184 (fax) www.justbuffalo.org mjk=40justbuffalo.org =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 10:06:29 -0600 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Michael O'Driscoll Subject: Special Journal Issue on Event and Sound in Poetry Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit A special issue of ESC: English Studies in Canada that members of the list might find of interest: "On Discreteness: Event and Sound in Poetry." Edited by Louis Cabri and Peter Quartermain. Digital Sound Editor Michael Hennessey. As Guest Editor Louis Cabri writes, "What most of these sixteen contributors to ESC: English Studies in Canada share--wihch makes this issue somewhat timely--is the intent to listen to the sound of poets' (and for one contributor, to listen to the sound of actors') poetry recordings, including other poetry performances. In this respect, there are contributors who consider recordings of Gertrude Stein and William Carlos Williams, Brion Gyson and Kenneth Rexroth, and contemporaries Caroline Bergvall, Charles Bernstein, Anne Carson, and Geraldine Monk, among others, from Canada, the U.S., and the UK." Print copies of the issue include a compact disc with 47 tracks considered in the articles. Contributions from: Rachel Blau DuPlessis, Scott Pound, Bob Perelman, Brook Houglum, Michael Hennessey, Meredith Quartermain, Suzanne Zelazo, Katherine Verhagen, Emily Carr, Brian Reed, Tom Orange, Bruce Holsapple, Reuven Tsur, Sarah Parry, Geoffrey Hlibchuk, Jon Cotner and Andy Fitch. For more information, or to purchase an issue for $25.00 (postage included), contact michael.odriscoll@ualberta.ca. -- Michael O'Driscoll Assoc. Professor English and Film Studies 3-5 Humanities Centre University of Alberta Edmonton, AB, T6G 2E5 Editor, ESC: English Studies in Canada www.arts.ualberta.ca/~esc/ ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 09:26:59 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: charles alexander Subject: ta(l)king eyes, by Jacque Brogan Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v935.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit "ta(l)king eyes is the most ambitious and successful long poem since Adrienne Rich's An Atlas of the Difficult World. In its honesty, imaginative brilliance, hybridic nature, and deep passions, it hits the reader the way William Carlos Williams's Spring and All must have hit its first readers. Powerful, truthful, and unforgettable -- this long poem is a fully achieved epic experiment for our times." -- Daniel T. O'Hara ta(l)king eyes by Jacque Vaught Brogan 134 pages ISBN 9780925904812 $21 The newest Chax Press book, by Jacque Vaught Brogan, is now available for purchase. It's oversized and priced slightly higher than our other paperback poetry books. However, those who reply to this message with an order, will receive a $1 discount plus free shipping, for a total of $4.50 discount in comparison to buying it in the normal way on our web site. Total cost then is $20. When you reply via email, let me know if you'd rather send in payment by mail and receive the book in return, or if you'd rather call in a credit or debit charge. If you prefer the ease of ordering on our web site, the direct page for this book is http://www.chax.org/poets/brogan.htm If you choose to send in payment, send it to Chax Press at 411 N 7th Ave, Ste 103, Tucson, AZ 85705-8388. More information is available on our web site: http://chax.org Information on more new books, by Joel Bettridge and Jane Sprague, to come your way within 2 weeks. Altogether we plan on announcing 7 new books this summer. Thank you! Charles / Chax Press ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:37:38 -0300 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Regina Pinto Subject: Re: POETICS Digest - 11 Jul 2009 to 12 Jul 2009 (#2009-154) In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit A potheosis? / A poteose? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZHQgTiWyrq0 Video Poetry, Suspense, Motion Continuous, Floating Foam / Espumas Flutuantes , Remix@ndo, Dancing on the leaves from where the frogs jump! Regina Pinto http://pintor.tumblr.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 09:45:35 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: charles alexander Subject: new book from chax: Salt, My Love Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v935.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit At Chax Press, we have been working for more than a year on the handmade book, Salt, My Love: A Ballad, by Patrick Pritchett. The book was actually printed in 2008, and a few copies were finished and sent to the author. But the handpainting in these books by Cynthia Miller is extremely time consuming, and the books have taken many more months to have enough for us to announce the book publicly. Now is that moment, though indeed, not all of the books are yet finished. But please, overwhelm us with orders for this truly remarkable letterpress- printed, hand-bound book, and we will ship what we have and finish more as soon as possible. "At last the light dims, and salt finds our mouths again." Patrick Pritchett's 10 part, sensuous, spiritual, and philosophical love poem unfolds amid Cynthia Miller's white painted pages. Literally, several pages unfold to turn a 20-page, 2-signature hand- sewn structure into a 24-page book printed letterpress on Nideggen paper. The book's covers, from St. Armand paper mill in Montreal, are a hand-made crinkly grey-brown paper whose texture recalls ancient scrolls, or the edge of the sea, a source of salt, as Pritchett writes, "the salt is taking us / both out to sea." The book is printed in 2 colors on Nideggen paper with Perpetua foundry type. It is sewn in a 2-signature method with concertina, and the covers are papers of tan linen fibers, handmade by the St. Armand papermill in Montreal. The visual artist Cynthia Miller, for long a major part of the artistic program at Chax Press, has hand-painted multiple pages in the book, using both pochoir method and free paint method. These paintings are entirely done in white acrylic and white ink. A few copies of Salt, My Love were boxed and sent to press subscribers, and now unboxed copies are available to the public at a price of $90 each. Discounts are available to libraries and educators and for multiple purchases; please inquire. In addition, standing orders to Chax Press, who commit to purchasing all that we publish, receive a 30% discount. We will not charge for shipping this book on pre-paid orders. This book is not available on our web site as of yet. You may order it by sending a check to us at 411 N 7th Ave, Ste 103, Tucson, AZ 85705-8388. Or, you may respond to this email, and we can arrange a time for you to call in with a credit or debit card payment. Thank you! Charles/Chax Press ps: We also have recently sent out an announcement for a new book by Jacque Vaught Brogan. Information on more new books, by Joel Bettridge and Jane Sprague, to come your way within 2 weeks. Altogether we plan on announcing 7 new books this summer. ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 12:38:16 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Skip Fox Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <809391.35415.qm@web51802.mail.re2.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit That's it! -----Original Message----- From: Poetics List (UPenn, UB) [mailto:POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU] On Behalf Of Mary Kasimor Sent: Sunday, July 12, 2009 11:24 AM To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... Creative writhing! ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:09:47 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: amy king Subject: Re: Your city's / town's poetry reading calendar? - Last calls? Comments: To: new-poetry@wiz.cath.vt.edu, Women's Poetry Listserve MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I'm finishing up the list - if anyone has more to add, please send today! Thanks, Amy --- On Thu, 7/9/09, amy king=A0 wrote: I found this great one for Chicago (updated daily) -- http://www.chicagopoe= trycalendar.org/ But I recently discovered in my web searches a sad lack of other city / tow= n poetry reading sites.=A0 Perhaps my skills are lacking.=A0 Portland, OR o= nly has one site about the police making poetry...? Please send me your poetry reading sites so that I might update my list -- = I'll post it here and on my blog for future reference when all seems comple= te!=A0 That way, whenever intrepid poets travel, they'll be able to check t= he sites and see what's what in your town! Thanks, Amy _______ =0A =0AAmy's Alias =0Ahttp://amyking.org/ =0A=0A =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 11:32:56 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Mary Kasimor Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I am a The Wire addict. It takes place in Baltimore. mary --- On Sun, 7/12/09, steve russell wrote: From: steve russell Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Sunday, July 12, 2009, 1:04 PM Sure, and why not throw in the Goddamn bible. I mean, hell, what is the bib= le? Narrative? Epic poetry? I'm thinking mostly of the Old Testament, of co= urse.=A0 As for "The Wire, " I'm a big fan of crime fiction, and George Pel= acanos is the main producer of "The Wire." Indeed, in the broad sense of th= e term (...poet...), why not include Pelacanos as a poet of the streets of = Washington, D.C.? Perhaps Q Taratino is the poet of video store clerks, if = not their saint. Why not talk about failed poets who turned to fiction afte= r their bout with poetry. Consider William Faulkner. As for cartoonist, I h= ave no problem calling E Gorey, or even=A0 Mr. peanuts Schultz, a poet. Ugh= , what was the topic??? --- On Sat, 7/11/09, George Bowering wrote: From: George Bowering Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Saturday, July 11, 2009, 4:01 PM Here we go; the usual widening and widening of the topic until we can include everything, such as L'il Abner and,oh, The Wire. gb On Jul 10, 2009, at 6:36 PM, Jonathan Morse wrote: > steve russell wrote: >> there are a few singular talents who've managed to create 1st rate work = in fiction, poetry, and drama as well as the essay. Consider Denis Johnson,= or Jim Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. > Goethe. Rilke. Hardy. Hugo. If you'll accept non-fiction, you can add Yea= ts and Dryden. If you count letters as imaginative literature, and why shou= ldn't you?, you can add Keats and Dickinson. Think big. >=20 > Jonathan Morse >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html George B. Author of his own misfortunes. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 11:33:05 -0700 Reply-To: Jeffrey.Gardiner@Sun.COM Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jeffrey Gardiner Subject: Re: ta(l)king eyes, by Jacque Brogan In-Reply-To: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII; format=flowed Charles, I'd like to call in an order and pay by credit charge...and receive the discount. Tell me a best time to call and the number. thanks, Jeff > "ta(l)king eyes is the most ambitious and successful long poem since > Adrienne Rich's An Atlas of the Difficult World. In its honesty, > imaginative brilliance, hybridic nature, and deep passions, it hits > the reader the way William Carlos Williams's Spring and All must have > hit its first readers. Powerful, truthful, and unforgettable -- this > long poem is a fully achieved epic experiment for our times." -- > Daniel T. O'Hara > > ta(l)king eyes > by Jacque Vaught Brogan > 134 pages > ISBN 9780925904812 > $21 > > The newest Chax Press book, by Jacque Vaught Brogan, is now available > for purchase. It's oversized and priced slightly higher than our other > paperback poetry books. However, those who reply to this message with > an order, will receive a $1 discount plus free shipping, for a total > of $4.50 discount in comparison to buying it in the normal way on our > web site. Total cost then is $20. When you reply via email, let me > know if you'd rather send in payment by mail and receive the book in > return, or if you'd rather call in a credit or debit charge. If you > prefer the ease of ordering on our web site, the direct page for this > book is > > http://www.chax.org/poets/brogan.htm > > > If you choose to send in payment, send it to Chax Press at 411 N 7th > Ave, Ste 103, Tucson, AZ 85705-8388. > > More information is available on our web site: http://chax.org > > Information on more new books, by Joel Bettridge and Jane Sprague, to > come your way within 2 weeks. Altogether we plan on announcing 7 new > books this summer. > > > Thank you! > Charles / Chax Press > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html -- ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 11:36:18 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Mary Kasimor Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I bet many poets do write fiction, but we write it for ourselves. I like to= simply write whatever and wherever my brain takes me. It may be awful writ= ing--I don't know because I am too close to it, but it is fun and a bit sca= ry and exciting. I really never know exactly where I am going.=20 =A0 Mary Kasimor --- On Sun, 7/12/09, steve russell wrote: From: steve russell Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Sunday, July 12, 2009, 1:04 PM Sure, and why not throw in the Goddamn bible. I mean, hell, what is the bib= le? Narrative? Epic poetry? I'm thinking mostly of the Old Testament, of co= urse.=A0 As for "The Wire, " I'm a big fan of crime fiction, and George Pel= acanos is the main producer of "The Wire." Indeed, in the broad sense of th= e term (...poet...), why not include Pelacanos as a poet of the streets of = Washington, D.C.? Perhaps Q Taratino is the poet of video store clerks, if = not their saint. Why not talk about failed poets who turned to fiction afte= r their bout with poetry. Consider William Faulkner. As for cartoonist, I h= ave no problem calling E Gorey, or even=A0 Mr. peanuts Schultz, a poet. Ugh= , what was the topic??? --- On Sat, 7/11/09, George Bowering wrote: From: George Bowering Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Saturday, July 11, 2009, 4:01 PM Here we go; the usual widening and widening of the topic until we can include everything, such as L'il Abner and,oh, The Wire. gb On Jul 10, 2009, at 6:36 PM, Jonathan Morse wrote: > steve russell wrote: >> there are a few singular talents who've managed to create 1st rate work = in fiction, poetry, and drama as well as the essay. Consider Denis Johnson,= or Jim Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. > Goethe. Rilke. Hardy. Hugo. If you'll accept non-fiction, you can add Yea= ts and Dryden. If you count letters as imaginative literature, and why shou= ldn't you?, you can add Keats and Dickinson. Think big. >=20 > Jonathan Morse >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html George B. Author of his own misfortunes. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 11:43:15 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve russell Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Could anyone recommend a decent "creative writhing" workshop? --- On Mon, 7/13/09, Skip Fox wrote: From: Skip Fox Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Monday, July 13, 2009, 1:38 PM That's it! -----Original Message----- From: Poetics List (UPenn, UB) [mailto:POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU] On Behalf Of Mary Kasimor Sent: Sunday, July 12, 2009 11:24 AM To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... Creative writhing! ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 12:11:25 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: brian whitener Subject: Re: POETICS Digest - 11 Jul 2009 to 12 Jul 2009 (#2009-154) In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable dear friends we at displaced press are very please to announce the publication of our latest book: Johan J=F6nson's Collobert Orbital, translated by Johannes G=F6ransson Now Available We are pleased to announce the publication of Johan J=F6nson's Collobert Orbital (translated by Johannes G=F6ransson) Praise for Collobert Orbital from Mark Nowak: If Vicente Huidobro met Georges Bataille on a Waste Management(R)truck, the result might be something akin to Johan J=F6nsson's Collobert Orbital, the = new manifesto of "the waste-disposal-working-class." At times soaring across "aerospatiality," at others existentially grounded in "an overheated world factory" of "all work, all healthcare, all logistics," J=F6nsson's linguist= ic propulsions and dynamic formal innovations challenge "a victorious bourgeoi= s poetry order" to, once again, rearticulate verse experimentation to the politics and poetics of working a day job. Praise for Collobert Orbital from Bruce Andrews DNA bonanza contaminant reverie, target overhead. Flock to revelator gridde= d up to have no stake in history. See that their grave is kept clean. Fataliz= e wrong, upend amphetamachinic tort. Zero immunity. Cology =97 hyperplex mini flair, underalphabetic biodebt. Ssay. I couldn't remember the advanced memory formula. Dunno ergo soma. Autoquadrilateral & exogeneric, the transparencies regroup. Law intuition anything uncocked reason craters. Eco rad mono dead with note attached, incalculably inorganic property of the object continuity you just heard =97 the world, overtime. Mooniac, tricked-= up torso love before discharges false dichotomies start stuttering. Ahysterica= l =97 swiftest closeup transplant nude spatiality. "To speak an ecstatic technology." The flattest are the busiest arterial munchies. Sextras: bend them over. Faster buckle conjure against choice as surrogate overheating extinction as obliteratable chew. Speed mash mouth lexicon amphetamaneuver. The goo goo amok, self torture broad-minded guts =97 interzonad gaffered al= l over you. Put tools in your face. Overdifferent anti-creamery daub up name. Existential logistics: a porous will, a rectal will suckling finality. Mutate epithet or no ending belowgistics. Buzzerless blisscharge, cuties with fists pry open your syllables. Cunnilanguage, cunnilanguish =97 hope, = a surgical implant. Wishful stun: harmony is a warning where anything can breathe. Poppy, missile! Safe, natural, bombing run =97 victory post-mortem lab blubber. Difference gets you dead. Prey unwriting rumba complicity radi= o spook you white on white disgust. Whiteous coke on scalpel socialized ice cream. The larval class: vote yes. Cattle reward you, interzonked Fanonical swearing in cattle corporation. Dark retro, subtlety reverses it up the ass= . Wage labor, context meltdowns. War =97 short term memory loss. You think ab= out a lot of things when you're insoluble. Reptility: turn gold into cash. PEWS (Political Economy [of the] World System) refusal mash-up. Organize the slaves to vaporize hegemon. Any accident would be one ending. - Bruce Andrews available at spd: http://www.spdbooks.org/Producte/9780982212011/collobert-orbital.aspx best, brian, daniel, and steven 2009/7/12 POETICS automatic digest system > There are 7 messages totalling 471 lines in this issue. > > Topics of the day: > > 1. appalling, redacted, pulchritude > 2. I want to write fiction but ... (3) > 3. Chaparral--Summer, 2009 > 4. REMINDER: Robinson, Fleisher & Amato This Thursday, Stratford Park > Reading > Series > 5. Third Thursday Poetry Night, July 16 - Dominick Rizzo > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 13:46:14 +0530 > From: steve dalachinsky > Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude > > lighten up > it's a ny thing to die for > or that dress is just to die for > > anyay what else is there worth dying for if not fashion > or a good cupcake > > On Fri, 10 Jul 2009 21:51:15 -0700 Wallis Leslie > writes: > > "to die for" > > > > What terrible inattention to the words coming out of our mouths > > leads us to say we would die for whatever delectable morsel coming > > into our mouths. How the misuse of that phrase diminishes what > > people have died for or what people are willing to die for. > > > > Wallis Leslie > > > > --- On Thu, 7/9/09, Lauren Russell wrote: > > > > > > From: Lauren Russell > > Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > Date: Thursday, July 9, 2009, 10:42 PM > > > > > > I hate the word "community," as in "The Black Community," "The LGBT > > Community," "The Jewish Community," etc., because it advances an > > oversimplified view of the world in asserting the existence of these > > enormous "communities" that do not actually exist. I mean, what is > > the often-discussed Black Community, anyway? There are many black > > communities, and there are black people who do not belong to any > > community, and there are black people who belong to communities that > > consist primarily of people who are not black. There is no single, > > homogenous "Black Community" as that misuse of the word seems to > > suggest. > > > > Lauren > > > > > > > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ------------------------------ > > Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 13:01:09 -0700 > From: George Bowering > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > > Here we go; > the usual widening and widening of the topic > until we can include everything, such as L'il Abner and,oh, The Wire. > > gb > > > On Jul 10, 2009, at 6:36 PM, Jonathan Morse wrote: > > > steve russell wrote: > >> there are a few singular talents who've managed to create 1st rate > >> work in fiction, poetry, and drama as well as the essay. Consider > >> Denis Johnson, or Jim Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. > > Goethe. Rilke. Hardy. Hugo. If you'll accept non-fiction, you can > > add Yeats and Dryden. If you count letters as imaginative > > literature, and why shouldn't you?, you can add Keats and > > Dickinson. Think big. > > > > Jonathan Morse > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ > > welcome.html > > George B. > Author of his own misfortunes. > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ------------------------------ > > Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 13:04:36 -0700 > From: George Bowering > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > > Didn't that guy that lived on the Olympic Peninsula and was imitated =3D2= 0 > by all the Creative Writhing students > skip from poetry to short fiction? Can't remember his name. Wrote a =3D20 > book called something like What Do > We Talk About When we Talk about Love or some such topic. > > gb > > On Jul 11, 2009, at 10:20 AM, steve russell wrote: > > > & I neglected to mention Gilbert Sorrentino or Paul Auster. =3D20 > > Reginald Gibbons, too, another excellent poet/fiction writer and =3D20 > > critic, and translator. There's a rather large list of very =3D20 > > inventive, versatile writer/poets .... Mark Strand .... > > > > --- On Fri, 7/10/09, steve russell wrote: > > > > From: steve russell > > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 8:40 PM > > > > there are a few singular talents who've managed to create 1st rate =3D2= 0 > > work in fiction, poetry, and drama as well as the essay. Consider =3D20 > > Denis Johnson, or Jim Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. & of =3D20 > > course we have the Buk, as well as Raymond Carver. I blame the so-=3D20 > > called creative writing programs for the unfortunate distinction =3D20 > > between fiction and prose. Jeanette Winterson doesn't make such =3D20 > > distinctions when she discusses her work. > > > > --- On Fri, 7/10/09, Mary Kasimor wrote: > > > > From: Mary Kasimor > > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 6:51 PM > > > > I figure that those who can write both fiction and poetry are =3D20 > > either more talented or more tenacious. What are your thoughts on =3D20 > > that? > > > > --- On Fri, 7/10/09, George Bowering wrote: > > > > > > From: George Bowering > > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 2:34 PM > > > > > > I have never found it to be a problem. > > I have managed a lot of novels and books of stories. > > > > I think that that is not all that uncommon in Canada. > > Kroetsch, Atwood, MacEwen, Ondaatje, McFadden, Cohen, etc. > > > > gb > > > > > > On Jul 10, 2009, at 10:27 AM, amy king wrote: > > > >> but poetry always stops me. > >> > >> > >> Just wondering, so thought I'd ask a bunch of poets who might have =3D= 20=3D > > >> the same itch, why can't you scratch it? Why this hurdle in =3D20 > >> making the transition? > >> > >> > >> John Ashbery -- "...every time I sit down and try to write some =3D20 > >> fiction I end up writing a > >> poem instead, so it gets continually postponed. In fact I often think > >> it=3D92s become for me a device for tricking myself into writing =3D > poetry." > >> > >> > >> Kristy Bowen -- "While one of the coolest things about poetry for =3D2= 0 > >> me is the ability to > >> twist language in all sorts of ways, fiction depends far too much on > >> meaning, on conveyance, to allow too much twisting or prodding before > >> you lose your reader. Even in my own reading exploits, the point from > >> which I enter a piece of fiction is entirely different from the state > >> of mind in which I enter a poem. Anything can happen in a poem, jumps > >> of logic, of image, of meaning, and I'm ..." cont'd here: http://=3D= 20=3D > > >> tiny.cc/fiction502 > >> > >> http://tiny.cc/fiction502 > >> > >> > >> Amy > >> > >> _______ > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> Amy's Alias > >> > >> http://amyking.org/ > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > =3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D= 3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D > =3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D > >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =3D20 > >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=3D20 > >> welcome.html > > > > Geo. Bowering, > > RCAF 227498 > > > > > > =3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D= =3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D > =3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =3D20 > > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=3D20 > > welcome.html > > > > > > > > > > > > =3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D= =3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D > =3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =3D20 > > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=3D20 > > welcome.html > > > > > > > > > > > > =3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D= =3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D > =3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =3D20 > > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=3D20 > > welcome.html > > > > > > > > > > > > =3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D= =3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D > =3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =3D20 > > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=3D20 > > welcome.html > > George Bowering, esq. > Not a morning kind of guy. > > > > =3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D= 3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D= 3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ------------------------------ > > Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 13:40:18 -0700 > From: Catherine Daly > Subject: Chaparral--Summer, 2009 > > new la poetry 'zine > > > The summer issue of Chaparral is here! The new edition features an > interview with Maggie Nelson and work by Dinah Lenney, Marsha de la O, > Lynne Thompson, Leilani Hall, Gail Wronsky and others. > > http://www.chaparralpoetry.net/ > > > > -- > All best, > Catherine Daly > c.a.b.daly@gmail.com > > > > -- > All best, > Catherine Daly > c.a.b.daly@gmail.com > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ------------------------------ > > Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 18:05:27 -0600 > From: Mark DuCharme > Subject: REMINDER: Robinson, Fleisher & Amato This Thursday, Stratford Pa= rk > Reading Series > > Please join us at the STRATFORD PARK READING SERIES as three extraordinar= y > =3D > writers present readings of their work: ELIZABETH ROBINSON=3D2C KASS > FLEISHER=3D > & JOE AMATO. > > It all happens THIS THURSDAY=3D2C JULY 16th at 7:30 p.m. > > Address: 3030 O=3D92NEAL PARKWAY=3D2C Boulder=3D2C Colorado > (across the street from Naropa University=3D92s Paramita campus & the > Boulder=3D > Cork restaurant) > > http://www.mapquest.com/maps?city=3D3DBoulder&state=3D3DCO&address=3D3D30= 30+O=3D92n=3D > eal+Parkway&zipcode=3D3D80301 > > A Donation is requested=3D97 but All are welcome! > > A reception will follow the reading > > =3DA7 > > DIRECTIONS: O=3D92Neal Parkway is off 30th Street in north Boulder betwee= n > Va=3D > lmont & Iris. Turn East at the signs for STRATFORD PARK WEST. The > communi=3D > ty house is the one-story building with a fence leading down to the stree= t=3D > =3D2C half a block from 30th. Please park ONLY on O=3D92Neal Parkway=3D2= C > O=3D92Ne=3D > al Circle=3D2C or in VISITOR spaces in the Stratford Park West lots. Ple= ase > =3D > do not park in any other nearby lots. Thank you. > > > > > =3DA7 > > > Elizabeth Robinson's most recent books are Inaudible Trumpeters and The > Orp=3D > han & its Relations. She has been a recipient of grants from the Fund fo= r > =3D > Poetry and the Foundation for Contemporary Arts=3D2C and has also been a > winn=3D > er of the Fence Modern Poets Series and the National Poetry Series. She > sp=3D > ends money that she does not have as a co-editor with Colleen Lookingbil > of=3D > EtherDome Chapbooks=3D2C and co-editor with Beth Anderson and Laura Sims= of > =3D > Instance Press. > =3D20 > Kass Fleisher authored Talking Out of School: Memoir of an Educated Woman > (=3D > Dalkey Archive Press=3D2C 2008)=3D3B The Adventurous (experimental prose= =3D3B > Fac=3D > tory School=3D2C 2007)=3D3B Accidental Species: A Reproduction (experimen= tal > pr=3D > ose=3D3B Chax Press=3D2C 2005)=3D3B and The Bear River Massacre and the M= aking > of=3D > History (nonfiction=3D3B SUNY Press=3D2C 2004). Her work has appeared in= The > I=3D > owa Review=3D2C Denver Quarterly=3D2C Mandorla=3D2C Notre Dame Review=3D2= C > Postmode=3D > rn Culture=3D2C and Z Magazine=3D2C and she writes screenplays with her > partner=3D > =3D2C Joe Amato. > =3D20 > > Joe Amato's most recent volume of poetry=3D2C Pain Plus Thyme=3D2C was > released=3D > by Factory School last summer. His memoir=3D2C Once an Engineer: A Song = of > t=3D > he Salt City=3D2C is due out from SUNY Press in September=3D2C and his fi= rst > no=3D > vel=3D2C Big Man with a Shovel=3D2C is due out from Chax Press later this > year.=3D > He's completed a second novel=3D2C Samuel Taylor's Last Night=3D2C and i= s > curr=3D > ently at work on a third novel=3D2C which takes its title from a 1938 sci= -fi > =3D > novella=3D2C Who Goes There? > =3D20 > > =3DA7 > > UPCOMING IN THE STRATFORD PARK READING SERIES: > Thursday=3D2C October 8th at 7:30 p.m.=3D97 Jack Collom & Amy Catanzano. > > =3DA7 > > If you no longer wish to receive email announcements of upcoming events i= n > =3D > the Stratford Park Reading Series=3D2C please email markducharme@hotmail.= com=3D > with the subject line "SPRS: REMOVE." > > _________________________________________________________________ > Insert movie times and more without leaving Hotmail=3DAE.=3D20 > > http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/QuickAdd?ocid=3D3DTXT_TAGLM_WL_HM= _Tut=3D > orial_QuickAdd_062009=3D > > > =3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D= 3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D= 3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ------------------------------ > > Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 03:22:09 -0400 > From: Sarah Sarai > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > > I wanted to create a perfect cheese souffl=3DE9 but I wrote a poem. > I wanted wings of wax but a broken kite was left in my stocking. > I wanted boundaries pushed but was told that would stretch the fabric. > I wanted to write a bestseller but penned a dazzling laundry list. > I imagined I wanted imagination but got a paisley scarf. > I wanted to write myself silly but started where I ended near the top ove= =3D > r the right corner=3D20 > beside the doorway, no, not that one, there, yes, to the pantry and would= =3D > you mind getting=3D20 > a can of Campbell=3D92s Chicken =3D91n Noodle soup (it=3D92s a classic). > I wanted to write an obituary but the idiot wouldn=3D92t die. > I wanted a week with Javier Bardem but he is a novel. > I wanted another week with Penelope Cruz but she is a toaster oven. > I wanted God to show me some love. Sun, rain and a glowing moon. > > Uneventfully yours, > Sarah Sarai > Popinjay in the Court of Louis Vuitton > (& valise to the stars) > > > =3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D= 3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D= 3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ------------------------------ > > Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 10:55:15 -0400 > From: Dan Wilcox > Subject: Third Thursday Poetry Night, July 16 - Dominick Rizzo > > the Poetry Motel Foundation > presents > > Third Thursday Poetry Night > > at > the Social Justice Center > 33 Central Ave., Albany, NY > > Thursday, July 16 > 7:00 sign up; 7:30 start > > Featured Poet: Dominick Rizzo > > Dominick Rizzo is the author of the poetry collection =3D93The Spiral =3D= 20 > Staircase of my Life=3D94 (Authorhouse), a portion of the proceeds of the > =3D20=3D > > sales of which go to suicide prevention organizations. > > -- with an open mic for community poets before & after the feature: =3D2= 0 > $3.00 donation, suggested; more if you got it, less if you can=3D92t.=3D2= 0 > > Your summertime host: Dan Wilcox. > =3D20=3D > > > =3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D= 3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D= 3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ------------------------------ > > End of POETICS Digest - 11 Jul 2009 to 12 Jul 2009 (#2009-154) > ************************************************************** > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:06:15 -0600 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Hilary Clark Subject: Re: Special Journal Issue on Event and Sound in Poetry In-Reply-To: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Hello, I'd like to purchase one copy of this special issue of ESC, please. How do I pay? Thanks, Hilary Clark English Dept. University of Saskatchewan 9 Campus Drive Saskatoon, SK S7N 5A5 (306) 966-5515 Michael O'Driscoll wrote: > A special issue of ESC: English Studies in Canada that members of the list > might find of interest: > > "On Discreteness: Event and Sound in Poetry." Edited by Louis Cabri and > Peter Quartermain. Digital Sound Editor Michael Hennessey. > > As Guest Editor Louis Cabri writes, "What most of these sixteen contributors > to ESC: English Studies in Canada share--wihch makes this issue somewhat > timely--is the intent to listen to the sound of poets' (and for one > contributor, to listen to the sound of actors') poetry recordings, including > other poetry performances. In this respect, there are contributors who > consider recordings of Gertrude Stein and William Carlos Williams, Brion > Gyson and Kenneth Rexroth, and contemporaries Caroline Bergvall, Charles > Bernstein, Anne Carson, and Geraldine Monk, among others, from Canada, the > U.S., and the UK." > > Print copies of the issue include a compact disc with 47 tracks considered > in the articles. Contributions from: Rachel Blau DuPlessis, Scott Pound, Bob > Perelman, Brook Houglum, Michael Hennessey, Meredith Quartermain, Suzanne > Zelazo, Katherine Verhagen, Emily Carr, Brian Reed, Tom Orange, Bruce > Holsapple, Reuven Tsur, Sarah Parry, Geoffrey Hlibchuk, Jon Cotner and Andy > Fitch. > > For more information, or to purchase an issue for $25.00 (postage included), > contact michael.odriscoll@ualberta.ca. > > > > > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 16:28:58 +0530 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve dalachinsky Subject: Re: appalling, redacted, pulchritude MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit sarh you only agree with me THIS ONCE??? On Sun, 12 Jul 2009 17:37:42 -0400 Sarah Sarai writes: > UTILIZE > > > > Sarah Sarai > knows Steve Dalchinsky as a ny thing and a thing to die for (and > agrees w/him but only > this once) > > <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< > lighten up > it's a ny thing to die for > or that dress is just to die for > > anyay what else is there worth dying for if not fashion > or a good cupcake > > On Fri, 10 Jul 2009 21:51:15 -0700 Wallis Leslie > > writes: > > "to die for" > > > > What terrible inattention to the words coming out of our mouths > > leads us to say we would die for whatever delectable morsel coming > > > into our mouths. How the misuse of that phrase diminishes what > > people have died for or what people are willing to die for. > > > > Wallis Leslie > > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:07:00 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: George Bowering Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <904897.59260.qm@web51806.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v753.1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Oh boy, Baltimore. The crab cakes at the Lexington Market the best anywhere. gb On Jul 13, 2009, at 11:32 AM, Mary Kasimor wrote: > I am a The Wire addict. It takes place in Baltimore. > mary > > --- On Sun, 7/12/09, steve russell wrote: > > > From: steve russell > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Sunday, July 12, 2009, 1:04 PM > > > Sure, and why not throw in the Goddamn bible. I mean, hell, what is > the bible? Narrative? Epic poetry? I'm thinking mostly of the Old > Testament, of course. As for "The Wire, " I'm a big fan of crime > fiction, and George Pelacanos is the main producer of "The Wire." > Indeed, in the broad sense of the term (...poet...), why not > include Pelacanos as a poet of the streets of Washington, D.C.? > Perhaps Q Taratino is the poet of video store clerks, if not their > saint. Why not talk about failed poets who turned to fiction after > their bout with poetry. Consider William Faulkner. As for > cartoonist, I have no problem calling E Gorey, or even Mr. peanuts > Schultz, a poet. Ugh, what was the topic??? > > --- On Sat, 7/11/09, George Bowering wrote: > > From: George Bowering > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Saturday, July 11, 2009, 4:01 PM > > Here we go; > the usual widening and widening of the topic > until we can include everything, such as L'il Abner and,oh, The Wire. > > gb > > > On Jul 10, 2009, at 6:36 PM, Jonathan Morse wrote: > >> steve russell wrote: >>> there are a few singular talents who've managed to create 1st >>> rate work in fiction, poetry, and drama as well as the essay. >>> Consider Denis Johnson, or Jim Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. >> Goethe. Rilke. Hardy. Hugo. If you'll accept non-fiction, you can >> add Yeats and Dryden. If you count letters as imaginative >> literature, and why shouldn't you?, you can add Keats and >> Dickinson. Think big. >> >> Jonathan Morse >> >> ================================== >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ >> welcome.html > > George B. > Author of his own misfortunes. > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ > welcome.html > > > > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ > welcome.html > > > > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ > welcome.html George "Whip" Bowering No slugging average to speak of. ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:08:01 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: George Bowering Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <433575.79173.qm@web52405.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v753.1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed "Workshop." There's your problem right there. gb On Jul 13, 2009, at 11:43 AM, steve russell wrote: > Could anyone recommend a decent "creative writhing" workshop? > > --- On Mon, 7/13/09, Skip Fox wrote: > > From: Skip Fox > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Monday, July 13, 2009, 1:38 PM > > That's it! > > -----Original Message----- > From: Poetics List (UPenn, UB) > [mailto:POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU] On > Behalf Of Mary Kasimor > Sent: Sunday, July 12, 2009 11:24 AM > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > > Creative writhing! > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ > welcome.html > > > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ > welcome.html > George H. Bowering, OUH Born without a religion. ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 16:33:15 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Skip Fox Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <433575.79173.qm@web52405.mail.re2.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dick Cheney used to run the most highly profiled program. But these days a prospective student might head to regional hotspots outside of her or his country. -----Original Message----- From: Poetics List (UPenn, UB) [mailto:POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU] On Behalf Of steve russell Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 1:43 PM To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... Could anyone recommend a decent "creative writhing" workshop? --- On Mon, 7/13/09, Skip Fox wrote: From: Skip Fox Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Monday, July 13, 2009, 1:38 PM That's it! -----Original Message----- From: Poetics List (UPenn, UB) [mailto:POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU] On Behalf Of Mary Kasimor Sent: Sunday, July 12, 2009 11:24 AM To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... Creative writhing! ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 16:59:48 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Maria Damon Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <433575.79173.qm@web52405.mail.re2.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit there are a number of forms of "movement meditation" such as Authentic Movement, Continuum, etc., all of which cd fulfill this delightful moniker. steve russell wrote: > Could anyone recommend a decent "creative writhing" workshop? > > --- On Mon, 7/13/09, Skip Fox wrote: > > From: Skip Fox > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Monday, July 13, 2009, 1:38 PM > > That's it! > > -----Original Message----- > From: Poetics List (UPenn, UB) [mailto:POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU] On > Behalf Of Mary Kasimor > Sent: Sunday, July 12, 2009 11:24 AM > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > > Creative writhing! > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 18:00:15 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Ruth Lepson Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable hardy too On 7/12/09 12:44 PM, "Charlotte Mandel" wrote: > Yes, Raymond Carver - as steve russell included in his listing. >=20 > On Jul 11, 2009, at 4:04 PM, George Bowering wrote: >=20 > Didn't that guy that lived on the Olympic Peninsula and was imitated > by all the Creative Writhing students > skip from poetry to short fiction? Can't remember his name. Wrote a > book called something like What Do > We Talk About When we Talk about Love or some such topic. >=20 > gb >=20 > On Jul 11, 2009, at 10:20 AM, steve russell wrote: >=20 >> & I neglected to mention Gilbert Sorrentino or Paul Auster. >> Reginald Gibbons, too, another excellent poet/fiction writer and >> critic, and translator. There's a rather large list of very >> inventive, versatile writer/poets .... Mark Strand .... >>=20 >> --- On Fri, 7/10/09, steve russell wrote: >>=20 >> From: steve russell >> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... >> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >> Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 8:40 PM >>=20 >> there are a few singular talents who've managed to create 1st rate >> work in fiction, poetry, and drama as well as the essay. Consider >> Denis Johnson, or Jim Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. & of >> course we have the Buk, as well as Raymond Carver. I blame the so- >> called creative writing programs for the unfortunate distinction >> between fiction and prose. Jeanette Winterson doesn't make such >> distinctions when she discusses her work. >>=20 >> --- On Fri, 7/10/09, Mary Kasimor wrote: >>=20 >> From: Mary Kasimor >> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... >> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >> Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 6:51 PM >>=20 >> I figure that those who can write both fiction and poetry are >> either more talented or more tenacious. What are your thoughts on >> that? >>=20 >> --- On Fri, 7/10/09, George Bowering wrote: >>=20 >>=20 >> From: George Bowering >> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... >> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >> Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 2:34 PM >>=20 >>=20 >> I have never found it to be a problem. >> I have managed a lot of novels and books of stories. >>=20 >> I think that that is not all that uncommon in Canada. >> Kroetsch, Atwood, MacEwen, Ondaatje, McFadden, Cohen, etc. >>=20 >> gb >>=20 >>=20 >> On Jul 10, 2009, at 10:27 AM, amy king wrote: >>=20 >>> but poetry always stops me. >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> Just wondering, so thought I'd ask a bunch of poets who might have >>> the same itch, why can't you scratch it? Why this hurdle in >>> making the transition? >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> John Ashbery -- "...every time I sit down and try to write some >>> fiction I end up writing a >>> poem instead, so it gets continually postponed. In fact I often think >>> it=B9s become for me a device for tricking myself into writing poetry." >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> Kristy Bowen -- "While one of the coolest things about poetry for >>> me is the ability to >>> twist language in all sorts of ways, fiction depends far too much on >>> meaning, on conveyance, to allow too much twisting or prodding before >>> you lose your reader. Even in my own reading exploits, the point from >>> which I enter a piece of fiction is entirely different from the state >>> of mind in which I enter a poem. Anything can happen in a poem, jumps >>> of logic, of image, of meaning, and I'm ..." cont'd here: http:// >>> tiny.cc/fiction502 >>>=20 >>> http://tiny.cc/fiction502 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> Amy >>>=20 >>> _______ >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> Amy's Alias >>>=20 >>> http://amyking.org/ >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >>> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ >>> welcome.html >>=20 >> Geo. Bowering, >> RCAF 227498 >>=20 >>=20 >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ >> welcome.html >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ >> welcome.html >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ >> welcome.html >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ >> welcome.html >=20 > George Bowering, esq. > Not a morning kind of guy. >=20 >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es & > sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 17:00:30 -0500 Reply-To: dgodston@gmail.com Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Daniel Godston Organization: Borderbend Arts Collective Subject: updates at bauhaus9090.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit You are invited to visit the "The Bauhaus: 90 Years / 90 Days" website (www.bauhaus9090.org). Updates include -- "Rediscovery and Rebirth" -- Gropius in Chicago Coalition event "Some Knowledge of Schlemmer Is Required" -- a machinima by Patrick Lichty "Working Class History and the Institute of Design" -- essay by Janina Ciezadlo "Bauhaus Reverse Abecedarian" -- poem by Dan Godston "The Twittering Machine" -- a poem by Alice Shapiro "5 Against 4" -- a painting by Lee Barry "BauHouse" -- a poem by Cathleen Schandelmeier "Extremely Hungary Beuer" -- design by Istvan Banyai You can register at the site and contribute to forums, and more features will be added soon. ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 18:18:46 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Nick Carbo Subject: Poetry review of Chinese, Japanese, What are These? up at Hyphen Magazine. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" reviewed by Barbara Jane Reyes (Poeta en San Francisco). http://tinyurl.com/lng4nq Thanks! ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 00:39:30 -0400 Reply-To: Adam Tobin Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Adam Tobin Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mr. Bowering, Sir, isn't it true that you are working on a poetics of crabbiness yourself? or is that just (and this, and proper grammar) a fiction? at > >Oh boy, Baltimore. >The crab cakes at the Lexington Market the best anywhere. > >gb > > >On Jul 13, 2009, at 11:32 AM, Mary Kasimor wrote: > >> I am a The Wire addict. It takes place in Baltimore. >> mary >> >> --- On Sun, 7/12/09, steve russell wrote: >> >> >> From: steve russell >> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... >> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >> Date: Sunday, July 12, 2009, 1:04 PM >> >> >> Sure, and why not throw in the Goddamn bible. I mean, hell, what is >> the bible? Narrative? Epic poetry? I'm thinking mostly of the Old >> Testament, of course. As for "The Wire, " I'm a big fan of crime >> fiction, and George Pelacanos is the main producer of "The Wire." >> Indeed, in the broad sense of the term (...poet...), why not >> include Pelacanos as a poet of the streets of Washington, D.C.? >> Perhaps Q Taratino is the poet of video store clerks, if not their >> saint. Why not talk about failed poets who turned to fiction after >> their bout with poetry. Consider William Faulkner. As for >> cartoonist, I have no problem calling E Gorey, or even Mr. peanuts >> Schultz, a poet. Ugh, what was the topic??? >> >> --- On Sat, 7/11/09, George Bowering wrote: >> >> From: George Bowering >> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... >> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >> Date: Saturday, July 11, 2009, 4:01 PM >> >> Here we go; >> the usual widening and widening of the topic >> until we can include everything, such as L'il Abner and,oh, The Wire. >> >> gb >> >> >> On Jul 10, 2009, at 6:36 PM, Jonathan Morse wrote: >> >>> steve russell wrote: >>>> there are a few singular talents who've managed to create 1st >>>> rate work in fiction, poetry, and drama as well as the essay. >>>> Consider Denis Johnson, or Jim Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. >>> Goethe. Rilke. Hardy. Hugo. If you'll accept non-fiction, you can >>> add Yeats and Dryden. If you count letters as imaginative >>> literature, and why shouldn't you?, you can add Keats and >>> Dickinson. Think big. >>> >>> Jonathan Morse >>> >>> ================================== >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >>> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ >>> welcome.html >> >> George B. >> Author of his own misfortunes. >> >> >> ================================== >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ >> welcome.html >> >> >> >> >> >> ================================== >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ >> welcome.html >> >> >> >> >> >> ================================== >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ >> welcome.html > >George "Whip" Bowering >No slugging average to speak of. > > >================================== >The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 01:20:10 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Ryan Daley Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <904897.59260.qm@web51806.mail.re2.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Pelicanos also writes a lot about DC, which he calls "Drama City," and which they discuss much in The Wire. ps. Pelicanos only produces some of the episodes, not even a majority. On Mon, Jul 13, 2009 at 2:32 PM, Mary Kasimor wrote: > I am a The Wire addict. It takes place in Baltimore. > mary > > --- On Sun, 7/12/09, steve russell wrote: > > > From: steve russell > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Sunday, July 12, 2009, 1:04 PM > > > Sure, and why not throw in the Goddamn bible. I mean, hell, what is the > bible? Narrative? Epic poetry? I'm thinking mostly of the Old Testament, of > course. As for "The Wire, " I'm a big fan of crime fiction, and George > Pelacanos is the main producer of "The Wire." Indeed, in the broad sense of > the term (...poet...), why not include Pelacanos as a poet of the streets of > Washington, D.C.? Perhaps Q Taratino is the poet of video store clerks, if > not their saint. Why not talk about failed poets who turned to fiction after > their bout with poetry. Consider William Faulkner. As for cartoonist, I have > no problem calling E Gorey, or even Mr. peanuts Schultz, a poet. Ugh, what > was the topic??? > > --- On Sat, 7/11/09, George Bowering wrote: > > From: George Bowering > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Saturday, July 11, 2009, 4:01 PM > > Here we go; > the usual widening and widening of the topic > until we can include everything, such as L'il Abner and,oh, The Wire. > > gb > > > On Jul 10, 2009, at 6:36 PM, Jonathan Morse wrote: > > > steve russell wrote: > >> there are a few singular talents who've managed to create 1st rate work > in fiction, poetry, and drama as well as the essay. Consider Denis Johnson, > or Jim Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. > > Goethe. Rilke. Hardy. Hugo. If you'll accept non-fiction, you can add > Yeats and Dryden. If you count letters as imaginative literature, and why > shouldn't you?, you can add Keats and Dickinson. Think big. > > > > Jonathan Morse > > > > ================================== > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > George B. > Author of his own misfortunes. > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 00:21:13 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: George Bowering Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v753.1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes; format=flowed On Jul 13, 2009, at 3:00 PM, Ruth Lepson wrote: > hardy too Well, it was the other way round. . . . > > > On 7/12/09 12:44 PM, "Charlotte Mandel" wrote: > >> Yes, Raymond Carver - as steve russell included in his listing. >> >> On Jul 11, 2009, at 4:04 PM, George Bowering wrote: >> >> Didn't that guy that lived on the Olympic Peninsula and was imitated >> by all the Creative Writhing students >> skip from poetry to short fiction? Can't remember his name. Wrote a >> book called something like What Do >> We Talk About When we Talk about Love or some such topic. >> >> gb >> >> On Jul 11, 2009, at 10:20 AM, steve russell wrote: >> >>> & I neglected to mention Gilbert Sorrentino or Paul Auster. >>> Reginald Gibbons, too, another excellent poet/fiction writer and >>> critic, and translator. There's a rather large list of very >>> inventive, versatile writer/poets .... Mark Strand .... >>> >>> --- On Fri, 7/10/09, steve russell wrote: >>> >>> From: steve russell >>> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... >>> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >>> Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 8:40 PM >>> >>> there are a few singular talents who've managed to create 1st rate >>> work in fiction, poetry, and drama as well as the essay. Consider >>> Denis Johnson, or Jim Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. & of >>> course we have the Buk, as well as Raymond Carver. I blame the so- >>> called creative writing programs for the unfortunate distinction >>> between fiction and prose. Jeanette Winterson doesn't make such >>> distinctions when she discusses her work. >>> >>> --- On Fri, 7/10/09, Mary Kasimor wrote: >>> >>> From: Mary Kasimor >>> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... >>> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >>> Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 6:51 PM >>> >>> I figure that those who can write both fiction and poetry are >>> either more talented or more tenacious. What are your thoughts on >>> that? >>> >>> --- On Fri, 7/10/09, George Bowering wrote: >>> >>> >>> From: George Bowering >>> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... >>> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >>> Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 2:34 PM >>> >>> >>> I have never found it to be a problem. >>> I have managed a lot of novels and books of stories. >>> >>> I think that that is not all that uncommon in Canada. >>> Kroetsch, Atwood, MacEwen, Ondaatje, McFadden, Cohen, etc. >>> >>> gb >>> >>> >>> On Jul 10, 2009, at 10:27 AM, amy king wrote: >>> >>>> but poetry always stops me. >>>> >>>> >>>> Just wondering, so thought I'd ask a bunch of poets who might have >>>> the same itch, why can't you scratch it? Why this hurdle in >>>> making the transition? >>>> >>>> >>>> John Ashbery -- "...every time I sit down and try to write some >>>> fiction I end up writing a >>>> poem instead, so it gets continually postponed. In fact I often =20 >>>> think >>>> it=92s become for me a device for tricking myself into writing =20 >>>> poetry." >>>> >>>> >>>> Kristy Bowen -- "While one of the coolest things about poetry for >>>> me is the ability to >>>> twist language in all sorts of ways, fiction depends far too =20 >>>> much on >>>> meaning, on conveyance, to allow too much twisting or prodding =20 >>>> before >>>> you lose your reader. Even in my own reading exploits, the point =20= >>>> from >>>> which I enter a piece of fiction is entirely different from the =20 >>>> state >>>> of mind in which I enter a poem. Anything can happen in a poem, =20 >>>> jumps >>>> of logic, of image, of meaning, and I'm ..." cont'd here: http:// >>>> tiny.cc/fiction502 >>>> >>>> http://tiny.cc/fiction502 >>>> >>>> >>>> Amy >>>> >>>> _______ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Amy's Alias >>>> >>>> http://amyking.org/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >>>> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ >>>> welcome.html >>> >>> Geo. Bowering, >>> RCAF 227498 >>> >>> >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >>> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ >>> welcome.html >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >>> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ >>> welcome.html >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >>> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ >>> welcome.html >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >>> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ >>> welcome.html >> >> George Bowering, esq. >> Not a morning kind of guy. >> >> >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 >> welcome.html >> >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 >> guidelines & >> sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 > welcome.html Geo. Bowering Heavy feet. Light heart. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 21:27:52 -1000 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Gabrielle Welford Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <4BE80550-3E32-4F63-96D0-695E49D7D02B@sfu.ca> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=WINDOWS-1252 Content-transfer-encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE aye, me too--stories, novel, essays... i'm english... but that can't be what's going on, can it? On Fri, 10 Jul 2009, George Bowering wrote: > I have never found it to be a problem. > I have managed a lot of novels and books of stories. > > I think that that is not all that uncommon in Canada. > Kroetsch, Atwood, MacEwen, Ondaatje, McFadden, Cohen, etc. > > gb > > > On Jul 10, 2009, at 10:27 AM, amy king wrote: > > > but poetry always stops me. > > > > > > Just wondering, so thought I'd ask a bunch of poets who might have > > the same itch, why can't you scratch it? Why this hurdle in > > making the transition? > > > > > > John Ashbery -- "...every time I sit down and try to write some > > fiction I end up writing a > > poem instead, so it gets continually postponed. In fact I often think > > it=92s become for me a device for tricking myself into writing poetry." > > > > > > Kristy Bowen -- "While one of the coolest things about poetry for > > me is the ability to > > twist language in all sorts of ways, fiction depends far too much on > > meaning, on conveyance, to allow too much twisting or prodding before > > you lose your reader. Even in my own reading exploits, the point from > > which I enter a piece of fiction is entirely different from the state > > of mind in which I enter a poem. Anything can happen in a poem, jumps > > of logic, of image, of meaning, and I'm ..." cont'd here: http:// > > tiny.cc/fiction502 > > > > http://tiny.cc/fiction502 > > > > > > Amy > > > > _______ > > > > > > > > > > > > Amy's Alias > > > > http://amyking.org/ > > > > > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ > > welcome.html > > Geo. Bowering, > RCAF 227498 > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 21:31:15 -1000 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Gabrielle Welford Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <345146.68398.qm@web51805.mail.re2.yahoo.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=utf-8 Content-transfer-encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE hmmm... tenacious, might be... On Fri, 10 Jul 2009, Mary Kasimor wrote: > I figure that those who can write both fiction and poetry are either more= talented or more tenacious. What are your thoughts on that? > > --- On Fri, 7/10/09, George Bowering wrote: > > > From: George Bowering > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 2:34 PM > > > I have never found it to be a problem. > I have managed a lot of novels and books of stories. > > I think that that is not all that uncommon in Canada. > Kroetsch, Atwood, MacEwen, Ondaatje, McFadden, Cohen, etc. > > gb > > > On Jul 10, 2009, at 10:27 AM, amy king wrote: > > > but poetry always stops me. > > > > > > Just wondering, so thought I'd ask a bunch of poets who might have the = same itch, why can't you scratch it?=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0Why this hurdle in ma= king the transition? > > > > > > John Ashbery -- "...every time I sit down and try to write some fiction= I end up writing a > > poem instead, so it gets continually postponed. In fact I often think > > it=E2=80=99s become for me a device for tricking myself into writing po= etry." > > > > > > Kristy Bowen -- "While one of the coolest things about poetry for me is= the ability to > > twist language in all sorts of ways, fiction depends far too much on > > meaning, on conveyance, to allow too much twisting or prodding before > > you lose your reader. Even in my own reading exploits, the point from > > which I enter a piece of fiction is entirely different from the state > > of mind in which I enter a poem. Anything can happen in a poem, jumps > > of logic, of image, of meaning, and I'm ..."=C2=A0 cont'd here:=C2=A0 h= ttp://tiny.cc/fiction502 > > > > http://tiny.cc/fiction502 > > > > > > Amy > > > > _______ > > > > > > > > > > > > Amy's Alias > > > > http://amyking.org/ > > > > > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidel= ines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > Geo. Bowering, > RCAF=C2=A0 227498 > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 05:16:56 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: David Kirschenbaum Subject: Boog City 58 Print and Online PDF Editions Available MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Please forward ------------------- Hi all, The print edition of Boog City 58 will be available today. You can =20 read the pdf version now at: http://welcometoboogcity.com/boogpdfs/bc58.pdf Thanks, David -------------------- Boog City 58 now available featuring: ***On the Cover*** **Our Printed Matter section, edited by Paolo Javier** =97"Mark Lamoureux=92s formal and conceptual ingenuity are a pleasure. =20= Constantly creating his own organic forms, he employs the field of the =20= page for composition in a manner not unlike Robert Duncan." =97from =20 Star Maps: Lamoureux and Lin Explore Varying Cosmos; Astronomy Orgonon =20= by Mark Lamoureux (BlazeVOX Books), reviewed by Tim Peterson =97"Lin=92s mourning is a strange and productive tribute indeed, since = it =20 implicitly plays upon the actor=92s name to address questions of space =20= and inscription." from Star Maps: Lamoureux and Lin Explore Varying =20 Cosmos; Heath by Tan Lin (Zaesterle Press), reviewed by Alan Ram=F3n =20 Clinton **And =46rom Our Poetry section, edited by Joanna Fuhrman** (excerpt below) =97Bushwick, Brooklyn's Douglas Piccinnini with "My Notebook is in Your Car" Few things you can do over that you can do over to reach completion. Say, like a drop from this cup added from some other cup which is no longer our friend. ***And Inside*** **Art editor Cora Lambert brings us work from Buchwick, Brooklyn's Dapper Chap Quarterly comic anthology.** **And the Rest of Our Poetry section** (excerpts below) =97Elmhurst, Queens' Geoffrey Cruickshank-Hagenbuckle with "Tragic Wand" They=92re tearing down the brownstones And townhouses in New York=97 =93We don=92t draw pictures Of the storm, We draw power from it.=94 =97Salt Lake City's Shira Dentz with "if it were rep-re-sent-a-tion-al" grate sunflowers slice worm into salad ohright bread would =20= be better seal eyes with their envelopes black seeds =20 furry centers and "buds" just buds pressing on thick black light made of holes there are crocuses starting to bloom; maybe in your head =97Greenpoint, Brooklyn's Kate Hall with "Variation" Fat My therapist asks what I think of my looks. =93I could lose a little weight,=94 I tell her. The next thing I know, I am in the basement of a church talking about my eating. =93I had a hamburger for lunch,=94 I tell them. =93Maybe you should change your hairstyle,=94 the woman to my left says. =93I like my hair,=94 I tell her. =93I was just thinking you could maybe layer the back,=94 she goes on. I get up to leave. =93Do you have a sponsor?=94 a woman in the back row asks. =97Tucson, Arizona's Laynie Browne with "Ps(alm) for a Boy Reading" Lying on his belly legs kicking up absently behind him Boy of seven, reading The Hobbit and "Ps(alm) for Transformational Silence" How will you comfort me? Read to me from a book of ps(alms) **And =46rom Our Music section, Urban Folk edited by Jonathan Berger** =97"Semerdjian produces such exciting and bracing pop music, filled with = =20 a range of influences." from Semerdjian Doesn=92t Let Art Get in the Way = =20 of a Good Time; The Big Beauty by Alan Semerdjian, reviewed by =20 Jonathan Berger =97"=91Thank You=92 is a remembrance of a long-lost friend. =91I never = ever =20 thought that I=92d be one to be quoting that Long Island son,=92 she =20 sings. =91When all is said and done only the good die young.=92" from = New =20 and Old: 21st Century Output from Julia Douglass; Poor People on TV =20 and In Scarsdale by Julia Douglass, reviewed by Berger =97"Decay looms everywhere in the songs on Speck, but the last two =20 songs, like the first, present a sense of optimism." from Young Girl, =20= Old Soul: Denying Decay Through the Power of Song; Speck by Alexa =20 Woodward, reviewed by Berger =97Costello=92s Web: Traveling Bands; Semerdjian, Kathy Zimmer, and =20 Brownbird Rudy Relic videos reviewed by Berger =97Forever Came Today: Disingenuous Lines of Thought Provoked Since =20 Michael Jackson=92s Death By Paula Carino ----- And thanks to our copy editor, Joe Bates. ----- Please patronize our advertisers: Hanging Loose Press * http://www.hangingloosepress.com/ House Press * http://www.housepress.org/records.html Lorraine Leckie * http://www.lorraineleckie.com/HTML/ Schwervon * http://www.schwervon.com/ Alan Semerdjian * http://www.alansemerdjian.com/ Rev. Billy Talen for Mayor * http://www.voterevbilly.org/ ----- To advertise in Boog City, see our ad rate card: http://welcometoboogcity.com/ad_rates.pdf Advertising or donation inquiries can also be directed to editor@boogcity.com or by calling 212-842-BOOG (2664), or you can send money to editor@boogcity.com via https://www.paypal.com/ ----- Poetry Submission Guidelines: Email subs to poetry@welcometoboogcity.com, with no more than five =20 poems, all in one attached file with =93My Name Submission=94 in the =20 subject line and as the name of the file, ie: Walt Whitman Submission. =20= Or mail with an SASE to Poetry editor, Boog City, 330 W. 28th St., =20 Suite 6H, N.Y., N.Y. 10001-4754. ----- Want to write a review (or be reviewed) in Boog=92s Urban Folk music or printed matter sections? Email UF editor Jonathan Berger, uf@welcometoboogcity.com or printed matter editor Paolo Javier, pm@welcometoboogcity.com ----- Want to have your work appear in our art section? Query our art editor, Cora Lambert, art@welcometoboogcity.com ----- 2,250 copies of Boog City are distributed among, and available for free at, the following locations: MANHATTAN East Village Sunshine Theater * 143 E. Houston St. (bet. 1st & 2nd Avenues) Bluestockings * 172 Allen St. (bet. Stanton & Rivington sts.) Pianos * 158 Ludlow St. (bet. Stanton and Rivington sts.) Living Room * 154 Ludlow St. (bet. Stanton and Rivington sts.) Cake Shop * 152 Ludlow St. (bet. Stanton and Rivington sts.) Bowery Poetry Club * 308 Bowery (bet. Houston & Bleecker sts.) Think Coffee * 1 Bleecker St. (@ Bowery) Trash and Vaudeville (upstairs) * 4 St. Mark=92s Pl. (bet. 2nd & 3rd =20= aves.) Mission Caf=E9 * 82 Second Ave. (bet. 4th & 5th sts.) Anthology Film Archives * 32 Second Ave. (bet. 1st & 2nd sts.) Sidewalk Caf=E9 * 94 Avenue A (bet. 6th & 7th sts.) Nuyorican Poets Caf=E9 * 236 E. 3rd St. (bet. Avenues B & C) Lakeside Lounge * 162 Avenue B (bet. 10th & 11th sts.) Life Caf=E9 * 343 E. 10th St. (bet. Avenues A & B) St. Mark=92s Books * 31 Third Ave. (bet. St. Mark=92s Pl. & 9th St.) St. Mark=92s Church * 131 E.10th St. (bet. 2nd & 3rd aves.) Lower Manhattan Acme Underground * 9 Great Jones St. (bet. Broadway & Lafayette St.) Shakespeare & Co. * 716 Broadway (bet. Waverly & Astor places) Other Music * 15 E. 4th St. (bet. Broadway & Lafayette St.) Angelika Film Center * 18 W. Houston St. (bet. Broadway & Mercer St.) Think Coffee * 248 Mercer St. (bet. W. 4th and W. 3rd sts.) Mercer Street Books * 206 Mercer St. (bet. Bleecker & Houston sts.) McNally Jackson * 52 Prince St. (bet. Mulberry & Lafayette sts.) Hotel Chelsea * 222 W. 23rd St. (bet. 7th & 8th aves.) BROOKLYN Greenpoint Greenpoint Coffee House * 195 Franklin St. (bet. Freeman & Green sts.) East Coast Aliens * 216 Franklin St. (bet. Huron & Green sts.) Thai Caf=E9 * 925 Manhattan Ave. (bet. Kent St. & Greenpoint Ave.) Matchless * 557 Manhattan Ave. (bet. Nassau and Driggs aves.) Champion Coffe * 1108 Manhattan Ave. (bet. Clay & DuPont sts.)=09 Williamsburg Sideshow Gallery * 319 Bedford Ave. (bet. S.2nd & S.3rd sts.) Supercore Caf=E9 * 305 Bedford Ave. (bet. S.1st & S.2nd sts.) Spoonbill & Sugartown * 218 Bedford Ave. (bet. N.4th & N.5th sts.) Ear Wax Records * 218 Bedford Ave. (bet. N.4th & N.5th sts.)=09 Bliss Caf=E9 * 191 Bedford Ave. (bet. N.6th & N.7th sts.)=09 Spike Hill * 184 Bedford Ave. (bet. N.6th & N.7th sts.)=09 Soundfix/Fix Cafe * 110 Bedford Ave. (at N.11th St.) --=20 David A. Kirschenbaum, editor and publisher Boog City 330 W. 28th St., Suite 6H NY, NY 10001-4754 For event and publication information: http://welcometoboogcity.com/ T: (212) 842-BOOG (2664)= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 03:11:55 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve russell Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable but Pelacanos, the wire producer, writes novels. they're set in d.c.=20 --- On Mon, 7/13/09, George Bowering wrote: > From: George Bowering > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Monday, July 13, 2009, 5:07 PM > Oh boy, Baltimore. > The crab cakes at the Lexington Market the best anywhere. >=20 > gb >=20 >=20 > On Jul 13, 2009, at 11:32 AM, Mary Kasimor wrote: >=20 > > I am a The Wire addict. It takes place in Baltimore. > > mary > >=20 > > --- On Sun, 7/12/09, steve russell > wrote: > >=20 > >=20 > > From: steve russell > > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > Date: Sunday, July 12, 2009, 1:04 PM > >=20 > >=20 > > Sure, and why not throw in the Goddamn bible. I mean, > hell, what is the bible? Narrative? Epic poetry? I'm > thinking mostly of the Old Testament, of course.=A0 As > for "The Wire, " I'm a big fan of crime fiction, and George > Pelacanos is the main producer of "The Wire." Indeed, in the > broad sense of the term (...poet...), why not include > Pelacanos as a poet of the streets of Washington, D.C.? > Perhaps Q Taratino is the poet of video store clerks, if not > their saint. Why not talk about failed poets who turned to > fiction after their bout with poetry. Consider William > Faulkner. As for cartoonist, I have no problem calling E > Gorey, or even=A0 Mr. peanuts Schultz, a poet. Ugh, what > was the topic??? > >=20 > > --- On Sat, 7/11/09, George Bowering > wrote: > >=20 > > From: George Bowering > > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > Date: Saturday, July 11, 2009, 4:01 PM > >=20 > > Here we go; > > the usual widening and widening of the topic > > until we can include everything, such as L'il Abner > and,oh, The Wire. > >=20 > > gb > >=20 > >=20 > > On Jul 10, 2009, at 6:36 PM, Jonathan Morse wrote: > >=20 > >> steve russell wrote: > >>> there are a few singular talents who've > managed to create 1st rate work in fiction, poetry, and > drama as well as the essay. Consider Denis Johnson, or Jim > Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. > >> Goethe. Rilke. Hardy. Hugo. If you'll accept > non-fiction, you can add Yeats and Dryden. If you count > letters as imaginative literature, and why shouldn't you?, > you can add Keats and Dickinson. Think big. > >>=20 > >> Jonathan Morse > >>=20 > >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not > accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.e= du/poetics/welcome.html > >=20 > > George B. > > Author of his own misfortunes. > >=20 > >=20 > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept > all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poet= ics/welcome.html > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept > all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poet= ics/welcome.html > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept > all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poet= ics/welcome.html >=20 > George "Whip" Bowering > No slugging average to speak of. >=20 >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all > posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/= welcome.html > =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 11:33:51 -0600 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jonathan Penton Subject: Come to our read in Terlingua, Texas! (seriously. Terlingua, Texas. It's the Taos of Tomorrow.) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Donna Snyder, Deb Hoag and Jonathan Penton will be attending the Way Out West Book Festival in Alpine, Texas on July 31st and August 1st. The WOW Texas Festival is an off-beat celebration of Southwestern literature; a hip and fun interpretation of what it means to be a desert-bound writer. Check out http://www.wowtxbookfestival.com/ for more information. On Saturday, immediately after the festival, we'll be driving through the sunset to La Kiva Restaurant and Bar in Terlingua, Texas ( http://www.lakiva.net/ ), which happens to be my favorite bar in my favorite area on earth. Terlingua is the town between the Big Bend National Park and the Big Bend Texas State Park, itself an ancient mining site with a cemetery that makes you feel icky in the best possible way. And reverent. Terlingua is one of the many tiny towns in the southwest that has been occupied by anarchists, Wiccans, freaks, and weirdoes, and La Kiva is a wonderfully friendly place to congregate with them. I cannot sufficiently sing the praises of Big Bend National Park and Terlingua's Chisos Mining Company Motel as a vacation spot (though I admit that August is not the time of year one normally explores the area). Terlingua's the subject of the 2007 documentary /"Ghost Town: 24 Hours in Terlingua/." If you live in the Big Bend area and have never been, our reading there is, clearly, the perfect opportunity to investigate. If not, be sure to lift a drink to us that weekend, for we will be reading in Terlingua, and you will not. That's: Donna Snyder, Deb Hoag, and Jonathan Penton Saturday, August 1st, 9pm Central Daylight Time La Kiva Restaurant and Bar Highway 170 in Terlingua, Texas Hugs and kisses, -- Jonathan Penton http://www.unlikelystories.org/ ------------------ Donna Snyder is the founder and curator of The Tumblewords Project, a community-based writing workshop that has served the Southwest on almost every Saturday for the past fourteen years. She has presented hundreds of creative writing workshops as an artist in the schools in the El Paso/ Las Cruces region, various local literary festivals, and community-funded events. She has published her work in such journals as /"Puerto Del Sol, Sin Fronteras, BorderSenses/," and select on-line journals. She has been a featured artist in such performance events and venues as the Taos Poetry Circus, the Border Book Festival, El Paso Museum of Art’s Museo-Literati reading series, the Branigan Library Authors Series, Umbilicus Mundi, the South Broadway Cultural Center in Albuquerque, the Out on a Limb series at the Santa Fe Actor’s Theater, and the Texas Kick-Ass Poets tour. She was a member of El Paso’s seminal poetry jam band, Central Nervous System. Her work as an artist, cultural and political organizer, and grassroots lawyer has been featured in articles in the "/El Paso Times, Bridge Review, Albuquerque Journal, Stanton Street, Alamogordo Daily News/," and the /"Las Cruces Sun/." In 2002 she won the Emma Tenayuca prize for her human rights work. Currently, Donna is preparing poetry manuscripts for El Rancho Press, Mouthfeel Press, and, of course, Unlikely Books, which will publish her manuscript in the summer of 2010. She’s also working on the first edition of /Mezcla/, the print anthology of The Tumblewords Project. -- Deb Hoag will be reading from/ "Crashin' the Real: one woman's search for truth, justice . . . and Steven Tyler" /(Dog Horn Publishing, 2009). When gonzo columnist Eve Petra is fired by her magazine's new owner, she spends a couple of days (okay, a week or so) wallowing in self-pity and Jack Daniels. To her great dismay, no one wants to hire a middle-aged female version of Hunter Thompson. The market has changed. People have changed. The only thing that hasn't changed is Eve. Lying on her bed wondering what the hell has happened to her life, it comes to her. Who has weathered every whim of the fickle public for nearly five decades? Who has shown the ability to rise from the ashes of every disaster? Who is looking down at her from a poster taped to her bedroom ceiling? Rock god Steven Tyler. Deb Hoag holds a Ph.D. in Clinical Psychology from the University of Detroit Mercy. She has been working in the mental health field for sixteen years, and is currently living and working in Flagstaff, Arizona. In 2010 Unlikely Books will publish /"Dr. Gonzo: A series of loosely related essays on equality, visibility and modern mental health/." -- Jonathan Penton’s books of poetry are /"Last Chap/" (Vergin’ Press, 2004),/ "Painting Rust"/ and "/Blood and Salsa" /(bound together in one volume by Unlikely Books, 2006) and /"Prosthetic Gods"/ (New Sins Press, 2008). He’ll be carrying these books and reading from them, and will have post-it notes so that he does not lose his place. ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 14:45:11 +0530 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve dalachinsky Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit that's what most folks do WORK SHOP On Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:08:01 -0700 George Bowering writes: > "Workshop." There's your problem right there. > > gb > > > On Jul 13, 2009, at 11:43 AM, steve russell wrote: > > > Could anyone recommend a decent "creative writhing" workshop? > > > > --- On Mon, 7/13/09, Skip Fox wrote: > > > > From: Skip Fox > > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > Date: Monday, July 13, 2009, 1:38 PM > > > > That's it! > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Poetics List (UPenn, UB) > > [mailto:POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU] On > > Behalf Of Mary Kasimor > > Sent: Sunday, July 12, 2009 11:24 AM > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > > > > Creative writhing! > > > > ================================== > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > > > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ > > welcome.html > > > > > > > > > > ================================== > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > > > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ > > welcome.html > > > > George H. Bowering, OUH > Born without a religion. > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 12:50:56 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: George Bowering Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <328530.62380.qm@web52411.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v753.1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed I recommend the Florida Street Cafe in DC for scrapple. gb On Jul 14, 2009, at 3:11 AM, steve russell wrote: > but Pelacanos, the wire producer, writes novels. they're set in d.c. > --- On Mon, 7/13/09, George Bowering wrote: > >> From: George Bowering >> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... >> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >> Date: Monday, July 13, 2009, 5:07 PM >> Oh boy, Baltimore. >> The crab cakes at the Lexington Market the best anywhere. >> >> gb >> >> >> On Jul 13, 2009, at 11:32 AM, Mary Kasimor wrote: >> >>> I am a The Wire addict. It takes place in Baltimore. >>> mary >>> >>> --- On Sun, 7/12/09, steve russell >> wrote: >>> >>> >>> From: steve russell >>> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... >>> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >>> Date: Sunday, July 12, 2009, 1:04 PM >>> >>> >>> Sure, and why not throw in the Goddamn bible. I mean, >> hell, what is the bible? Narrative? Epic poetry? I'm >> thinking mostly of the Old Testament, of course. As >> for "The Wire, " I'm a big fan of crime fiction, and George >> Pelacanos is the main producer of "The Wire." Indeed, in the >> broad sense of the term (...poet...), why not include >> Pelacanos as a poet of the streets of Washington, D.C.? >> Perhaps Q Taratino is the poet of video store clerks, if not >> their saint. Why not talk about failed poets who turned to >> fiction after their bout with poetry. Consider William >> Faulkner. As for cartoonist, I have no problem calling E >> Gorey, or even Mr. peanuts Schultz, a poet. Ugh, what >> was the topic??? >>> >>> --- On Sat, 7/11/09, George Bowering >> wrote: >>> >>> From: George Bowering >>> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... >>> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >>> Date: Saturday, July 11, 2009, 4:01 PM >>> >>> Here we go; >>> the usual widening and widening of the topic >>> until we can include everything, such as L'il Abner >> and,oh, The Wire. >>> >>> gb >>> >>> >>> On Jul 10, 2009, at 6:36 PM, Jonathan Morse wrote: >>> >>>> steve russell wrote: >>>>> there are a few singular talents who've >> managed to create 1st rate work in fiction, poetry, and >> drama as well as the essay. Consider Denis Johnson, or Jim >> Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. >>>> Goethe. Rilke. Hardy. Hugo. If you'll accept >> non-fiction, you can add Yeats and Dryden. If you count >> letters as imaginative literature, and why shouldn't you?, >> you can add Keats and Dickinson. Think big. >>>> >>>> Jonathan Morse >>>> >>>> ================================== >>>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not >> accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http:// >> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >>> >>> George B. >>> Author of his own misfortunes. >>> >>> >>> ================================== >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept >> all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http:// >> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ================================== >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept >> all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http:// >> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ================================== >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept >> all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http:// >> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >> >> George "Whip" Bowering >> No slugging average to speak of. >> >> >> ================================== >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all >> posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/ >> poetics/welcome.html >> > > > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ > welcome.html George H. Bowering, OC Dull as dishwater. ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 16:07:06 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: { brad brace } Subject: six new pleated plaid pamphlets published! Comments: To: WRYTING-L automatic digest -- Theory and Writing MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII 131 Running Deer Running Great Risk Running Rampant 132 Running Servant Running Up After Running Water 133 Running Wild Runs Counter Runs Roaring 134 Ruptured Hymen Rural Idyll Ruses Detected 135 Rush Repeat Rushed Fused Rushing Waters 136 Russet Brown Russian Revolution Rust Dust six new pleated plaid pamphlets published! only $15 over 878 pages! { brad brace } Pleated Plaid Pamphlets Volumes 131-136 Number 2 [accompaniment to insatiable abstraction engine] http://www.bbrace.net/abstraction-engine.html bbrace@eskimo.com brad brace, bbrace, architecture, engineering, biography, memoir, illustration, map, creative, writing, drama, opera, puzzles, games, samizdat, artists' books, poetry, fluxus, contemporary, art, design, fiction,musical ppp131-2 http://www.lulu.com/content/e-book/pleated-plaid-pamphlet-vol-131-no-2/7400200 ppp132-2 http://www.lulu.com/content/e-book/pleated-plaid-pamphlet-vol-132-no-2/7400242 ppp133-2 http://www.lulu.com/content/e-book/pleated-plaid-pamphlet-vol-133-no-2/7400304 ppp134-2 http://www.lulu.com/content/e-book/pleated-plaid-pamphlet-vol-134-no-2/7400332 ppp136-2 http://www.lulu.com/content/e-book/pleated-plaid-pamphlet-vol-136-no-2/7400366 ppp137-2 http://www.lulu.com/content/e-book/pleated-plaid-pamphlet-vol-137-no-2/7400420 ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 21:36:27 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: "E. J. McAdams" Subject: Reminder: Marcella Durand at Exit Art Wednesday (NYC) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SEA Poetry SeriesFeaturing poet Marcella Durand Wednesday, July 15 7:30pm - 9pm FREE Come early and see the exhibit END OF OIL Stay late for the cash bar reception For more details: http://www.seapoetryseries.blogspot.com/ Please forward to friends!! ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 08:21:40 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: mIEKAL aND Subject: Activist wrongly accused of Brad Will's murder Comments: To: Theory and Writing MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Oaxaca Justice Condemns Innocent APPO Man for the Murder of Brad Will No Evidence and No Witnesses to the Actual Crime: Juan Manuel Martinez Moreno Sentenced to Prison By Nancy Davies Commentary from Oaxaca http://www.narconews.com/Issue58/article3679.html July 10, 2009 Juan Manuel Martinez Moreno has been sentenced to prison by the judge of the Fifth Federal Court, Rosa Iliana Noriega Perez, for the murder of US Indymedia videographer Brad Will on October 26, 2006. This in spite of: * Brad Will video-graphed his murderers running toward him carrying pis= tols * The two assailants shown in the video, Abel Zarate, registrar of Santa Lucia del Camino, and Oswaldo Manuel Aguilar Coello who was a municipal police officer, were arrested but subsequently released by government orders. Both are strongly tied to the PRI * There was no evidence for accusing Juan Martinez Moreno, who was standing near, not facing, Brad Will when Will was shot * The =93witnesses=94 in fact saw nothing; Feria Perez, the chief witness, admitted he repeated hearsay from Democracy Now: Activists Protest Jailing of Oaxaca Activist in Will Killing And here in New York, a group of activists rallied outside the Mexican consulate Monday to protest the latest in the case of the slain American journalist Brad Will. Will was shot and killed on October 27, 2006, while covering the popular uprising in the Mexican province of Oaxaca. His own camera captured his shooting. Will=92s family and friends have criticized the Mexican government for charging a Oaxaca activist with Will=92s murder instead of state police forces. Last week, a Mexican judge reportedly ruled that the activist, Juan Moreno, can be held indefinitely and that hearsay evidence can be used against him. Mark Read, a friend of Brad Will, criticized Moreno=92s prosecution. Mark Read: =93Juan Manuel Martinez Moreno, the man falsely accused of Brad=92s murder, is also a part of this movement, also a man of principle. That Brad=92s murder is being used to railroad a fellow political activist is the most profound insult to his memory. And it is not the first time that his death has been used in such a way.=94 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 16:36:15 -0600 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Michael Roberson Subject: Poetry and Failure MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Struck by the acuteness of and subsequent attention to Christian Bök's discussion of "Writing and Failure" on the Harriet Blog, I am looking for further considerations of poetry and failure or poetry and inadequacy. In one regard, much has been written about poets and personal inadequacies or senses of failure, but what about the actual writing of poetry as an inevitably impossible, doomed, or failed endeavor? Do we continue to write poetry because it ultimately fails to do what we hope it might or should? Is the "failure of poetry" a failure of language, or poetics? Any thoughts or ideas would be immensely appreciated. ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 15:08:00 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: amy king Subject: Special Issue of Ekleksographia -- Guest edited by Amy King Comments: To: new-poetry@wiz.cath.vt.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Special Issue of Ekleksographia --=20 Guest edited by Amy King =C2=A0 http://ekleksographia.ahadadabooks.com/issuetwo/ =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Featuring work by: =C2=A0 Diana Adams=20 Cynthia Arrieu-King with Hillary Gravendyk Anny Ballardini =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Jeanne Marie Beaumont Dan Boehl =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Alexander Dickow Linh Dinh =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Tomas Ekstr=C3=B6m Erica Miriam Fabri =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Farrah Field Adam Fieled =C2=A0=20 Annie Finch Ossian Foley =C2=A0=20 Jennifer H. Fortin Maya Funaro=20 Heather Green Niels Hav, trans. by P. K. Brask & Patrick Friesen=20 Scott Hightower Dan Hoy =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Dorta Jagi=C4=87, trans. by Ana Bo=C5=BEi=C4=8Devi=C4=87 Amy King =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Tony Mancus Nicholas Manning =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Miguel Murphy Gina Myers =C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Keith Newton Obododimma Oha =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Daniela Olszewska Maya Pindyck =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Matthew Rotando Toma=C5=BE =C5=A0alamun, trans. with Michael Thomas Taren =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Barry Schwabsky Evie Shockley =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Lytton Smith Sampson Starkweather =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Rohith Sundararaman Chris Vitiello =C2=A0=20 David Wolach =C2=A0 http://ekleksographia.ahadadabooks.com/issuetwo/ =C2=A0 Future issues forthcoming curated by Pam Brown and Alan Halsey.=C2=A0 Also = special theme issues, Oulipo, GLBT, Boston , Chicago=C2=A0and Prague issues= are in the works.=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Please forward and enjoy responsibly.=C2=A0=20 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 http://ekleksographia.ahadadabooks.com/issuetwo/ =C2=A0 _______ Amy's Alias http://amyking.org/=0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 12:56:03 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Elizabeth Switaj Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure In-Reply-To: <3bb732cb15f49c69b884a593c1bd1df5.squirrel@webmail.ucalgary.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Do we continue to write poetry because it ultimately fails to do what we hope it might or should? That may be so for some and certainly is why I continue to write* a poem*, but other than that I continue writing because those hopes shift and are various. >Is the "failure of poetry" a failure of language, or poetics? Yes. ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 15:59:16 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Evan Munday Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure In-Reply-To: <3bb732cb15f49c69b884a593c1bd1df5.squirrel@webmail.ucalgary.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v926) I can't speak to that, but I can recommend another book by B=F6k's =20 publishers (and, in the interests of full disclosure, my employer) =20 that may help: The Laundromat Essay by Kyle Buckley. http://www.chbooks.com/catalogue/laundromat_essay The book is ostensibly a long poem about a man's attempt to retrieve =20 his clothing from a nearby laundromat, but is more about the failure =20 and disappointment of poetry than anything else. =46rom a Calgary Herald interview with Buckley: The former University of Calgary student first cobbled together the =20 thoughts behind The Laundromat Essay as part of a thesis for his =20 master's degree in English literature. He couldn't defend it, however, =20= because he became increasingly fascinated with how it was a failure. 'I had a lot of questions when writing it,' he says. 'In some ways, it =20= was the failure of cohesiveness in poetry and those questions of =20 concerns that I wrapped into how I rewrote the book. It's almost a =20 book written within the collapsing ruins of another book.' Evan --------------- Publicist Coach House Books On Jul 14, 2009, at 6:36 PM, Michael Roberson wrote: > Struck by the acuteness of and subsequent attention to Christian B=F6k's= > discussion of "Writing and Failure" on the Harriet Blog, I am =20 > looking for > further considerations of poetry and failure or poetry and =20 > inadequacy. In > one regard, much has been written about poets and personal =20 > inadequacies or > senses of failure, but what about the actual writing of poetry as an > inevitably impossible, doomed, or failed endeavor? Do we continue to > write poetry because it ultimately fails to do what we hope it might =20= > or > should? Is the "failure of poetry" a failure of language, or poetics? > > Any thoughts or ideas would be immensely appreciated. > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 > guidelines & sub/unsub info: = http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 13:10:28 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jim Andrews Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <20090715.144512.1464.0.skyplums@juno.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ya and in that order. ja http://vispo.com From: "steve dalachinsky" > that's what most folks do WORK SHOP ,,, ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 18:22:31 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Christopher Rizzo Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure In-Reply-To: <3bb732cb15f49c69b884a593c1bd1df5.squirrel@webmail.ucalgary.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Michael. Thanks for the stimulating questions. I jotted a response on my blog, if you'd care to read: www.inplaceofchairs.blogspot.com Bests, Chris On Tue, Jul 14, 2009 at 6:36 PM, Michael Roberson wro= te: > Struck by the acuteness of and subsequent attention to Christian B=C3=B6k= 's > discussion of "Writing and Failure" on the Harriet Blog, I am looking for > further considerations of poetry and failure or poetry and inadequacy. I= n > one regard, much has been written about poets and personal inadequacies o= r > senses of failure, but what about the actual writing of poetry as an > inevitably impossible, doomed, or failed endeavor? Do we continue to > write poetry because it ultimately fails to do what we hope it might or > should? Is the "failure of poetry" a failure of language, or poetics? > > Any thoughts or ideas would be immensely appreciated. > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 21:24:26 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Paul Siegell Subject: A widespread, high-spirited head rush Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Hi, What was the last concert you went to?=20 JUST RELEASED: jambandbootleg by Paul Siegell AMAZON (already re-stocking): http://www.amazon.com/jambandbootleg-Paul-Siegell/dp/098162832X/ref=3Dsr_= 1_2?ie=3DUTF8&s=3Dbooks&qid=3D1246128940&sr=3D8-2 A-HEAD PUBLISHING: http://a-headpublishing.com/A-Head_book_store.html "For centuries, people have tried to take words and turn them into music.= What Paul Siegell does in his collection of poetry, jambandbootleg, is ta= ke music and turn it back into words. And he does it exceptionally well, capturing both the excitement of concert-going and the poetic essence of = the improvisational music scene." =E2=80=94MARC BROWNSTEIN, bass player of th= e Disco Biscuits "Behold! Blend pinches of the Beats and Phish with a big bowl of Fantasti= c Originality =E2=80=93 unlike any poet I've ever known =E2=80=93 wave a bu= rning match over it, inhale deeply. The astonishing dream that fills your head =E2=80=93 t= hat's Paul Siegell." =E2=80=94CHARLES McNAIR, Paste Magazine "Siegell is a wild madman, a verbal musician as imposing as a rock star, = who just happens to also go behind the curtain of his raucous stage and share= some wonderfully personal sides that wrap an arm around the audience he continues to entertain." =E2=80=94GRADY HARP, Amazon "Top 10" Reviewer Please forward to anyone who'd appreciate=E2=80=94Let's get into the song= ! in tremendous appreciation, paul> http://paulsiegell.blogspot.com/ =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 21:11:36 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Gabrielle Welford Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <765052.94905.qm@web51807.mail.re2.yahoo.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Content-disposition: inline yes=2C me too--never know=2C exactly=2E =A0i do love it that way=2E=2E=2E= ----- Original Message ----- From=3A Mary Kasimor =3Cmkasimor=40YAHOO=2ECOM=3E Date=3A Monday=2C July 13=2C 2009 2=3A04 pm Subject=3A Re=3A I want to write fiction but =2E=2E=2E To=3A POETICS=40LISTSERV=2EBUFFALO=2EEDU =3E I bet many poets do write fiction=2C but we write it for = =3E ourselves=2E I like to simply write whatever and wherever my brain = =3E takes me=2E It may be awful writing--I don=27t know because I am too= = =3E close to it=2C but it is fun and a bit scary and exciting=2E I = =3E really never know exactly where I am going=2E = =3E =A0 =3E Mary Kasimor =3E = =3E --- On Sun=2C 7/12/09=2C steve russell =3Cpoet=5Fin=5Fhell=40YAHOO=2E= COM=3E wrote=3A =3E = =3E = =3E From=3A steve russell =3Cpoet=5Fin=5Fhell=40YAHOO=2ECOM=3E =3E Subject=3A Re=3A I want to write fiction but =2E=2E=2E =3E To=3A POETICS=40LISTSERV=2EBUFFALO=2EEDU =3E Date=3A Sunday=2C July 12=2C 2009=2C 1=3A04 PM =3E = =3E = =3E Sure=2C and why not throw in the Goddamn bible=2E I mean=2C hell=2C = what = =3E is the bible=3F Narrative=3F Epic poetry=3F I=27m thinking mostly of= the = =3E Old Testament=2C of course=2E=A0 As for =22The Wire=2C =22 I=27m a b= ig fan of = =3E crime fiction=2C and George Pelacanos is the main producer of =22The= = =3E Wire=2E=22 Indeed=2C in the broad sense of the term (=2E=2E=2Epoet=2E= =2E=2E)=2C why = =3E not include Pelacanos as a poet of the streets of Washington=2C = =3E D=2EC=2E=3F Perhaps Q Taratino is the poet of video store clerks=2C = if = =3E not their saint=2E Why not talk about failed poets who turned to = =3E fiction after their bout with poetry=2E Consider William Faulkner=2E= = =3E As for cartoonist=2C I have no problem calling E Gorey=2C or even=A0= = =3E Mr=2E peanuts Schultz=2C a poet=2E Ugh=2C what was the topic=3F=3F=3F= =3E = =3E --- On Sat=2C 7/11/09=2C George Bowering =3Cbowering=40SFU=2ECA=3E w= rote=3A =3E = =3E From=3A George Bowering =3Cbowering=40SFU=2ECA=3E =3E Subject=3A Re=3A I want to write fiction but =2E=2E=2E =3E To=3A POETICS=40LISTSERV=2EBUFFALO=2EEDU =3E Date=3A Saturday=2C July 11=2C 2009=2C 4=3A01 PM =3E = =3E Here we go=3B =3E the usual widening and widening of the topic =3E until we can include everything=2C such as L=27il Abner and=2Coh=2C = The Wire=2E =3E = =3E gb =3E = =3E = =3E On Jul 10=2C 2009=2C at 6=3A36 PM=2C Jonathan Morse wrote=3A =3E = =3E =3E steve russell wrote=3A =3E =3E=3E there are a few singular talents who=27ve managed to create 1= st = =3E rate work in fiction=2C poetry=2C and drama as well as the essay=2E = =3E Consider Denis Johnson=2C or Jim Harrison=2C or the late Thomas Dish= =2E =3E =3E Goethe=2E Rilke=2E Hardy=2E Hugo=2E If you=27ll accept non-ficti= on=2C you = =3E can add Yeats and Dryden=2E If you count letters as imaginative = =3E literature=2C and why shouldn=27t you=3F=2C you can add Keats and = =3E Dickinson=2E Think big=2E =3E =3E = =3E =3E Jonathan Morse =3E =3E = =3E =3E =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3E =3E The Poetics List is moderated =26 does not accept all posts=2E = =3E Check guidelines =26 sub/unsub info=3A = =3E http=3A//epc=2Ebuffalo=2Eedu/poetics/welcome=2Ehtml =3E George B=2E =3E Author of his own misfortunes=2E =3E = =3E = =3E =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3E The Poetics List is moderated =26 does not accept all posts=2E Check= = =3E guidelines =26 sub/unsub info=3A = =3E http=3A//epc=2Ebuffalo=2Eedu/poetics/welcome=2Ehtml =3E = =3E = =3E = =3E = =3E =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3E The Poetics List is moderated =26 does not accept all posts=2E Check= = =3E guidelines =26 sub/unsub info=3A = =3E http=3A//epc=2Ebuffalo=2Eedu/poetics/welcome=2Ehtml =3E = =3E = =3E =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 = =3E = =3E =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3E The Poetics List is moderated =26 does not accept all posts=2E Check= = =3E guidelines =26 sub/unsub info=3A = =3E http=3A//epc=2Ebuffalo=2Eedu/poetics/welcome=2Ehtml =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 03:05:43 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Sarah Sarai Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain Baltimore: also *Homicide" (Yay, *Homicide*)=20 If you have nothing better to do and self-esteem issues you could spend a= short time at=20 http://www.myspace.com/sarahsarai where I have archived a few of my short stories which made it online (oth= ers made it into=20 print). (Finishing a longer work and hoping to get another longer work o= ut there.) And=20 I'm a poet.=20=20 Distinctions are useless. EXCEPT: Poets are more fun than fiction writer= s, more=20 companionable.=20=20 Your friend and mine, Sarah Sarai Reconciled to Your Fate http://my3000lovingarms.blogspot.com/ http://www.myspace.com/sarahsarai http://www.verbsap.com/2005mar/sarai.html =20=20 "I have been called to a holy office by the Lord Himself, who most mercif= ully appeared=20 before me, His servant, in the year 1743, when He opened my sight into th= e spiritual=20 world and enabled me to converse with spirits and angels, in which state = I have continued=20 up to this day." Emanuel Swedenborg =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 00:11:22 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: George Bowering Subject: Re: A widespread, high-spirited head rush In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v753.1) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On Jul 15, 2009, at 6:24 PM, Paul Siegell wrote: > Hi, > > What was the last concert you went to? I guess it was the Vancouver Symphony Orchestra doing Beethoven's Ninth and other stuff about 18 months ago. gb ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 10:14:44 +0100 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Roy Exley Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure In-Reply-To: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Hi Michael, Don't forget Samuel Beckett's words - "No matter - try again - fail again - fail better". If everything was successful perfection, there would be no point in going on - it's in the blood to keep trying and failing better, orbiting around the impossibility of perfection, but keeping it in sight. Missed aspirations might seem like failure but we are driven on to new and perhaps more relevant aspirations. Destiny might seem like a very abstract and vague concept but experience seems to tell us that it does have a reality in our lives. Roy Exley. On 15/7/09 11:22 pm, "Christopher Rizzo" wrote: > Hi Michael. Thanks for the stimulating questions. I jotted a response on = my > blog, if you'd care to read: > www.inplaceofchairs.blogspot.com >=20 > Bests, > Chris >=20 > On Tue, Jul 14, 2009 at 6:36 PM, Michael Roberson w= rote: >=20 >> Struck by the acuteness of and subsequent attention to Christian B=F6k's >> discussion of "Writing and Failure" on the Harriet Blog, I am looking fo= r >> further considerations of poetry and failure or poetry and inadequacy. = In >> one regard, much has been written about poets and personal inadequacies = or >> senses of failure, but what about the actual writing of poetry as an >> inevitably impossible, doomed, or failed endeavor? Do we continue to >> write poetry because it ultimately fails to do what we hope it might or >> should? Is the "failure of poetry" a failure of language, or poetics? >>=20 >> Any thoughts or ideas would be immensely appreciated. >>=20 >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guideli= nes >> & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >>=20 >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es & > sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >=20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 05:22:50 -0800 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: carol dorf Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hard to say where one "poem" ends and the next begins. Don't forget pleasure -- pleasure in language, pleasure in structuring the "poem," referencing experience. (Almost all of reading, for me; and a good part of my writing.) On Wed, Jul 15, 2009 at 11:56 AM, Elizabeth Switaj wrote: > > Do we continue to write poetry because it ultimately fails to do what we > hope it might or should? > > That may be so for some and certainly is why I continue to write* a poem*, > but other than that I continue writing because those hopes shift and are > various. > > >Is the "failure of poetry" a failure of language, or poetics? > > Yes. > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 06:21:47 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Joel Weishaus Subject: "The Gateless Gate" Pages 25-26 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear Friends and Colleagues: Here are pages 25-26 of "The Gateless Gate": http://web.pdx.edu/~pdx00282/Gate/Pgs%2025-26.htm Mirror site: http://www.cddc.vt.edu/host/weishaus/Gate/Pgs%2025-26.htm=20 Introduction: http://web.pdx.edu/~pdx00282/Gate/Intro.htm Notes: 1- I've decided to send two (one screen), instead of four pages, as I'm = sure that many of you are pressed for time. 2-The colors have been changed, so that they may appear on each monitor = closer to what I've intended. 3-The bibliography (Bib) link at the bottom of each page has been fixed, = and bookmarks added. 4-As always, please let me know if you want to be deleted from these = notices. -Joel =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 06:37:39 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: PJ Subject: submission call - audio poetry In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "from east to west: bicoastal = =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A"from east to west:=A0 bicoastal = verse" - fall '09:=A0=A0Audio Poetry =0A=0A=0AOur fall issue will have an accompanying audio supplement, hopeful= ly both online and as a CD. Every poem in our audio section will be linked = to a=0Arecording of the poem. The text of the poem should be sent in the bo= dy=0Aof an email to PJ Nights (tangerine_reflections@yahoo.com)=0Awith "aud= io submission" in the subject line. The audio of the poem can=0Abe attached= to the email and should be an .mp3 file. If you don't have=0Arecording sof= tware, try "Audacity" (http://audacity.sourceforge.net/), an open-source, = cross-platform sound recorder. =0A=0AThe deadline for the fall issue is August 15, 2009. Links to our current and past issues can be found at http://www.geocities.c= om/pj_nights (until the end of October when we will be acquiring a new doma= in name). Thank you! PJ Nights =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 07:41:04 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Thomas savage Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure In-Reply-To: <3bb732cb15f49c69b884a593c1bd1df5.squirrel@webmail.ucalgary.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sometimes poetry fails and sometimes it succeeds.=A0 Which it is depends up= on what the poetry is trying to do and whether the poetry produced is any g= ood or not.=A0 Regards, Tom Savage --- On Tue, 7/14/09, Michael Roberson wrote: From: Michael Roberson Subject: Poetry and Failure To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Tuesday, July 14, 2009, 6:36 PM Struck by the acuteness of and subsequent attention to Christian B=F6k's discussion of "Writing and Failure" on the Harriet Blog, I am looking for further considerations of poetry and failure or poetry and inadequacy.=A0 I= n one regard, much has been written about poets and personal inadequacies or senses of failure, but what about the actual writing of poetry as an inevitably impossible, doomed, or failed endeavor?=A0 Do we continue to write poetry because it ultimately fails to do what we hope it might or should?=A0 Is the "failure of poetry" a failure of language, or poetics? Any thoughts or ideas would be immensely appreciated. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 12:33:11 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: David-Baptiste Chirot Subject: Life Writing in Poetry Workshop with Judith Harway 7/25/09 In-Reply-To: <7078.51499.qm@web81401.mail.mud.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Thu=2C 16 Jul 2009 10:10:10 -0700 From: woodlandpattern@sbcglobal.net Subject: Life Writing in Poetry Workshop with Judith Harway 7/25/09 To: woodlandpattern@sbcglobal.net Local author and teacher =20 Leads a workshop at Woodland Pattern Book Center=20 Life Writing in Poetry=20 =20 (Milwaukee=2C WI) On Saturday=2C July 25=2C 2009=2C from 1-4pm=2C writer and teacher Judith Harway will teach a one-day workshop which will w= ork with students to identify and address the key stories punctuating our lives. Through variety of activities (brainstorming=2C directed writing exercises=2C reading contempo= rary poems and discussion)=2C participants will discover what influences them in= life and writing and how to creatively put it on paper.=20 =20 Judith Harway's books of poetry include All That is Left (Turning Point Books=2C 2009) and The Memory Box (Zarigueya Press=2C 2002). Her work has appeared in dozens of literary journals=2C and= has earned fellowships from the Wisconsin Arts Board=2C the Hambidge Center and= the MacDowell Colony. She is on the faculty of the Milwaukee Institute of Art a= nd Design. ### =20 Event Listing When: Saturday=2C July 25=2C 2009=3B 1pm-4pm=20 What: Life Writing in Poetry with Judith Harway Where: Woodland Pattern Book Center=2C 720 E. Locust St. Milwaukee=2C WI 53212=20 Cost: $30/$25 membersLink: http://www.woodlandpattern.org/workshops/adults.shtml#h= arway Life Writing in Poetry with Judith Harway Saturday=2C July 25=2C 1-4pm $30 / $25 members This workshop will help participants to identify and frame key stories from life in poetry. Through a variety of activities (brainstorming=2C directed writing exercises=2C reading contemporary poems=2C discussion)=2C participating writers will discover new influences and directions=2C and explore the range of their own voices. http://www.woodlandpattern.org/ Woodland Pattern Book Center 720 E. Locust Street Milwaukee=2C WI 53212 phone 414.263.5001 _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live=99: Keep your life in sync.=20 http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=3DTXT_TAGLM_WL_BR_life_in_synch_062009= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 12:50:45 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: David-Baptiste Chirot Subject: Woodland Pattern: Creativity & Aging Anthology Celebration and Reading with Jack Collom In-Reply-To: <419694.58377.qm@web81404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Creativity & Aging Anthology Celebration=20 and Reading with Jack Collom Date: Wed=2C 15 Jul 2009 15:45:08 -0700 From: woodlandpattern@sbcglobal.net Subject: Celebration with Jack Collom at MPL To: woodlandpattern@sbcglobal.net Creativity & Aging Anthology Celebration=20 and Reading with Jack Collom=20 =20 Saturday=2C July 18=2C 2009=3B 2pm (FREE)=20 Milwaukee Public Library=2C Loos Room=20 814 W. Wisconsin Ave.=20 Milwaukee=2C WI 53233=20 =20 Please join us in the Loos Room at Milwaukee Public Library on Saturday=2C July 18th at 2pm for a reading to celebrate the publication = of Woodland Pattern=92s Creativity & Aging Anthology with: =20 Poet-in-Residence=2C Jack Collom Creativity & Aging Workshop Students Aviva Cristy Joe Radke =20 The Creativity & Aging workshops were held every Tuesday & Thursday=2C from 1pm-3pm=2C for the past seven weeks at the Wilson Park Senior Center. The students were instructed by Joe Radke=2C Aviva Cristy=2C and Poet-in-Residence=2C Jack Co= llom. =20 Jack Collom was born in Chicago=2C Illinois=2C 8 November 1931=2C and grew up in nearby Western Springs.=20 He walked a lot in Salt Creek Woods and began bird watching at age 11. He joined the U.S. Air Force and wrote his first poems in Tripoli=2C Libya.= He earned an MA in English on the GI Bill=2C and has taught Creative Writing free-lance for over thirty years. H= e is Adjunct Professor at Naropa University=2C where he received the 2001 Presid= ent=92s Award for Faculty and has been teaching Eco-lit (Ecology Literature) for 19 consecutive years=2C as well as outreach teacher-training.=20 =20 Collom has authored 22 books and chapbooks of poetry. He is=2C moreover=2C responsible for three collections (with essays and commentary) = of writings by children=2C all published by Teachers & Writers Collaborative= =2C New York. In 2001=2C Tuumba Press issued a more than 500-page-long volume=2C Red Car Goes By=2C as his Select= ed Poems. His latest books are Exchanges of Earth & Sky and Situations=2C Sing= s (with Lyn Hejinian). =20 Jack Collom long ago rejected the notion that a distinction is to be made between the quotidian and the poetic. There is poetry everywh= ere. But to find poetry everywhere means that one is incessantly engaged with th= e world at the level of poetry=85. His attention to surprise is pronounced bu= t never programmatic. The result is (as Merrill Gilfillan has phrased it) =93= the dance and weave between fierce notation and ceilingless song.=94 from Edito= rs=92 Preface to Red Car Goes By. =20 Light refreshments will be served. =20 For more information contact Chuck Stebelton at 414.263.5001. =20 Made possible with generous support from: The Greater Milwaukee Foundation=2C The Helen Bader Foundation=2C Faye McBeath Foundati= on=2C National Endowment for the Arts=2C Interfaith Older Adult Programs=2C UWM C= enter on Age & Community=2C & UWM Osher Lifelong Learning Institute. http://www.woodlandpattern.org/ Woodland Pattern Book Center 720 E. Locust Street Milwaukee=2C WI 53212 phone 414.263.5001 _________________________________________________________________ Insert movie times and more without leaving Hotmail=AE.=20 http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/QuickAdd?ocid=3DTXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tut= orial_QuickAdd_062009= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 12:02:53 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve russell Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable & both are equally depressing, but people seem to enjoy shopping. Strange.= =20 --- On Wed, 7/15/09, Jim Andrews wrote: > From: Jim Andrews > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Wednesday, July 15, 2009, 4:10 PM > ya and in that order. >=20 > ja > http://vispo.com=20 > From: "steve dalachinsky" > > that's what most folks=A0 > do=A0=A0=A0WORK=A0=A0=A0SHOP >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > ,,, >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all > posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/= welcome.html > =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 12:12:47 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: amy king Subject: Special Issue of Ekleksographia -- Failed to Include MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Cover art credit:=C2=A0 Orna Ben Shoshan, "The Burden of Happiness" --- On Wed, 7/15/09, amy king wrote: Special Issue of Ekleksographia --=20 Guest edited by Amy King =C2=A0 http://ekleksographia.ahadadabooks.com/issuetwo/ =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Featuring work by: =C2=A0 Diana Adams=20 Cynthia Arrieu-King with Hillary Gravendyk Anny Ballardini =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Jeanne Marie Beaumont Dan Boehl =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Alexander Dickow Linh Dinh =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Tomas Ekstr=C3=B6m Erica Miriam Fabri =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Farrah Field Adam Fieled =C2=A0=20 Annie Finch Ossian Foley =C2=A0=20 Jennifer H. Fortin Maya Funaro=20 Heather Green Niels Hav, trans. by P. K. Brask & Patrick Friesen=20 Scott Hightower Dan Hoy =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Dorta Jagi=C4=87, trans. by Ana Bo=C5=BEi=C4=8Devi=C4=87 Amy King =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Tony Mancus Nicholas Manning =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Miguel Murphy Gina Myers =C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Keith Newton Obododimma Oha =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Daniela Olszewska Maya Pindyck =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Matthew Rotando Toma=C5=BE =C5=A0alamun, trans. with Michael Thomas Taren =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Barry Schwabsky Evie Shockley =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Lytton Smith Sampson Starkweather =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=20 Rohith Sundararaman Chris Vitiello =C2=A0=20 David Wolach =C2=A0 http://ekleksographia.ahadadabooks.com/issuetwo/ =C2=A0 Future issues forthcoming curated by Pam Brown and Alan Halsey.=C2=A0 Also = special theme issues, Oulipo, GLBT, Boston , Chicago=C2=A0and Prague issues= are in the works.=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Please forward and enjoy responsibly.=C2=A0=20 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 http://ekleksographia.ahadadabooks.com/issuetwo/ =C2=A0 _______ Amy's Alias http://amyking.org/ =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 09:07:26 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Lars Palm Subject: Tom Beckett from ungovernable press Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Dear All, what can I say more than that ungovernable press is happy to announce the= arrival of Another Shadow? by Tom Beckett the summer night may look a little different after you've read it cheers, lars http://ungovernablepress.weebly.com http://mischievoice.blogspot.com =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 14:39:21 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: amy king Subject: Poetry Events / Calendars -- complete but ... Comments: To: Women's Poetry Listserve , new-poetry@wiz.cath.vt.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable The permanent link for the Poetry Events / Calendars is here: http://amyking.wordpress.com/2009/07/16/poetry-events-calendars/=20 However, I will add the calendar to at least two more online venues such as= Red Room and Goodreads, and perhaps others, once the calendar is a little = more filled out.=A0 I don't have time at the moment, but it seems there are= a few major cities and small town series that have been omitted.=A0 Please= feel free to backchannel addt'l suggestions or post them in the comments t= o be added to the list.=A0 Once I've added more over the next few days, I'l= l duplicate the listing for others who don't venture to my blog. Thanks to all who chipped in and provided links!=A0 Hopefully this resource= will serve those on the hunt for live poetry for a long time! Best, Amy _______ =0A =0A =0AAmy's Alias =0Ahttp://amyking.org/=0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 14:37:06 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Patrick Dillon Subject: Re: A widespread, high-spirited head rush In-Reply-To: <82CD1646-5330-416B-84F4-51A332B7C024@sfu.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Appropriate to the title of your book, the last concert I attended was Robert Randolph and the Family Band. He seems to be mostly admired by the jam band scene. I went because I am a fervent fan of the so-called "sacred steel" music. I wasn't disappointed. He played Glenn Lee's "Joyful Sounds." I think there are very few opportunities to hear that piece of music live. Glenn Lee's song is probably my favorite recording I have ever heard. It is a piece of music where each moment is better than the next. When the song starts to fade out it becomes jaw droppingly good, I would really love to hear the full unedited recording. Pesky fade out. You can download the song here for $1: http://www.amazon.com/Joyful-Sounds/dp/B0011V925Q On Thu, Jul 16, 2009 at 2:11 AM, George Bowering wrote: > On Jul 15, 2009, at 6:24 PM, Paul Siegell wrote: > > Hi, >> >> What was the last concert you went to? >> > > I guess it was the Vancouver Symphony Orchestra doing Beethoven's Ninth > and other stuff about 18 months ago. > > gb > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 14:58:16 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jordan Stempleman Subject: Re: Tom Beckett from ungovernable press In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable fuck yes! =20 > Date: Thu=2C 16 Jul 2009 09:07:26 -0400 > From: larspalm69@GMAIL.COM > Subject: Tom Beckett from ungovernable press > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >=20 > Dear All=2C >=20 > what can I say more than that ungovernable press is happy to announce the > arrival of >=20 > Another Shadow? by Tom Beckett >=20 > the summer night may look a little different after you've read it >=20 > cheers=2C > lars >=20 >=20 >=20 > http://ungovernablepress.weebly.com >=20 > http://mischievoice.blogspot.com >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live=99 SkyDrive=99: Get 25 GB of free online storage. http://windowslive.com/online/skydrive?ocid=3DTXT_TAGLM_WL_SD_25GB_062009= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 15:53:59 +0530 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve dalachinsky Subject: Re: A widespread, high-spirited head rush MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit rashied ali quintet last nite tonite kronos qt i go to almost 1 or 2 a nite On Thu, 16 Jul 2009 00:11:22 -0700 George Bowering writes: > On Jul 15, 2009, at 6:24 PM, Paul Siegell wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > What was the last concert you went to? > > I guess it was the Vancouver Symphony Orchestra doing Beethoven's > Ninth > and other stuff about 18 months ago. > > gb > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 13:31:19 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve russell Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable The chili dogs at Ben’s Chili Bowl, overrated. Ben's, btw, is= =0A=0AThe chili dogs at Ben=E2=80=99s Chili Bowl, overrated. Ben's, btw, is= mentioned a few times in a couple of the Pelecanos novels.=20 --- On Tue, 7/14/09, George Bowering wrote: From: George Bowering Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Tuesday, July 14, 2009, 3:50 PM I recommend the Florida Street Cafe in DC for scrapple. gb On Jul 14, 2009, at 3:11 AM, steve russell wrote: >=C2=A0 but Pelacanos, the wire producer,=C2=A0 writes novels. they're set = in d.c. > --- On Mon, 7/13/09, George Bowering wrote: > >> From: George Bowering >> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... >> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >> Date: Monday, July 13, 2009, 5:07 PM >> Oh boy, Baltimore. >> The crab cakes at the Lexington Market the best anywhere. >> >> gb >> >> >> On Jul 13, 2009, at 11:32 AM, Mary Kasimor wrote: >> >>> I am a The Wire addict. It takes place in Baltimore. >>> mary >>> >>> --- On Sun, 7/12/09, steve russell >> wrote: >>> >>> >>> From: steve russell >>> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... >>> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >>> Date: Sunday, July 12, 2009, 1:04 PM >>> >>> >>> Sure, and why not throw in the Goddamn bible. I mean, >> hell, what is the bible? Narrative? Epic poetry? I'm >> thinking mostly of the Old Testament, of course.=C2=A0 As >> for "The Wire, " I'm a big fan of crime fiction, and George >> Pelacanos is the main producer of "The Wire." Indeed, in the >> broad sense of the term (...poet...), why not include >> Pelacanos as a poet of the streets of Washington, D.C.? >> Perhaps Q Taratino is the poet of video store clerks, if not >> their saint. Why not talk about failed poets who turned to >> fiction after their bout with poetry. Consider William >> Faulkner. As for cartoonist, I have no problem calling E >> Gorey, or even=C2=A0 Mr. peanuts Schultz, a poet. Ugh, what >> was the topic??? >>> >>> --- On Sat, 7/11/09, George Bowering >> wrote: >>> >>> From: George Bowering >>> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... >>> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >>> Date: Saturday, July 11, 2009, 4:01 PM >>> >>> Here we go; >>> the usual widening and widening of the topic >>> until we can include everything, such as L'il Abner >> and,oh, The Wire. >>> >>> gb >>> >>> >>> On Jul 10, 2009, at 6:36 PM, Jonathan Morse wrote: >>> >>>> steve russell wrote: >>>>> there are a few singular talents who've >> managed to create 1st rate work in fiction, poetry, and >> drama as well as the essay. Consider Denis Johnson, or Jim >> Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. >>>> Goethe. Rilke. Hardy. Hugo. If you'll accept >> non-fiction, you can add Yeats and Dryden. If you count >> letters as imaginative literature, and why shouldn't you?, >> you can add Keats and Dickinson. Think big. >>>> >>>> Jonathan Morse >>>> >>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not >> accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://=20 >> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >>> >>> George B. >>> Author of his own misfortunes. >>> >>> >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept >> all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://=20 >> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept >> all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://=20 >> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept >> all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://=20 >> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >> >> George "Whip" Bowering >> No slugging average to speak of. >> >> >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all >> posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/=20 >> poetics/welcome.html >> > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check=C2=A0=20 > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 > welcome.html George H. Bowering, OC Dull as dishwater. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 15:26:03 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Comments: RFC822 error: Invalid RFC822 field - "Literacy and Health Education Programs". Rest of header flushed. From: Jennifer Karmin Subject: JOB: Literacy & Health Education (Chicago) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Project Director=0ALiteracy and Health Education Programs=0AThe Gwendolyn B= rooks Center for Black Literature and Creative Writing at Chicago State Uni= versity =0A=0ASince its inception, the Gwendolyn Brooks Center for Black Li= terature and Creative Writing at Chicago State University has supported pro= jects that use literary and artistic approaches to address social justice i= ssues. For five years, the Center=E2=80=99s focus has been the HIV/AIDS Y= outh Prevention Education Program (H.Y.P.E.) which targets teenagers and yo= ung adults. Our HIV Youth Prevention Education (H.Y.P.E.) program=E2=80=99= s mission is to educate high school students, adult learners, and the local= community through creative literacy programs. These programs focus on HIV = prevention and care as well as cultural sensitivity and the removal of stig= mas. =0A=0AThe artistic nature of the project requires the inclusion of art= ists with a variety of backgrounds and extensive experience in education. = The Project Director will provide management of the project including logis= tics, marketing and technical support. This individual will also be the li= aison between the Center=E2=80=99s Literacy and Health Education programs, = the schools and other venues, and guide the educational focus. The Project= Director will be responsible for the HIV/AIDS education component of the p= roject. The Project Director should have leadership abilities and manageria= l expertise to implement and further the goals of the Center=E2=80=99s Lite= racy and Health Education programs and aid the Brooks Center in sustaining = this important work. The Project Director will work effectively as part of = a team of Brooks Center staff and CSU administrators. The Project Director = reports to the director of the Gwendolyn Brooks Center. =0A=0ADuties=0A=E2= =80=A2=09Manage H.Y.P.E programs, most notably the Positive Poetry Performa= nce Troupes.=0A=E2=80=A2=09Help identify and guide a core group of teaching= artists and serve as the conduit between the artistic staff and Brooks Cen= ter/CSU administrative staff. =0A=E2=80=A2=09Aid in the establishment of a= sustained and replicable model for using the arts focusing particularly on= the literature and social justice emphasis of Gwendolyn Brooks and other l= ike-minded writers and artists. =0A=E2=80=A2=09Oversee the creation and pub= lication of a third international anthology of creative writing from people= of color on HIV/AIDS. =0A=E2=80=A2=09Participate in/contribute to plannin= g for the expansion of GBC social justice programs.=0A=E2=80=A2=09Enthusias= tically promote partnerships, programs, and projects to be pursued by the B= rooks Center in an effort to further the work of Gwendolyn Brooks and Brook= s Center programming. =0A=E2=80=A2=09As meeting with administrators from sc= hools and other venues is critical to the success of these programs, the Pr= oject Director must own a car and possess a valid driver=E2=80=99s license = and automobile insurance.=0AQualifications=0A=E2=80=A2=09A minimum of five = years experience in non-profit or arts management=0A=E2=80=A2=09A minimum o= f five years experience working in educational settings=0A=E2=80=A2=09Must = be extremely organized and capable of independent thought and multi-tasking= =0A=E2=80=A2=09Advanced knowledge of Chicago Public Schools and the Chicago= Artistic and Non-profit Communities =0A=E2=80=A2=09Advanced knowledge of l= iterature and the arts=0A=E2=80=A2=09Must be an effective communicator in a= ll mediums.=0A=E2=80=A2=09Strong administrative skills=0A=E2=80=A2=09M.A., = M.F.A. or Ph.D. preferred=0A=0ASalary: =0AThis is a full-time consultant po= sition, renewed annually. Salary negotiable.=0A=0AApplication: =0AChicago S= tate University is an equal opportunity employer.=0AInterested applicants s= hould mail a cover letter, a C.V./r=C3=A9sum=C3=A9, and a list of personal = references to:=0A=0AQuraysh Ali Lansana, Director=0AThe Gwendolyn Brooks Ce= nter for Black Literature=0Aand Creative Writing=0AAssociate Professor of E= nglish and Creative Writing=0AChicago State University=0ADouglas Hall 210-A= =0A9501 S. King Drive=0AChicago, IL 60628-1598=0A=0AThe deadline for applic= ations is August 7, 2009. =0AThe start date is September 1, 2009.=0A=0A=0A= =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 15:28:35 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Sam Truitt Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure In-Reply-To: <719db60d0907160622o3367db8cq9f380ca3f20f3dc4@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Is this thread I'm surprised not to see Laura Riding (Jackson) hasn't come = up - her sentiment as nailed by posthumous title THE FAILURE OF POETRY, THE= PROMISE OF LANGUAGE (ed. John Nolan) underscored by her giving up poems in= the late 1930's - tied to truth, to being true - but she writes someplace = (her essay on Stein maybe?): =0A=0A=E2=80=9C=E2=80=A6if poetry had all subj= ects taken away from it,=0Athere was one subject of which poetry could not = be deprived, namely, that=0Apoetry had come to an end. Here was an ingeniou= s method for indefinitely=0Apostponing the end of poetry=E2=80=A6 since poe= try was to write about nothing, it could=0Awrite about everything from the = standpoint of nothing; it could still have its=0Aepic without the burden of= having to have convictions about it.=E2=80=9D =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A----- Origina= l Message ----=0AFrom: carol dorf =0ATo: POETICS@LIST= SERV.BUFFALO.EDU=0ASent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 9:22:50 AM=0ASubject: Re: = Poetry and Failure=0A=0AHard to say where one "poem" ends and the next begi= ns.=0A=0ADon't forget pleasure -- pleasure in language, pleasure in structu= ring the=0A"poem," referencing experience.=0A=0A(Almost all of reading, for= me; and a good part of my writing.)=0A=0AOn Wed, Jul 15, 2009 at 11:56 AM,= Elizabeth Switaj wrote:=0A=0A> > Do we continue to writ= e poetry because it ultimately fails to do what we=0A> hope it might or sho= uld?=0A>=0A> That may be so for some and certainly is why I continue to wri= te* a poem*,=0A> but other than that I continue writing because those hopes= shift and are=0A> various.=0A>=0A> >Is the "failure of poetry" a failure o= f language, or poetics?=0A>=0A> Yes.=0A>=0A> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A= > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es=0A> & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=0A>=0A= =0A=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0AThe Poetics List is moderated & does not a= ccept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/= poetics/welcome.html=0A=0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 16:08:18 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Luke Schlueter Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Yeah, I actually called myself on behalf of friends. I guess they sold = out pretty quickly early this aft. Sorry. =20 L. ________________________________ From: Poetics List (UPenn, UB) on behalf of steve russell Sent: Thu 7/16/2009 3:02 PM To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... & both are equally depressing, but people seem to enjoy shopping. = Strange. --- On Wed, 7/15/09, Jim Andrews wrote: > From: Jim Andrews > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Wednesday, July 15, 2009, 4:10 PM > ya and in that order. > > ja > http://vispo.com =20 > From: "steve dalachinsky" > > that's what most folks=20 > do WORK SHOP > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ,,, > > = =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all > posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: = http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check = guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 17:44:07 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve russell Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii too many people forget pleasure. sure, poetry is hard work, but sweating out a poem is still fun. a big disappointment if the poem is a complete failure, but fun almost always happens at some point during the shaping, & considering the $$$$ rewards, who'd write the stuff if this were not the case? --- On Thu, 7/16/09, carol dorf wrote: From: carol dorf Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Thursday, July 16, 2009, 9:22 AM Hard to say where one "poem" ends and the next begins. Don't forget pleasure -- pleasure in language, pleasure in structuring the "poem," referencing experience. (Almost all of reading, for me; and a good part of my writing.) On Wed, Jul 15, 2009 at 11:56 AM, Elizabeth Switaj wrote: > > Do we continue to write poetry because it ultimately fails to do what we > hope it might or should? > > That may be so for some and certainly is why I continue to write* a poem*, > but other than that I continue writing because those hopes shift and are > various. > > >Is the "failure of poetry" a failure of language, or poetics? > > Yes. > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 18:16:21 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: David Chirot Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure In-Reply-To: <3bb732cb15f49c69b884a593c1bd1df5.squirrel@webmail.ucalgary.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable before essaying to "answer the question" isn't it perhaps necessary to firs= t ask some questions of oneself, of the speaker, of the audience, of the readers? What Power, whose Power and where from, and how, and why-- Who Speaks--the One Presumed to Know-- to one so that there is the pressure to respond as though the question itself is unquestioningly a question whic= h one must ask of oneself and others? of Poetry? Is the very asking of and response to the question not in itself a form of informing one of one's inadequacy, one's failure in not asking the question oneself without being told to do so? That is, that at the center of the question is the unquestioning belief in its Truth, in the manner of fiction readers and their "willing suspension o= f disbelief? In other words, before even asking questions of the question, one is immediately acquiescing to its terms of inadequacy, failure, abjectness, defeat, being crushed down being obedient--not asking questions but being a "model prisoner/worker"-- From the start, one accepts the designations offered by these questions and the either/or set up it projects on to oneself . . . . Might not the inadequacy the failure or the success in a sense being with asking why is it that one accepst the voice of the questioern as Authority, and why it is one unquestioningly "follows it," allows it to define the range of one's possibilities of existence--within such a narrow confinement-- Does the question and ones' responses to it in fact have anything to do wit= h "Poetry"-- Is not the question about Who What and Where has the Power to prevent persons from asking How, Why?-- To paraphrase Emerson: "The failure and inadequacy one sees in poetry is within one's own eye." What sort of success --or failure--is one thinking of, desiring, demanding for? To be known, recognized in one's lifetime? And when that is dubiously or not achieved, to think of the inadequacy of poetry--or perhaps the inadequacy of the thinkers, critics, taste makers, publishers of poetry-- What are the standards one sets oneself for one's own person to decide if one has failed or not? Do the applause and notice of others count the most in the scale of achievement? I think the best example there is of a poet finding poetry inadequate to th= e tasks he demands of it is Rimbaud. He stopped writing poetry and "became somebody else." Emile Nelligan, sometimes called the Quebecois/Canadian Rimbaud--for his talent evinced at an early age--also called it quits with poetry and committed himself to an asylum for the rest of hislife. Many are the poets around the world who left behind them one book, unnotice= d in their time, and stopped writing, turning instead to other activities. Paul Valery, George Oppen, "left poetry" for decades each, only to return later in life to finding in poetry what they had no found elsewhere. Laura Riding left Poetry but wrote about it in prose-- What does one mean by "inadequacy?" In the las tpoem in his Larry Eigner's first published book (by the Creeleys, in Majorca)-ends with the question which has Rimbaud's "literally and in every other sense" of meanings expressed simultaneously, punning----"am I an incompetent after all?" In the 1980's there was argae in Art Criticism for the concept of the "abject." is the poetic "inadequacy" related to the abject? Think of al the meanings of the word "inadequacy," their contexts--their allusions--their expression as "received ideas--" What is the motivation for one to choose to find poetry, and/or one's poetry-- inadequate, a failure? Is this the choice of the poet, or of the poet vi-vis the recognition she receives from others, one's sense of one's work as inadequate, a failure? How much does the recognition even when negative mean to you, poet-- Does one write for an audience only--for oneself only-- Does one want to be ignored but also "known of"--or even "fairly well known--"--" a cult figure?--" "A minor writer with major ambitions s/he is an example of those who overshot the reach of their abilities." "A major poet in the guise of a minor---" Personally, i think the idea of merely stating the failure or inadequacy of poetry as though "everyone knows what it means"--is to begin from a foundation that is hazy, vague, and unsteady --. Needn't the terms be treated with more precision, , defined more clearly--perhaps find themselves to be "as yet unknown and/or little understood?" Are failure and/or inadequacy and al the examples given anything different from the Received Ideas like those in Flaubert's dictionary of these? Is the discussion being held because of the failure and inadequate in thinking up any other topic to address? Is the failure one receives from "outside" directly or indirectly or not a= t all related to the success or failure of the works on the inside of the poet-- Who gives the critic and canon maker, the taste maker the noise maker, the One Presumed to Know the right to be the judge of the works, of the poet--doesn't one just sign away one's rights in terms of what will be the controlling factor in many ways of what it is to be essaying as a career-- For this is the question that needs also to be asked: iso ne speaking of a poet's CAREER--or of their VOCATION-- Isn't it a sign of the careerism associated with these rankings, "failures,= " inadequacies " that one is required in some way to 'take al these into account?" The question is--to whom are these questions addressed--primarily career poets who read the Harriett blog, the primarily academic /white collar readers-- and aren't many of these institutions, careers, ultimately dependent not so much on the failure or success of the work or ine's failure or success in terms of anthologies, papers, but heavil dependence as well on the moneys of priavte foundations, the military, sweatshop labor for corporations assuaging guilt by helping to pa= y for a program or two- "on the failure of poetry?" If enough poets are convinced they have failed--what shall they do then--where to seek elsewhere for anew kind of career-- or to restart the career by "radically altering one's approach"-- What motives do these questions discussions have on, vis-a-vis with--this boredom and confinement within institutions, hierarchies within grou'ps,' rigid structures of al kinds in society and poetics that hamper and drastically narrow done one's field ot action or thought, s o that within this very narrow limited aperture, one is gauged by the meres= t slips of tense as to the success or failure of one's fitting in or not to hose deemed worth recognition--or to be sadly among those shipped off into the snow to die--or simply exiled to inferior jobs and non noticed careers which in themselves may make the once poet give it up for some other more intereting and "profitable" hobby so called-- With so man questions of these kinds, whais usefu to keep i mind is-what is the motivation for the question? What is the motivation for this rarticular writer NOW to ask it and to make his own judgements on their determinations-- One might say that the most overlooked thing is that the asking of the question re failure and inadequacy is accepted as a given. Aren't often the things most in need of questioning toese that persons and poets accept meekly as givens, things 'everyone knows"--"automatically, without saying?" In one sense is not a person''s asking the question based on others taking it as a given property of poetry to be judged as a success or inadequate, a failure by oneself and/or others- -is this asking of questions re "failure/success" based on what one takes t= o be givens that al 'accept"-- or on a self-imposed given? On Tue, Jul 14, 2009 at 3:36 PM, Michael Roberson wro= te: > Struck by the acuteness of and subsequent attention to Christian B=F6k's > discussion of "Writing and Failure" on the Harriet Blog, I am looking for > further considerations of poetry and failure or poetry and inadequacy. I= n > one regard, much has been written about poets and personal inadequacies o= r > senses of failure, but what about the actual writing of poetry as an > inevitably impossible, doomed, or failed endeavor? Do we continue to > write poetry because it ultimately fails to do what we hope it might or > should? Is the "failure of poetry" a failure of language, or poetics? > > Any thoughts or ideas would be immensely appreciated. > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 21:15:43 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Maria Damon Subject: Re: A widespread, high-spirited head rush In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The FAB trio: Billy Bang, Barry Altschul, and Joe Fonda, at a small club in Basel a coupla weeks ago. Fabulous indeed. Patrick Dillon wrote: > Appropriate to the title of your book, the last concert I attended was > Robert Randolph and the Family Band. He seems to be mostly admired by the > jam band scene. I went because I am a fervent fan of the so-called "sacred > steel" music. > > I wasn't disappointed. He played Glenn Lee's "Joyful Sounds." I think there > are very few opportunities to hear that piece of music live. Glenn Lee's > song is probably my favorite recording I have ever heard. It is a piece of > music where each moment is better than the next. When the song starts to > fade out it becomes jaw droppingly good, I would really love to hear the > full unedited recording. Pesky fade out. > > You can download the song here for $1: > http://www.amazon.com/Joyful-Sounds/dp/B0011V925Q > > On Thu, Jul 16, 2009 at 2:11 AM, George Bowering wrote: > > >> On Jul 15, 2009, at 6:24 PM, Paul Siegell wrote: >> >> Hi, >> >>> What was the last concert you went to? >>> >>> >> I guess it was the Vancouver Symphony Orchestra doing Beethoven's Ninth >> and other stuff about 18 months ago. >> >> gb >> >> >> ================================== >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines >> & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >> >> > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 20:38:26 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jim Andrews Subject: new dbCinema series: Olga MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit i've been writing a graphic synthesizer/langu(im)age processor called dbCinema and, recently, dbCinemizing with some images of Olga, the Vancouver fashion model and book maker--as in artists' books and regular books. i've read one of her books called Soros. the writing is by Kedrick James. Olga's visuals are Russian Constructivistic. It's a real page turner! Soros was hanged before his first meeting with Soros on January 6 1990. Soros will give no choice but to award them enough divergence to go wrong. By June of 1993 Soros was against this time. Of course it helps if you know a little of the Soros story. the dbCinema series on Olga is at http://vispo.com/dbcinema/olga i think these are rather intense. Many thanks to Olga for permission to display these on vispo.com. And to Miles de Courcy, the photographer, and Katherine Soucie, the dress designer. In Internet Explorer and Opera the series stops around image 470 (of 581 images) on my system. Works fine in Safari and Firefox, however. Opera will display all images if you increase the disk cache size in Preferences. But I can't get Internet Explorer to display all the images, on my system. So I recommend you don't use that browser. Too bad. Used to be a good browser. But it's now the Bush administration of browsers: mad with security issues. Overkill. No fun. Forces of dullness. If yer on a PC, the F11 key toggles yer browser fullscreen and back. All the images are 1280 x 1024 pixels, so they probly take up all yer real estate. The first pass through the images is relatively slow as it downloads the big images one by one. But that is well-suited to a first viewing: each of the images is meant as something viewable as a still. When all of them have downloaded, it speeds up to 12.5 frames per second (if yer puter is up to the job) and so you see it in a different light, as a high-res, 47 second video. and it is quite different this way. the controls at top left let you pause it on and off and advance by one image or go back one image. you can also change the delay between images. it is meant to be experienced this way, rather than simply as a video that plays with no interactivity. There are more dbCinema image series at http://vispo.com/dbcinema/meditations.htm ja http://vispo.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 00:48:01 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: George Bowering Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <412588.89489.qm@web52401.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v753.1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes; format=flowed I agree with that. But you can say you were there. That's the main thing, I think. gb On Jul 16, 2009, at 1:31 PM, steve russell wrote: > The chili dogs at Ben=92s Chili Bowl, overrated. Ben's, btw, is > > > The chili dogs at Ben=92s Chili Bowl, overrated. Ben's, btw, is =20 > mentioned a few times in a couple of the Pelecanos novels. > > --- On Tue, 7/14/09, George Bowering wrote: > > From: George Bowering > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Tuesday, July 14, 2009, 3:50 PM > > I recommend the Florida Street Cafe in DC for scrapple. > > gb > > > On Jul 14, 2009, at 3:11 AM, steve russell wrote: > >> but Pelacanos, the wire producer, writes novels. they're set in =20= >> d.c. >> --- On Mon, 7/13/09, George Bowering wrote: >> >>> From: George Bowering >>> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... >>> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >>> Date: Monday, July 13, 2009, 5:07 PM >>> Oh boy, Baltimore. >>> The crab cakes at the Lexington Market the best anywhere. >>> >>> gb >>> >>> >>> On Jul 13, 2009, at 11:32 AM, Mary Kasimor wrote: >>> >>>> I am a The Wire addict. It takes place in Baltimore. >>>> mary >>>> >>>> --- On Sun, 7/12/09, steve russell >>> wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> From: steve russell >>>> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... >>>> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >>>> Date: Sunday, July 12, 2009, 1:04 PM >>>> >>>> >>>> Sure, and why not throw in the Goddamn bible. I mean, >>> hell, what is the bible? Narrative? Epic poetry? I'm >>> thinking mostly of the Old Testament, of course. As >>> for "The Wire, " I'm a big fan of crime fiction, and George >>> Pelacanos is the main producer of "The Wire." Indeed, in the >>> broad sense of the term (...poet...), why not include >>> Pelacanos as a poet of the streets of Washington, D.C.? >>> Perhaps Q Taratino is the poet of video store clerks, if not >>> their saint. Why not talk about failed poets who turned to >>> fiction after their bout with poetry. Consider William >>> Faulkner. As for cartoonist, I have no problem calling E >>> Gorey, or even Mr. peanuts Schultz, a poet. Ugh, what >>> was the topic??? >>>> >>>> --- On Sat, 7/11/09, George Bowering >>> wrote: >>>> >>>> From: George Bowering >>>> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... >>>> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >>>> Date: Saturday, July 11, 2009, 4:01 PM >>>> >>>> Here we go; >>>> the usual widening and widening of the topic >>>> until we can include everything, such as L'il Abner >>> and,oh, The Wire. >>>> >>>> gb >>>> >>>> >>>> On Jul 10, 2009, at 6:36 PM, Jonathan Morse wrote: >>>> >>>>> steve russell wrote: >>>>>> there are a few singular talents who've >>> managed to create 1st rate work in fiction, poetry, and >>> drama as well as the essay. Consider Denis Johnson, or Jim >>> Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. >>>>> Goethe. Rilke. Hardy. Hugo. If you'll accept >>> non-fiction, you can add Yeats and Dryden. If you count >>> letters as imaginative literature, and why shouldn't you?, >>> you can add Keats and Dickinson. Think big. >>>>> >>>>> Jonathan Morse >>>>> >>>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>>>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not >>> accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http:// >>> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >>>> >>>> George B. >>>> Author of his own misfortunes. >>>> >>>> >>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept >>> all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http:// >>> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept >>> all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http:// >>> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept >>> all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http:// >>> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >>> >>> George "Whip" Bowering >>> No slugging average to speak of. >>> >>> >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all >>> posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/ >>> poetics/welcome.html >>> >> >> >> >> >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ >> welcome.html > > George H. Bowering, OC > Dull as dishwater. > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 > welcome.html > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 > welcome.html George H. Bowering Wishes your happiness. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 00:47:03 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: George Bowering Subject: Re: A widespread, high-spirited head rush In-Reply-To: <20090716.155400.1152.5.skyplums@juno.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v753.1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed I love Rashied Ali. My favourite drummer. I heard him with the Aylers around 1967 ]and I heard him in Vancouver last year. I didn't know he did concerts, though. gb On Jul 16, 2009, at 3:23 AM, steve dalachinsky wrote: > rashied ali quintet last nite > tonite kronos qt > i go to almost 1 or 2 a nite > On Thu, 16 Jul 2009 00:11:22 -0700 George Bowering > writes: >> On Jul 15, 2009, at 6:24 PM, Paul Siegell wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> >>> What was the last concert you went to? >> >> I guess it was the Vancouver Symphony Orchestra doing Beethoven's >> Ninth >> and other stuff about 18 months ago. >> >> gb >> >> ================================== >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: >> http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >> >> > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ > welcome.html Geo. H. Bowering Adaptable yet reliable. ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 00:54:21 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Alan Sondheim Subject: Lynx Bookmark File MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Lynx Bookmark File Some older Net history - this is a bookmark file I kept from 1995 to maybe ten years ago; some, perhaps most, of the sites are down, but the file itself seems of interest since a lot of the sites were 'historic' one way or another. Enjoy if you can - - Alan Bookmark file

  1. Kyushu Online
  2. ftp wuarchive.wustl.edu
  3. ftp archive.umich.edu
  4. huge software directory
  5. Social Indicators of Development
  6. Internet Text: 0
  7. World Population
  8. mud directory
  9. Welcome directory
  10. MOO directory
  11. Desert Research Institute Home Page
  12. HISTORY AND PREHISTORY OF THE WEB
  13. irc directory
  14. The Psychology of Cyberspace
  15. The Ancient World Web: The Ultimate Index of All Things Ancient
  16. CyberAtlas Index
  17. Argos Ancient World Search
  18. The Internet Biodiversity Service
  19. CYBERMIND CONFERENCE 96
  20. The Tree of Life Home Page
  21. t2
  22. Akkadian language (Babylonian and Assyrian cuneiform texts)
  23. Index of /mail-archives/cybermind
  24. RADAR Online Magazine-Multi-lingual, Fukuoka area news
  25. The MUD Resource Collection: Research
  26. Julia!
  27. Cybersociology Mag
  28. The Perl Journal
  29. Fukuoka Suburbs
  30. Nectec FTP Archive.
  31. The Linux Documentation Project: Homepage
  32. Figlet Server
  33. Nihonjo Journal
  34. Sarasvati Sindhu civilization, language and script: Index
  35. Kyoto National Museum
  36. Fukuoka NOW!
  37. NewMedia
  38. Molecular Expressions
  39. Thunus' Home page: Linux
  40. tomsrtbt home page
  41. Phatlinux
  42. The Early History of Indo-European Languages
  43. Fukuoka Music
  44. Jargon File Resources
  45. Monochrome - Probably the UK's largest internet BBS
  46. Buddhist Studies - Art
  47. The Internet: An Ethnographic Approach
  48. Buddhist Studies WWW VL
  49. Wordlist
  50. The Middle English
  51. Cybermind
  52. Akkadian Cuneiform Test, list 1.
  53. The Internet A Writer's Guide
  54. Internet Ancient History Sourcebook: Main Page
  55. BeeHive
  56. The Early History of Data Networks
  57. Bonpo Homepage
  58. The Computer Museum History
  59. Online PDP-8 Main Page
  60. Early Recorded Sounds and Wax Cylinders
  61. Cybermind Archive Links
  62. FreeSpeech Internet Television
  63. Mailing List Archives Nettime
  64. Another Cybermind Web Page
  65. Eric Weisstein's World of Mathematics
  66. Artport Idea Line
  67. Internet Resources Meta-Index
  68. Aquatic Botany
  69. Lichens of North America
  70. INSIDE THE SKULL HOUSE - Introduction
  71. Zen Buddhism WWW Virtual Library
  72. 1911 Encyclopedia Britannica
  73. AncientScripts.com
  74. Crocodilians
  75. CDLI (Cuneiform project)
  76. BirdSource- Birding with a Purpose.
  77. List of Lists for Internet Research
  78. Gongsun Longzi
  79. BROOKLYN BOTANIC GARDEN >> NEW YORK METROPOLITAN FLORA
  80. Brainstorms
  81. Everglade Reclamation
  82. The Career Network, from The Chronicle of Higher Education
  83. CPAN (Perl modules)
  84. CORAL Reef
  85. Worldometers: Population
  86. Ancient Near East
  87. Whalesong
  88. Florida Lagoon biology
  89. Reference Library of Digitized Insect Sounds
  90. Rational Japanese: Contents
  91. Centre for European Sociology Bibliography
  92. SourceForge.net: Project of the Month
  93. Arabian Nights / Omar Khayyam
  94. Japanese Historical Maps
  95. Psychology and Aging - Featured Article
  96. Microbiology Microbes Bacteria Information and Links
  97. A Digital Base Map of the Americas
  98. Linmodem-HOWTO
  99. The Swinburne Project
  100. Pure Land Mountain
  101. Stephen Wolfram: A New Kind of Science Explorer: Mathematica Kit
  102. Matthew G. Kirschenbaum: Darknet Nostalgia
  103. Mitch Kapor's Weblog: October 2002 Archives
  104. Radical Software
  105. Welcome to ARKive
  106. REALbasic - Download.com
  107. FLAC - Free Lossless Audio Codec
  108. WTMA Wet Tropics
  109. Diana Deutsch's Web Page
  110. Spamotomy
  111. Computer Dream Survey - About
  112. chris murray's tex files
  113. Discordia || Cyborg Liberation?
  114. dichtung-digital
  115. wrytings
  116. company in space
  117. M/C Journal - Fibre
  118. Pebbles PDA Project
  119. The great Cybermind novel
  120. Computer Generated Writing
  121. Jacket 24 - Nada Gordon, in conversation with Tom Beckett
  122. BROOKLYN BOTANIC GARDEN >> Plant Records
  123. Crag Hill's poetry scorecard: November 2003 Archives
  124. Syndic8.com - Welcome!
  125. Goshiki Daruma and Color Symbols ?F??? \F?U?
  126. People Link's New World Village
  127. Fukuoka Now English News
  128. A Taste of Linux
  129. Mydoom elimination
  130. Semantic Web Research Group - OWL Site - owl.mindswap.org
  131. Cycling '74
  132. LinuxDevCenter.com: Why Run Free Software on a PDA? [Jan. 29, 2004]
  133. zaurus
  134. NRDC: Nature's Voice
  135. Crocodilian Biology Database - Crocodiles, Caimans, Alligators, Gharials
  136. Irreversibility and Heat Generation in the Computing Process
  137. The Fundamental Physical Limits of Computation
  138. CM2001 Article: Sandy Baldwin
  139. Python Programming Language
  140. Solving Cubic Equations
  141. LiveWires 2004 : Python course
  142. rowena
  143. Sakhalin Island
  144. NOVA | Secrets of the Crocodile Caves | PBS
  145. ZNet's Chomsky Archive
  146. The Art and Politics of Arthur Szyk
  147. Welcome to the Tibetan Buddhist Resource Center
  148. Droplet - Microscopy of the Protozoa
  149. NYU CAT - Technologies and Projects
  150. Vintage Calculators Web Museum
  151. GeoVRML.org
  152. Butterflies of North America
  153. Ambient Devices - Everyday Wireless Objects (Smart Personal Objects, Pervasive Computing, Ubiquitous Computing)
  154. tangible media group
  155. BABEL: A Glossary of Computer Related Abbreviations and Acronyms
  156. Textbook of Bacteriology
  157. Butterflies and Skippers of North America -
  158. Fairchild vr Herbarium
  159. world premiere: the phenomenology of the virtual
  160. Plutschow - Chinese Sacrificial Practices
  161. MeshForum
  162. Oxymorons.info - Oxymorons, Oxymoron
  163. Mathtools.net -
  164. Chinese mathematics
  165. Lewis Carroll Scrapbook Home
  166. Florian Cramer
  167. Plasma Science and Technology
  168. David Em Bio
  169. RLE :: Signals, Information, and Algorithms Laboratory
  170. ARS Electronica FESTIVAL
  171. Brooklyn Botanic Garden: New York Metropolitan Flora Project
  172. Ziff Davis Web Buyer's Guide: IT white papers, product reviews and technology buying guides.
  173. Fukuoka Now English News
  174. hamradio source ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 08:18:12 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Patrick Dillon Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <412588.89489.qm@web52401.mail.re2.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > > The chili dogs at Ben=92s Chili Bowl, overrated. Ben's, btw, is > > > The chili dogs at Ben=92s Chili Bowl, overrated. Ben's, btw, is mentioned= a > few times in a couple of the Pelecanos novels. > Ben's is famous for chili half smokes, not chili dogs (but they serve both)= . And it's obviously famous for reasons unrelated to food. On Thu, Jul 16, 2009 at 3:31 PM, steve russell wrot= e: > The chili dogs at Ben=92s Chili Bowl, overrated. Ben's, btw, is > > > The chili dogs at Ben=92s Chili Bowl, overrated. Ben's, btw, is mentioned= a > few times in a couple of the Pelecanos novels. > > --- On Tue, 7/14/09, George Bowering wrote: > > From: George Bowering > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Tuesday, July 14, 2009, 3:50 PM > > I recommend the Florida Street Cafe in DC for scrapple. > > gb > > > On Jul 14, 2009, at 3:11 AM, steve russell wrote: > > > but Pelacanos, the wire producer, writes novels. they're set in d.c. > > --- On Mon, 7/13/09, George Bowering wrote: > > > >> From: George Bowering > >> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > >> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > >> Date: Monday, July 13, 2009, 5:07 PM > >> Oh boy, Baltimore. > >> The crab cakes at the Lexington Market the best anywhere. > >> > >> gb > >> > >> > >> On Jul 13, 2009, at 11:32 AM, Mary Kasimor wrote: > >> > >>> I am a The Wire addict. It takes place in Baltimore. > >>> mary > >>> > >>> --- On Sun, 7/12/09, steve russell > >> wrote: > >>> > >>> > >>> From: steve russell > >>> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > >>> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > >>> Date: Sunday, July 12, 2009, 1:04 PM > >>> > >>> > >>> Sure, and why not throw in the Goddamn bible. I mean, > >> hell, what is the bible? Narrative? Epic poetry? I'm > >> thinking mostly of the Old Testament, of course. As > >> for "The Wire, " I'm a big fan of crime fiction, and George > >> Pelacanos is the main producer of "The Wire." Indeed, in the > >> broad sense of the term (...poet...), why not include > >> Pelacanos as a poet of the streets of Washington, D.C.? > >> Perhaps Q Taratino is the poet of video store clerks, if not > >> their saint. Why not talk about failed poets who turned to > >> fiction after their bout with poetry. Consider William > >> Faulkner. As for cartoonist, I have no problem calling E > >> Gorey, or even Mr. peanuts Schultz, a poet. Ugh, what > >> was the topic??? > >>> > >>> --- On Sat, 7/11/09, George Bowering > >> wrote: > >>> > >>> From: George Bowering > >>> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > >>> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > >>> Date: Saturday, July 11, 2009, 4:01 PM > >>> > >>> Here we go; > >>> the usual widening and widening of the topic > >>> until we can include everything, such as L'il Abner > >> and,oh, The Wire. > >>> > >>> gb > >>> > >>> > >>> On Jul 10, 2009, at 6:36 PM, Jonathan Morse wrote: > >>> > >>>> steve russell wrote: > >>>>> there are a few singular talents who've > >> managed to create 1st rate work in fiction, poetry, and > >> drama as well as the essay. Consider Denis Johnson, or Jim > >> Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. > >>>> Goethe. Rilke. Hardy. Hugo. If you'll accept > >> non-fiction, you can add Yeats and Dryden. If you count > >> letters as imaginative literature, and why shouldn't you?, > >> you can add Keats and Dickinson. Think big. > >>>> > >>>> Jonathan Morse > >>>> > >>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > >>>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not > >> accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http:// > >> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >>> > >>> George B. > >>> Author of his own misfortunes. > >>> > >>> > >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept > >> all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http:// > >> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept > >> all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http:// > >> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept > >> all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http:// > >> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >> > >> George "Whip" Bowering > >> No slugging average to speak of. > >> > >> > >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all > >> posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/ > >> poetics/welcome.html > >> > > > > > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ > > welcome.html > > George H. Bowering, OC > Dull as dishwater. > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 23:46:21 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Nicholas Piombino Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure In-Reply-To: <750841.39659.qm@web50201.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable "Opens magazine several times at the fact that poetry is at crossroads." F. Scott Fitzgerald (from "The Notebooks", in "The Crack Up", edited by Edmund Wilson)=20 On 7/16/09 6:28 PM, "Sam Truitt" wrote: > Is this thread I'm surprised not to see Laura Riding (Jackson) hasn't com= e up > - her sentiment as nailed by posthumous title THE FAILURE OF POETRY, THE > PROMISE OF LANGUAGE (ed. John Nolan) underscored by her giving up poems i= n the > late 1930's - tied to truth, to being true - but she writes someplace (he= r > essay on Stein maybe?): >=20 > =B3=8Aif poetry had all subjects taken away from it, > there was one subject of which poetry could not be deprived, namely, that > poetry had come to an end. Here was an ingenious method for indefinitely > postponing the end of poetry=8A since poetry was to write about nothing, it > could > write about everything from the standpoint of nothing; it could still hav= e its > epic without the burden of having to have convictions about it.=B2 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > ----- Original Message ---- > From: carol dorf > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 9:22:50 AM > Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure >=20 > Hard to say where one "poem" ends and the next begins. >=20 > Don't forget pleasure -- pleasure in language, pleasure in structuring th= e > "poem," referencing experience. >=20 > (Almost all of reading, for me; and a good part of my writing.) >=20 > On Wed, Jul 15, 2009 at 11:56 AM, Elizabeth Switaj wro= te: >=20 >>> Do we continue to write poetry because it ultimately fails to do what w= e >> hope it might or should? >>=20 >> That may be so for some and certainly is why I continue to write* a poem= *, >> but other than that I continue writing because those hopes shift and are >> various. >>=20 >>> Is the "failure of poetry" a failure of language, or poetics? >>=20 >> Yes. >>=20 >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guideli= nes >> & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >>=20 >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es & > sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es & > sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 11:23:16 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Sam Truitt Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "You can say anything in prose, so poetry should be reserved for saying not= hing" =0A(Khlebnikov), like the soul, lost at the xroads.=0A=0A=0A=0A----- = Original Message ----=0AFrom: Nicholas Piombino = =0ATo: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU=0ASent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 11:46:2= 1 PM=0ASubject: Re: Poetry and Failure=0A=0A"Opens magazine several times a= t the fact that poetry is at crossroads."=0A=0AF. Scott Fitzgerald (from "T= he Notebooks", in "The Crack Up", edited by=0AEdmund Wilson) =0A=0A=0AOn 7/= 16/09 6:28 PM, "Sam Truitt" wrote:=0A=0A> Is this thr= ead I'm surprised not to see Laura Riding (Jackson) hasn't come up=0A> - he= r sentiment as nailed by posthumous title THE FAILURE OF POETRY, THE=0A> PR= OMISE OF LANGUAGE (ed. John Nolan) underscored by her giving up poems in th= e=0A> late 1930's - tied to truth, to being true - but she writes someplace= (her=0A> essay on Stein maybe?):=0A> =0A> =C2=B3=C5=A0if poetry had all su= bjects taken away from it,=0A> there was one subject of which poetry could = not be deprived, namely, that=0A> poetry had come to an end. Here was an in= genious method for indefinitely=0A> postponing the end of poetry=C5=A0 sinc= e poetry was to write about nothing, it=0A> could=0A> write about everythin= g from the standpoint of nothing; it could still have its=0A> epic without = the burden of having to have convictions about it.=C2=B2=0A> =0A> =0A> =0A>= =0A> ----- Original Message ----=0A> From: carol dorf =0A> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU=0A> Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 9= :22:50 AM=0A> Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure=0A> =0A> Hard to say where on= e "poem" ends and the next begins.=0A> =0A> Don't forget pleasure -- pleasu= re in language, pleasure in structuring the=0A> "poem," referencing experie= nce.=0A> =0A> (Almost all of reading, for me; and a good part of my writing= .)=0A> =0A> On Wed, Jul 15, 2009 at 11:56 AM, Elizabeth Switaj wrote:=0A> =0A>>> Do we continue to write poetry because it ultimate= ly fails to do what we=0A>> hope it might or should?=0A>> =0A>> That may be= so for some and certainly is why I continue to write* a poem*,=0A>> but ot= her than that I continue writing because those hopes shift and are=0A>> var= ious.=0A>> =0A>>> Is the "failure of poetry" a failure of language, or poet= ics?=0A>> =0A>> Yes.=0A>> =0A>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A>> The Poeti= cs List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines=0A>> & s= ub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=0A>> =0A> =0A> = =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A> The Poetics List is moderated & does not ac= cept all posts. Check guidelines &=0A> sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.e= du/poetics/welcome.html=0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=0A> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check= guidelines &=0A> sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.ht= ml=0A=0A=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0AThe Poetics List is moderated & does= not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffal= o.edu/poetics/welcome.html=0A=0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 13:26:55 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: mIEKAL aND Subject: Palindrome for David Bromige Comments: To: Theory and Writing , ubuweb@yahoogroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v935.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit (In the middle of reshelving some old mags I found this inside a copy of the David Bromige issue of The Difficulties, edited by Tom Beckett) Debut brag sore tip radar nod. Dad dotes mile van. Edit non word team nor page look cuckoo beer tred. No, who read set in bards evil kook lives drab nites. Dear oh wonder tree book. Cuckoo leg apron meat. Drown on tide. Navel, I'm set odd, add on radar pit. Eros garb tubed. ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 12:19:21 -0600 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Emily Carr Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, Michael. Tthese are interesting questions. Though I also wonder why we apply terms like *success* & *failure* to poetry, & when we do so who is speaking to & for whom & whether, in defining these terms, we are thinking about intent or affect or a combination of the two or perhaps even a third, more useful term. There are so many approaches to the notion of failure in poetry, & (surely this is why you've asked) Christian's is only one. I've begun to think through my own at the Toadlily Press Blog, if you are interested: http://toadlilypress.com/toadlily-blog/. Cheers, Emily On Thu, Jul 16, 2009 at 4:28 PM, Sam Truitt wrote: Is this thread I'm surprised not to see Laura Riding (Jackson) hasn't come up - her sentiment as nailed by posthumous title THE FAILURE OF POETRY, THE PROMISE OF LANGUAGE (ed. John Nolan) underscored by her giving up poems in the late 1930's - tied to truth, to being true - but she writes someplace (her essay on Stein maybe?): =93=85if poetry had all subjects taken away from it, there was one subject of which poetry could not be deprived, namely, that poetry had come to an end. Here was an ingenious method for indefinitely postponing the end of poetry=85 since poetry was to write about nothing, it= could write about everything from the standpoint of nothing; it could still have = its epic without the burden of having to have convictions about it.=94 ----- Original Message ---- From: carol dorf To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 9:22:50 AM Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure Hard to say where one "poem" ends and the next begins. Don't forget pleasure -- pleasure in language, pleasure in structuring the "poem," referencing experience. (Almost all of reading, for me; and a good part of my writing.) On Wed, Jul 15, 2009 at 11:56 AM, Elizabeth Switaj wrote= : > > Do we continue to write poetry because it ultimately fails to do what w= e > hope it might or should? > > That may be so for some and certainly is why I continue to write* a poem*= , > but other than that I continue writing because those hopes shift and are > various. > > >Is the "failure of poetry" a failure of language, or poetics? > > Yes. > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 11:47:41 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: amy king Subject: Tough economy - insight? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I've got a few friends -- poet friends -- who have recently suffered the "l= ay off" axe.=A0 While I suspect this axe is wielded to make more profits fo= r stockholders and management (didn't JP Morgan just pull in a huge unpredi= cted spike in profit this quarter?), I know the concrete reality is that my= friends are suffering and may for some time to come.=A0 Profit increases a= re fun to brag about and buy yachts with, but finding enough cash to feed t= he landlord isn't so pleasant.=A0=20 So I'm asking:=A0 what would you do?=A0 Any job insight advice?=A0 What wor= k/markets are still available to these poets, many with college degrees?=A0= Where do you seek listings friendly to the poetically-inclined?=A0 Know of= any work available in NY?=A0 (Feel free to backchannel on that last questi= on, for I have some astute poet friends ready, smart, and quite able) Just wondering.=A0 And if you have any stories -- inspiring or otherwise --= please do share~ Thanks, Amy =A0 _______ =0A =0A =0AAmy's Alias =0Ahttp://amyking.org/=0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 11:53:40 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Mary Kasimor Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Yes, I agree. And some of my best poems have been unexpected "works of geni= us." I love writing and finding the unexpected as I wrte. If it is too easy= to write, it's not half as much fun. =A0 Mary --- On Thu, 7/16/09, steve russell wrote: From: steve russell Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Thursday, July 16, 2009, 7:44 PM too many people forget pleasure. sure, poetry is hard work, but sweating ou= t a poem is still fun. a big disappointment if the poem is a complete failu= re, but fun almost always happens at some point during the shaping, & consi= dering the $$$$ rewards, who'd write the stuff if this were not the case?= =20 --- On Thu, 7/16/09, carol dorf wrote: From: carol dorf Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Thursday, July 16, 2009, 9:22 AM Hard to say where one "poem" ends and the next begins. Don't forget pleasure -- pleasure in language, pleasure in structuring the "poem," referencing experience. (Almost all of reading, for me; and a good part of my writing.) On Wed, Jul 15, 2009 at 11:56 AM, Elizabeth Switaj wrote= : > > Do we continue to write poetry because it ultimately fails to do what w= e > hope it might or should? > > That may be so for some and certainly is why I continue to write* a poem*= , > but other than that I continue writing because those hopes shift and are > various. > > >Is the "failure of poetry" a failure of language, or poetics? > > Yes. > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =A0 =A0 =A0=20 =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 11:56:12 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Mary Kasimor Subject: Re: Tough economy - insight? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable My understanding is that colleges and universities are doing well during th= e bad economy. If your friends have MA's or MFA's, I suggest that they talk= to the chairs in the English or other departments that they are qualified = to teach in.=20 --- On Fri, 7/17/09, amy king wrote: From: amy king Subject: Tough economy - insight? To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Friday, July 17, 2009, 1:47 PM I've got a few friends -- poet friends -- who have recently suffered the "l= ay off" axe.=A0 While I suspect this axe is wielded to make more profits fo= r stockholders and management (didn't JP Morgan just pull in a huge unpredi= cted spike in profit this quarter?), I know the concrete reality is that my= friends are suffering and may for some time to come.=A0 Profit increases a= re fun to brag about and buy yachts with, but finding enough cash to feed t= he landlord isn't so pleasant.=A0=20 So I'm asking:=A0 what would you do?=A0 Any job insight advice?=A0 What wor= k/markets are still available to these poets, many with college degrees?=A0= Where do you seek listings friendly to the poetically-inclined?=A0 Know of= any work available in NY?=A0 (Feel free to backchannel on that last questi= on, for I have some astute poet friends ready, smart, and quite able) Just wondering.=A0 And if you have any stories -- inspiring or otherwise --= please do share~ Thanks, Amy =A0 _______ Amy's Alias http://amyking.org/ =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 14:01:38 -0500 Reply-To: dgodston@gmail.com Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Daniel Godston Organization: Borderbend Arts Collective Subject: Bauhaus9090 updates MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit "The Bauhaus: 90 Years / 90 Days" is a new project which commemorates the 90th anniversary of the Bauhaus. Every day during this 90-day project (from July 6 till October 3), a project happens which creatively plays around with and pays homage to an aspect of the Bauhaus. Examples of those projects might include a dance performance inspired by Oskar Schlemmer's ballet, a musical performance that uses a Kandinsky painting as a graphic score, a fiber art project inspired by Anni Albers' work, a poem inspired by Walter Gropius' architecture, a short story inspired by Marianne Brandt's work, an essay reflecting on an aspect of the Bauhaus movement, and so on. You are invited to visit "The Bauhaus: 90 Years / 90 Days" website (www.bauhaus9090.org). You can register on the site and join the forums, and there are other features too. Here are some updates -- PROJECTS "The Twittering Machine," a poem by Alice Shapiro "Composition for Josef Albers," a painting by Tony Renner "FORM FOLLOW FUNCTION," a poem by Charlie Newman "Some Knowledge of Schlemmer Is Required," a machinima by Patrick Lichty "Up / Down," a poem by Jamie Kazay "Influence in Time," a painting by Jeremy Hight "Inutil Paisagem," a poem by Matthew S. Barton "Working Class History and the Institute of Design," an essay with photos by Janina Ciezadlo "BauHouse," a poem by Cathleen Schandelmeier "Littlehampton's Lobsters," a community art project in Littlehampton, West Sussex, UK "The Anagrammed Bauhaus," a poem by Dave Morice EVENTS "Laszlo Moholy-Nagy Birthday Celebration" (Monday, July 20) "Chicago Bauhaus in July" (Saturday, July 25) "The Bauhaus: 90 Years / 90 Days" is being organized by the Borderbend Arts Collective and the Gropius in Chicago Coalition. ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 19:09:30 +0000 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: cranesbill@COMCAST.NET Subject: Re: Palindrome for David Bromige In-Reply-To: <4BBBB2CE-B8A2-4D9B-801A-870001A7C6E0@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This is lovely! Thanks for posting it.=20 David Benedetti has a fat three-ring binder overflowing with palindromes. A= pparently it's his main project.=20 J. A. Lee=20 ----- Original Message -----=20 From: "mIEKAL aND" =20 To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU=20 Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 12:26:55 PM GMT -07:00 US/Canada Mountain=20 Subject: Palindrome for David Bromige=20 (In the middle of reshelving some old mags I found this inside a copy =C2= =A0=20 of the David Bromige issue of The Difficulties, edited by Tom Beckett)=20 Debut brag sore tip radar nod. =C2=A0Dad dotes mile van. =C2=A0Edit non wor= d =C2=A0=20 team nor page look cuckoo beer tred. =C2=A0No, who read set in bards evil = =C2=A0=20 kook lives drab nites. =C2=A0Dear oh wonder tree book. =C2=A0Cuckoo leg apr= on =C2=A0=20 meat. =C2=A0Drown on tide. =C2=A0Navel, I'm set odd, add on radar pit. =C2= =A0Eros =C2=A0=20 garb tubed.=20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=20 The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 15:33:44 -0500 Reply-To: halvard@gmail.com Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Halvard Johnson Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure In-Reply-To: <243116.10110.qm@web50210.mail.re2.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "I have nothing to say and am saying it, and that is poetry." --John Cage (more or less) Hal "A paranoid is someone who knows a little of what's going on." --William S. Burroughs Halvard Johnson =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D halvard@gmail.com http://sites.google.com/site/halvardjohnson/Home http://entropyandme.blogspot.com http://imageswithoutwords.blogspot.com http://www.hamiltonstone.org On Fri, Jul 17, 2009 at 1:23 PM, Sam Truitt wrote: > "You can say anything in prose, so poetry should be reserved for saying > nothing" > (Khlebnikov), like the soul, lost at the xroads. > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Nicholas Piombino > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 11:46:21 PM > Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure > > "Opens magazine several times at the fact that poetry is at crossroads." > > F. Scott Fitzgerald (from "The Notebooks", in "The Crack Up", edited by > Edmund Wilson) > > > On 7/16/09 6:28 PM, "Sam Truitt" wrote: > > > Is this thread I'm surprised not to see Laura Riding (Jackson) hasn't > come up > > - her sentiment as nailed by posthumous title THE FAILURE OF POETRY, TH= E > > PROMISE OF LANGUAGE (ed. John Nolan) underscored by her giving up poems > in the > > late 1930's - tied to truth, to being true - but she writes someplace > (her > > essay on Stein maybe?): > > > > =C2=B3=C5=A0if poetry had all subjects taken away from it, > > there was one subject of which poetry could not be deprived, namely, th= at > > poetry had come to an end. Here was an ingenious method for indefinitel= y > > postponing the end of poetry=C5=A0 since poetry was to write about noth= ing, it > > could > > write about everything from the standpoint of nothing; it could still > have its > > epic without the burden of having to have convictions about it.=C2=B2 > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: carol dorf > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 9:22:50 AM > > Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure > > > > Hard to say where one "poem" ends and the next begins. > > > > Don't forget pleasure -- pleasure in language, pleasure in structuring > the > > "poem," referencing experience. > > > > (Almost all of reading, for me; and a good part of my writing.) > > > > On Wed, Jul 15, 2009 at 11:56 AM, Elizabeth Switaj > wrote: > > > >>> Do we continue to write poetry because it ultimately fails to do what > we > >> hope it might or should? > >> > >> That may be so for some and certainly is why I continue to write* a > poem*, > >> but other than that I continue writing because those hopes shift and a= re > >> various. > >> > >>> Is the "failure of poetry" a failure of language, or poetics? > >> > >> Yes. > >> > >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines > >> & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >> > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & > > sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & > > sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 16:55:16 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve russell Subject: Re: Tough economy - insight? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable i can think of jobs, not careers, that would be available since what applie= s in d.c. should also apply in NY. your friends could supplement their inco= me with courier work or catering work. after 9/11, courier work has shrunk,= but there's still plenty or work available, even part-time work. & the sam= e holds true of catering. Still, few people are willing to make either of t= hese options into careers. but during tough times ... --- On Fri, 7/17/09, amy king wrote: > From: amy king > Subject: Tough economy - insight? > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Friday, July 17, 2009, 2:47 PM > I've got a few friends -- poet > friends -- who have recently suffered the "lay off" axe.=A0 > While I suspect this axe is wielded to make more profits for > stockholders and management (didn't JP Morgan just pull in a > huge unpredicted spike in profit this quarter?), I know the > concrete reality is that my friends are suffering and may > for some time to come.=A0 Profit increases are fun to brag > about and buy yachts with, but finding enough cash to feed > the landlord isn't so pleasant.=A0=20 >=20 > So I'm asking:=A0 what would you do?=A0 Any job insight > advice?=A0 What work/markets are still available to these > poets, many with college degrees?=A0 Where do you seek > listings friendly to the poetically-inclined?=A0 Know of any > work available in NY?=A0 (Feel free to backchannel on that > last question, for I have some astute poet friends ready, > smart, and quite able) >=20 > Just wondering.=A0 And if you have any stories -- inspiring > or otherwise -- please do share~ >=20 > Thanks, >=20 > Amy > =A0 >=20 > _______ >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > Amy's Alias >=20 > http://amyking.org/ >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all > posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/= welcome.html > =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 18:20:32 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve russell Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable who complained about the usual widening/widening of the topic? Writing fict= ion/poetry, the bible,=C2=A0 and now chili half/smokes. jeez --- On Fri, 7/17/09, Patrick Dillon wrote: From: Patrick Dillon Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Friday, July 17, 2009, 9:18 AM > > The chili dogs at Ben=E2=80=99s Chili Bowl, overrated. Ben's, btw, is > > > The chili dogs at Ben=E2=80=99s Chili Bowl, overrated. Ben's, btw, is men= tioned a > few times in a couple of the Pelecanos novels. > Ben's is famous for chili half smokes, not chili dogs (but they serve both)= . And it's obviously famous for reasons unrelated to food. On Thu, Jul 16, 2009 at 3:31 PM, steve russell wrot= e: > The chili dogs at Ben=E2=80=99s Chili Bowl, overrated. Ben's, btw, is > > > The chili dogs at Ben=E2=80=99s Chili Bowl, overrated. Ben's, btw, is men= tioned a > few times in a couple of the Pelecanos novels. > > --- On Tue, 7/14/09, George Bowering wrote: > > From: George Bowering > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Tuesday, July 14, 2009, 3:50 PM > > I recommend the Florida Street Cafe in DC for scrapple. > > gb > > > On Jul 14, 2009, at 3:11 AM, steve russell wrote: > > >=C2=A0 but Pelacanos, the wire producer,=C2=A0 writes novels. they're se= t in d.c. > > --- On Mon, 7/13/09, George Bowering wrote: > > > >> From: George Bowering > >> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > >> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > >> Date: Monday, July 13, 2009, 5:07 PM > >> Oh boy, Baltimore. > >> The crab cakes at the Lexington Market the best anywhere. > >> > >> gb > >> > >> > >> On Jul 13, 2009, at 11:32 AM, Mary Kasimor wrote: > >> > >>> I am a The Wire addict. It takes place in Baltimore. > >>> mary > >>> > >>> --- On Sun, 7/12/09, steve russell > >> wrote: > >>> > >>> > >>> From: steve russell > >>> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > >>> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > >>> Date: Sunday, July 12, 2009, 1:04 PM > >>> > >>> > >>> Sure, and why not throw in the Goddamn bible. I mean, > >> hell, what is the bible? Narrative? Epic poetry? I'm > >> thinking mostly of the Old Testament, of course.=C2=A0 As > >> for "The Wire, " I'm a big fan of crime fiction, and George > >> Pelacanos is the main producer of "The Wire." Indeed, in the > >> broad sense of the term (...poet...), why not include > >> Pelacanos as a poet of the streets of Washington, D.C.? > >> Perhaps Q Taratino is the poet of video store clerks, if not > >> their saint. Why not talk about failed poets who turned to > >> fiction after their bout with poetry. Consider William > >> Faulkner. As for cartoonist, I have no problem calling E > >> Gorey, or even=C2=A0 Mr. peanuts Schultz, a poet. Ugh, what > >> was the topic??? > >>> > >>> --- On Sat, 7/11/09, George Bowering > >> wrote: > >>> > >>> From: George Bowering > >>> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > >>> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > >>> Date: Saturday, July 11, 2009, 4:01 PM > >>> > >>> Here we go; > >>> the usual widening and widening of the topic > >>> until we can include everything, such as L'il Abner > >> and,oh, The Wire. > >>> > >>> gb > >>> > >>> > >>> On Jul 10, 2009, at 6:36 PM, Jonathan Morse wrote: > >>> > >>>> steve russell wrote: > >>>>> there are a few singular talents who've > >> managed to create 1st rate work in fiction, poetry, and > >> drama as well as the essay. Consider Denis Johnson, or Jim > >> Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. > >>>> Goethe. Rilke. Hardy. Hugo. If you'll accept > >> non-fiction, you can add Yeats and Dryden. If you count > >> letters as imaginative literature, and why shouldn't you?, > >> you can add Keats and Dickinson. Think big. > >>>> > >>>> Jonathan Morse > >>>> > >>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > >>>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not > >> accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http:// > >> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >>> > >>> George B. > >>> Author of his own misfortunes. > >>> > >>> > >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept > >> all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http:// > >> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept > >> all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http:// > >> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept > >> all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http:// > >> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >> > >> George "Whip" Bowering > >> No slugging average to speak of. > >> > >> > >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all > >> posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/ > >> poetics/welcome.html > >> > > > > > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ > > welcome.html > > George H. Bowering, OC > Dull as dishwater. > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 18:31:10 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Stephen Vincent Subject: Paris places to stay??? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii We're going to Paris for 10 days in September. If you know of such, I will much appreciate any good suggestions on a nice place (affordable) to stay that is 'central'. I will take any suggestions b/c. Thank you, Stephen Vincent http://stephenvincent.net/blog/ ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 15:44:16 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: mIEKAL aND Subject: Fwd: poets barred Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v935.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Apparently UK is starting to adopt US-style profiling in the name of terrorism... Begin forwarded message: > From: GILES GOODLAND > Date: July 17, 2009 1:39:56 PM CDT > To: BRITISH-IRISH-POETS@JISCMAIL.AC.UK > Subject: poets barred > Reply-To: British & Irish poets > > This made me cross, and want to cry: > > > http://www.ledburyreporter.co.uk/news/4498396.Top_poets_denied_entry_to_UK_for_festival/ ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 11:33:41 +1000 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Alison Croggon Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I like Giacometti on this - one of my signal quotations: "Success, failure, they are both secondary" On Sat, Jul 18, 2009 at 4:19 AM, Emily Carr wrote: > Hi, Michael. Tthese are interesting questions. Though I also wonder > why we apply terms like *success* & *failure* to poetry, & when we do > so who is speaking to & for whom & whether, in defining these terms, > we are thinking about intent or affect or a combination of the two or > perhaps even a third, more useful term. There are so many approaches > to the notion of failure in poetry, & (surely this is why you've > asked) Christian's is only one. I've begun to think through my own at > the Toadlily Press Blog, if you are interested: > > http://toadlilypress.com/toadlily-blog/. > > Cheers, > Emily > > > > On Thu, Jul 16, 2009 at 4:28 PM, Sam Truitt wrote: > > Is this thread I'm surprised not to see Laura Riding (Jackson) hasn't > come up - her sentiment as nailed by posthumous title THE FAILURE OF > POETRY, THE PROMISE OF LANGUAGE (ed. John Nolan) underscored by her > giving up poems in the late 1930's - tied to truth, to being true - > but she writes someplace (her essay on Stein maybe?): > > =93=85if poetry had all subjects taken away from it, > there was one subject of which poetry could not be deprived, namely, that > poetry had come to an end. Here was an ingenious method for indefinitely > postponing the end of poetry=85 since poetry was to write about nothing, = it could > write about everything from the standpoint of nothing; it could still hav= e its > epic without the burden of having to have convictions about it.=94 > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: carol dorf > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 9:22:50 AM > Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure > > Hard to say where one "poem" ends and the next begins. > > Don't forget pleasure -- pleasure in language, pleasure in structuring th= e > "poem," referencing experience. > > (Almost all of reading, for me; and a good part of my writing.) > > On Wed, Jul 15, 2009 at 11:56 AM, Elizabeth Switaj wro= te: > >> > Do we continue to write poetry because it ultimately fails to do what = we >> hope it might or should? >> >> That may be so for some and certainly is why I continue to write* a poem= *, >> but other than that I continue writing because those hopes shift and are >> various. >> >> >Is the "failure of poetry" a failure of language, or poetics? >> >> Yes. >> >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guideli= nes >> & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >> > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > --=20 Editor, Masthead: http://www.masthead.net.au Blog: http://theatrenotes.blogspot.com Home page: http://www.alisoncroggon.com =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 10:51:10 -0400 Reply-To: az421@FreeNet.Carleton.CA Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Rob McLennan Subject: 12 or 20 questions with Kevin Killian here: http://robmclennan.blogspot.com/2009/07/12-or-20-questions-with-kevin-killian.html rob -- writer/editor/publisher ...STANZAS mag, above/ground press & Chaudiere Books (www.chaudierebooks.com) ...coord.,SPAN-O + ottawa small press fair ...14th poetry coll'n - gifts (Talon) ...2nd novel - missing persons www.abovegroundpress.blogspot.com * http://robmclennan.blogspot.com/ ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 16:01:01 +0000 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Cindy King Subject: Eat Fresh: Joy Harjo for Subway In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Six inch=2C anyone?=20 =20 http://fittoboom.msnbc.msn.com/?source=3Dmsn>1=3D25054#/home/video/10/0 _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live=99 Hotmail=AE: Search=2C add=2C and share the web=92s latest s= ports videos. Check it out. http://www.windowslive.com/Online/Hotmail/Campaign/QuickAdd?ocid=3DTXT_TAGL= M_WL_QA_HM_sports_videos_072009&cat=3Dsports= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 12:25:12 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: amy king Subject: Re: Eat Fresh: Joy Harjo for Subway In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Cool story (sans the sub part, perhaps)! Amy _______ Amy's Alias http://amyking.org/ --- On Sat, 7/18/09, Cindy King wrote: Six inch, anyone? http://fittoboom.msnbc.msn.com/?source=msn>1=25054#/home/video/10/0 ___________________________________________________________ ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 09:53:19 -1000 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jonathan Morse Subject: Re: Tough economy - insight? In-Reply-To: <752880.8505.qm@web51805.mail.re2.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mary Kasimor wrote: > My understanding is that colleges and universities are doing well during the bad economy. Ye gods, Mary. No they aren't. Subscribe (free) to http://www.insidehighered.com to learn how misinformed you've been. Jonathan Morse University of Hawaii ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 13:23:29 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: George Bowering Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... In-Reply-To: <79958.58524.qm@web52407.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v753.1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes; format=flowed I used to think that the chili at Tim Hortons is pretty good, but you get tired of it soon. gb On Jul 17, 2009, at 6:20 PM, steve russell wrote: > who complained about the usual widening/widening of the topic? =20 > Writing fiction/poetry, the bible, and now chili half/smokes. jeez > > --- On Fri, 7/17/09, Patrick Dillon wrote: > > From: Patrick Dillon > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Friday, July 17, 2009, 9:18 AM > >> >> The chili dogs at Ben=92s Chili Bowl, overrated. Ben's, btw, is >> >> >> The chili dogs at Ben=92s Chili Bowl, overrated. Ben's, btw, is =20 >> mentioned a >> few times in a couple of the Pelecanos novels. >> > > Ben's is famous for chili half smokes, not chili dogs (but they =20 > serve both). > And it's obviously famous for reasons unrelated to food. > > > > On Thu, Jul 16, 2009 at 3:31 PM, steve russell =20 > wrote: > >> The chili dogs at Ben=92s Chili Bowl, overrated. Ben's, btw, is >> >> >> The chili dogs at Ben=92s Chili Bowl, overrated. Ben's, btw, is =20 >> mentioned a >> few times in a couple of the Pelecanos novels. >> >> --- On Tue, 7/14/09, George Bowering wrote: >> >> From: George Bowering >> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... >> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >> Date: Tuesday, July 14, 2009, 3:50 PM >> >> I recommend the Florida Street Cafe in DC for scrapple. >> >> gb >> >> >> On Jul 14, 2009, at 3:11 AM, steve russell wrote: >> >>> but Pelacanos, the wire producer, writes novels. they're set =20 >>> in d.c. >>> --- On Mon, 7/13/09, George Bowering wrote: >>> >>>> From: George Bowering >>>> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... >>>> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >>>> Date: Monday, July 13, 2009, 5:07 PM >>>> Oh boy, Baltimore. >>>> The crab cakes at the Lexington Market the best anywhere. >>>> >>>> gb >>>> >>>> >>>> On Jul 13, 2009, at 11:32 AM, Mary Kasimor wrote: >>>> >>>>> I am a The Wire addict. It takes place in Baltimore. >>>>> mary >>>>> >>>>> --- On Sun, 7/12/09, steve russell >>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> From: steve russell >>>>> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... >>>>> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >>>>> Date: Sunday, July 12, 2009, 1:04 PM >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Sure, and why not throw in the Goddamn bible. I mean, >>>> hell, what is the bible? Narrative? Epic poetry? I'm >>>> thinking mostly of the Old Testament, of course. As >>>> for "The Wire, " I'm a big fan of crime fiction, and George >>>> Pelacanos is the main producer of "The Wire." Indeed, in the >>>> broad sense of the term (...poet...), why not include >>>> Pelacanos as a poet of the streets of Washington, D.C.? >>>> Perhaps Q Taratino is the poet of video store clerks, if not >>>> their saint. Why not talk about failed poets who turned to >>>> fiction after their bout with poetry. Consider William >>>> Faulkner. As for cartoonist, I have no problem calling E >>>> Gorey, or even Mr. peanuts Schultz, a poet. Ugh, what >>>> was the topic??? >>>>> >>>>> --- On Sat, 7/11/09, George Bowering >>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> From: George Bowering >>>>> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... >>>>> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >>>>> Date: Saturday, July 11, 2009, 4:01 PM >>>>> >>>>> Here we go; >>>>> the usual widening and widening of the topic >>>>> until we can include everything, such as L'il Abner >>>> and,oh, The Wire. >>>>> >>>>> gb >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Jul 10, 2009, at 6:36 PM, Jonathan Morse wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> steve russell wrote: >>>>>>> there are a few singular talents who've >>>> managed to create 1st rate work in fiction, poetry, and >>>> drama as well as the essay. Consider Denis Johnson, or Jim >>>> Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. >>>>>> Goethe. Rilke. Hardy. Hugo. If you'll accept >>>> non-fiction, you can add Yeats and Dryden. If you count >>>> letters as imaginative literature, and why shouldn't you?, >>>> you can add Keats and Dickinson. Think big. >>>>>> >>>>>> Jonathan Morse >>>>>> >>>>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>>>>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not >>>> accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http:// >>>> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >>>>> >>>>> George B. >>>>> Author of his own misfortunes. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>>>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept >>>> all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http:// >>>> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>>>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept >>>> all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http:// >>>> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>>>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept >>>> all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http:// >>>> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >>>> >>>> George "Whip" Bowering >>>> No slugging average to speak of. >>>> >>>> >>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all >>>> posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/ >>>> poetics/welcome.html >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >>> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ >>> welcome.html >> >> George H. Bowering, OC >> Dull as dishwater. >> >> >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 >> guidelines >> & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >> >> >> >> >> >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 >> guidelines >> & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >> > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 > welcome.html > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check =20 > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 > welcome.html GB Under electronic surveillance. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 22:32:57 +0530 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve dalachinsky Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit since so many "insiders" strive so hard to be outsiders these days i guess failure in poetry "world "may be considered a plus (HA) tho most that consider themselves outsider who are insiders are both successful in their work and their career tho nothin ever seems enough On Sat, 18 Jul 2009 11:33:41 +1000 Alison Croggon writes: > I like Giacometti on this - one of my signal quotations: "Success, > failure, they are both secondary" > > On Sat, Jul 18, 2009 at 4:19 AM, Emily Carr > wrote: > > Hi, Michael. Tthese are interesting questions. Though I also > wonder > > why we apply terms like *success* & *failure* to poetry, & when we > do > > so who is speaking to & for whom & whether, in defining these > terms, > > we are thinking about intent or affect or a combination of the two > or > > perhaps even a third, more useful term. There are so many > approaches > > to the notion of failure in poetry, & (surely this is why you've > > asked) Christian's is only one. I've begun to think through my own > at > > the Toadlily Press Blog, if you are interested: > > > > http://toadlilypress.com/toadlily-blog/. > > > > Cheers, > > Emily > > > > > > > > On Thu, Jul 16, 2009 at 4:28 PM, Sam Truitt > wrote: > > > > Is this thread I'm surprised not to see Laura Riding (Jackson) > hasn't > > come up - her sentiment as nailed by posthumous title THE FAILURE > OF > > POETRY, THE PROMISE OF LANGUAGE (ed. John Nolan) underscored by > her > > giving up poems in the late 1930's - tied to truth, to being true > - > > but she writes someplace (her essay on Stein maybe?): > > > > “…if poetry had all subjects taken away from it, > > there was one subject of which poetry could not be deprived, > namely, that > > poetry had come to an end. Here was an ingenious method for > indefinitely > > postponing the end of poetry… since poetry was to write about > nothing, it could > > write about everything from the standpoint of nothing; it could > still have its > > epic without the burden of having to have convictions about it.” > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: carol dorf > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 9:22:50 AM > > Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure > > > > Hard to say where one "poem" ends and the next begins. > > > > Don't forget pleasure -- pleasure in language, pleasure in > structuring the > > "poem," referencing experience. > > > > (Almost all of reading, for me; and a good part of my writing.) > > > > On Wed, Jul 15, 2009 at 11:56 AM, Elizabeth Switaj > wrote: > > > >> > Do we continue to write poetry because it ultimately fails to > do what we > >> hope it might or should? > >> > >> That may be so for some and certainly is why I continue to write* > a poem*, > >> but other than that I continue writing because those hopes shift > and are > >> various. > >> > >> >Is the "failure of poetry" a failure of language, or poetics? > >> > >> Yes. > >> > >> ================================== > >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines > >> & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >> > > > > ================================== > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > > > > > > > ================================== > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > ================================== > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > -- > Editor, Masthead: http://www.masthead.net.au > Blog: http://theatrenotes.blogspot.com > Home page: http://www.alisoncroggon.com > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 23:04:41 +0530 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve dalachinsky Subject: Re: A widespread, high-spirited head rush MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit you saw rashied with ayler i'll ask him what dya mean ya din't know he did concerts? semantics he did a gig 3 sets is that better usage of lingo? On Fri, 17 Jul 2009 00:47:03 -0700 George Bowering writes: > I love Rashied Ali. My favourite drummer. > I heard him with the Aylers around 1967 > ]and I heard him in Vancouver last year. > I didn't know he did concerts, though. > > gb > > > On Jul 16, 2009, at 3:23 AM, steve dalachinsky wrote: > > > rashied ali quintet last nite > > tonite kronos qt > > i go to almost 1 or 2 a nite > > On Thu, 16 Jul 2009 00:11:22 -0700 George Bowering > > > writes: > >> On Jul 15, 2009, at 6:24 PM, Paul Siegell wrote: > >> > >>> Hi, > >>> > >>> What was the last concert you went to? > >> > >> I guess it was the Vancouver Symphony Orchestra doing > Beethoven's > >> Ninth > >> and other stuff about 18 months ago. > >> > >> gb > >> > >> ================================== > >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: > >> http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >> > >> > > > > > > ================================== > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > > > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ > > welcome.html > > Geo. H. Bowering > Adaptable yet reliable. > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 11:52:28 -0500 Reply-To: dgodston@gmail.com Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Daniel Godston Organization: Borderbend Arts Collective Subject: Moholy-Nagy birthday celebration MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The great artist Laszlo Moholy-Nagy was born on July 20, 1895. You are invited to join us, as we celebrate Moholy-Nagy's birthday at Brown Rice -- screening of Moholy-Nagy's "Lobsters" & discussion of "Littlehampton's Lobsters" Janina Ciezadlo reads part of "The Truth to Materials," her essay about the Bauhaus. performance of "Moholy #2" (composition by Guillermo Gregorio) Guillermo Gregorio -- clarinet & saxophone Christopher Preissing -- flute Dan Godston -- trumpet & small instruments Alex Wing -- upright bass Joshua Manchester -- percussion Brown Rice 4432 N. Kedzie Ave., 1st floor Chicago, IL 60625 9 p.m. starting time. Doors open one half hour before performance time, all ages. Brown Rice is a half block north of the Montrose / Kedzie intersection, close to the Kedzie station on the CTA brown line. The entrance is below a sign that reads "Perfect." Please call 312.543.7027 for more info. http://www.brownricemusic.org http://www.bauhaus9090.org http://www.moholy-nagy.org http://www.epitonic.com/artists/guillermogregorio.html http://www.notations21.net/viewscores.html http://www.myspace.com/auristrio http://www.myspace.com/alexwing http://www.joshuamanchester.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 14:37:18 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: CA Conrad Subject: Giovanni's Room Bookstore VERY IMPORTANT PLEASE READ! HELP IS NEEDED! MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This post with photos and links is also at PhillySound: http://phillysound.blogspot.com/2009_07_01_archive.html Giovanni's Room 345 South 12th St. (corner of 12th & Pine Sts.) Philadelphia, PA 19107 215/923-2960 giovannis_room@verizon.net http://www.queerbooks.com GIOVANNI'S ROOM BOOKSTORE in Philadelphia is the world's largest Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Transgendered, Feminist bookstore. The catalog of titles it holds for us is staggering, and no where in any brick and mortar store, independent or corporate, can we find all these titles together to browse whenever we want, to purchase whenever we want. I worked at the store for nearly 7 years, and its importance for LGBT and feminist readers around the world was something I felt, and took seriously when it was felt. While independent bookstores have been disappearing, none have been disappearing as quickly as queer/feminist bookstores. Corporate bookstores WILL NOT carry ALL these titles for you to discover. I remember a woman coming into the store who was 78 years old, and had been married, had children, and was now wanting to come out of the closet. The Coming Out section of books is unlike any other in the world, and I also showed her the video NITRATE KISSES. I forget what she purchased, but I remember feeling, truly feeling the importance of Giovanni's Room Bookstore at helping create a place for this woman who was older than my grandmothers. The store has survived MANY tough times, including bricks being thrown through the windows. The bricks from these hate crimes now line the owner's garden. Edwin Hermance, Skip, and all their amazing staff and volunteers are facing an enormous crisis. Major reconstruction is about to take place on the store's one wall, and it will cost A LOT of money. Edwin and Skip and all the staff want you to PLEASE shop at the store to help them in this time of need. IF THERE ARE BOOKS YOU WANT but cannot find, they WILL order them for you. Below is a note from Edwin Hermance with many more details. Please shop at Giovanni's Room, for all our sake! CAConrad ------------- from Edwin Hermance, owner of Giovanni's Room Bookstore Giovanni's Room, the oldest independent LGBT bookstore in the United States today, needs your help and support to survive. Our 12th St. wall, which is structurally unsound, must be taken down and rebuilt from the ground up; construction will begin by sometime in August. The cost of this renovation, roughly $50,000, will not be easily paid; independent bookstores, lgbt bookstores included, have never been that profitable. Our store's success is measured by the people Giovanni's Room has helped in an almost limitless number of ways and by the exposure we have given to authors and publishers, filmmakers and musicians. This will be a delicate time in the store's history. We need your support more than ever, and the store will remain open during the construction. Here is what we are asking you to do: *Continue to shop at Giovanni's Room despite the challenges. *Order in person, online, by email, and by phone. *Show your support! We have often faced adversity. In the beginning, in 1973, we had hardly any books to sell and the store was staffed 100% by volunteers. When homophobic landlords evicted us from the Spruce Street location and no one, on a major street, would rent to Giovanni's Room, we were able to raise the down payment for the current location by borrowing from you, our customers. Over 100 volunteers helped renovate the building to make the beautiful space we have occupied since 1979. Now, at this defining juncture, we have formed a Committee that will be addressing fundraising, volunteers, special community and author events, and other activities to help meet the cost of this repair. Keep gay heritage alive. Volunteer your time - make a financial pledge! Your support to Giovanni's Room will help us survive our 36th year. Edwin Hermance ------------ HOPE YOU MAKE IT OVER TO GIOVANNI'S ROOM! LET'S KEEP THIS PLACE ALIVE! CAConrad -- PhillySound: new poetry http://PhillySound.blogspot.com THE BOOK OF FRANK by CAConrad http://CAConrad.blogspot.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 12:44:05 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: David Chirot Subject: Re: poets barred In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear mIEKAL: many thanks for forwarding this there is the example of the Guantanamo Poets, whose works went through alon= g and literally "tortuous process" including which poems were cleared and how they were translated;the poems were done by order of the Army by non-literary translators. Every attempt was made to suppress anything that might in any way be considered to be carrying hidden messages to the outsid= e world. Poetry after al with "poetic language" which can be interpreted man= y different ways, would seem to be a possible way of spreading propaganda or messages to relatives, organized groups,journalists, etc. here are two essay/reviews which are re the Guantanamo and a flickr of visual poetry *Death from this Window/Doors of Guantanamo* --* ** *http://www.flickr.com/photos/chirotzer0/sets/72157618302466170/ 42 items | 0 viewsvisual-sonic-visceral poetry David-Baptiste Chirot: "Waterboarding & Poetry" Wordforword #13 Spring 2008 (also has Visual Poetry by chirot) Kaurab Translation Site Poems from Guant=E1namo The Detainees Speak David Baptite Chirot in the US in the last few years a very large number of cultural events been canceled or forced to find other homes, if possible--predominately anything Palestinian or connected with Palestine-Israel and exhibitions like that of a Jewish Cultural center in Chicago which are perceived by a person or group that finds anything remotely "critical of Israel" being expressed.(outside the US called "the New McCarthyism" This is a report of Opening Night for this year's Palestinian Festival of Literature in Jerusalem. The Closing Night--the poets toured in between--was also banned; the British Consulate intervened and the Festival continued in their Consulate. also at my blog there are videos, photostream, morei nformations on the poets and their tour- several of the poets are Palestinian-Americans livin= g in the US--there are also interviews with the poets On opposite sides of the world, two"democracies" are banning not only poetry but many other kinds of "Free Speech"-- below is the tittle and address for a post that arrived today from Jewish Peace Mews--two articles and a great many links--re the trials of the outspoken in many different areas of life and the stifling of Free Speech within Israel-- the reason given in UK, USA, Israel and many other countries for an "assault" on their own laws regarding Freedom of Expression as well as breaking International Laws to forbid freedom of Expression in other countries-- the reason always given is "Security" to make YOU more secure --the State will dispossess YOU of increasingly mor= e rights-- making "more secure" the individual citizen is effectively finding a way to secure them with a "security state"--the population as a whole becomes prisoners of the State controlling their lives- Monday, May 25, 2009 Palfest 09: Culture vs. Power The Guardian reports today that armed Israeli police last night tried to halt the opening night of the Palestinian Festival of Literature, organised by Ahdaf Soueif, when they ordered a Palestinian theatre in East Jerusalem to close, claiming tha= t the festival - which is funded by the British Council and UNESCO - had received funding from the Palestinian Authority. Soueif writes on Palfest's author blog http://www.palfest.org/authorsblog.html (referring to a famous phrase of Edward Said's): Today, my friends, we saw the clearest example of our mission: to confront the culture of power with the power of culture. Authority. Soueif writes on Palfest's author blog(referring to a famous phrase of Edward Said's): Today, my friends, we saw the clearest example of our mission: to confront the culture of power with the power of culture. Despite attempts to prevent the sharing and transmission of culture, Palfes= t is using all the communications tools at its disposal to reach out -- for videos, photos, blogs and other Palfest updates go here. Here's a video from the opening night: Rela Mazali: The criminal investigation of New Profile and freedom of expressionhttp:// davidbaptistechirot.blogspot.com/2009/07/rela-mazali-criminal-investigation= -of.html On Fri, Jul 17, 2009 at 1:44 PM, mIEKAL aND wrote: > Apparently UK is starting to adopt US-style profiling in the name of > terrorism... > > Begin forwarded message: > > From: GILES GOODLAND >> Date: July 17, 2009 1:39:56 PM CDT >> To: BRITISH-IRISH-POETS@JISCMAIL.AC.UK >> Subject: poets barred >> Reply-To: British & Irish poets >> >> This made me cross, and want to cry: >> >> >> >> http://www.ledburyreporter.co.uk/news/4498396.Top_poets_denied_entry_to_= UK_for_festival/ >> > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 18:46:26 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Troy Camplin Subject: Re: spiritual materialism In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Troy Cam= My book Diaphysics is precisely about spiritual matierialism.=0A=0ATroy Cam= plin=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0AFrom: Christopher Riz= zo =0ATo: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU=0ASent: Monday, J= uly 6, 2009 3:08:12 PM=0ASubject: Re: spiritual materialism=0A=0AI'm findin= g this string really quite interesting. Glad to hear evidence of=0Asuch a w= ide-ranging interest.=0A=0AAryanil, much thanks for reminding me of Whitman= and Tagore. I'm tempted to=0Aadd Pound to that set, too.=0A=0AThere are a = few significant differences between, say, Olson and Whitman.=0ABriefly, Ols= on's cosmology took the philosophy of mathematics, quantum=0Amechanics, and= Cybernetic theory (which turns into information theory,=0Areally) into acc= ount, as well as the phenomenology of Merleau-Ponty, etc.=0A=0AFor sure, th= ere are similarities to Whitman, but I figured (perhaps too=0Ahastily?) tha= t a post-Heisenberg view of reality might key into Jim's ideas=0Aa bit more= readily.=0A=0AAs for Eastern approaches to spirituality, perhaps one of th= e more=0Ainteresting bits in Olson is his use of the first line from Wilhel= m's=0Atranslation of The Secret of the Golden Flower: "That which exists th= rough=0Aitself is what is called meaning." And it is useful to note that Wh= ilhelm=0Atranslates "meaning" with a capital "M" (suggesting Tao), whereas = Olson uses=0Athe term in lower-case.=0A=0ASimply (and reductively), Olson u= ses the line to indicate something closer=0Ato autopoiesis than Logos, or r= ather the One. Creeley explains that one=0Aconsequence of all this is that = language is not "importantly" referential.=0AStill provocative, I think.=0A= =0AAnd, Chris, as for Benjamin, I'm thinking of his use of "nunc stans," in= =0Aparticular, and what uses it may have in this context....=0A=0AAnyway, j= ust a few thoughts.=0A=0ABests,=0AChris=0A=0AOn Mon, Jul 6, 2009 at 1:47 PM= , Jonathan Ball wrote:=0A=0A> Some of these ideas mi= ght approach the way Slavoj Zizek reads the Hegelian=0A> paradox that "the = spirit is a bone" .... I am travelling without any books=0A> and so I can't= say much more or even verify my quote etc but your the Olson=0A> quote bri= ngs this idea to mind, in light of the previous email.=0A>=0A> Jonathan Bal= l=0A>=0A> On Sun, Jul 5, 2009 at 10:29 PM, Christopher Rizzo >wrote:=0A>=0A> > Jim,=0A> >=0A> > Interesting post. Are you famil= iar with Charles Olson's work? In a=0A> > conversation with Herbert Kenny, = 1969, Olson says "I mean something I=0A> > believe we possess crucially. I = think our body is our soul. And if you=0A> > don't=0A> > have your body as = a factor of creation, you don't have a soul." Olson=0A> > articulates the s= ame idea at other times, too.=0A> >=0A> > In any event, an explanation of t= he above would prove lengthy, so please=0A> > feel free to backchannel me i= f you're so inclined. I'm writing two books=0A> on=0A> > Olson at the momen= t.=0A> >=0A> > c.rizzo@gmail.com=0A> >=0A> > Bests,=0A> > Chris=0A> >=0A> >= On Sun, Jul 5, 2009 at 3:41 PM, Jim Andrews wrote:=0A> >= =0A> >=A0 > it is commonly observed that a great deal of contemporary art/w= riting=0A> > > involves a double sense of 'the material'. the term is under= stood to=0A> > refer=0A> > > not only to the subject matter (the 'standard'= understanding in=0A> writing)=0A> > but=0A> > > also the matter of the med= ia in the piece, the material embodiment of=0A> the=0A> > > piece. it's als= o commonly observed that the latter awareness of and=0A> > approach=0A> > >= to composition not solely by ideation, meditation on the subject=0A> matte= r,=0A> > but=0A> > > also through operation on the material embodiment, has= come to be much=0A> > more=0A> > > widely understood as a part of reading = than it was a generation ago.=0A> when=0A> > we=0A> > > encounter work that= does not follow the grammars and approaches=0A> > > traditionally associat= ed with work, we inquire into the methods of=0A> > > composition, the appro= ach to materiality, and look for relations=0A> between=0A> > > those method= s and approaches and the subject matter, or look for the=0A> > subject=0A> = > > matter in the light of those things. and so read differently, thereby.= =0A> > and=0A> > > in this way, we now read some literary work in ways that= are closer to=0A> > how=0A> > > we approach a great deal of visual art.=0A= > > >=0A> > > but what i want to get at is something that isn't so commonly= observed,=0A> > at=0A> > > the moment, but may be in the next generation. = and that's the relation=0A> of=0A> > > awareness of the materiality of writ= ing/art to our ideas of who and=0A> what=0A> > we=0A> > > are. that's erm a= wkwardly stated. what i'm trying to get at is this.=0A> the=0A> > > whole e= mphasis on materiality is involved in a larger movement to=0A> explore=0A> = > > how things like ideation, imagination, the spiritual, beauty, truth,=0A= > > > goodness, justice--all our ideals and things normally associated with= =0A> the=0A> > > immaterial--operate in the material world.=0A> > >=0A> > >= in this sense, we might say that the whole contemporary awareness of=0A> >= > materiality in art is part of a larger ah spiritual materialism. i=0A> >= googled=0A> > > that term, after it occurred to me, and i assure you i'm u= sing it in a=0A> > > different sense than ch=F6gyam trungpa, who uses it "t= o describe mistakes=0A> > > spiritual seekers commit which turn the pursuit= of spiritualism into an=0A> > ego=0A> > > building and confusion creating = endeavor" (wikipedia). instead, i'm=0A> > refering=0A> > > to a relatively = common sort of philosophy in which the material=0A> substrate=0A> > of=0A> = > > ideation and even the spiritual is affirmed and its relations with even= =0A> > the=0A> > > flightiest of fancies are explored. not to denigrate or = dismiss things=0A> > like=0A> > > spirituality but to explore how they oper= ate materially.=0A> > >=0A> > > perhaps more evidently, now, this is also r= elated to philosophies of=0A> mind=0A> > > in which the materiality of thou= ght itself is affirmed--as a chemical=0A> and=0A> > > informational process= , however emergent--and the brain and the mind=0A> that=0A> > > emerge from= its processes are conceived as fully embodied in the=0A> > material.=0A> >= > so that the idea of being able to create thinking machines (however=0A> = > unlike=0A> > > us) becomes a real possibility. and we are conceptualized = as nature's=0A> > > (near?) ultimate machines. and machines are conceptuali= zed not as the=0A> > simple=0A> > > things we once thought they must be but= as often very complex=0A> biological=0A> > > creatures that, nonetheless, = are embodied in the material world and=0A> are,=0A> > > therefore, subject = to the constraints and possibilities of machines in=0A> > the=0A> > > mater= ial world.=0A> > >=0A> > > to wrap it up, we now see the relation between c= ontemporary artistic=0A> > > emphasis on the materiality of writing/art and= the larger moment of=0A> > > 'spiritual materialism'.=0A> > >=0A> > > ja= =0A> > > http://vispo.com=0A> > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A> > > The= Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check=0A> > guideli= nes=0A> > > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html= =0A> > >=0A> >=0A> > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A> > The Poetics List is = moderated & does not accept all posts. Check=0A> guidelines=0A> > & sub/uns= ub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=0A> >=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A> = --=0A> www.jonathanball.com=0A> www.jonathanball.blogspot.com=0A> www.haiku= horoscopes.com=0A>=0A> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A> The Poetics List is= moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines=0A> & sub/unsub in= fo: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=0A>=0A=0A=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=0AThe Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Chec= k guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html= =0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 10:42:35 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Camille Martin Subject: new on Rogue Embryo's blog Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 New on Rogue Embryo http://rogueembryo.wordpress.com Alberta Turner: What do you mean, mean? the air blanked out. it had been seen on its mind. Empty Lawns and Battered Days: Rupert Loydell=92s =93Slow-Motion=94 Extreme Inefficiency: The Way Things Go (film by Peter Fischli and David We= iss) Signs of Rita Hypnagogic Dreams: John Franklin=92s Fig Newton on a Piano Stool Previously: - Serendipity and the Felon: Jiri Kolar, Emmet Gowin, and the Cortical Iceb= erg - Laura Jensen: Degrees of Separation from Bad Boats - If the needle is a poem, then what is the fang? - Camille Martin=92s upcoming events - e.ratio Sonnets: Nathan Thompson and Camille Martin - Anselm Hollo=92s Heavy Jars: =93Hard to say whether the jars=92ve gotten = any lighter.=94 - Rae Armantrout=92s Waves of Punchlines - A False Start: T. S. Eliot, Snoopy, and the Artist's Statement and more . . . Camille Martin http://www.camillemartin.ca http://rogueembryo.wordpress.com =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 09:39:04 -0600 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jonathan Ball Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, lady people! Pigeons are good. Winter is good. Stoolpigeons are good--- thought they're in league with the government, trying to kill all spontaneity. Hello everyone! Time to start losing. Losing is good. Losing is what we came here to do, and it's going quite well, thanks for asking. --- Kevin Connolly, from "Counterpane" ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 13:05:44 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Michael Kelleher Subject: Literary Buffalo E-Newsletter 07.20.09-07.26.09 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=UTF-8 LITERARY BUFFALO 07.20.09-07.26.09 MEMBER EVENT: JUST BUFFALO GOES TO THE BALLPARK=21 FRIDAY AUGUST 14TH, 7:35 P.M. COCA COLA FIELD SECTION 106 (FIRST BASE SIDE BEHIND HOME PLATE) 275 WASHINGTON STREET BUFFALO, NY ADMISSION FREE FOR CURRENT JUST BUFFALO MEMBERS Guests and children =2410 Children under 3 FREE 35 Seats Available RSVP REQUIRED=21 Please call 832-5400 to reserve yours=21 I see great things in baseball.=CB=87 It's our game - the American game. -Walt Whitman, poet This isn't a poetry reading. This is baseball. -Ed Adamczyk, writer & village historian of Kenmore BABEL Most Innovative Arts Programming (Any Artform) Buffalo Spree Magazine's Best of Buffalo 2009 Award BABEL 2009-2010 SEASON SUBSCRIPTIONS ON SALE NOW=21 October 9, A.S. Byatt November 20, Ha Jin March 5, Azar Nafisi April 16, Salman Rushdie Previous Subscriber: =2485 New Subscriber: =24110 These subscriptions include general admission seating at all 4 events. Patron: =24275 Patron Pair: =24450 Patron level subscriptions include VIP reserved seating and admission to al= l pre-event author receptions. Purchase subscriptions now at http://www.justbuffalo.org/babel or by phone = at 716.832.5400. __________________________________________________________________________= EVENTS THIS WEEK All events free and open to the public unless otherwise noted. For more detailed information and a complete listing of furute events, plea= se visit the Literary Buffalo web calendar: http://www.justbuffalo.org/index.php?task=3Dview&id=3D22 07.22.09 Talking Leaves Books Catherine Parker and Roland Martin Performance/Book signing for: A Rose Beside The Water Wednesday, July 22, 7:00 PM Talking Leaves Books, 3158 Main St. __________________________________________________________________________= JUST BUFFALO MEMBER s WRITER CRITIQUE GROUP The member writer critique group meets 1st and 3rd Tuesdays at the Market A= rcade. The critique group WILL continue to meet all summer long. Click here for more info: http://www.justbuffalo.org/media/pdf/CritiqueGroup0409.pdf ___________________________________________________________________________ UNSUBSCRIBE If you would like to unsubscribe from this list, just say so and you will i= mmediately be removed. _______________________________ Michael Kelleher Artistic Director Just Buffalo Literary Center Market Arcade 617 Main St., Ste. 202A Buffalo, NY 14203 716.832.5400 716.270.0184 (fax) www.justbuffalo.org mjk=40justbuffalo.org =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 12:49:12 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Comments: RFC822 error: Invalid RFC822 field - "unders=". Rest of header flushed. From: Sam Truitt Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Right - many thanks - that's the terrific saying - with the triple=0Aunders= tanding of "nothing" as no correspondence outside itself - no=0Apurpose - = it doesn't do anything except what it does - not causal -=0Ait's intransiti= ve (as came up) and so the PLEASURE (also come up) is in=0Aand of itself - = what Williams said, "If it's not a pleasure it's not a=0Apoem" - and then = "nothing" as an IMPOSSIBILITY - as even a vacuum has=0Aa form, or there is = a meeting - and so one can keep saying - or trying,=0Aas somebody said - bu= t one fails - one FALLS, which is the cadence=0A(dance) and Cage's chance t= oo (both from the Latin "cadere" - to fall).=0AThat "nothing" is like Cage'= s SILENCE, an experiential impossibility -=0Ait's a concept - going back to= the vacuum - as he discovered entering=0Ain a sound-proof chamber and hear= d the hum of his nervous system. That=0Athere is an inside. So, what's the = point of saying - speaking or=0Awriting - except the pleasure and the findi= ng, measuring, how=0Athings fall out, arrange themselves, in language or an= y other symbolic=0Asystem... I have found personally it's to put myself int= o a situation=0Ain which I can no harm. Celine said someplace that there ar= e two kinds=0Aof poets: those that write and those that don't, noting the l= atter are=0Amore happy. And maybe if you don't try you can't fail... I don'= t know=0Aif that Ridingly true, but it does seem to have something to do wi= th self - that very thing that seems in a situation of=0Acomposition=0Anece= ssary to be out of - as self is "separate" - it's critical,=0Adivides: you = lose the whole - and there is one, just as there is nothing, too - we sense= - like "the hub of a wheel, the immobile center that=0Amakes rotation poss= ible." But the fail is a pleasure - it gets at=0Athe root of how we are - t= he risk - as someplace I heard we are born=0Awith two instincts: reaction t= o loud noises and fear of falling.=0A=0A=0A----- Original Message ----=0AFr= om: Halvard Johnson =0ATo: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU= =0ASent: Friday, July 17, 2009 4:33:44 PM=0ASubject: Re: Poetry and Failure= =0A=0A"I have nothing to say and am saying it, and that is poetry."=0A --= John Cage (more or less)=0A=0A=0AHal=0A=0A"A paranoid is someone who knows = a little=0Aof what's going on."=0A --William S. Burrough= s=0A=0AHalvard Johnson=0A=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =0Ahalvard@gmail.com=0Ahttp://sites.google.com/site/halvardjohnson/Home=0Ah= ttp://entropyandme.blogspot.com=0Ahttp://imageswithoutwords.blogspot.com=0A= http://www.hamiltonstone.org=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0AOn Fri, Jul 17, 2009 at 1:23 = PM, Sam Truitt wrote:=0A=0A> "You can say anything in= prose, so poetry should be reserved for saying=0A> nothing"=0A> (Khlebniko= v), like the soul, lost at the xroads.=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A> ----- Original Messa= ge ----=0A> From: Nicholas Piombino =0A> To: POETI= CS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU=0A> Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 11:46:21 PM=0A> S= ubject: Re: Poetry and Failure=0A>=0A> "Opens magazine several times at the= fact that poetry is at crossroads."=0A>=0A> F. Scott Fitzgerald (from "The= Notebooks", in "The Crack Up", edited by=0A> Edmund Wilson)=0A>=0A>=0A> On= 7/16/09 6:28 PM, "Sam Truitt" wrote:=0A>=0A> > Is th= is thread I'm surprised not to see Laura Riding (Jackson) hasn't=0A> come u= p=0A> > - her sentiment as nailed by posthumous title THE FAILURE OF POETRY= , THE=0A> > PROMISE OF LANGUAGE (ed. John Nolan) underscored by her giving = up poems=0A> in the=0A> > late 1930's - tied to truth, to being true - but = she writes someplace=0A> (her=0A> > essay on Stein maybe?):=0A> >=0A> > =C2= =B3=C5=A0if poetry had all subjects taken away from it,=0A> > there was one= subject of which poetry could not be deprived, namely, that=0A> > poetry h= ad come to an end. Here was an ingenious method for indefinitely=0A> > post= poning the end of poetry=C5=A0 since poetry was to write about nothing, it= =0A> > could=0A> > write about everything from the standpoint of nothing; i= t could still=0A> have its=0A> > epic without the burden of having to have = convictions about it.=C2=B2=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> > ----- Original Me= ssage ----=0A> > From: carol dorf =0A> > To: POETICS@= LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU=0A> > Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 9:22:50 AM=0A> > S= ubject: Re: Poetry and Failure=0A> >=0A> > Hard to say where one "poem" end= s and the next begins.=0A> >=0A> > Don't forget pleasure -- pleasure in lan= guage, pleasure in structuring=0A> the=0A> > "poem," referencing experience= .=0A> >=0A> > (Almost all of reading, for me; and a good part of my writing= .)=0A> >=0A> > On Wed, Jul 15, 2009 at 11:56 AM, Elizabeth Switaj =0A> wrote:=0A> >=0A> >>> Do we continue to write poetry because i= t ultimately fails to do what=0A> we=0A> >> hope it might or should?=0A> >>= =0A> >> That may be so for some and certainly is why I continue to write* a= =0A> poem*,=0A> >> but other than that I continue writing because those hop= es shift and are=0A> >> various.=0A> >>=0A> >>> Is the "failure of poetry" = a failure of language, or poetics?=0A> >>=0A> >> Yes.=0A> >>=0A> >> =3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A> >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accep= t all posts. Check=0A> guidelines=0A> >> & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffa= lo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=0A> >>=0A> >=0A> > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =0A> > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check=0A>= guidelines &=0A> > sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.= html=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A> >= The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check=0A> guide= lines &=0A> > sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html= =0A>=0A> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A> The Poetics List is moderated & do= es not accept all posts. Check guidelines=0A> & sub/unsub info: http://epc.= buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=0A> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Ch= eck guidelines=0A> & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome= .html=0A>=0A=0A=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0AThe Poetics List is moderated = & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.= buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=0A=0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 13:14:44 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve russell Subject: Re: spiritual materialism MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable sounds sort of similiar to dianetics, or scientology in drag. cynical, ugh,= me. --- On Sun, 7/19/09, Troy Camplin wrote: > From: Troy Camplin > Subject: Re: spiritual materialism > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Sunday, July 19, 2009, 9:46 PM > Troy Cam > My book Diaphysics is precisely about spiritual > matierialism. >=20 > Troy Camplin >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > ________________________________ > From: Christopher Rizzo > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Sent: Monday, July 6, 2009 3:08:12 PM > Subject: Re: spiritual materialism >=20 > I'm finding this string really quite interesting. Glad to > hear evidence of > such a wide-ranging interest. >=20 > Aryanil, much thanks for reminding me of Whitman and > Tagore. I'm tempted to > add Pound to that set, too. >=20 > There are a few significant differences between, say, Olson > and Whitman. > Briefly, Olson's cosmology took the philosophy of > mathematics, quantum > mechanics, and Cybernetic theory (which turns into > information theory, > really) into account, as well as the phenomenology of > Merleau-Ponty, etc. >=20 > For sure, there are similarities to Whitman, but I figured > (perhaps too > hastily?) that a post-Heisenberg view of reality might key > into Jim's ideas > a bit more readily. >=20 > As for Eastern approaches to spirituality, perhaps one of > the more > interesting bits in Olson is his use of the first line from > Wilhelm's > translation of The Secret of the Golden Flower: "That which > exists through > itself is what is called meaning." And it is useful to note > that Whilhelm > translates "meaning" with a capital "M" (suggesting Tao), > whereas Olson uses > the term in lower-case. >=20 > Simply (and reductively), Olson uses the line to indicate > something closer > to autopoiesis than Logos, or rather the One. Creeley > explains that one > consequence of all this is that language is not > "importantly" referential. > Still provocative, I think. >=20 > And, Chris, as for Benjamin, I'm thinking of his use of > "nunc stans," in > particular, and what uses it may have in this context.... >=20 > Anyway, just a few thoughts. >=20 > Bests, > Chris >=20 > On Mon, Jul 6, 2009 at 1:47 PM, Jonathan Ball > wrote: >=20 > > Some of these ideas might approach the way Slavoj > Zizek reads the Hegelian > > paradox that "the spirit is a bone" .... I am > travelling without any books > > and so I can't say much more or even verify my quote > etc but your the Olson > > quote brings this idea to mind, in light of the > previous email. > > > > Jonathan Ball > > > > On Sun, Jul 5, 2009 at 10:29 PM, Christopher Rizzo > > >wrote: > > > > > Jim, > > > > > > Interesting post. Are you familiar with Charles > Olson's work? In a > > > conversation with Herbert Kenny, 1969, Olson says > "I mean something I > > > believe we possess crucially. I think our body is > our soul. And if you > > > don't > > > have your body as a factor of creation, you don't > have a soul." Olson > > > articulates the same idea at other times, too. > > > > > > In any event, an explanation of the above would > prove lengthy, so please > > > feel free to backchannel me if you're so > inclined. I'm writing two books > > on > > > Olson at the moment. > > > > > > c.rizzo@gmail.com > > > > > > Bests, > > > Chris > > > > > > On Sun, Jul 5, 2009 at 3:41 PM, Jim Andrews > > wrote: > > > > > >=A0 > it is commonly observed that a great deal > of contemporary art/writing > > > > involves a double sense of 'the material'. > the term is understood to > > > refer > > > > not only to the subject matter (the > 'standard' understanding in > > writing) > > > but > > > > also the matter of the media in the piece, > the material embodiment of > > the > > > > piece. it's also commonly observed that the > latter awareness of and > > > approach > > > > to composition not solely by ideation, > meditation on the subject > > matter, > > > but > > > > also through operation on the material > embodiment, has come to be much > > > more > > > > widely understood as a part of reading than > it was a generation ago. > > when > > > we > > > > encounter work that does not follow the > grammars and approaches > > > > traditionally associated with work, we > inquire into the methods of > > > > composition, the approach to materiality, > and look for relations > > between > > > > those methods and approaches and the subject > matter, or look for the > > > subject > > > > matter in the light of those things. and so > read differently, thereby. > > > and > > > > in this way, we now read some literary work > in ways that are closer to > > > how > > > > we approach a great deal of visual art. > > > > > > > > but what i want to get at is something that > isn't so commonly observed, > > > at > > > > the moment, but may be in the next > generation. and that's the relation > > of > > > > awareness of the materiality of writing/art > to our ideas of who and > > what > > > we > > > > are. that's erm awkwardly stated. what i'm > trying to get at is this. > > the > > > > whole emphasis on materiality is involved in > a larger movement to > > explore > > > > how things like ideation, imagination, the > spiritual, beauty, truth, > > > > goodness, justice--all our ideals and things > normally associated with > > the > > > > immaterial--operate in the material world. > > > > > > > > in this sense, we might say that the whole > contemporary awareness of > > > > materiality in art is part of a larger ah > spiritual materialism. i > > > googled > > > > that term, after it occurred to me, and i > assure you i'm using it in a > > > > different sense than ch=F6gyam trungpa, who > uses it "to describe mistakes > > > > spiritual seekers commit which turn the > pursuit of spiritualism into an > > > ego > > > > building and confusion creating endeavor" > (wikipedia). instead, i'm > > > refering > > > > to a relatively common sort of philosophy in > which the material > > substrate > > > of > > > > ideation and even the spiritual is affirmed > and its relations with even > > > the > > > > flightiest of fancies are explored. not to > denigrate or dismiss things > > > like > > > > spirituality but to explore how they operate > materially. > > > > > > > > perhaps more evidently, now, this is also > related to philosophies of > > mind > > > > in which the materiality of thought itself > is affirmed--as a chemical > > and > > > > informational process, however emergent--and > the brain and the mind > > that > > > > emerge from its processes are conceived as > fully embodied in the > > > material. > > > > so that the idea of being able to create > thinking machines (however > > > unlike > > > > us) becomes a real possibility. and we are > conceptualized as nature's > > > > (near?) ultimate machines. and machines are > conceptualized not as the > > > simple > > > > things we once thought they must be but as > often very complex > > biological > > > > creatures that, nonetheless, are embodied in > the material world and > > are, > > > > therefore, subject to the constraints and > possibilities of machines in > > > the > > > > material world. > > > > > > > > to wrap it up, we now see the relation > between contemporary artistic > > > > emphasis on the materiality of writing/art > and the larger moment of > > > > 'spiritual materialism'. > > > > > > > > ja > > > > http://vispo.com > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not > accept all posts. Check > > > guidelines > > > > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not > accept all posts. Check > > guidelines > > > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > www.jonathanball.com > > www.jonathanball.blogspot.com > > www.haikuhoroscopes.com > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept > all posts. Check guidelines > > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all > posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/= welcome.html >=20 >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all > posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/= welcome.html > =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 14:29:14 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jim Andrews Subject: Re: spiritual materialism MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit i'm sure 'spiritual materialism' could mean any number of um things. that's part of its poetical if not philosophical appeal, as poetry is the art of being profoundly vague. so one doesn't like to 'disambiguate' too strongly. however, here's a bit more about what i had in mind. others will have their own, different notions of what it might mean. many of us, as writers and/or artists or whatever, find ourselves working with 'the material' in ways that we weren't earlier on. with less emphasis on transcribing our 'inner thoughts and feelings' and more emphasis on what the words are saying. and yes there are often things we want to get them to say, if we can (like now), but we observe that not only are we not entirely clear what that might be, until we find the words, but that even when we do, they aren't quite what we thought they might be and are often better as something we didn't anticipate at all via not mindless manipulation of symbols but through a process of writerly/artistic discovery that involves mind and mindless, material and material, material and spiritual. via engaging with the material both in an objective manner, as things on a page subject to choice and cutup, random and thoughtful selection...and all the compositional techniques we use. and this different engagement with 'the material' is part of what i had in mind as a kind of materialism. of course the term 'materialism' has a very interesting history going back to Indian and Greek atomism and into the contemporary world in many different ways. usually the 'material' is atomistic. matter. a philosophy of the composition of matter and the generation of the ten thousand things. only recently has it been associated with consumerist zeal and denials of the importance of feelings, emotions, and so on. a blip on the map. usually there's a scientistic element, often a strong one, to materialisms. they often seek to apply an occam-like razor to eliminate assumptions that are not required or attribute causes to supernatural agents. materialisms usually do their darndest to appeal only to reason and material evidence in their theories. but of course, as artists, we are by no means in the bizness of appealing solely to reason. we don't produce many theories of the universe and everything but, instead, are basically wordy minstrels singing into the black hole of mind and media. and, for lack of a better word, there is a 'spiritual' dimension to what we talk about, what we do, how we go about it, and so on. emotion, feeling, mood, tone, connotation, subjectivity, all these are normally important to art. yet our approach, or the approach of many of us, to writing and/or art or whatever, in our current age, does involve this 'materialism' i mentioned that does indeed have a scientistic dimension in that we do try to keep our eye somewhat objectively not on what we ourselves are feeling and thinking about what we're creating but on what others might also get from it and, beyond that, in our approach to working with the material as recombinant, as involved in the processes of network cutup, reassembly, and our sources of the material can be spam or texts recovered from net searches or whatever and our methods of composition can involve the algorithmic and so on. kedrick james's term for all this is 'writing post-person'. but, even so, we are not so much interested in creating interesting language machines as in the human appeal of these machines made out of words. so that a contemporary, writerly materialism usually involves some sort of meditation on our relations with language and machines. not to dehumanize but to locate and explore our humanity in relation to mind and mindlessness, the intention and the unintended, the machine and the human. there's that kurzweil book 'the age of spiritual machines'. with emphasis on artificial intelligence. and that's interesting, but typically our emphasis is not on artificial intelligence but on our own intelligence extended, changed, dwarfed, zoomed, augmented, pounded, filtered, twittered, frittered, coerced, directed, freed, drugged, blasted, spliced, diced, googled, ogled, bamboozled, frugalled, layered, informationalized, playered, stirred, blurred, penetrated, iconized, infiltrated, visualized, datafied, search enginized, tokenized, blip bopified, ding donglered and piece-wise transformed via our engagement with language and contemporary language environments. our own intelligences are somewhat artificial. and we operate in a material combinatorium of language not as in a meaningless concourse of atoms but in our own very purposefully processual cyclotrons, intent upon both the material and energy of its release. ja http://vispo.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 13:21:55 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve russell Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable chili you know a little goes l o n gest once you b u r p=20 --- On Sat, 7/18/09, George Bowering wrote: > From: George Bowering > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Saturday, July 18, 2009, 4:23 PM > I used to think that the chili at Tim > Hortons is pretty good, > but you get tired of it soon. >=20 > gb >=20 >=20 > On Jul 17, 2009, at 6:20 PM, steve russell wrote: >=20 > > who complained about the usual widening/widening of > the topic?=C2=A0=20 > > Writing fiction/poetry, the bible,=C2=A0 and now chili > half/smokes. jeez > > > > --- On Fri, 7/17/09, Patrick Dillon > wrote: > > > > From: Patrick Dillon > > Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > Date: Friday, July 17, 2009, 9:18 AM > > > >> > >> The chili dogs at Ben=E2=80=99s Chili Bowl, overrated. > Ben's, btw, is > >> > >> > >> The chili dogs at Ben=E2=80=99s Chili Bowl, overrated. > Ben's, btw, is=C2=A0=20 > >> mentioned a > >> few times in a couple of the Pelecanos novels. > >> > > > > Ben's is famous for chili half smokes, not chili dogs > (but they=C2=A0=20 > > serve both). > > And it's obviously famous for reasons unrelated to > food. > > > > > > > > On Thu, Jul 16, 2009 at 3:31 PM, steve russell=C2=A0=20 > > wrote: > > > >> The chili dogs at Ben=E2=80=99s Chili Bowl, overrated. > Ben's, btw, is > >> > >> > >> The chili dogs at Ben=E2=80=99s Chili Bowl, overrated. > Ben's, btw, is=C2=A0=20 > >> mentioned a > >> few times in a couple of the Pelecanos novels. > >> > >> --- On Tue, 7/14/09, George Bowering > wrote: > >> > >> From: George Bowering > >> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but ... > >> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > >> Date: Tuesday, July 14, 2009, 3:50 PM > >> > >> I recommend the Florida Street Cafe in DC for > scrapple. > >> > >> gb > >> > >> > >> On Jul 14, 2009, at 3:11 AM, steve russell wrote: > >> > >>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0but Pelacanos, the wire > producer,=C2=A0 writes novels. they're set=C2=A0=20 > >>> in d.c. > >>> --- On Mon, 7/13/09, George Bowering > wrote: > >>> > >>>> From: George Bowering > >>>> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction but > ... > >>>> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > >>>> Date: Monday, July 13, 2009, 5:07 PM > >>>> Oh boy, Baltimore. > >>>> The crab cakes at the Lexington Market the > best anywhere. > >>>> > >>>> gb > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> On Jul 13, 2009, at 11:32 AM, Mary Kasimor > wrote: > >>>> > >>>>> I am a The Wire addict. It takes place > in Baltimore. > >>>>> mary > >>>>> > >>>>> --- On Sun, 7/12/09, steve russell > > >>>> wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> From: steve russell > >>>>> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction > but ... > >>>>> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > >>>>> Date: Sunday, July 12, 2009, 1:04 PM > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> Sure, and why not throw in the Goddamn > bible. I mean, > >>>> hell, what is the bible? Narrative? Epic > poetry? I'm > >>>> thinking mostly of the Old Testament, of > course.=C2=A0 As > >>>> for "The Wire, " I'm a big fan of crime > fiction, and George > >>>> Pelacanos is the main producer of "The > Wire." Indeed, in the > >>>> broad sense of the term (...poet...), why > not include > >>>> Pelacanos as a poet of the streets of > Washington, D.C.? > >>>> Perhaps Q Taratino is the poet of video > store clerks, if not > >>>> their saint. Why not talk about failed > poets who turned to > >>>> fiction after their bout with poetry. > Consider William > >>>> Faulkner. As for cartoonist, I have no > problem calling E > >>>> Gorey, or even=C2=A0 Mr. peanuts Schultz, > a poet. Ugh, what > >>>> was the topic??? > >>>>> > >>>>> --- On Sat, 7/11/09, George Bowering > > >>>> wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> From: George Bowering > >>>>> Subject: Re: I want to write fiction > but ... > >>>>> To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > >>>>> Date: Saturday, July 11, 2009, 4:01 > PM > >>>>> > >>>>> Here we go; > >>>>> the usual widening and widening of the > topic > >>>>> until we can include everything, such > as L'il Abner > >>>> and,oh, The Wire. > >>>>> > >>>>> gb > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> On Jul 10, 2009, at 6:36 PM, Jonathan > Morse wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>>> steve russell wrote: > >>>>>>> there are a few singular > talents who've > >>>> managed to create 1st rate work in > fiction, poetry, and > >>>> drama as well as the essay. Consider Denis > Johnson, or Jim > >>>> Harrison, or the late Thomas Dish. > >>>>>> Goethe. Rilke. Hardy. Hugo. If > you'll accept > >>>> non-fiction, you can add Yeats and Dryden. > If you count > >>>> letters as imaginative literature, and why > shouldn't you?, > >>>> you can add Keats and Dickinson. Think > big. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Jonathan Morse > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > >>>>>> The Poetics List is moderated > & does not > >>>> accept all posts. Check guidelines & > sub/unsub info: http:// > >>>> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >>>>> > >>>>> George B. > >>>>> Author of his own misfortunes. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > >>>>> The Poetics List is moderated & > does not accept > >>>> all posts. Check guidelines & > sub/unsub info: http:// > >>>> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > >>>>> The Poetics List is moderated & > does not accept > >>>> all posts. Check guidelines & > sub/unsub info: http:// > >>>> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > >>>>> The Poetics List is moderated & > does not accept > >>>> all posts. Check guidelines & > sub/unsub info: http:// > >>>> epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >>>> > >>>> George "Whip" Bowering > >>>> No slugging average to speak of. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > >>>> The Poetics List is moderated & does > not accept all > >>>> posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub > info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/ > >>>> poetics/welcome.html > >>>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not > accept all posts. Check > >>> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ > >>> welcome.html > >> > >> George H. Bowering, OC > >> Dull as dishwater. > >> > >> > >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not > accept all posts. Check=C2=A0=20 > >> guidelines > >> & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not > accept all posts. Check=C2=A0=20 > >> guidelines > >> & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > >> > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept > all posts. Check=C2=A0=20 > > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 > > welcome.html > > > > > > > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept > all posts. Check=C2=A0=20 > > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/=20 > > welcome.html >=20 > GB > Under electronic surveillance. >=20 >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all > posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/= welcome.html > =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 14:29:43 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Mary Kasimor Subject: Re: Tough economy - insight? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I have not read everything in insidehighered, but I think that what I said was misunderstood by you, based on what I did read. I am not saying that careers are doing well in higher ed. I am saying that there are adjunct semester by semester jobs available because when the economy is bad, people go back to college. I am talking about surivival mode, not tenure. I am now a tenured instructor at a technical/community college in the midwest. We are not currently hiring tenure track positions, but I can say that we will be hiring adjunct positions. I have done the adjunct route, and I know that it is not ideal and I know that it is very frustrating for people with PhDs. (I have two lowly Master's degrees from a state university.) However, I do know that adjunct teaching is a better position than selling shoes at Kohl's, which was another option for me about 12 years ago. I can also understand that working as an adjunct and wondering if your bills will be paid causes a great deal of stress because I have also dealt with that stress. I was supporting my two children and myself from semester to semester with very little child support from their dad ($100/month). In a very bad economy, I am saying that it is better than many other possible scenarios. Sometimes you just have to suck it up. Mary --- On Sat, 7/18/09, Jonathan Morse wrote: From: Jonathan Morse Subject: Re: Tough economy - insight? To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Saturday, July 18, 2009, 2:53 PM Mary Kasimor wrote: > My understanding is that colleges and universities are doing well during the bad economy. Ye gods, Mary. No they aren't. Subscribe (free) to http://www.insidehighered.com to learn how misinformed you've been. Jonathan Morse University of Hawaii ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 20:49:50 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jennifer Karmin Subject: July 25 & 26: Wisconsin Readings MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable **SATURDAY, JULY 25** Poets: QURAYSH ALI LANSANA JENNIFER KARMIN Musicians: AUSTIN SPIKA I HAVE THREE HANDS 6pm at Blueberries Cafe 515 Sixth Street Racine, Wisconsin BONK! series sponsored by the Racine Public Library=20 http://bonkperformanceseries.wordpress.com=20 **SUNDAY, JULY 26** Poets: ANDY GRICEVICH JENNIFER KARMIN 2pm at Avol's Bookstore 315 West Gorham Street Madison, Wisconsin http://www.avolsbooks.com @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ QURAYSH ALI LANSANA is the author of They Shall Run--Harriet Tubman Poems a= nd the poetry collection southside rain; a children's book, The Big World; = and a poetry chapbook, cockroach children: corner poems and street psalms.= =C2=A0 He is the editor of Glencoe/McGraw-Hill's African American Literatur= e Reader, and I Represent and dream in yourself, which are two anthologies = of literary works from Chicago's award-winning youth arts employment progra= m, Gallery 37.=C2=A0 He is currently Director of the Gwendolyn Brooks Cente= r for Black Literature and Creative Writing and an Assistant Professor of E= nglish and Creative Writing at Chicago State University.=20 ANDY GRICEVICH is uncomfortably writing this in the third person. He's a po= et,actor, theater director and musician whose work occasionally finds the t= ime to get itself published here and there. He spent much of the last four = years melding political theater and experimental music with the Nonsense Co= mpany, and performing satirical cabaret songs with the Prince Myshkins. And= y edits Cannot Exist, a print poetry magazine put lovingly together in his = living room in Madison, Wisconsin. He very rarely, and with extensive disco= mfort, blogs at ndgwriting.blogspot.com. JENNIFER KARMIN=E2=80=99s text-sound epic Aaaaaaaaaaalice will be published= by Flim Forum Press in 2009. She curates the Red Rover Series and is a fou= nding member of the public art group Anti Gravity Surprise. Her multidiscip= linary projects have been presented nationally at festivals, artist-run spa= ces, and on city streets.=C2=A0 Jennifer teaches creative writing to immigr= ants at Truman College and works as a Poet in Residence for the Chicago Pub= lic Schools. Recent poems are published in the journals Cannot Exist, MoonL= it, Otoliths, and anthologized in Come Together: Imagine Peace(Bottom Dog P= ress), Not A Muse (Haven Books), and The City Visible: Chicago Poetry for t= he New Century (Cracked Slab Books). AUSTIN SPIKA is recognized as an outstanding percussionist in a variety of = musical genres, having received numerous awards and recognitions throughout= his young career.=C2=A0 In 2007, CL Barnhouse published Rim Shot, Spika=E2= =80=99s first concert band/parade snare composition co-written with Donald = Young.=C2=A0 He has been involved with many musical organizations in the Ra= cine and Milwaukee areas including three award-winning years with the Racin= e Lighthouse Brigade percussion line, three years with the University of Wi= sconsin-Milwaukee Jazz and Wind Ensembles, and several summers with the Wis= consin Conservatory of Music Jazz Ensembles.=C2=A0=20 =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 14:46:24 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Vernon Frazer Subject: Please check out the new ROCKPILE Website & Blog at Big Bridge (from Michael Rothenberg) Comments: cc: Michael Rothenberg Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v935.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ROCKPILE is a collaboration between David Meltzer =97 poet, musician, =20= essayist, and more =97 and Michael Rothenberg of Big Bridge Press. David = =20 and Michael will journey through eight cities in the U.S. to perform =20 poetry and prose, composed while on the road, with local musicians and =20= artists in each city. ROCKPILE will serve to educate and preserve as =20 well as to create a history of collaboration. It will help to =20 reinforce the tradition of the troubadour of all generations, central =20= to the cultural upheaval and identity politics that reawakened poets, =20= artists, musicians, and songwriters in the mid-1960s through the =20 1970s. The project will end with a final multimedia performance =20 celebration in San Francisco. The ROCKPILE Website & Blog will tell you all you need to know about =20 the ROCKPILE project including performance dates, venues, artist bios =20= and performance clips of some of the musicians we will be meeting and =20= performing with in each of the cities. Once we hit the road, we will be posting travel photos, journal =20 entries, performance videos, interviews and more, daily, on the =20 ROCKPILE Blog, so log on and join us as we travel around the country. =20= Write us, comment on the blog, and let us know you are with us, let us =20= know you care! And of course, we hope to see you on the road! Best, Michael Rothenberg, David Meltzer, Terri Carrion & Ziggy. ROCKPILE www.bigbridge.org/rockpile/ Made possible by a grant from the Creative Work Fund, a program of the =20= Walter and Elise Haas Fund, also supported by generous grants from The William and Flora Hewlett =20 Foundation and The James Irvine Foundation, and support from the =20 Committee on Poetry. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 00:20:03 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: George Bowering Subject: Re: A widespread, high-spirited head rush In-Reply-To: <20090718.230441.424.25.skyplums@juno.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v753.1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Remember when Rashied played instead of Elvin Jones in a quartet that Had Alice instead of Mccoy? Whew, that was good. Listened to some just today. gb On Jul 18, 2009, at 10:34 AM, steve dalachinsky wrote: > you saw rashied with ayler i'll ask him > what dya mean ya din't know he did concerts? > semantics he did a gig 3 sets is that better usage of lingo? > > On Fri, 17 Jul 2009 00:47:03 -0700 George Bowering > writes: >> I love Rashied Ali. My favourite drummer. >> I heard him with the Aylers around 1967 >> ]and I heard him in Vancouver last year. >> I didn't know he did concerts, though. >> >> gb >> >> >> On Jul 16, 2009, at 3:23 AM, steve dalachinsky wrote: >> >>> rashied ali quintet last nite >>> tonite kronos qt >>> i go to almost 1 or 2 a nite >>> On Thu, 16 Jul 2009 00:11:22 -0700 George Bowering >> >>> writes: >>>> On Jul 15, 2009, at 6:24 PM, Paul Siegell wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi, >>>>> >>>>> What was the last concert you went to? >>>> >>>> I guess it was the Vancouver Symphony Orchestra doing >> Beethoven's >>>> Ninth >>>> and other stuff about 18 months ago. >>>> >>>> gb >>>> >>>> ================================== >>>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >>>> guidelines & sub/unsub info: >>>> http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> ================================== >>> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >> >>> guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ >>> welcome.html >> >> Geo. H. Bowering >> Adaptable yet reliable. >> >> >> ================================== >> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check >> guidelines & sub/unsub info: >> http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html >> >> > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/ > welcome.html Geo. H. Bowering Adaptable yet reliable. ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 04:25:16 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: David Kirschenbaum Subject: Tues./Boog City presents P-Queue/Queue Books Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v924) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable please forward ------------------ Boog City presents d.a. levy lives: celebrating the renegade press Season 6 finale: P-Queue/Queue Books (Buffalo, N.Y.) this Tues., July 28, 6:00 p.m. sharp, free ACA Galleries 529 W. 20th St., 5th Flr. NYC Event will be hosted by P-Queue/Queue Books editor Andrew Rippeon Featuring readings from Jos=E9 Felipe Alvergue Stephen Collis Zack Finch Sueyeun Juliette Lee Ben Miller There will be wine, cheese, and crackers, too. Curated and with an introduction by Boog City editor David Kirschenbaum ------ **P-Queue/Queue Books http://www.p-queue.org/ P-Queue was founded in 2003 by Sarah Campbell with the special intent =20= to investigate the overlaps and departures between the prose line and =20= that of verse. Today P-Queue continues these investigations, while =20 also exploring other such tipping points, including visual-textual, =20 spoken-written, and polemic-poetic. A chapbook series started in 2007, =20= and treats primarily collaborative projects. *Performer Bios* **Jos=E9 Felipe Alvergue http://jacketmagazine.com/36/r-chainlinks-rb-alvergue.shtml With an M.F.A. from the Cal Arts School of Critical Studies, Jos=E9 =20 Felipe Alvergue is presently a student of the SUNY Buffalo Poetics =20 Program. He is the author of us look up/ there red dwells (Queue Books). **Stephen Collis http://epc.buffalo.edu/authors/collis/ Stephen Collis is the author of three books of poetry, Mine (New =20 Star); Anarchive (New Star), which was nominated for the Dorothy =20 Livesay Poetry Prize; and The Commons (Talonbooks)=97the latter two of =20= which form parts of his on-going =93Barricades Project.=94 He is also = the =20 author of two book-length studies, Phyllis Webb and the Common Good =20 (Talonbooks) and Through Words of Others: Susan Howe and Anarcho-=20 Scholasticism (ELS Editions). His new book, On the Material (which =20 includes the long poem =934x4=94) is forthcoming from Talonbooks next =20= year. Long a member of the Kootenay School of Writing, he teaches =20 American literature, poetry, and poetics at Simon Fraser University. **Zack Finch http://bostonreview.net/BR29.6/finch.php Zack Finch is a doctoral candidate in the poetics program at the State =20= University of New York at Buffalo and teaches periodically as a =20 visiting lecturer in creative writing at Dartmouth College. His poems =20= and reviews have appeared in journals such as Poetry, American Letters =20= & Commentary, Boston Review, and Tin House. **Sueyeun Juliette Lee http://corollarypress.blogspot.com/ Sueyeun Juliette Lee lives in Philadelphia, where she edits Corollary =20= Press, a chapbook series devoted to new work by writers of color. Her =20= publications include That Gorgeous Feeling (Coconut Books), and the =20 chapbooks Mental Commitment Robots (Portable Press at Yo-Yo Labs), =20 Perfect Villagers (Octopus Books), and Trespass Slightly In (Coconut). **Benjamin Miller Benjamin Miller has an M.F.A. from CalArts and is a writer and a =20 musician. He lives in NYC. ---- Directions: C/E to 23rd St., 1/9 to 18th St. Venue is bet. 10th and 11th avenues Next event: Thurs. Sept. 10 d.a. levy lives: celebrating the renegade press, Season 7 Kick-Off Day 2 of 3rd annual Welcome to Boog City poetry and music festival Rope-A-Dope Press (South Boston, Mass.) http://ropeadopebooks.blogspot.com/ -- David A. Kirschenbaum, editor and publisher Boog City 330 W.28th St., Suite 6H NY, NY 10001-4754 For event and publication information: http://welcometoboogcity.com/ T: (212) 842-BOOG (2664)= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 05:13:38 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve russell Subject: Re: Tough economy - insight? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable i forgot to mention dog walking. & the money is excellent if you can do it = free lance. it works in d.c. because many people are workoholics and haven'= t lives but do have an income and enough guilt to pay someone to walk their= dogs. do the arthimitic. one dog per/half hour/15.00 ... add dogs ... evem= at a reduced rate ...=20 --- On Fri, 7/17/09, Mary Kasimor wrote: > From: Mary Kasimor > Subject: Re: Tough economy - insight? > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Friday, July 17, 2009, 2:56 PM > My understanding is that colleges and > universities are doing well during the bad economy. If your > friends have MA's or MFA's, I suggest that they talk to the > chairs in the English or other departments that they are > qualified to teach in.=20 >=20 > --- On Fri, 7/17/09, amy king > wrote: >=20 >=20 > From: amy king > Subject: Tough economy - insight? > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Friday, July 17, 2009, 1:47 PM >=20 >=20 > I've got a few friends -- poet friends -- who have recently > suffered the "lay off" axe.=A0 While I suspect this axe is > wielded to make more profits for stockholders and management > (didn't JP Morgan just pull in a huge unpredicted spike in > profit this quarter?), I know the concrete reality is that > my friends are suffering and may for some time to come.=A0 > Profit increases are fun to brag about and buy yachts with, > but finding enough cash to feed the landlord isn't so > pleasant.=A0=20 >=20 > So I'm asking:=A0 what would you do?=A0 Any job insight > advice?=A0 What work/markets are still available to these > poets, many with college degrees?=A0 Where do you seek > listings friendly to the poetically-inclined?=A0 Know of any > work available in NY?=A0 (Feel free to backchannel on that > last question, for I have some astute poet friends ready, > smart, and quite able) >=20 > Just wondering.=A0 And if you have any stories -- inspiring > or otherwise -- please do share~ >=20 > Thanks, >=20 > Amy > =A0 >=20 > _______ >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > Amy's Alias >=20 > http://amyking.org/ >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all > posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/= welcome.html >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all > posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/= welcome.html > =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 06:28:25 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve russell Subject: Poetry/Failure MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable so, with Auden, suppose that "Poetry makes nothing happen." or, as Charles Simic points out: "The act of torture consist of various str= ategies/meant to increase/ the imagination of homo sapiens." =A0it seems as though we're left with little more than irony. besides pleasure, what can poetry offer? perhaps the one successful didatic poet of the 20th century, Bertold Brecht= , said it best: All roads led into the mire in my time. My tongue betrayed me to the butchers. There was little I could do. But those in power Sat safer withut me: that was my hope. So passed my time Which hadbeen given to me on earth. =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 11:58:07 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Kyle Schlesinger Subject: new mailing address Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Dear friends, As of August 1, 2009 the mailing address for Kyle Schlesinger and Cuneiform Press will be: Kyle Schlesinger Cuneiform Press 5003 Eilers Avenue Austin, Texas 78751 Telephone number, email, and urls will remain the same. We're bringing along a new Vandercook, type cabinet, and other letterpress goods. Watch for new publications this fall, starting with Bill Berkson and George Schneeman's collaboration TED BERRIGAN. Cheers, Kyle - - - - - Kyle Schlesinger Proprietor Cuneiform Press www.cuneiformpress.com www.cuneiformpress.blogspot.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 14:19:56 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Charles Bernstein Subject: University of Alabama Press Recession Sale MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hank Lazer and I are glad to pass this on to the Poetics List (some of our favorite books). Our Summer Recession special on select titles. Not 20% off ... not 30% ... not even one-third off ... One half-price. Yes you heard that right ... a fifty percent discount. five o incredible? unbelievable? perhaps ... But act now while supplies last ... ----------------------------------------------------- The University of Alabama Press is proud to offer a RECESSION SPECIAL on many of the titles found in its Modern and Contemporary Poetics Series. Purchase any of the following books at 50% off the regular retail price. (See below for pricing in USD and ISBNs required for ordering.) To purchase a copy of any of these titles at the HALF PRICE discount offer, good through August 30, 2009, just call our warehouse in Chicago toll-free at (800) 621-2736 or locally at (773) 702-7000 and mention sales code MCPRS-01. As always, we invite you to forward this e-mail to any of your colleagues who you think might be interested, or suggest names and addresses to which we should send future mailings. If you have any questions, please contact me directly at rminder@uapress.ua.edu or 205-348-1566. For more information on these and other titles in the Modern and Contemporary Poetics Series, visit our website at http://uapress.ua.edu/series.cfm?id=MCP. Rebecca Todd Minder Electronic Marketing, Advertising, and Exhibits Manager The University of Alabama Press Box 870380, Tuscaloosa, AL 35487-0380 rminder@uapress.ua.edu 205.348.1566 * 205.348.9201 fax Led by Language by Rachel Back (paper, ISBN 0-8173-1132-7): $27.50 now $13.75 Another South by Bill Lavender (paper, ISBN 0-8173-1241-2): $28.95 now $14.48 Syncopations by Jed Rasula (paper, ISBN 0-8173-5030-6): $29.95 now $14.98 A Poetics of Impasse by Susan M. Schultz (paper, ISBN 0-8173-5198-1): $36.00 now $18.00 What Is a Poet? by Hank Lazer (paper, ISBN 0-8173-0326-X): $29.75 now $14.88 Simulcast by Benjamin Friedlander (paper, ISBN 0-8173-5028-4): $29.95 now $14.98 The Point Is To Change It by Jerome McGann (paper, ISBN 0-8173-5408-5): $32.95 now $16.48 Hart Crane by Brian M. Reed (paper, ISBN 0-8173- 5270-8): $35.00 now $17.50 Louis Zukofsky by Mark Scroggins (paper, ISBN 0-8173- 0957-8): $27.50 now $13.75 All prices are in U.S. Dollars / Canada residents add 7% GST / International shipping: $8.50 per book Domestic shipping: $5.00 for the first book and $1.00 for each additional book Offer expires August 30, 2009 Sales Code: MCPRS-01 ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 15:10:57 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?S=E9amas_Cain?= Subject: "a sonic field recording ..." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable _______________ tr=EDd an gcoill ("through the woods") by S=E9amas Cain has been published by The Red Jasper in Dublin, Ireland to read Liam Carson's review of the book in the July 2009 issue of "Poetry Ireland Review" go to ... http://www.freewebs.com/seamascain/liamcarsonsreview.htm to read S=E9amas Cain's response to various questions from Liam Carson, go to ... http://www.freewebs.com/seamascain/questionsanswers.htm tr=EDd an gcoill ("through the woods") ISBN 978-0-9563001-0-2 http://www.freewebs.com/seamascain/ may be purchased from "An Seancheann" (The Old Head) Books & Collections, Woodley House, Castletownshend Road, Skibbereen, County Cork, Ireland Web-site: http://www.worldwidebookshop.com/detail/16526AB/ Phone: +353 87 290 36 13 E-mail: worldwidebookshop@hotmail.com _______________ =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 01:31:04 +0000 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: blacksox@ATT.NET Subject: Showdown in O Town-7/23, 7pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Thursday, July 23 7PM to 10PM at The Cameo Theatre (located in the old Cruises Only building - 1013 E. Colonial Drive), Team Orlando 2009 will face off against three other teams packed with amazing poets in a National Poetry Slam style bout where, after four rounds, one team will win the first ever Showdown in O-Town. Our teams are so far: Team Orlando 2009: Shawn Welcome, Curtis Meyer, Ronin, MyVerse, Alex Ruiz - the most talented team Orlando will ever throw at the National Poetry Slam thus far. This is an amazing mix of accomplished poets and hungry newcomers who will rock your faces off with their poetic might. Team Slamazon: Kendra Corrie, Dani O., Veronica Smith, Holly Riggs - this team features both winners of the 2009 Fringe Poetry Smackdown (who both won with 30s), a 2009 Smackdown runner up, and a poetic leviathan emerging from the depths. This steam is fierce. They will destroy you with their verse, then wear your skin like a pelt. Team Payback: Tod Caviness, Trevor Fraiser, Tam Tam the Sandwich Man, Alex Vega - all these poets were part of the Broken Speech Post-Season and they seek vengenance on Team Orlando for denying them from representing the City Beautiful. Team Pandemonium : Chaz Yorick, Lilly, Michael Sloan, Zachary Kluckman - this team is the ultimate wildcard. We can only speculate the mayhem this mysterious group can cause. These teams will face Team Orlando at the Showdown in O-Town in an epic bout never seen before in the City Beautiful...until now. And we have a super special feature to kick off the show - individual National Poetry Slam Champion and individual World Poetry Slam Champion Mighty Mike McGee. Wanna hear the best part? You can see this National Poetry Slam style bout with a side of legendary for just $5. $5 to see amazing poetry. $5 to get your face rocked so far off, you can put it on a wall as a trophy to tell your grandchildren about that time poetry rocked your face off on this night. For your $5, you not only get to witness awesome poetry but get your name thrown in the hat for a door prize: a $25 gift card to Urban Think, Orlando's only independent book store. All proceeds go to Team Orlando 2009. Peace Russ Golata ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 14:53:31 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Comments: RFC822 error: Invalid RFC822 field - "unders=". Rest of header flushed. From: Sam Truitt Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Right - many thanks - that's the terrific saying - with the triple=0Aunders= tanding of "nothing" as no correspondence outside itself - no=0Apurpose - = it doesn't do anything except what it does - not causal -=0Ait's intransiti= ve (as came up) and so the PLEASURE (also come up) is in=0Aand of itself - = what Williams said, "If it's not a pleasure it's not a=0Apoem" - and then = "nothing" as an IMPOSSIBILITY - as even a vacuum has=0Aa form, or there is = a meeting - and so one can keep saying - or trying,=0Aas somebody said - bu= t one fails - one FALLS, which is the cadence=0A(dance) and Cage's chance t= oo (both from the Latin "cadere" - to fall).=0AThat "nothing" is like Cage'= s SILENCE, an experiential impossibility -=0Ait's a concept - going back to= the vacuum - as he discovered entering=0Ain a sound-proof chamber and hear= d the hum of his nervous system. That=0Athere is an inside. So, what's the = point of saying - speaking or=0Awriting - except the pleasure and the findi= ng, measuring, how=0Athings fall out, arrange themselves, in language or an= y other symbolic=0Asystem... I have found personally it's to put myself int= o a situation=0Ain which I can no harm. Celine said someplace that there ar= e two kinds=0Aof poets: those that write and those that don't, noting the l= atter are=0Amore happy. And maybe if you don't try you can't fail... I don'= t know=0Aif that Ridingly true, but it does seem to have something to do wi= th self - that very thing that seems in a situation of=0Acomposition=0Anece= ssary to be out of - as self is "separate" - it's critical,=0Adivides:=0Ayo= u lose the whole - and there is one, just as there is nothing, too -=0Awe s= ense - like "the hub of a wheel, the immobile center that=0Amakes rotation = possible." But the fail is a pleasure - it gets at=0Athe root of how we are= - the risk - as someplace I heard we are born=0Awith two instincts: reacti= on to loud noises and fear of falling.=0A=0A=0A----- Original Message ----= =0AFrom: Halvard Johnson =0ATo: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO= .EDU=0ASent: Friday, July 17, 2009 4:33:44 PM=0ASubject: Re: Poetry and Fai= lure=0A=0A"I have nothing to say and am saying it, and that is poetry."=0A = --John Cage (more or less)=0A=0A=0AHal=0A=0A"A paranoid is someone who kn= ows a little=0Aof what's going on."=0A --William S. Burr= oughs=0A=0AHalvard Johnson=0A=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=0Ahalvard@gmail.com=0Ahttp://sites.google.com/site/halvardjohnson/Home= =0Ahttp://entropyandme.blogspot.com=0Ahttp://imageswithoutwords.blogspot.co= m=0Ahttp://www.hamiltonstone.org=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0AOn Fri, Jul 17, 2009 at 1= :23 PM, Sam Truitt wrote:=0A=0A> "You can say anythin= g in prose, so poetry should be reserved for saying=0A> nothing"=0A> (Khleb= nikov), like the soul, lost at the xroads.=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A> ----- Original M= essage ----=0A> From: Nicholas Piombino =0A> To: P= OETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU=0A> Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 11:46:21 PM= =0A> Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure=0A>=0A> "Opens magazine several times = at the fact that poetry is at crossroads."=0A>=0A> F. Scott Fitzgerald (fro= m "The Notebooks", in "The Crack Up", edited by=0A> Edmund Wilson)=0A>=0A>= =0A> On 7/16/09 6:28 PM, "Sam Truitt" wrote:=0A>=0A> = > Is this thread I'm surprised not to see Laura Riding (Jackson) hasn't=0A>= come up=0A> > - her sentiment as nailed by posthumous title THE FAILURE OF= POETRY, THE=0A> > PROMISE OF LANGUAGE (ed. John Nolan) underscored by her = giving up poems=0A> in the=0A> > late 1930's - tied to truth, to being true= - but she writes someplace=0A> (her=0A> > essay on Stein maybe?):=0A> >=0A= > > =C2=B3=C5=A0if poetry had all subjects taken away from it,=0A> > there = was one subject of which poetry could not be deprived, namely, that=0A> > p= oetry had come to an end. Here was an ingenious method for indefinitely=0A>= > postponing the end of poetry=C5=A0 since poetry was to write about nothi= ng, it=0A> > could=0A> > write about everything from the standpoint of noth= ing; it could still=0A> have its=0A> > epic without the burden of having to= have convictions about it.=C2=B2=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> > ----- Origi= nal Message ----=0A> > From: carol dorf =0A> > To: PO= ETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU=0A> > Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 9:22:50 AM= =0A> > Subject: Re: Poetry and Failure=0A> >=0A> > Hard to say where one "p= oem" ends and the next begins.=0A> >=0A> > Don't forget pleasure -- pleasur= e in language, pleasure in structuring=0A> the=0A> > "poem," referencing ex= perience.=0A> >=0A> > (Almost all of reading, for me; and a good part of my= writing.)=0A> >=0A> > On Wed, Jul 15, 2009 at 11:56 AM, Elizabeth Switaj <= poesis@gmail.com>=0A> wrote:=0A> >=0A> >>> Do we continue to write poetry b= ecause it ultimately fails to do what=0A> we=0A> >> hope it might or should= ?=0A> >>=0A> >> That may be so for some and certainly is why I continue to = write* a=0A> poem*,=0A> >> but other than that I continue writing because t= hose hopes shift and are=0A> >> various.=0A> >>=0A> >>> Is the "failure of = poetry" a failure of language, or poetics?=0A> >>=0A> >> Yes.=0A> >>=0A> >>= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A> >> The Poetics List is moderated & does = not accept all posts. Check=0A> guidelines=0A> >> & sub/unsub info: http://= epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=0A> >>=0A> >=0A> > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=0A> > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. = Check=0A> guidelines &=0A> > sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics= /welcome.html=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=0A> > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check= =0A> guidelines &=0A> > sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welc= ome.html=0A>=0A> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A> The Poetics List is moder= ated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines=0A> & sub/unsub info: ht= tp://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A> =3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A> The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all = posts. Check guidelines=0A> & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetic= s/welcome.html=0A>=0A=0A=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0AThe Poetics List is m= oderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: ht= tp://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 20:51:36 -0500 Reply-To: dgodston@gmail.com Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Daniel Godston Organization: Borderbend Arts Collective Subject: Chicago Bauhaus in July MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit "Chicago Bauhaus in July" Saturday, July 25 (3-6 p.m.) at Acme Art Works You are invited to attend "Chicago Bauhaus in July," which features poetry and micro-fiction readings, an art talk, musical performances, a discussion about the Michael Reese Hospital, a "Metallic Fest" workshop, and a conversation about a new Cairo-Chicago project initiative. The purposes of "Chicago Bauhaus in July" are to creatively explore the Bauhaus spirit, and to raise awareness about the current effort to preserve the buildings on the Michael Reese Hospital campus. * * * Al DeGenova, Jamie Kazay, Charlie Newman, and Larry Sawyer read selections of their poetry. David Boykin performs a set of solo percussion. Amanda Marbais reads several micro-fiction pieces. Members of the Gropius in Chicago Coalition give a presentation about the ongoing campaign to preserve the buildings designed by Bauhaus founder Walter Gropius, on the Michael Reese Hospital campus. performance by Amalgamating -- Paul Hartsaw -- tenor saxophone Dan Godston -- trumpet Alex Wing -- drums Jerome Bryerton -- drums Bert Stabler gives a talk about how his artwork has been influenced by Bauhaus artists Paul Klee and Laszlo Moholy-Nagy. Houreya Elsayed and Dan Godston talk about the Cairo-Chicago project, via skype. "Metallic Festival" workshop In 1929, the Bauhaus hosted a Metallic Festival, during which participants dressed up in metal outfits. Part of the impetus behind that was the Bauhaus' insistence that industrialization could be playful. Also, Bauhaus artist/choreographer Oskar Schlemmer created "Metal Dance," which explored metal as a material that has remarkable light-reflecting properties. Participants of the "Metallic Festival" workshop will design metal costumes, as well as have the opportunity to make hand-sculpted metal objects (such as hats and miniature buildings). Also, musicians will interact with the sounds of amplified metal, during a several-minute improvised piece. $5 suggested donation, sliding scale This event is hosted by the Near Northwest Arts Council at Acme Art Works, and it is co-organized by the Borderbend Arts Collective and the Gropius in Chicago Coalition. Acme Art Works St Paul's Cultural Center 2215 West North Ave. Chicago, IL 60647 http://www.nnwac.org/ http://www.gropiuschicago.org http://requitedjournal.com/index.php?/masthead/ http://www.myspace.com/davidboykinexpanse http://www.myspace.com/zootsuitbeatnick http://metastablesound.com/ http://www.milkmag.org/ http://www.bertstabler.com http://www.myspace.com/alexwing http://www.myspace.com/jeromebryerton http://www.bauhaus9090.org ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 20:39:06 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Troy Camplin Subject: Re: spiritual materialism In-Reply-To: <252562.78342.qm@web52403.mail.re2.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable It is as completely unrelated to dianetics as one could possibly be, trust = me. The term is Greek. Dia- means through, and physics from physis, meaning= nature. "Through the levels of nature." That's diaphysics. =0A=0ATroy=0A= =0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0AFrom: steve russell =0ATo: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU=0ASent: Monday, July 20= , 2009 3:14:44 PM=0ASubject: Re: spiritual materialism=0A=0Asounds sort of = similiar to dianetics, or scientology in drag. cynical, ugh, me.=0A--- On S= un, 7/19/09, Troy Camplin wrote:=0A=0A> From: Troy = Camplin =0A> Subject: Re: spiritual materialism=0A> = To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU=0A> Date: Sunday, July 19, 2009, 9:46 PM= =0A> Troy Cam=0A> My book Diaphysics is precisely about spiritual=0A> matie= rialism.=0A> =0A> Troy Camplin=0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> ____________________= ____________=0A> From: Christopher Rizzo =0A> To: POETIC= S@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU=0A> Sent: Monday, July 6, 2009 3:08:12 PM=0A> Subjec= t: Re: spiritual materialism=0A> =0A> I'm finding this string really quite = interesting. Glad to=0A> hear evidence of=0A> such a wide-ranging interest.= =0A> =0A> Aryanil, much thanks for reminding me of Whitman and=0A> Tagore. = I'm tempted to=0A> add Pound to that set, too.=0A> =0A> There are a few sig= nificant differences between, say, Olson=0A> and Whitman.=0A> Briefly, Olso= n's cosmology took the philosophy of=0A> mathematics, quantum=0A> mechanics= , and Cybernetic theory (which turns into=0A> information theory,=0A> reall= y) into account, as well as the phenomenology of=0A> Merleau-Ponty, etc.=0A= > =0A> For sure, there are similarities to Whitman, but I figured=0A> (perh= aps too=0A> hastily?) that a post-Heisenberg view of reality might key=0A> = into Jim's ideas=0A> a bit more readily.=0A> =0A> As for Eastern approaches= to spirituality, perhaps one of=0A> the more=0A> interesting bits in Olson= is his use of the first line from=0A> Wilhelm's=0A> translation of The Sec= ret of the Golden Flower: "That which=0A> exists through=0A> itself is what= is called meaning." And it is useful to note=0A> that Whilhelm=0A> transla= tes "meaning" with a capital "M" (suggesting Tao),=0A> whereas Olson uses= =0A> the term in lower-case.=0A> =0A> Simply (and reductively), Olson uses = the line to indicate=0A> something closer=0A> to autopoiesis than Logos, or= rather the One. Creeley=0A> explains that one=0A> consequence of all this = is that language is not=0A> "importantly" referential.=0A> Still provocativ= e, I think.=0A> =0A> And, Chris, as for Benjamin, I'm thinking of his use o= f=0A> "nunc stans," in=0A> particular, and what uses it may have in this co= ntext....=0A> =0A> Anyway, just a few thoughts.=0A> =0A> Bests,=0A> Chris= =0A> =0A> On Mon, Jul 6, 2009 at 1:47 PM, Jonathan Ball =0A> wrote:=0A> =0A> > Some of these ideas might approach the way Slavoj= =0A> Zizek reads the Hegelian=0A> > paradox that "the spirit is a bone" ...= . I am=0A> travelling without any books=0A> > and so I can't say much more = or even verify my quote=0A> etc but your the Olson=0A> > quote brings this = idea to mind, in light of the=0A> previous email.=0A> >=0A> > Jonathan Ball= =0A> >=0A> > On Sun, Jul 5, 2009 at 10:29 PM, Christopher Rizzo=0A> > >wrote:=0A> >=0A> > > Jim,=0A> > >=0A> > > Interesting po= st. Are you familiar with Charles=0A> Olson's work? In a=0A> > > conversati= on with Herbert Kenny, 1969, Olson says=0A> "I mean something I=0A> > > bel= ieve we possess crucially. I think our body is=0A> our soul. And if you=0A>= > > don't=0A> > > have your body as a factor of creation, you don't=0A> ha= ve a soul." Olson=0A> > > articulates the same idea at other times, too.=0A= > > >=0A> > > In any event, an explanation of the above would=0A> prove len= gthy, so please=0A> > > feel free to backchannel me if you're so=0A> inclin= ed. I'm writing two books=0A> > on=0A> > > Olson at the moment.=0A> > >=0A>= > > c.rizzo@gmail.com=0A> > >=0A> > > Bests,=0A> > > Chris=0A> > >=0A> > >= On Sun, Jul 5, 2009 at 3:41 PM, Jim Andrews=0A> =0A> wrote:= =0A> > >=0A> > >=A0 > it is commonly observed that a great deal=0A> of cont= emporary art/writing=0A> > > > involves a double sense of 'the material'.= =0A> the term is understood to=0A> > > refer=0A> > > > not only to the subj= ect matter (the=0A> 'standard' understanding in=0A> > writing)=0A> > > but= =0A> > > > also the matter of the media in the piece,=0A> the material embo= diment of=0A> > the=0A> > > > piece. it's also commonly observed that the= =0A> latter awareness of and=0A> > > approach=0A> > > > to composition not = solely by ideation,=0A> meditation on the subject=0A> > matter,=0A> > > but= =0A> > > > also through operation on the material=0A> embodiment, has come = to be much=0A> > > more=0A> > > > widely understood as a part of reading th= an=0A> it was a generation ago.=0A> > when=0A> > > we=0A> > > > encounter w= ork that does not follow the=0A> grammars and approaches=0A> > > > traditio= nally associated with work, we=0A> inquire into the methods of=0A> > > > co= mposition, the approach to materiality,=0A> and look for relations=0A> > be= tween=0A> > > > those methods and approaches and the subject=0A> matter, or= look for the=0A> > > subject=0A> > > > matter in the light of those things= . and so=0A> read differently, thereby.=0A> > > and=0A> > > > in this way, = we now read some literary work=0A> in ways that are closer to=0A> > > how= =0A> > > > we approach a great deal of visual art.=0A> > > >=0A> > > > but = what i want to get at is something that=0A> isn't so commonly observed,=0A>= > > at=0A> > > > the moment, but may be in the next=0A> generation. and th= at's the relation=0A> > of=0A> > > > awareness of the materiality of writin= g/art=0A> to our ideas of who and=0A> > what=0A> > > we=0A> > > > are. that= 's erm awkwardly stated. what i'm=0A> trying to get at is this.=0A> > the= =0A> > > > whole emphasis on materiality is involved in=0A> a larger moveme= nt to=0A> > explore=0A> > > > how things like ideation, imagination, the=0A= > spiritual, beauty, truth,=0A> > > > goodness, justice--all our ideals and= things=0A> normally associated with=0A> > the=0A> > > > immaterial--operat= e in the material world.=0A> > > >=0A> > > > in this sense, we might say th= at the whole=0A> contemporary awareness of=0A> > > > materiality in art is = part of a larger ah=0A> spiritual materialism. i=0A> > > googled=0A> > > > = that term, after it occurred to me, and i=0A> assure you i'm using it in a= =0A> > > > different sense than ch=F6gyam trungpa, who=0A> uses it "to desc= ribe mistakes=0A> > > > spiritual seekers commit which turn the=0A> pursuit= of spiritualism into an=0A> > > ego=0A> > > > building and confusion creat= ing endeavor"=0A> (wikipedia). instead, i'm=0A> > > refering=0A> > > > to a= relatively common sort of philosophy in=0A> which the material=0A> > subst= rate=0A> > > of=0A> > > > ideation and even the spiritual is affirmed=0A> a= nd its relations with even=0A> > > the=0A> > > > flightiest of fancies are = explored. not to=0A> denigrate or dismiss things=0A> > > like=0A> > > > spi= rituality but to explore how they operate=0A> materially.=0A> > > >=0A> > >= > perhaps more evidently, now, this is also=0A> related to philosophies of= =0A> > mind=0A> > > > in which the materiality of thought itself=0A> is aff= irmed--as a chemical=0A> > and=0A> > > > informational process, however eme= rgent--and=0A> the brain and the mind=0A> > that=0A> > > > emerge from its = processes are conceived as=0A> fully embodied in the=0A> > > material.=0A> = > > > so that the idea of being able to create=0A> thinking machines (howev= er=0A> > > unlike=0A> > > > us) becomes a real possibility. and we are=0A> = conceptualized as nature's=0A> > > > (near?) ultimate machines. and machine= s are=0A> conceptualized not as the=0A> > > simple=0A> > > > things we once= thought they must be but as=0A> often very complex=0A> > biological=0A> > = > > creatures that, nonetheless, are embodied in=0A> the material world and= =0A> > are,=0A> > > > therefore, subject to the constraints and=0A> possibi= lities of machines in=0A> > > the=0A> > > > material world.=0A> > > >=0A> >= > > to wrap it up, we now see the relation=0A> between contemporary artist= ic=0A> > > > emphasis on the materiality of writing/art=0A> and the larger = moment of=0A> > > > 'spiritual materialism'.=0A> > > >=0A> > > > ja=0A> > >= > http://vispo.com=0A> > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A> > > > The Poe= tics List is moderated & does not=0A> accept all posts. Check=0A> > > guide= lines=0A> > > > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.ht= ml=0A> > > >=0A> > >=0A> > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A> > > The Poeti= cs List is moderated & does not=0A> accept all posts. Check=0A> > guideline= s=0A> > > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=0A>= > >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> > --=0A> > www.jonathanball.com=0A> > www.jonath= anball.blogspot.com=0A> > www.haikuhoroscopes.com=0A> >=0A> > =3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A> > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept=0A> a= ll posts. Check guidelines=0A> > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/p= oetics/welcome.html=0A> >=0A> =0A> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A> The Poe= tics List is moderated & does not accept all=0A> posts. Check guidelines & = sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=0A> =0A> =0A> = =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A> The Poetics List is moderated & does not ac= cept all=0A> posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.e= du/poetics/welcome.html=0A> =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0A= The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 10:20:56 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jade Hudson Subject: Last call for Toxic Issue 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This is a friendly reminder that the submission period for www.toxicpoetry.com is quickly coming to its end. We will be closing the doors for the first issue on July 28th. Once again, we are an online publication for international, experimental, mp3 poetry. We welcome submissions from anyone who is experimenting with the mp3 format. If you would like to send us work: -E-mail editors@toxicpoetry.com with your mp3(s) as (an) attachment(s), with the title(s) of the piece(s) and your name. If you have questions, comments, or info that can help us: -E-mail toxicquestions@gmail.com You are free to send as much work as you like. In fact, we welcome this. Much thanks to those that have already blessed us with their submissions. Happy Submitting and a Toxic Toast, Jade Hudson Toxic Co-editor and Webmaster ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 13:05:47 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: David Kirschenbaum Subject: A Few Tables Available at Boog Fest's Small, Small Press Fair Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v924) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi all, Boog City still has room for a few more tablers and would like to =20 invite you to exhibit at our 6th annual small, small press fair (with =20= indie records and crafts, too). For the first time the fair will span two days, Sat. Sept. 12-Sun. =20 Sept. 13, and will be held at a new location, Brooklyn=92s Unnameable =20= Books (600 Vanderbilt Ave.) in their backyard. The fair will take =20 place during the final two days of the 3rd annual Welcome to Boog City =20= poetry and music festival. The fair will open on Saturday with two-and-a-half hours of =20 performances by authors from each of the tablers. Tables are $30 for the fair, $20 dollars if you bring your own bridge =20= table (of up to 3=92 x 3=92) with a portion of the proceeds going to = help =20 Unnameable Books. Door charge for attendees is by donation. Please email me, Boog City editor and publisher David Kirschenbaum, to = editor@boogcity.com=20 , as soon as possible to reserve your table and schedule your reader. =20= We look forward to the fair once again being a warm gathering with =20 wonderful books, poetry, music, and other items from around our =20 creative community. This year=92s fair will feature a barbecue from our good friends at =20 Unnameable, as well as readings, musical performances, poets in =20 conversation, and a lively panel. Below this note is the schedule for =20= the two days of the fair. as ever, David ------------- Sat. 9/12, 12:00 p.m. Unnameable Books 600 Vanderbilt Ave., bet. Prospect Pl. St. Marks Ave., Brooklyn 6th Annual Small, Small Press Fair Featuring readings from authors of the exhibiting presses from 12:00 p.m.-2:30 p.m. Presses include: Dan Wilcox, A.P.D. (Dan Wilcox) Jennifer Knox, Bloof Books (Shanna Compton) Andrew Hughes, Book Thug (Jay MillAr) Norman Lock, Ellipsis Press (Eugene Lim) reader TK, EOAGH (Tim Peterson) reader TK, Litmus Press (Julian Brolaski) reader TK, Outskirts Press (Will Hallgren) Austin Alexis, Poets Wear Prada (Roxanne Hoffman) reader TK, Portable Press at Yo-Yo Labs Press (Brenda Ijima) reader TK, 2nd Avenue Press (Paolo Javier) reader TK, Straw Gate Press (Phyllis Wat) Rachel Levitsky, Ugly Duckling Presse (Matvei Yankelevich) ----------------- 2:30 p.m.-Jesse Schoen-music 3:00 p.m.-Ammiel Alcalay 3:15 p.m.-Danielle Le Gros Georges 3:35 p.m.-Ryan Walker 3:55 p.m.-Jim Dunn 4:15 p.m.-Phoebe Kreutz-music 4:45 p.m.-Karen Weiser 5:00 p.m.-Katie Yates 5:20 p.m.-Dana Ward 5:40 p.m.-Anselm Berrigan 5:55 p.m.-Anselm Berrigan in conversation with Buck Downs 6:25 p.m.-Buck Downs 6:45 p.m.-Gracefully-music 7:15 p.m.-Jean-Paul Pecqueur 7:30 p.m.-Brenda Coultas 7:45 p.m.-Mike County 8:05 p.m.-Ish Klein Sun. 9/13, 12:00 p.m. Unnameable Books 6th Annual Small, Small Press Fair 12:00 p.m.-Paul Foster Johnson 12:15 p.m.-Nick Piombino 12:30 p.m.-Eric Gelsinger 12:45 p.m.-Joanna Sondheim 1:00 p.m.-Tracey McTague 1:15 p.m.-Alan Semerdjian-music 1:45 p.m.-Martha King 2:00 p.m.-Brendan Lorber 2:15 p.m.-Dan Wilcox 2:35 p.m.-Basil King 2:50 p.m.-3:00-break 3:00 p.m.-Discussion of Politics, Community, Poetics curated and moderated by Greg Fuchs featuring Jonathan Allen, Antonio D'Ambrosio, Allen Gilbert, Eileen =20 Myles, and more 4:30 p.m.-4:40-break 4:40 p.m.-Corina Copp 4:55 p.m.-Lewis Warsh 5:10 p.m.-Hailey Higdon 5:30 p.m.-Shanna Compton 5:45 p.m.-Angela Veronica Wong 6:00 p.m.-Dorit-music 6:30 p.m.-Cristiana Baik 6:45 p.m.-Paolo Javier 7:00 p.m.-Sara Wintz 7:15 p.m.-Ryan Murphy 7:30 p.m.-Gary Parrish 7:45 p.m.-Justin Marks --=20 David A. Kirschenbaum, editor and publisher Boog City 330 W. 28th St., Suite 6H NY, NY 10001-4754 For event and publication information: http://welcometoboogcity.com/ T: (212) 842-BOOG (2664)= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 18:38:19 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Douglas Manson Subject: Re: Tough economy - insight? In-Reply-To: <211428.7303.qm@web52403.mail.re2.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Weirdly enough, I am moving to NYC just as Amy sees her friends and poets losing jobs. There has to be a way that people can form a group or organization, or as Duncan said somewhere--create the free association of mutual interests--to put all this corporate/institutionally-squandered skill, smarts, agility and amazing perception to work, and meaningfully so. We know why the economy is derailed, but why not start making work by making something new that people are actively interested and engaged in--not anything already done to death, or that bores us into paralysis-- I just hate to think of how many people out there are seemingly idled by a brain-stalled system, failed promises, and the sluggish, backwards logic of our education system. and i'm sick of getting emails that start out "wish I had better news to give you about our department...the economy" blah blah blah. yuck, doug On Wed, Jul 22, 2009 at 8:13 AM, steve russell wrote: > i forgot to mention dog walking. & the money is excellent if you can do it > free lance. it works in d.c. because many people are workoholics and haven't > lives but do have an income and enough guilt to pay someone to walk their > dogs. do the arthimitic. one dog per/half hour/15.00 ... add dogs ... evem > at a reduced rate ... > > --- On Fri, 7/17/09, Mary Kasimor wrote: > > > From: Mary Kasimor > > Subject: Re: Tough economy - insight? > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > Date: Friday, July 17, 2009, 2:56 PM > > My understanding is that colleges and > > universities are doing well during the bad economy. If your > > friends have MA's or MFA's, I suggest that they talk to the > > chairs in the English or other departments that they are > > qualified to teach in. > > > > --- On Fri, 7/17/09, amy king > > wrote: > > > > > > From: amy king > > Subject: Tough economy - insight? > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > Date: Friday, July 17, 2009, 1:47 PM > > > > > > I've got a few friends -- poet friends -- who have recently > > suffered the "lay off" axe. While I suspect this axe is > > wielded to make more profits for stockholders and management > > (didn't JP Morgan just pull in a huge unpredicted spike in > > profit this quarter?), I know the concrete reality is that > > my friends are suffering and may for some time to come. > > Profit increases are fun to brag about and buy yachts with, > > but finding enough cash to feed the landlord isn't so > > pleasant. > > > > So I'm asking: what would you do? Any job insight > > advice? What work/markets are still available to these > > poets, many with college degrees? Where do you seek > > listings friendly to the poetically-inclined? Know of any > > work available in NY? (Feel free to backchannel on that > > last question, for I have some astute poet friends ready, > > smart, and quite able) > > > > Just wondering. And if you have any stories -- inspiring > > or otherwise -- please do share~ > > > > Thanks, > > > > Amy > > > > > > _______ > > > > > > > > > > > > Amy's Alias > > > > http://amyking.org/ > > > > > > > > > > ================================== > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all > > posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > > > > > > > ================================== > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all > > posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 21:05:00 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: crystal hoffman Subject: Re: Tough economy - insight? In-Reply-To: <60466cc60907231538q71aedd97xb53f72e8d01c0423@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Copy editing work is tough, but its always a good place to start into the p= ublishing field. The company I work for Beacon Premedia Global is growing a= nd hiring. I work on the American Physical Society's journal APR D: Particl= es, Fields, Gravitation, and Cosmology. (Absolutely fascinating research on= the nature of dark matter being done right now). I could give you contact = information if you like. It's twenty hours a week, work from home, ten hour= s have to be done 9-5 and the rest are flex, pay is anywhere between 11 and= 13 and hour depending on experience, 60 hours PTO.=20 Let me know if you are interested. Crystal J. Hoffman crystaljeanhoffman@gmail.com --- On Thu, 7/23/09, Douglas Manson wrote: From: Douglas Manson Subject: Re: Tough economy - insight? To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Thursday, July 23, 2009, 6:38 PM Weirdly enough, I am moving to NYC just as Amy sees her friends and poets losing jobs.=A0 There has to be a way that people can form a group or organization, or as Duncan said somewhere--create the free association of mutual interests--to put all this corporate/institutionally-squandered skill, smarts, agility and amazing perception to work, and meaningfully so. We know why the economy is derailed, but why not start making work by makin= g something new that people are actively interested and engaged in--not anything already done to death, or that bores us into paralysis-- I just hate to think of how many people out there are seemingly idled by a brain-stalled system, failed promises, and the sluggish, backwards logic of our education system.=A0 and i'm sick of getting emails that start out "wis= h I had better news to give you about our department...the economy" blah blah blah. yuck, doug On Wed, Jul 22, 2009 at 8:13 AM, steve russell wrot= e: > i forgot to mention dog walking. & the money is excellent if you can do i= t > free lance. it works in d.c. because many people are workoholics and have= n't > lives but do have an income and enough guilt to pay someone to walk their > dogs. do the arthimitic. one dog per/half hour/15.00 ... add dogs ... eve= m > at a reduced rate ... > > --- On Fri, 7/17/09, Mary Kasimor wrote: > > > From: Mary Kasimor > > Subject: Re: Tough economy - insight? > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > Date: Friday, July 17, 2009, 2:56 PM > > My understanding is that colleges and > > universities are doing well during the bad economy. If your > > friends have MA's or MFA's, I suggest that they talk to the > > chairs in the English or other departments that they are > > qualified to teach in. > > > > --- On Fri, 7/17/09, amy king > > wrote: > > > > > > From: amy king > > Subject: Tough economy - insight? > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > Date: Friday, July 17, 2009, 1:47 PM > > > > > > I've got a few friends -- poet friends -- who have recently > > suffered the "lay off" axe.=A0 While I suspect this axe is > > wielded to make more profits for stockholders and management > > (didn't JP Morgan just pull in a huge unpredicted spike in > > profit this quarter?), I know the concrete reality is that > > my friends are suffering and may for some time to come. > > Profit increases are fun to brag about and buy yachts with, > > but finding enough cash to feed the landlord isn't so > > pleasant. > > > > So I'm asking:=A0 what would you do?=A0 Any job insight > > advice?=A0 What work/markets are still available to these > > poets, many with college degrees?=A0 Where do you seek > > listings friendly to the poetically-inclined?=A0 Know of any > > work available in NY?=A0 (Feel free to backchannel on that > > last question, for I have some astute poet friends ready, > > smart, and quite able) > > > > Just wondering.=A0 And if you have any stories -- inspiring > > or otherwise -- please do share~ > > > > Thanks, > > > > Amy > > > > > > _______ > > > > > > > > > > > > Amy's Alias > > > > http://amyking.org/ > > > > > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all > > posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all > > posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 15:40:25 +1000 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: John Tranter Subject: Announcing Jacket 37 -- Early 2009 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Announcing Jacket 37 -- Early 2009 Like the 2004 Hubble Ultra Deep Field image, http://hubblesite.org/newscenter/archive/releases/2004/07/image/a/format/large_web/ ... Jacket glitters with constellations and galaxies of luminous and sometimes bewildering insights: Catch it now, before it swims out of your ken: http://jacketmagazine.com/37/index.shtml Jacket magazine: Editor: John Tranter -- Associate Editor: Pam Brown Visit our new Jacket Notes pages: readings, new books & magazines, blogs, etc. http://sites.google.com/site/jacket-notes/Home You may send Letters to the Editor: please be concise and courteous. http://jacketmagazine.com/00/letters2the-editor.shtml We only have time to read for Jacket in June, July and January: please don't send material out of season. "I dislike a great deal of contemporary poetry -- all of the past you read is usually quite great -- but it is a useful thorn to have in one's side." (Frank O'Hara) In brief, Jacket 37 contents: ========== Articles ========== *** Caroline Bergvall: A Cat in the Throat on bilingual occupants *** Louis Bury: The Exercise and the Oulipo: 99 Variations on a Thesis *** Christopher Rizzo: An Extensive Body of Work: Robert Creeley's Poetics of Affect: "American poetry is indeed "full of daybooks," but American poetry -- and criticism -- are also filled with what Harry Frankfurt accurately terms well-developed programs of producing bullshit..." *** Beverly Dahlen: Some notes on George Stanley 's "Vancouver: A Poem" *** Christopher Funkhouser: Presents: Maria Damon's textile styling *** Jack Spicer's "The Book of the Death of Arthur", by Jim Goar *** George Kalamaras (ed.): Surrealist Inquiry: "Would You Lend Money To?" *** David Kaufmann: Frank O'Hara's Timing *** Kevin Killian: Jack Spicer's Secret *** Burt Kimmelman: George Oppen and Martin Heidegger: The Philosophy and Poetry of "Gelassenheit", and the Language of Faith *** An excerpt from John Latta's blog, "Isola di Rifiuti", May 2009 *** Stephen Mooney: Discontinuous Visuality -- Brakhage's 'just seeing', and background temporality in contemporary poetics *** Douglas Piccinnini: Ashbery In Paris: Out of School *** H. K. Rainey: Along Comes Something: Mapping Motion in Selections from Lyn Hejinian's "Happily" *** Dale Smith: 'Lyric Poetry after Auschwitz'?: Kent Johnson and Political Satire *** Richard Swigg: Parts, Pairs, Positions: A Reading of George Oppen's "Discrete Series" *** Duncan White: "The American Areas": Place, Language and the Construction of Everyday Life in the Novels of Ben Marcus ========== Heaney Agonistes ========== *** Jeffrey Side: The Dissembling Poet: Seamus Heaney and the Avant-garde *** Rob Stanton: 'A shy soul fretting and all that ': Heaney, Prynne and Brands of Uncertainty *** The Group in Belfast, 1960s: (Seamus Heaney: The Early Years) Letters to the Editor from: *** Ira Lightman; *** John Muckle; *** J.P. Craig; *** Jamie McKendrick; *** David Latane; *** Aidan Semmens; *** Ira Lightman (2); *** Jamie McKendrick (2); *** Ira Lightman (3); *** Desmond Swords; *** Todd Swift and Jeffrey Side; *** Jeffrey Side, reply to Desmond Swords; *** Jamie McKendrick (3); *** Ira Lightman (4); *** Jeffrey Side responds to Ira Lightman; *** Jeffrey Side responds to Jamie McKendrick; *** From Desmond Swords, 2009-04-07; *** From Jamie McKendrick, 2009-04-09; *** Jeffrey Side responds to Jamie McKendrick; *** Andrew Boobier ========== Poems ========== *** Louis Armand: Correspondences *** Joel Chace: Six poems: Scaffold, 19-24 *** Tom Clark: Three poems: Keats on Shipboard, September 1820 / Comic Interpretation / from "Little Cantos": 1 *** Peter Davis: Five poems *** Elizabeth Fodaski: Two poems: Latent Progress / Short History *** Joergen Gassilewski, "saturation", translated by Robert Oesterbergh *** Chrissie Gittins: Three poems: Anxiety / Menopause / Sex Drive Problem *** Jim Goar: Three poems: Just passing through / Sunken treasure / overseas edition *** Phil Hall: Four poems: An Apprenticeship Ends / Variorum / Stephen Foster / Sawmill Tuning *** Barbara Henning: Three prose pieces: Out of Detroit / Organ Light / Protestants and Catholics *** Brian Henry: Three poems: Oklahoma / George W. Bush / Actually Sounding *** Tom Hibbard: Poem: VII. Big Snow *** Fanny Howe: After Watching Klimov's "Agoniya" *** John Kinsella: Seven poems from "Graphology" *** Heller Levinson: from green therapeutics this whale *** Steve McOrmond: Night Figures *** Geoff Page: Southward *** Alan Loney: Testament : tenth muse *** Camille Martin: 8 Sonnets *** Annie Mullen: Three poems: You're Highness / Jarlyth and Phyllis / News of the World *** Tomas Salamun: Three poems, translated by Brian Henry: The Loire Delta / poem ("If I don't know what to do...") / Greece *** Edgar Saavedra: "Island", translated by Kristin Dykstra *** Lisa Samuels: from "Metropolis" *** Beth Staley: The first voice loop was an echo *** John Tranter: Two Poems: Derek Walcott's Lips; and Craig Raine's Arsehole: variations on a theme by Helen Farish *** Barry Wallenstein: Five poems: Shades of Keats / The Fabulous Backdrop / Euphoria Ripens / The Mite and the Peacock / Gazing at Raindrops *** Les Wicks: Healed and Hurt *** Harriet Zinnes: Two poems: The Wilderness / Conclusion ========== Interviews ========== *** Joe Amato in conversation with Chris Pusateri, 2009 *** Eric Baus in conversation with Cynthia Arrieu-King: Bushwick, N.Y., 4 May 2009 *** Aaron Kunin in conversation with Ben Lerner *** Jennifer Moxley in conversation with Noah Eli Gordon *** Murat Nemet-Nejat in conversation with Kent Johnson, 2009 *** David Shapiro: in conversation with Kent Johnson, 2009, with an Introduction by Don Share *** Rachel Zolf in conversation with Joel Bettridge, 2008-2009 ========== Featured Review ========== *** Philip Mead: Networked Language: Culture & History in Australian Poetry, reviewed by Pam Brown ========== Feature ========== *** Rachel Blau DuPlessis: Draft 94: Mail Art ========== Reviews ========== *** Louis Armand: "Solicitations: Essays on Criticism and Culture", reviewed by Jeroen Nieuwland *** Anny Ballardini: "Ghost Dance in 33 Movements", reviewed by Crag Hill *** Jules Boykoff and Kaia Sand: "Landscapes of Dissent: Guerrilla Poetry & Public Space", reviewed by Philip Metres *** Jacques Derrida: "Monolinguism of the Other or The Prosthesis of Origin" (translated by Patrick Mensah), reviewed by Tom Hibbard: When Poetry Becomes Visual: Derrida's "Monolingualism of the Other" *** Rosmarie Waldrop (ed.). Dichten = [number ten], 16 new (to American readers) German poets, reviewed by Catherine Hales *** Sharon Dolin: "Burn and Dodge", reviewed by Robert Mueller *** Joseph Donahue: "Terra Lucida", reviewed by John Olson *** Elena Fanailova: "The Russian Version" (poems), Translated by Genya Turovskaya and Stephanie Sandler, reviewed by Stephan Delbos *** Adam Fieled: "When You Bit", reviewed by Jeffrey Side *** Sandy Florian: "The Tree of No", reviewed by Robert Savino Oventile *** Tim Gaze: "Noology", reviewed by Michael Farrell *** Nora Delaney: The Poetry of Melissa Green *** Rob Halpern and Taylor Brady: "Snow Sensitive Skin", reviewed by Thom Donovan *** John Hollander, "A Draft of Light: Poems", reviewed by by Alex Lewis *** Mystery Man! "... he may be a hypocrite, like some fornicating Baptist pastor. This seems to be what some of his critics think." Kent Johnson: "Homage to the Last Avant-Garde", reviewed by Peter Davis *** Rae Desmond Jones: "Blow Out", reviewed by Martin Duwell. See over 80 photos from the launch for that book here. *** August Kleinzahler: Sleeping It Off in Rapid City: Poems, New and Selected, Reviewed by Michael Aiken *** Ben Lerner: Barbara Claire Freeman and S.M. Stone: "No, / but... ": Ben Lerner's "Didactic Elegy" *** Jonathan Littell: "The Kindly Ones", translated by Charlotte Mandell, reviewed by Stash Luczkiw *** Clive Matson: "Mainline to the Heart", reviewed by Kevin Ring *** George Messo: "Entrances", reviewed by Alistair Noon *** Jennifer Moxley: "Clampdown", reviewed by Rob Stanton *** Eugene Ostashevsky: "The Life and Opinions of DJ Spinoza". Drawings by Eugene Timerman, reviewed by Timothy Leonido *** Ron Padgett: "How to Be Perfect", reviewed by Jack Cox *** Barbara Roether; "The Middle Atlas: Poems from Morocco 2004-2006", reviewed by Monica Peck *** Jerome Rothenberg & Jeffrey C. Robinson, eds. "Poems for the Millennium: The University of California Book of Romantic & Postromantic Poetry". Volume Three, reviewed by Joe Safdie *** Craig Santos Perez: "from UNINCORPORATED TERRITORY", reviewed by Mary Kasimor *** Ryoko Sekiguchi: "Two Markets, Once Again", Translated from the French by Sarah Riggs, reviewed by Eric Selland *** Brandon Shimoda: "The Alps", reviewed by Brandon Downing *** "Gertrude Stein: Selections", Joan Retallack (Ed.), reviewed by Jill Magi *** Stephanie Strickland; "Zone : Zero", Ahsahta Press, 2008 reviewed by Rachel Daley *** Tao Lin: "you are a little bit happier than i am", reviewed by C.S. Perez *** Steve Tills: "Rugh Stuff", reviewed by Gerald Schwartz *** Keith Waldrop: "The Real Subject: Queries and Conjectures of Jacob Delafon with Sample Poems", reviewed by C.S. Perez *** Sonja Yelich: "get some", reviewed by Lisa Samuels *** Andrew Zawacki: "Petals of Zero Petals of One", reviewed by Daniel Shoemaker *** Lila Zemborain: "mauve sea-orchids" (Trans. Rosa Alcala and Monica de la Torre), reviewed by Marie Larson _______________ John Tranter 39 Short Street, Balmain 2041, Australia Phone Sydney (61+2+) 95 55 85 02 http://johntranter.com/ http://jacketmagazine.com/ _______________ John Tranter 39 Short Street, Balmain 2041, Australia Phone Sydney (61+2+) 95 55 85 02 http://johntranter.com/ http://jacketmagazine.com/ ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 04:25:55 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Rachel Loden Subject: D. A. Powell & Rachel Loden in San Francisco MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thursday, August 6th at 7 p.m. D. A. Powell & Rachel Loden Reading from their new books, Chronic & Dick of the Dead Bookshop West Portal 80 West Portal Avenue San Francisco, CA 94127 415 564 8080 http://www.bookshopwestportal.com/ D. A. Powell is the author of Tea, Lunch and Cocktails. The latter was a finalist for the Lambda and the National Book Critics' Circle Awards. His most recent collection is Chronic (Graywolf, 2009). Together with David Trinidad and a cast of hundreds, Powell is also the author of By Myself: An Autobiography (Turtle Point, 2009). A former Briggs-Copeland lecturer in Poetry at Harvard University, Powell now teaches in the English Department at University of San Francisco. Rachel Loden is the author of Dick of the Dead, which came out in May. Her first book, Hotel Imperium, was selected as one of the ten best poetry books of the year by the San Francisco Chronicle, which called it "quirky and beguiling." It was also shortlisted for the Bay Area Book Reviewers Award. Honors include two appearances in the Best American Poetry series, a Pushcart Prize, a Fellowship in Poetry from the California Arts Council, and a grant from the Fund for Poetry. ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 10:39:22 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: mIEKAL aND Subject: The cost of our dead poets society Comments: To: British & Irish poets MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable The cost of our dead poets society http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2009/jul/23/keats-house-funding The enormous sums spent on dead authors' houses should be used to support those with few other chances to write Keats House in Hampstead, the low pale villa where the poet lived, has been renovated and will be opened to the public tomorrow. It is proudly proclaimed to be the house where he penned Ode to a Nightingale and asked the girl next door to marry him. Yet Keats lived there for just two years, albeit his most creative. It prompts the question =96 does this postcard-pretty house of a writer who died at 26, which will attract those who like visiting pretty houses in Hampstead, deserve a =A3424,000 grant by the Heritage Lottery Fund, supplemented by the Corporation of London? Let's contrast the apparent ease of finding the money for the young man Keats with the struggles over Mrs Gaskell, whose former house is at 84 Plymouth Grove, Ardwick, Manchester. It is a Grade II*-listed Regency-style villa, and it is on the English Heritage buildings at risk register. The Gaskell Society says it needs over =A32m to save it, yet it has secured just =A3260,000, covering the first phase of renovation. I hope the society does not find the rest of the money; let the house rot and wilt and tumble down. These houses of the well-read dead signify only the self-importance of the literary society, waving the bowl to feed the cult of the author. I used to live in Ardwick, and knew the Gaskell house long before I knew of her, or read anything by her. For years I walked by, to and from school, in total ignorance. Yet, while I became sympathetic to the didactic aims of her works, which make her of far higher social importance than Keats, and may explain her relative neglect, I would rather see the energies of these literary societies channelled differently. Dare they turn their gazes from the dead to the living? The Gaskell Society declares that "the restoration of the building will act as a flagship for the regeneration of a socially disadvantaged area". This is a repulsive sentiment =96 the girls of nearby Moss Side need more than Mrs Gaskell's bricks to inspire them =96 and it is hard not to think that the fundraisers are leeching off the "socially disadvantaged" label of the area that has grown up around it. But by ditching these shrines to dead writers, they could begin to make a real difference to living ones. Gaskell made her fortune and reputation writing about downtrodden women. Ardwick has plenty of them, many of whom could be finding their own literary voice. Ardwick needs youth centres and libraries and creative writing groups, where these woefully under-represented working-class women can be encouraged. Then we would have a richer and more diversified literature =96 actually penned by those that live it. Let us find ways of encouraging potential writers. Then I will give you an area that will be its own social regeneration. Because it is the works that matter, not which room the author squatted in, twiddling her hair and sucking the end of her quill. I'm sure that Mrs Gaskell would agree. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 23:01:41 +0000 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jesse Glass Subject: Experimental Poetry/Performance in Baltimore/Washington Area MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I'd like to connect with experimental poetry/performance groups in the Baltimore/Washington area for a project at the University of Maryland, College Park. Back channel please. Jesse ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 25 Jul 2009 09:10:28 -0300 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Regina Pinto Subject: News MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable 1- My new experimental, sound, visual poetry work "An Iranian Rose is an Iranian Rose is an Iranian Rose" / 2009 ( http://arteonline.arq.br/neda/ ) is participating of the Project Pantea's Rose by Deb King July 25th is a 'Global Day of Action in Unity with the People of Iran.' Pantea's Rose intends to be a simple show of solidarity, of shared humanity, with the mothers, fathers and children, the artists, academics and working people of Iran. Considering the importance the internet has been to the Iranian people's communication with the outside world, a net action take place is particularly appropriate. http://www.panteasroses.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------= --------------------------------------------------- 2- My work "Caf=E9 com P=E3o" / 2008 ( http://arteonline.arq.br/train/ ) is participating of the FILE 09: http://www.file.org.br FILE 10 NURBS PROTO 4KT is the title of the FILE 09 exhibition that takes place in S=E3o Paulo, Brazil, from July 28 to August 30, 2009 at the Fiesp - Ruth Cardoso Cultural Center, from July 28 to August 30, Monday 11 a.m.-8 p.m., Tuesday to Saturday 10 a.m.-8 p.m. and Sunday 10 a.m.-7 p.m. This year, we have the honor to present FILE 10 -- ten years of events accomplished in the city of S=E3o Paulo, ten years of discussion on art and technology in Brazil. The 10th edition of FILE - Electronic Language International Festival - the major art and technology festival in Brazil and Latin America shows a great diversity of national and international research and productions. In this 10th edi tion 300 artists participate - among groups, collectives and individual works - from more than 30 nationalities, with productions in the areas of digital culture. CAF=C9 COM P=C3O "Caf=E9 com P=E3o: coffee with bread, experimental visual/sound poetry by the artist Regina Pinto ." Tags: Manuel Badeira, Trem de Ferro, Henri Bergson, Interactive, Digital poetry, Sound Poetry, Visual poetry, New Media, Web art, experimental, literary, programming, movies, photos, Regina C=E9lia Pinto, Bruno Ferreira Pinto (voice), Brigitte Neufeldt (voice), Myron Turner (voice), poetics, innovative" =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Regina Pinto http://arteonline.arq.br http://pintor.tumblr.com =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 25 Jul 2009 09:04:15 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: EJOYCE Subject: Slow Language MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On NPR this morning Scott Simon asked a novelist how the Internet has= affected writing. He responded that he now finds it difficult to read= writers like Henry James because he has grown unaccustomed to complicated= syntax and longer, more developed arguments and that a movement needs to= be started like the Slow Foods Movement that he called Slow Language. He= said that poetry constitutes slow language. --Lisa Joyce p.s. It took me a long time to write this message but, sadly, I write it= from a long distance from any other readers. Does Slow Language, like Slow= Foods, need to embrace the local and the locally produced? =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 25 Jul 2009 16:31:22 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jim Andrews Subject: Book by Dominic McIver Lopes: A Philosophy of Computer Art MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Dominic McIver Lopes has a book coming out in August called A Philosophy of Computer Art; info at http://www.apoca.mentalpaint.net . I see a précis at http://aesthetics-online.org/articles/index.php?articles_id=40 He teaches Philosophy in Vancouver. Nice to have a different sort of approach to these matters. A philosopher. And he talks about my piece Seattle Drift. In which the basic philosophy is 'do me'. Which, come to think of it, fits in with his philosophy, which stresses computation and interactivity in 'computer art', which he distinguishes from 'digital art'. A useful distinction. Just about all art, these days, is involved in the digital. Even dance and the most print-minded endeavors of the literary. the most fundamental phenomenological characteristic of computers is programmability. this is what separates computers from other types of man-made machines. 'turing-complete' programmability provides a radical flexibility in what machines can do. flexibility so radical that there is no proof, and probably never will be, that there exist thought processes of which humans are capable and computers are not. there probably never will be such proof because if such proof existed, it would mean that there was proof that there are types of machines that go beyond the capabilities of turing machines. and such proof has been sought since the early days of computing, to no avail. what does this mean for computer art? well, there are many artists who see computers as glorified media machines. glorified typewriters. or glorified sound editing facilities. and so on. more of the same only easier and better. so their notion of computer art does not go very far. we shall have more of the same from them. because that's what you get when you think of computers as glorified old-media machines. and of course we're getting lots of it. whereas if we see computers as offering really quite radical possibilities, possibilities that are poetentially as flexible as thought itself in dynamic generation, then we have to revise our notions concerning the vistas of computer art. and not settle for more of the same. programming that is not interactive can be very interesting, of course. it can also be made to respond to the surroundings or remote data in ways that aren't interactive with the audience but are nonetheless involved in growth and change, learning and possibly even thought of some sort. and that can be interesting in art pieces. but i agree with Lopes that there is something special to *interactivity with people* in computer art. really good interactivity brings modes of discovery that are most interesting to me, among works of computer art. there can be a kind of dialogue or communication that is deeply satisfying as an art experience. perhaps because this sort of communication most dramatically and immediately explores our relations with machines and each other and ourselves. we get an inkling of some form of thought and communication that is a deep mixture of human thought and emotion and communication together with this new element we know is on the horizon of thought, ie, the thought of machines. ja http://vispo.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 25 Jul 2009 19:47:59 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: William Slaughter Subject: Notice: Mudlark MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed New and On View: Mudlark Poster No. 82 (2009) Five Poems by Jesse Shipway Jesse Shipway earned his PhD in the School of English, Journalism and European Languages at the University of Tasmania. He has published essays, reviews and poems in a number of journals including Journal of Genocide Research, Australian Literary Studies, Architectural Review (Australia) and Island. He edits the literature site www.anastomoo.com and lives with his family in Hobart, Tasmania. Spread the word. Far and wide, William Slaughter MUDLARK An Electronic Journal of Poetry & Poetics Never in and never out of print... E-mail: mudlark@unf.edu URL: http://www.unf.edu/mudlark ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 19:03:40 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jennifer Karmin Subject: July 28: Marhsall, NC MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable THE MARSHALL AURICULAR HOUR=20 Tuesday Night Summer Series=20 JULY 28 with writers Amina Cain Jennifer Karmin Kristin Prevallet and musician Steve Davidowski=20 at The French Broad Institute of Time and The River 68 North Main Street=20 Marshall, North Carolina AMINA CAIN is the author of I Go To Some Hollow (Les Figues Press, 2009), a= collection of stories that revolve quietly around human relationality, lan= dscape, and emptiness.=C2=A0 Her work has appeared or is forthcoming in pub= lications such as 3rd bed, Action Yes, Denver Quarterly, Dewclaw, Encyclope= dia vol. 2, La Petite Zine, and Sidebrow and has been translated into Polis= h on MINIMALBOOKS.=C2=A0 She is also a curator, most recently for When Does= It or You Begin? (Memory as Innovation), a month long festival of writing,= performance, and video that took place at Links Hall in Chicago last Janua= ry.=C2=A0 She currently lives in Los Angeles.=20 JENNIFER KARMIN's text-sound epic Aaaaaaaaaaalice will be published by Flim= Forum Press in 2009. She curates the Red Rover Series and is a founding me= mber of the public art group Anti Gravity Surprise. Her multidisciplinary p= rojects have been presented nationally at festivals, artist-run spaces, and= on city streets.=C2=A0 Jennifer teaches creative writing to immigrants at = Truman College and works as a Poet in Residence for the Chicago Public Scho= ols. Recent poems are published in the journals Cannot Exist, MoonLit, Otol= iths, and anthologized in Come Together: Imagine Peac(Bottom Dog Press), No= t A Muse (Haven Books), and The City Visible: Chicago Poetry for the New Ce= ntury (Cracked Slab Books). KRISTIN PREVALLET's books include I, Afterlife: Essay in Mourning Time(Essa= y Press, 2007), Shadow Evidence Intelligence (Factory School, 2006), Scratc= h Sides: Poetry, Documentation, and Image-Text Projects (Skanky Possum, 200= 2), and Perturbation, My Sister: A Study of Max Ernst=E2=80=99s Hundred Hea= dless Woman (First Intensity, 1997).=C2=A0 She co-edited Third Mind: Creati= ve Writing Through Visual Art with Tonya Foster (Teachers & Writers, 2002),= an anthology of essays about the challenges and rewards of uniting art and= writing in the classroom. Her selected edition of Helen Adam=E2=80=99s bal= lads and collages, The Helen Adam Reader, was published by the National Poe= try Foundation in 2007. THE FRENCH BROAD INSTITUTE OF TIME AND THE RIVER (FBI) is an arts venue and= residency program founded by poet Lee Ann Brown and actor/director Tony To= rn.=20 =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 15:02:16 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: cris cheek Subject: part: short life housing (review) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit just up on Chris Goode's highly estimable blog, following an excellent write up on Tom Raworth's collected prose "Earn Your Milk" and sundry other items: In a slightly different mode but no less vimful is cris cheek's part: short life housing, a big event in itself but exciting also in that it's the first item to arise in a fair while from Nate Dorward's excellent The Gig in Toronto. This really handsome book collects work from the early 80s up to the nearly present, and it's as good as introduction to cheek's work as you could wish for without actually seeing & hearing him unleash the true complexity of these works in performance. Having carried around this volume with me for a while, jumping in and out of it, I begin to see how (for me, right now) it reflects my own interest in the practice of place-ma(r)king in performance, a practice that can be lived in, that's not some reflective treetop or secluded glade, but a grimy, spunky, urban site whose churning, whirling multiplicities contain actual life behaviours, not just mimickings or courtroom sketches of these. The language here is able to be both edificial and viral, to jump (somewhat as theatre does, but free of some of theatre's topical responsibilities) between testimony and speculation; it is a language containing a cast of thousands, but also never quite adding up to one whole. To an extent this is a feature of the book as a whole: a kind of nagging provisionality, equal to the degree in which text in cheek's work is never just text, but is a participant in a whole playground (or workshop) of presences and effects. For example, I'm glad, on encountering here the fascinating canning town chronicles (from 1991-94) to know the CD of the same name by Slant, cheek's group with Sianed Jones and Philip Jeck, which terrifically effectively animates the same resources. Whether or not one knows cris's performative practices, however, I'm certain anyone would recognize the imperative embedded in all the works collected here to approach reading as a whole-body practice, and as an enterprise made sense of only in the context of collective action. The only possible reason I can see for cheek never to have received the props he's due in British writing networks is that he's scary like that. He needs you up on your feet: you just can't think hard enough or fast enough to stick with him if you're sitting down. (Having said which, Jonny and I were lucky enough to spend some time hanging out with cris during his recent UK visit -- he's based in the States now; we miss him -- and there was a good measure of sedentary lolling in the hot June weather. What started out as a quick lunch squeezed in between his other appointments turned into a six hour marathon of anecdote and argument and much laughter, which left a real impression of wanting to stay more strongly connected to him than I've been of late. Eventually we adjourned to the BFI for drinks: and as cris finally left us, striding off through the bar, his imposing stature arguing productively with the lovely skirty kilty thing he was wearing, and his bald head bobbing above the post-work throng, we heard a slightly camp voice from the table behind us say: "Julius Caesar has left the building." Quite so.) http://beescope.blogspot.com/2009/07/imagine-life.html ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 10:57:18 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: nieuwland jeroen Subject: Visual art / poetry In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Dear everyone, I've had some discussions recently following from a remark by a friend that the distinction between visual art and poetry is reactionary, similarly to the hard and fast distinction that used to be made between sculpure and painting. Personally I can't help but thinking that even though often the distinction is blurred, there remains an essential difference between the two; namely, that visual art might, but need not use language, but for poetry, however widely understood, language is an essential ingredient. Does anyone have any thoughts on this? Thanks and best, Jeroen ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 16:55:28 +0000 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Nate Pritts Subject: ZOMG! H_NGM_N #8, y'all In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable OFFICIAL ANNOUNCEMENT ---> Like=2C it's night time & there are these two guys & they're all like=2C I'm gonna break into this BANK=2C yo. To steal the MON-ey. And the other guy is like=2C yo=2C what about the H_NGM_N? Like for realz? And the first guy is like what - that tired old washed up old guy? Like no one has even SEEN him for like YEARS or something. Guys probably dead. http://www.h-ngm-n.com And the second guy is like yo. And so it was that there were guys straight up robbing banks all over the city & when I say bank I mean JOURNALS PUBLISHING BAD POETRY & then there's like this quick cut=2C right=2C where you see like SOMEthing on a balcony or some junk=2C like high up like looking down all bad@$$ & then these two guys are like about to break into the bank still? By which I mean BAD POETRY RUNNING RAMPANT all up in the grill of the fair city? And what? http://www.h-ngm-n.com So that's it man. It's like yo - H_NGM_N #8. SWOOP. And like everyone thought he was dead & yo & like that was it? But he's here & cleaning house & by house I mean THE LANDSCAPE OF CONTEMPORARY POETRY & by cleaning I mean like straight up cleaning. So it's like not only for you but for the city & banks & POETRY & also for yourself that you must needs click yon link & spread the word that=2C like=2C if you were afraid to go out at night? Or read poetry? There is no more reason to fear ever now: http://www.h-ngm-n.com yrs ever & always -=20 n8 & crew PS follow the 'M_N on Twitter for updates --> http://twitter.com/TW_TT_R ___________ :: Dr. Nate Pritts =20 :: http://www.natepritts.com _________________________________________________________________ NEW mobile Hotmail. Optimized for YOUR phone. Click here. http://windowslive.com/Mobile?ocid=3DTXT_TAGLM_WL_CS_MB_new_hotmail_072009= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 12:59:55 -0400 Reply-To: Aryanil Mukherjee Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Aryanil Mukherjee Subject: Re: The cost of our dead poets society In-Reply-To: <4651221.283001248454773370.JavaMail.root@dom-zbox1.bo3.lycos.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Second it. Really....what a waste...=20 Just a tiny fraction of that could have helped=C2=A0so many homeless poets.= ..=20 aryanil=20 ----- Original Message -----=20 From: "mIEKAL aND" =20 To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU=20 Sent: Friday, July 24, 2009 11:39:22 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern=20 Subject: The cost of our dead poets society=20 The cost of our dead poets society=20 http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2009/jul/23/keats-house-funding=20 The enormous sums spent on dead authors' houses should be used to=20 support those with few other chances to write=20 Keats House in Hampstead, the low pale villa where the poet lived, has=20 been renovated and will be opened to the public tomorrow. It is=20 proudly proclaimed to be the house where he penned Ode to a=20 Nightingale and asked the girl next door to marry him. Yet Keats lived=20 there for just two years, albeit his most creative. It prompts the=20 question =E2=80=93 does this postcard-pretty house of a writer who died at = 26,=20 which will attract those who like visiting pretty houses in Hampstead,=20 deserve a =C2=A3424,000 grant by the Heritage Lottery Fund, supplemented by= =20 the Corporation of London?=20 Let's contrast the apparent ease of finding the money for the young=20 man Keats with the struggles over Mrs Gaskell, whose former house is=20 at 84 Plymouth Grove, Ardwick, Manchester. It is a Grade II*-listed=20 Regency-style villa, and it is on the English Heritage buildings at=20 risk register. The Gaskell Society says it needs over =C2=A32m to save it,= =20 yet it has secured just =C2=A3260,000, covering the first phase of=20 renovation. I hope the society does not find the rest of the money;=20 let the house rot and wilt and tumble down. These houses of the=20 well-read dead signify only the self-importance of the literary=20 society, waving the bowl to feed the cult of the author.=20 I used to live in Ardwick, and knew the Gaskell house long before I=20 knew of her, or read anything by her. For years I walked by, to and=20 from school, in total ignorance. Yet, while I became sympathetic to=20 the didactic aims of her works, which make her of far higher social=20 importance than Keats, and may explain her relative neglect, I would=20 rather see the energies of these literary societies channelled=20 differently. Dare they turn their gazes from the dead to the living?=20 The Gaskell Society declares that "the restoration of the building=20 will act as a flagship for the regeneration of a socially=20 disadvantaged area". This is a repulsive sentiment =E2=80=93 the girls of= =20 nearby Moss Side need more than Mrs Gaskell's bricks to inspire them =E2=80= =93=20 and it is hard not to think that the fundraisers are leeching off the=20 "socially disadvantaged" label of the area that has grown up around=20 it.=20 But by ditching these shrines to dead writers, they could begin to=20 make a real difference to living ones. Gaskell made her fortune and=20 reputation writing about downtrodden women. Ardwick has plenty of=20 them, many of whom could be finding their own literary voice. Ardwick=20 needs youth centres and libraries and creative writing groups, where=20 these woefully under-represented working-class women can be=20 encouraged. Then we would have a richer and more diversified=20 literature =E2=80=93 actually penned by those that live it.=20 Let us find ways of encouraging potential writers. Then I will give=20 you an area that will be its own social regeneration. Because it is=20 the works that matter, not which room the author squatted in,=20 twiddling her hair and sucking the end of her quill. I'm sure that Mrs=20 Gaskell would agree.=20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=20 The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html=20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 13:43:32 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Murat Nemet-Nejat Subject: Re: The cost of our dead poets society In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Joe, Would you have felt differently if the house was of a poet you thought more highly of? I have a sense Keats ios not too high on your list of poets. Murat On Fri, Jul 24, 2009 at 11:39 AM, mIEKAL aND wrote: > The cost of our dead poets society > > http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2009/jul/23/keats-house-funding > > The enormous sums spent on dead authors' houses should be used to > support those with few other chances to write > > Keats House in Hampstead, the low pale villa where the poet lived, has > been renovated and will be opened to the public tomorrow. It is > proudly proclaimed to be the house where he penned Ode to a > Nightingale and asked the girl next door to marry him. Yet Keats lived > there for just two years, albeit his most creative. It prompts the > question =96 does this postcard-pretty house of a writer who died at 26, > which will attract those who like visiting pretty houses in Hampstead, > deserve a =A3424,000 grant by the Heritage Lottery Fund, supplemented by > the Corporation of London? > > Let's contrast the apparent ease of finding the money for the young > man Keats with the struggles over Mrs Gaskell, whose former house is > at 84 Plymouth Grove, Ardwick, Manchester. It is a Grade II*-listed > Regency-style villa, and it is on the English Heritage buildings at > risk register. The Gaskell Society says it needs over =A32m to save it, > yet it has secured just =A3260,000, covering the first phase of > renovation. I hope the society does not find the rest of the money; > let the house rot and wilt and tumble down. These houses of the > well-read dead signify only the self-importance of the literary > society, waving the bowl to feed the cult of the author. > > I used to live in Ardwick, and knew the Gaskell house long before I > knew of her, or read anything by her. For years I walked by, to and > from school, in total ignorance. Yet, while I became sympathetic to > the didactic aims of her works, which make her of far higher social > importance than Keats, and may explain her relative neglect, I would > rather see the energies of these literary societies channelled > differently. Dare they turn their gazes from the dead to the living? > > The Gaskell Society declares that "the restoration of the building > will act as a flagship for the regeneration of a socially > disadvantaged area". This is a repulsive sentiment =96 the girls of > nearby Moss Side need more than Mrs Gaskell's bricks to inspire them =96 > and it is hard not to think that the fundraisers are leeching off the > "socially disadvantaged" label of the area that has grown up around > it. > > But by ditching these shrines to dead writers, they could begin to > make a real difference to living ones. Gaskell made her fortune and > reputation writing about downtrodden women. Ardwick has plenty of > them, many of whom could be finding their own literary voice. Ardwick > needs youth centres and libraries and creative writing groups, where > these woefully under-represented working-class women can be > encouraged. Then we would have a richer and more diversified > literature =96 actually penned by those that live it. > > Let us find ways of encouraging potential writers. Then I will give > you an area that will be its own social regeneration. Because it is > the works that matter, not which room the author squatted in, > twiddling her hair and sucking the end of her quill. I'm sure that Mrs > Gaskell would agree. > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 16:12:17 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: amy king Subject: This Saturday: Stain Carries on -- ~ Julian Brolaski, Adam Fieled, Nada Gordon, Scott Hightower, Chris Stackhouse & David Wolach ~ MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable The Stain of Poetry carries on, so please forward: Â = =0A=0AThe Stain of Poetry carries on, so please forward:=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0A= =C2=A0=0A=0AWe're excited to introduce you to our new venue, Goodbye=0ABlue= Monday!=C2=A0 A "cave of=0Awonders, living room, library, and curiosity sh= op," they offer a=0Avariety:=C2=A0 sake-infused lemonade,=0Ayour favorite b= eers, chocolate cake and other tasty items -- what more could=0Ayou want?= =C2=A0 How about some killer=0Apoets?=C2=A0 Join us for the superlaunch=0Aw= ith:=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0ASaturday, August 1st @ 7 p.m. =0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0A~ Jul= ian Brolaski, Adam Fieled, Nada Gordon, Scott=0AHightower, Chris Stackhouse= & David Wolach ~=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0AGoodbye Blue Monday=0A=0A(go= through cafe room=0A=0Ato back garden stage)=0A=0A1087 Broadway=0A=0A(corn= er of Dodworth St)=0A=0ABrooklyn, NY 11221-3013=0A=0A(718) 453-6343=0A=0A= =C2=A0=0A=0AJ M Z trains to Myrtle Ave=0A=0Aor J train to Kosciusko St.=0A= =0A=C2=A0=0A=0A~=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0AJulian T. Brolaski is the author of the c= hapbooks Hellish=0ADeath Monsters (Spooky Press,=C2=A0=0A2001), Letters to = Hank Williams (True West Press, 2003), The Daily=0AUsonian(Atticus/Finch, 2= 004) and Madame Bovary=E2=80=99s Diary (Cy Press, 2005) (under=0Athe name T= anya Brolaski), Buck in a Corridor (flynpyntar, 2008) and the blog=0Aherm o= f warsaw.=C2=A0 Xir first book=0Agowanus atropolis is forthcoming from Ugly= Duckling Presse. Brolaski lives in=0ABrooklyn where xe writes poetry, serv= es as a Litmus Press editor, plays country=0Amusic inThe Low & the Lonesome= , and curates th=E2=80=99every-other-monthly=0Afreakshow Mongrel Vaudeville= .=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0A~=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0AAdam Fieled is a poet, musician, and = critic based in=0APhiladelphia. He has released several books and chapbooks= , maintains two=0Ablogs,and is finishing his PhD at Temple University, wher= e he teaches.=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0A~=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0ANada Gordon is the author= of four poetry books: Folly, V.=0AImp, Are Not Our Lowing Heifers Sleeker = than Night-Swollen Mushrooms?, and=0Aforiegnn bodie =E2=80=93 and, with Gar= y Sullivan, an e-pistolary techno-romantic=0Anon-fiction novel, Swoon. She = practices poetry as deep entertainment and is a=0Aproud member of the Flarf= Collective. Visit her blog=0Aathttp://ululate.blogspot.com.=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A= =0A~=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0AScott Hightower=E2=80=99s third collection, =E2=80=9C= Part of the Bargain,=E2=80=9D=0Areceived the 2004 Hayden Carruth Award. His= translations from Spanish have=0Agarnered him a Willis Barnstone Translati= on Prize. He is a contributing editor=0Ato =E2=80=9CThe Journal.=E2=80=9D= =C2=A0 His reviews=0Afrequently appear in =E2=80=9CColdfront Magazine=E2=80= =9D and =E2=80=9CBoxcar Poetry Review.=E2=80=9D=C2=A0=C2=A0 A native of cen= tral Texas, he=0Alives with one foot in New York City, one in Texas, and on= e in Madrid, Spain.=0AHe teaches at NYU, and has taught poetry, non-fiction= writing, and translation=0Aat Drew, F.I.T., Fordham, and Poets House.=0A= =0A=C2=A0=0A=0A~=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0AChristopher Stackhouse is the author of p= oetry collected in=0Athe chapbook Slip (Corollary Press, 2005); co-author o= f Seismosis (1913 Press,=0A2006), a dialogic collaboration featuring Stackh= ouse=E2=80=99s drawings and text by=0Awriter/professor John Keene (Northwes= tern University), with essays from poet Ed=0ARoberson and poet/critic Geoff= rey Jacques. He holds has MFA in=0AWriting/Interdisciplinary Studies from B= ard College; is a Cave Canem Writers=0AFellow; and is a 2005 Fellow in Poet= ry, New York Foundation for the Arts. His=0Arecent essays have been publish= ed in the literary journal American Poet, and=0Athe anthology A Best of Fen= ce: The First Nine Years. He will be a guest faculty=0Amember in the Naropa= University Summer Writing Program 2009, at the Jack=0AKerouac School of Di= sembodied Poetics in Boulder, Colorado. He organizes=0AReadings at Max Prot= etch Gallery in New York City with poet/assistant gallery=0Adirector Stuart= Krimko. Currently completing a manuscript of poetry, while also=0Adoing re= search for the development of a non-fiction book on poetics, Stackhouse=0Al= ives and works in Brooklyn New York.=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0A~=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0ADa= vid Wolach is professor of writing, poetics, &=0Aphilosophy at The Evergree= n State in Olympia, Washington, and visiting poet in=0ABard College=E2=80= =99s Workshop in Language & Thinking.=C2=A0 Author of Fractions of M, The T= ranscendental Insect Reader,=0AActs of Art/Works of Violence, and the forth= coming Scripto Erratum (sound/text=0Acompositions, scored with composer Aru= n Chandra & video artist Tasha Glen),=0ADavid=E2=80=99s work has appeared t= his year or is forthcoming from Bird Dog, CRIT,=0ANight Train, Diode, The C= oncelebratory Shoehorn Review, Venereal Kittens,=0A[...]: An Anthology of N= ew American Writing, AB OVO, and Ignavia Press: Journal=0Aof Transgressive = Queer Writing.=C2=A0=0AMuch of his work is multi-media and performative, an= d has been featured=0Aat venues such as Buffalo Poetics Series 2009, The Am= erican Cybernetics=0AConference 2009, and Bard=E2=80=99s Visiting Poets Ser= ies.=C2=A0 David is also editor of Wheelhouse Magazine & Press and=0Acurato= r of PRESS: A Cross-Cultural Literary Conference.=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0A~=0A=0A= =C2=A0=0A=0AHosted by Amy King and Ana Bo=C5=BEi=C4=8Devi=C4=87=0A=0A=C2=A0= =0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0AINFO:=C2=A0=0Ahttp://stainofpoetry.wordpress.= com/=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0ARSVP:=C2=A0=0Ahttp://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid= =3D103132898882=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0A=C2=A0= =0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0A-- =0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0AAmy's Alias=0A=0Ahttp://amyking.org/= =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 10:53:36 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Catherine Daly Subject: Re: The cost of our dead poets society In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Are you the one who also posted about how Edith Wharton's House is losing money?http://www.edithwharton.org/ "Thanks to the generosity of our supporters, the co-operation of our principal creditors, and to a large gift from the Alice M. Kaplan Memorial Reserve, The Mount has staved off the threat of foreclosure that has recently threatened its existence." It always annoyed me that Lowe's supports Biltmore and not The Mount, but The Mount people really overestimated the appeal of Wharton and the Berkshires, and never hit up serious interior design / construction money. As opposed to The Mount, it seems that Gaskell's house is supposed to be turned into a community center. I think that sounds like a good use, rather than teaching writing in soulless "youth centres," teaching writing in a pretty house that local craftsmen helped restore. I think everyone's beginning to realize how public objects become landmarks. That said, "street view" of the existing community center indicates it is in yet another tumbledown mansion. The Keats house has been a museum since 1925. -- All best, Catherine Daly c.a.b.daly@gmail.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 14:59:15 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: cris cheek Subject: part: short life housing MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi all, i've got a new book out in the world. I urge you to support The Gig, a fine fine press, and buy a copy. It's a handsome book and i'm very proud of it! You can order thru SPD and Bridge Street Books too i hope. I expect to be doing some live readings to promote it (so, erm. . . all offers welcome ;-)) cris cheek part: short life housing This book collects seven texts written between 1981 and 1999, by UK-born, US-based poet/multimedia artist cris cheek. cheek was one of the key figure= s in the London poetry scene of the 1980s =E2=80=94 the so-called =E2=80=9Clinguistically-innovative poetry=E2=80=9D grouping later anthologi= zed in Robert Sheppard and Adrian Clarke=E2=80=99s Floating Capital: New Poets from Londo= n. Likewise, he became central to developments in Performance Writing emerging out of variant distributed networks during the following decade. He has remained a prolific, genre-slipping figure: poet, performance artist and musician, whose activities range from the ambitious conceptual project Things Not Worth Keeping to recordings with the ensembles Slant and Garam Masala. Yet to date his publications have been relatively scarce and elusive, a situation which part: short life housing goes far to rectify. At the heart of this book are two long sequences, previously unpublished aside from short extracts: =E2=80=9Ccanning town chronicles,=E2=80=9D a sca= thing set of verbal accretions that emerged from the wreckage of the Thatcher era; and = =E2=80=9Cf o g s,=E2=80=9D a series of typestracts quarried from verbal improvisations= recorded during outdoor walks in densely foggy weather. Also included are several shorter pieces, including a selection of early 1980s work and =E2=80=9Cplai= n speaking yet,=E2=80=9D cheek=E2=80=99s memorial to the novelist Kathy Acker= . The poems have, in keeping with the author=E2=80=99s concern for the specificity of occasio= n and publication, been revised and visually reimagined with this volume in mind. * For all its thickness, unanticipated moves, visual beauty, and playful language acrobatics, the poetry of part: short life housing consistently retains the edge of serious critique. There are few poets as attuned to the sounds and ambient fogs of everyday life as cris cheek, yet his record is tuned and sharply turned toward the reimagining of social knowledge. This volume is a generous move towards the full representation of cheek=E2=80=99= s crucial project. =E2=80=94 Carla Harryman Finally a good and rich span of writings from cris cheek. Here=E2=80=99s an= artist and writer whose work has always taken up active tenancy of the languages and the streets of urban living, recording them and composing them back int= o the dense abstract neighbourhoods of his pieces. With this careful selection, cris cheek reminds us that he is a Londoner and as such is as inhabited by Dickens=E2=80=99 dark maze of industrial streets as by mind-al= tering years of activist art lodgings, smoggy thoughtful wanderings or the eerie shock of the thatcheritic city. That=E2=80=99s at least two hundred years o= f grime, greed and energy you=E2=80=99ll find distilled in the cellular lines and in= k splashes of this great volume. =E2=80=93 Caroline Bergvall =E2=80=9Ci s y o u r t o n g u e a g l o m / w e a p o n t h a t s t a i n = s ?=E2=80=9D cris cheek is the Kepler of Chisenhale Dance Space. After a century of developments in poetic form best understood as a series of metaphors for transcribed speech, cheek=E2=80=99s poetry often actually is transcribed sp= eech, throwing shapes on the page that pay homage to (and lay the ghosts of) all the dead metaphors. As in Alvin Lucier=E2=80=99s I Am Sitting in a Room, th= e speech in cheek=E2=80=99s work functions as something like echolocation: its refle= ctions (on him and in us) mapping out an ever more complex and multifocal shape fo= r the public sphere, =E2=80=9Cw h e r e o t h e r s f e a r t o / t / r e a d= .=E2=80=9D =E2=80=94 Peter Manson * cris cheek, part: short life housing. The Gig, 2009. ISBN 978-0-9735875-5-5= . 270pp, 6=E2=80=B3 x 9=E2=80=B3, perfectbound. ORDERING INFORMATION (with a special deal!) Within Canada: $22.50 =E2=80=94 Within the US: $22.50 US UK: =C2=A317 =E2=80=94 Euro: =E2=82=AC22 All prices include postage. A special deal: for $8 Cdn / $8 US / =C2=A35 / =E2=82=AC7, add one of the f= ollowing: * Slant, the canning town chronicles, sound&language (CD with cheek, Sianed Jones, Phillip Jeck =E2=80=94 music based around texts collected in part: s= hort life housing, as well as a reading of a Kinks tune=E2=80=A6!) * cris cheek, the church, the school, the beer (Critical Documents) * Antiphonies: Essays on Women=E2=80=99s Experimental Poetries in Canada * Maggie O=E2=80=99Sullivan, Palace of Reptiles * Allen Fisher, Entanglement Please make out cheques to =E2=80=9CNate Dorward=E2=80=9D, & send to: 109 Hounslow Ave, North York, ON, M2N 2B1, Canada (email: ndorward [at-sign] ndorward [dot] com) =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 11:39:56 +1200 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Lisa Samuels Subject: Oystercatcher Press wins UK pamphlet award MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I meant to send this earlier. It's great to see a wide-ranging avant chapbook press win such a thing. See story following the individual winner (Elizabeth Burns) write-up: 'Oystercatcher Press has won the UK Poetry Publisher Award of the Michael Marks Awards for Poetry Pamphlets at PBS' http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2009/jun/25/poetry-pamphlet-award-elizab eth-burns Lisa ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 20:49:35 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Paul Nelson Subject: Re: Slow Language In-Reply-To: <2009072513041523ad963e7e@webmail1.edinboro.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Lisa, Have you seen the Big Bridge Slow Poetry anthology? http://bigbridge.org/BB14/SLOWPO.HTM Bon appetit. Paul Paul E. Nelson Global Voices Radio SPLAB! American Sentences Organic Poetry Poetry Postcard Blog Ilalqo, WA 253.735.6328 ________________________________ From: EJOYCE To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Sent: Saturday, July 25, 2009 6:04:15 AM Subject: Slow Language On NPR this morning Scott Simon asked a novelist how the Internet has affected writing. He responded that he now finds it difficult to read writers like Henry James because he has grown unaccustomed to complicated syntax and longer, more developed arguments and that a movement needs to be started like the Slow Foods Movement that he called Slow Language. He said that poetry constitutes slow language. --Lisa Joyce p.s. It took me a long time to write this message but, sadly, I write it from a long distance from any other readers. Does Slow Language, like Slow Foods, need to embrace the local and the locally produced? ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 23:28:55 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jim Andrews Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry In-Reply-To: <155462.39245.qm@web34206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > I've had some discussions recently > following from a remark by a friend that the distinction between > visual art and poetry is reactionary, similarly to the hard and fast > distinction that used to be made between sculpure and painting. what do you mean by "reactionary"? books on language in visual art have tended to concentrate on the work of conceptual artists. such as kosuth. visual poetry has not been prominent in visual art, certainly. partly because visual art is a gallery-oriented thing. and more involved in commerce than poetry tends to be. also, visual poetry very often is not sophisticated as image, ie, it's not up to snuff as image. but even when it is, it's usually not very involved in gallerys and commerce and so on. > Personally I can't help but thinking > that even though often the distinction is blurred, there remains an > essential difference between the two; namely, that > visual art might, but need not use language, but for poetry, however > widely > understood, language is an essential ingredient. what do you mean by "language"? i think that what we think of as language is changing. just fer instance, in the theory of computation, a language can be simply a set of strings. and the theory of computation can be viewed as the study of the formal properties of sets of strings, of languages. clearly this notion of language is a bit different from what a poet might typically think of as language. but, also, we see how the realm of the visual can in some cases be mapped to languages. we 'parse' the visual field. we give space a kind of syntax and grammar. pattern recognition is language recognition because patterns are expressed in computing environments as strings or sets of strings or rules for generating sets of strings. all of which is just to suggest that part of the whole intensity of our moment as poets involves a deep broadening and reexamination of what we think of as language and where and how language operates. and of course this touches arts and science. concerning poetry, for me, it's the intensity of the engagement with language that counts. not whether it's in a particular form of language. ja http://vispo.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 03:51:04 +0530 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve dalachinsky Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit try visual poetry On Fri, 24 Jul 2009 10:57:18 -0700 nieuwland jeroen writes: > Dear everyone, > > > I've had some discussions recently > following from a remark by a friend that the distinction between > visual art and poetry is reactionary, similarly to the hard and > fast > distinction that used to be made between sculpure and painting. > > Personally I can't help but thinking > that even though often the distinction is blurred, there remains an > essential difference between the two; namely, that > visual art might, but need not use language, but for poetry, however > widely > understood, language is an essential ingredient. > > Does anyone have any thoughts on this? > > Thanks and best, Jeroen > > > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 08:37:23 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Marcus Bales Subject: Re: Slow Language In-Reply-To: <2009072513041523ad963e7e@webmail1.edinboro.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Carrie Fisher: "Instant gratification takes too long." (A character in one of her novels says it, not her). On 25 Jul 2009 at 9:04, EJOYCE wrote: Date sent: Sat, 25 Jul 2009 09:04:15 -0400 Send reply to: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: EJOYCE Subject: Slow Language To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > On NPR this morning Scott Simon asked a novelist how the Internet > has affected writing. He responded that he now finds it difficult to > read writers like Henry James because he has grown unaccustomed to > complicated syntax and longer, more developed arguments and that a > movement needs to be started like the Slow Foods Movement that he > called Slow Language. He said that poetry constitutes slow > language. > > --Lisa Joyce > > p.s. It took me a long time to write this message but, sadly, I > write it from a long distance from any other readers. Does Slow > Language, like Slow Foods, need to embrace the local and the locally > produced? > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 09:13:59 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Murat Nemet-Nejat Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry In-Reply-To: <43B2F981FDBD4914BC3F279641C2B33C@OwnerPC> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Jim, "also, visual poetry very often is not sophisticated as image, ie, it's not up to snuff as image. but even when it is, it's usually not very involved in gallerys and commerce and so on." I do agree about poetry not being involved in commerce part of your comment. But what do you mean by "not sophisticated"? Are you not equating sophistication by the techinical prowess of computers, in that way, being trapped by the ghost of progress? Is progress not a quality that often the poets/artists of one age feel about themselves only to be disillusioned later, to be debunked or attacked by a later age? Ciao, Murat On Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 2:28 AM, Jim Andrews wrote: > I've had some discussions recently >> following from a remark by a friend that the distinction between >> visual art and poetry is reactionary, similarly to the hard and fast >> distinction that used to be made between sculpure and painting. >> > > what do you mean by "reactionary"? > > books on language in visual art have tended to concentrate on the work of > conceptual artists. such as kosuth. > > visual poetry has not been prominent in visual art, certainly. partly > because visual art is a gallery-oriented thing. and more involved in > commerce than poetry tends to be. > > also, visual poetry very often is not sophisticated as image, ie, it's not > up to snuff as image. but even when it is, it's usually not very involved in > gallerys and commerce and so on. > > Personally I can't help but thinking >> that even though often the distinction is blurred, there remains an >> essential difference between the two; namely, that >> visual art might, but need not use language, but for poetry, however >> widely >> understood, language is an essential ingredient. >> > > what do you mean by "language"? > > i think that what we think of as language is changing. > > just fer instance, in the theory of computation, a language can be simply a > set of strings. and the theory of computation can be viewed as the study of > the formal properties of sets of strings, of languages. clearly this notion > of language is a bit different from what a poet might typically think of as > language. > > but, also, we see how the realm of the visual can in some cases be mapped > to languages. we 'parse' the visual field. we give space a kind of syntax > and grammar. pattern recognition is language recognition because patterns > are expressed in computing environments as strings or sets of strings or > rules for generating sets of strings. > > all of which is just to suggest that part of the whole intensity of our > moment as poets involves a deep broadening and reexamination of what we > think of as language and where and how language operates. and of course this > touches arts and science. > > concerning poetry, for me, it's the intensity of the engagement with > language that counts. not whether it's in a particular form of language. > > ja > http://vispo.com > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 09:32:25 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Camille Martin Subject: new on Rogue Embryo's blog In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 New on Rogue Embryo=92s blog: New & improved font! Also: Experiment #61 a pinch of salt Continents of Foam: Elis=E9e Reclus=92 Analogous Phenomena The Prince of Orange Gail Tarantino: Learning to Use Spoon by Reading Braille how beautiful is the universe When Houses Were Alive http://rogueembryo.wordpress.com Camille Martin http://www.camillemartin.ca http://rogueembryo.wordpress.com =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 10:17:32 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Douglas Manson Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry In-Reply-To: <20090727.035104.1104.5.skyplums@juno.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit A great set of questions, and Jim's post is helpful in thinking about them. I also wonder why the distinction would be reactionary. There were a lot of visual artists/media artists in the poetics seminars led by Charles Bernstein at UB in the 1990s. Jim is wrong about poets in galleries--hundreds of visual poets have had their work in flagship museums/galleries, and too many to list here, but the most recent is Lawrence Wiener's 40 year retrospective at the Whitney Museum. Dick Higgins' term intermedia (and his book on that subject) is the most useful, I think, to understanding the relationships of/ between and in the arts. People should reject the distinction & develop as much as possible as cultural, creative, performing, practicing artists and writers. The distinction is classical, categorical (Aristotelian) and relates to social identities more than any practice. From the sociological viewpoint, we can understand the economic meaning and use of the distinction, the specific "places" constructed for the making, distributing, consumption of the work. This is found in concrete form in the academic disciplines, and among organizations, associations, foundations, etc. i.e.: museum vs. library. Lessing's book Laocoon. Conceptual artists, digital artists, conceptual writers, digital literature--etc. the viewpoint from aesthetics and poetics is of a fluid continuum of practices and works. Our computer screens, our monitors, are now a place of text bound by a heretofore visually-oriented "frame" (a TV)--though digital writing can be projected on, or through, just about any medium now. Also the distinction of the limitation of language v. universality of image--thus the 1960s-onward excitement over the idea of visual poetry bringing, immediately, poetic forms into international exchange beyond the limits of any local language. see the poem, talk the art. Now someone should tell us all about the distinction between thinking and art. Are art and thinking different? douglas On Sun, Jul 26, 2009 at 6:21 PM, steve dalachinsky wrote: > try visual poetry > > On Fri, 24 Jul 2009 10:57:18 -0700 nieuwland jeroen > writes: > > Dear everyone, > > > > > > I've had some discussions recently > > following from a remark by a friend that the distinction between > > visual art and poetry is reactionary, similarly to the hard and > > fast > > distinction that used to be made between sculpure and painting. > > > > Personally I can't help but thinking > > that even though often the distinction is blurred, there remains an > > essential difference between the two; namely, that > > visual art might, but need not use language, but for poetry, however > > widely > > understood, language is an essential ingredient. > > > > Does anyone have any thoughts on this? > > > > Thanks and best, Jeroen > > > > > > > > > > ================================== > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > -- www.dougfinmanson.blogspot.com www.myspace.com/inksaudible ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 10:29:51 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Laura Hinton Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry In-Reply-To: <43B2F981FDBD4914BC3F279641C2B33C@OwnerPC> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Although verbal and visual languages are different, they are both "languages." I've been reading W.J.T. Mitchell, who conceptualizes many of these issues in historic and conceptual detail. The classic perspective traditionally perceives the "visual" as *not* "language," as *not* artifice but "natural," or "immediate" to the eye -- therefore, something very unlike poetry. That perspective, historically (for example, Gombrich) has given way to a recognition that such "immediacy" in the visual image is a myth, and that visual images are as manipulated and textual as are verbal/poetic ones. -- Laura Hinton Professor of English City College of New York http://www.mermaidtenementpress.com http://www.chantdelasirene.com On Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 2:28 AM, Jim Andrews wrote: > I've had some discussions recently >> following from a remark by a friend that the distinction between >> visual art and poetry is reactionary, similarly to the hard and fast >> distinction that used to be made between sculpure and painting. >> > > what do you mean by "reactionary"? > > books on language in visual art have tended to concentrate on the work of > conceptual artists. such as kosuth. > > visual poetry has not been prominent in visual art, certainly. partly > because visual art is a gallery-oriented thing. and more involved in > commerce than poetry tends to be. > > also, visual poetry very often is not sophisticated as image, ie, it's not > up to snuff as image. but even when it is, it's usually not very involved in > gallerys and commerce and so on. > > Personally I can't help but thinking >> that even though often the distinction is blurred, there remains an >> essential difference between the two; namely, that >> visual art might, but need not use language, but for poetry, however >> widely >> understood, language is an essential ingredient. >> > > what do you mean by "language"? > > i think that what we think of as language is changing. > > just fer instance, in the theory of computation, a language can be simply a > set of strings. and the theory of computation can be viewed as the study of > the formal properties of sets of strings, of languages. clearly this notion > of language is a bit different from what a poet might typically think of as > language. > > but, also, we see how the realm of the visual can in some cases be mapped > to languages. we 'parse' the visual field. we give space a kind of syntax > and grammar. pattern recognition is language recognition because patterns > are expressed in computing environments as strings or sets of strings or > rules for generating sets of strings. > > all of which is just to suggest that part of the whole intensity of our > moment as poets involves a deep broadening and reexamination of what we > think of as language and where and how language operates. and of course this > touches arts and science. > > concerning poetry, for me, it's the intensity of the engagement with > language that counts. not whether it's in a particular form of language. > > ja > http://vispo.com > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 08:39:27 -0800 Reply-To: Laurie Schneider & Crag Hill Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Laurie Schneider & Crag Hill Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jeroen: Ah, a question that seems to never get satisfactorily answered. People have been trying since Plato: http://humanities.uchicago.edu/faculty/mitchell/glossary2004/utpicturapoesis.htm Best, Crag ----- Original Message ----- From: "nieuwland jeroen" To: Sent: Friday, July 24, 2009 9:57 AM Subject: Visual art / poetry > Dear everyone, > > > I've had some discussions recently > following from a remark by a friend that the distinction between > visual art and poetry is reactionary, similarly to the hard and fast > distinction that used to be made between sculpure and painting. > > Personally I can't help but thinking > that even though often the distinction is blurred, there remains an > essential difference between the two; namely, that > visual art might, but need not use language, but for poetry, however > widely > understood, language is an essential ingredient. > > Does anyone have any thoughts on this? > > Thanks and best, Jeroen > > > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.392 / Virus Database: 270.13.29/2261 - Release Date: 07/25/09 05:58:00 ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 10:59:38 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Maria Damon Subject: mercy mercy mercy Comments: To: Theory and Writing , spidertangle@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Merce Cunningham, the American choreographer who was among a handful of 20th-century figures to make dance a major art and a major form of theater, died Sunday night. He was 90 and lived in Manhattan. Read More: http://www.nytimes.com/?emc=na ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 10:32:19 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: nieuwland jeroen Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry In-Reply-To: <43B2F981FDBD4914BC3F279641C2B33C@OwnerPC> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Thanks Jim, 'reactionary' wasn't a word my friend used, but I assume he meant that there was a time when a distinction between visual art / poetry made sense, or at least was accepted, but that now it is anachronistic. I guess it does come down to what is meant with language and I do understand that images could be arranged in a formally 'linguistic' systematicity. It seems weird though that a visual artist or poet could present their work as either art or poetry. Not that I insist on the distinction, on the contrary. But I do have my doubts about calling syntactically/grammatically mapped images poetry. Isn't there a systematicity inherent in everything? Maybe it's the communal element I'm missing, that language is an agreed upon convention, used by a group of people.. "...part of the whole intensity of our moment as poets involves a deep broadening and reexamination of what we think of as language": I think this maybe is an accurate description of our present situation; that we're in a transitional moment with respect to language, leaving an unclear distinction between visual art / poetry. J. ________________________________ From: Jim Andrews To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 8:28:55 AM Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry > I've had some discussions recently > following from a remark by a friend that the distinction between > visual art and poetry is reactionary, similarly to the hard and fast > distinction that used to be made between sculpure and painting. what do you mean by "reactionary"? books on language in visual art have tended to concentrate on the work of conceptual artists. such as kosuth. visual poetry has not been prominent in visual art, certainly. partly because visual art is a gallery-oriented thing. and more involved in commerce than poetry tends to be. also, visual poetry very often is not sophisticated as image, ie, it's not up to snuff as image. but even when it is, it's usually not very involved in gallerys and commerce and so on. > Personally I can't help but thinking > that even though often the distinction is blurred, there remains an essential difference between the two; namely, that > visual art might, but need not use language, but for poetry, however widely > understood, language is an essential ingredient. what do you mean by "language"? i think that what we think of as language is changing. just fer instance, in the theory of computation, a language can be simply a set of strings. and the theory of computation can be viewed as the study of the formal properties of sets of strings, of languages. clearly this notion of language is a bit different from what a poet might typically think of as language. but, also, we see how the realm of the visual can in some cases be mapped to languages. we 'parse' the visual field. we give space a kind of syntax and grammar. pattern recognition is language recognition because patterns are expressed in computing environments as strings or sets of strings or rules for generating sets of strings. all of which is just to suggest that part of the whole intensity of our moment as poets involves a deep broadening and reexamination of what we think of as language and where and how language operates. and of course this touches arts and science. concerning poetry, for me, it's the intensity of the engagement with language that counts. not whether it's in a particular form of language. ja http://vispo.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 11:42:56 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: David Chirot Subject: Re: The cost of our dead poets society In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit One good thing abt the museums and landmarks approach is it helps generate money for the local community via tourism The money could be used for as Catherine suggest library places to teach or make zine posters anything- (there might be pressure to just crank out more little replicas of the house and the figure(s) of the writer/s who lived in the house- the "Fauxk Art" approach i call it- local citizens become elves in a little Bronte workshop and one day rebel! and burn the place down and then no more tourists-- seriously, there have been efforts in recent years to restore the houses Poe lived in in NYC-- my mother years ago sent a long long New Yorker article by a man who was in search of the house where Walt Whitman lived when he wrote and produced the First Edition of leaves of Grass. A very long search! Finally the writer climbs many flights of stairs and knocks on the door of the place where Whitman would've lived--and a giant Rastafarian answers the door. The writers says--did you know that the great poet Walt Whitman lived here when he wrote Leaves of Grass, the first version? the gentleman at the door replied--ho do you know a great poet isn't living here NOW. Recently, by accident, someone fired an actual shot during those mass recreations of the Battel of gettyburg in whcih people i exact historical uniforms and with gun replicas and swords and cannon fight out the "reply" of the 150 year old batte. I am surprised more people do not start taking advantge of these battles to do some battling of their own-- i wonder if someday to keep the costs of maintenance down, these scenes might not be presented as are those of the caves where the cave paintings are-- the caves one may no longer visit as part of their "protection" are replicated in every way, and that way the tourist, the interested, the curious--may "*re--experience* in a literal way via the *re-creation* of the original house where once upon a time the great so and so wrote in one corner and used the chamber pot in another- to experience via a replica--is a very interesting concept in itself-- does one experience the same sensory and spiritual aura & drama of the original site? or does one come away with a replica of what might have been one's experience in the face or inside the original? so that one's "experience" becomes removed from the site, distanced by replication-- and is another way in which the world is "evacuated" by the simulacrum, the replicants, reproductions, simulations-- one's feelings of a place are no longer of place but of an abstracted, distanced "idea" or "concept" of the "installation"-- the materials one is experiencing are not the same as the originals, perhaps made out of an entirely different kind of material, though looking all the same "very life-like"-- so now the living may visit a place where no one lived but is a life-like replica of a place where formerly people actually lived-- if "no one" other than an idea of a being, lives inside the replica--then is one encountering--no one? or a replkicant of the "writers spirit which one may still feel haunting these old walls." so--a "spirit" of the writer--becomes a replicant of the spirit of the writer existing in a replicated home of the writer-- surrounded by so much replication, does human remain strictly human, or does it not perhaps begin to take on "the feelings and emotions of an imagination or idea of a replicant's feelings and ideas"-- and so eventually the person who enter the replicated house and meet the replicants of the spirits of the dead writer--inhabiting and haunting these replicated spaces--what then?--eventually the person becomes awarre of the touch of the replicated as being more real than the untouched original-to themselves and their freinds and al the rest who come there-- and by feeling only replications, replicants eventual the human might dream, desire to be also a replicant of oneself's' dead being, or of one's living one--to "live on" as a replication of one 's spirit in a physical way impossible before-- then death would become more important than life because in death one can replicate life without the consequences as one remains only inside the replication of ones "safe" abode-- there would be then the necessitating of making a replicated body as well a replicated spirit-- one doesn't even have to die to "have one's replicant and spirit walk beside one"-- (perhaps related to --or a replicant of --"the Third Who Walks beside me"--as in Eliot or Burroughs-Gysin's The third mind--??-[-they had in mind the quote from Eliot]) i wi leave off there, but it is a variant on-what exactly are people seeking to view an original house where once the lady's slippers trod? are one's dreams one's life one's imagination altered by the contact with the spirit 'sitl infusing these pieces of furniture, these curtains, the very fireplace, with the spirit of the writer--" so that one walks out with a part of the "dead' one's being accompanying one-- and would this really be radically different once one was going to replicated caves and houses--- to touch greatness is this a way to Thank the writer and also hope that God willing some of the Greatness might rub off on oneself, or inhabit oneself as it is "drunk in," as one is "immersed in its spirit waves"-- i think the strangest "home of a writer" i have seen/been was that of Nostradamus (this was before much had been made of it being such--i imagine now a tourist trap of the Nostradamus-predictad MegaMagnitude!)-)--in Saint-Remy, where Van Gogh much later on committed suicide in the asylum just outside the little town-- this place was so tiny and almost unnoticeable in a street without sunshine straight out of literally-- to be sure!-- the "Dark Ages"-- as t was so anonymously like every other tiny low ceilinged stone house among the row of them lined exactly next each other-- the streets looked more like it belonged in the nearby town of Uzes-- which is to say-- like a much darker copy of the film Las Hurdas (Land without bread) by Luis Bunuel (a mockumentary) On Fri, Jul 24, 2009 at 10:53 AM, Catherine Daly wrote: > Are you the one who also posted about how Edith Wharton's House is losing > money?http://www.edithwharton.org/ > > "Thanks to the generosity of our supporters, > the co-operation of our principal creditors, and to a large gift from the > Alice M. Kaplan Memorial Reserve, The Mount has staved off the threat of > foreclosure that has recently threatened its existence." > > It always annoyed me that Lowe's supports Biltmore and not The Mount, but > The Mount people really overestimated the appeal of Wharton and the > Berkshires, and never hit up serious interior design / construction money. > > As opposed to The Mount, it seems that Gaskell's house is supposed to be > turned into a community center. I think that sounds like a good use, > rather > than teaching writing in soulless "youth centres," teaching writing in a > pretty house that local craftsmen helped restore. I think everyone's > beginning to realize how public objects become landmarks. That said, > "street view" of the existing community center indicates it is in yet > another tumbledown mansion. > > The Keats house has been a museum since 1925. > > -- > All best, > Catherine Daly > c.a.b.daly@gmail.com > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 16:41:02 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Small Press Traffic Subject: hey batter batter, swing batter MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bill Luoma has been working hard in preparation for his August baseball writing laboratory at the Oakland Coliseum. Check out what's in store for the workshop at http://oakdish.blogspot.com/. There is still room available for this event, so sign up today at smallpresstraffic@gmail.com. _____ The title of the workshop is Oakdish. Oakland A's /White Sox Game with Bill Luoma Oakland Coliseum Saturday August 22nd 3:45pm workshop/6:05pm game $40 includes admission to the game and a baseball to take home/ $30 students and members In the spirit of the Basketball Aritcle by Meyer and Waldman and Yo-Yo's with Money by Berrigan and Schiff, we will spend some time working on the body of baseball & poetry. Or just poetry since that encompasses baseball. read: * Beyond A Boundary, C.L.R. James, Duke Up 1993 * The American Game: Capitalism, Decolonialization, World Domination, and Baseball, John D. Kelly, Prickly Paradigm Press 1996 * The Basketball Article, Bernadette Mayer and Anne Waldman, Shark Books 2005 bring:notebook, pen, binoculars, short poem that will fit on a baseball, some phrase, collage on 4x6 baseball card, hat get: * 1 baseball * 1 copy (facsimile) of Yo-Yo's with Money, Ted Berrigan and Harris Schiff, United Artists 1977 * 1 copy (original) of the proceeds of whatever we do published by subpress if there is enough work/interest * 1 bleachers ticket to Oakland vs Detroit -- Samantha Giles Executive Director Small Press Traffic Literary Arts Center sptraffic.org smallpresstraffic.blogspot.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 22:09:06 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jim Andrews Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry In-Reply-To: <1dec21ae0907270613p7106c5b5t949e4e81cef6c5f5@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit it's nothing about computers, murat. a lot of visual poetry--of course there are wonderful exceptions--is not interesting as image. it is often interesting as text/image hybrid and possibly as language and/or poem in a mainly literary vein, or as proto-information/text step one poetics creator or as schematic language machine blueprint or musical 'score' or any number of other things that are strong enough functionally/conceptually that, in a real sense, it doesn't matter that, as image, they are naive or poorly executed or just not interested in the piece simply as image. usually visual poetry isn't by people whose main thing is visual art or who, otherwise, have managed to pick up a sense of image that makes inroads both literarily, in a broad sense, and in visual art. but, similarly, if you look at visual art, how often is it interesting concerning language even when it uses written language? it might be interesting as image or installation or event or in any number of other typically visual-art-oriented parameters. moreover, some scepticism regarding the efficacy of attention to the visual art oriented quality of image is warranted. often what's of interest is of interest as image for silly reasons. popular culture is a forty five year old determinedly juvenile. visual poetry is not often popular, it doesn't have to do the popular thing, and that also is valuable. also, a certain scepticism regarding the value of gallerys is useful. i remember hearing a big canadian curator say 'an artist without a gallery is nothing'. which is unbelievably arrogant. you know, in net art, early on, there was talk about the value of artists doing net art to be free from the gallerys. but of course much of that was punk-minded propaganda to attract the attention of a gallery. so i don't intend the remark simply as a criticism of visual poetry or visual poets. the practice is fluid, as douglas suggests. but my observation is that there still are lots of divides between visual art and visual poetry. ja http://vispo.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Murat Nemet-Nejat" To: Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 6:13 AM Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry > Hi Jim, > > "also, visual poetry very often is not sophisticated as image, ie, it's > not > up to snuff as image. but even when it is, it's usually not very involved > in > gallerys and commerce and so on." > > I do agree about poetry not being involved in commerce part of your > comment. > But what do you mean by "not sophisticated"? Are you not equating > sophistication by the techinical prowess of computers, in that way, being > trapped by the ghost of progress? Is progress not a quality that often the > poets/artists of one age feel about themselves only to be disillusioned > later, to be debunked or attacked by a later age? > > Ciao, > > Murat ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 21:17:52 -1000 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jonathan Morse Subject: CFP: Ashbery in Paris, 2010 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit http://www.fabula.org/actualites/article30672.php -- from Ron Silliman's blog. Jonathan Morse ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 16:49:08 -1000 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jonathan Morse Subject: Visuals and verbals In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Photography, language, and memory are discussed on the blog "The Art Part" at http://jonathan-morse.blogspot.com. Jonathan Morse ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 09:07:57 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: James Robinson Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry In-Reply-To: <669945.30025.qm@web34201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Interesting thread. It's funny. I am in the midst of proposing a show to a gallery. The name of the show is "I HATE POETRY READINGS"... Basically, it's an anthology bound on walls that promotes a public reading of work that resists , on some level, vocalization. I've always enjoyed art receptions and believe that kind of tone, and the communication amongst the viewers, is appropriate to fulfilling a text's meaning. Regular readings, in my experience, are so one way and very colonizing on the part of the reader...Further, there is also a serious tone, a stuffiness, that seems to stifle what could be valuable conversations regarding the work. The work I am looking for, and the work I've so far found for it, is what I call "post-genre" works. I somehow think it's important to stay away from the words "poems", "poetry", "visual poetry" -- people have assumptions of what these are, also, there are stereotypes of the "poem and poet" that I think are negative and cheesy-- black berets, warm and humid personalities. Case in point, I remember talking about poems to people who could care less-- their response: "Isn't poetry what you do before suicide?"-- So there's "poetry as symptom"... Work being produced today fail public's templates of what a poem is-- largely because of curriculum and public education... SO here's my thought: 1) Come up with a new label 2) do readings in appropriate settings 3) Publish and sell posters instead of books. JR On Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 1:32 PM, nieuwland jeroen wrote: > Thanks Jim, > 'reactionary' wasn't a word my friend used, but I assume he meant that > there was a time when a distinction between visual art / poetry made sense, > or at least was accepted, but that now it is anachronistic. > > I guess it does come down to what is meant with language and I do > understand that images could be arranged in a formally 'linguistic' > systematicity. It seems weird though that a visual artist or poet could > present their work as either art or poetry. Not that I insist on the > distinction, on the contrary. But I do have my doubts about calling > syntactically/grammatically mapped images poetry. Isn't there a > systematicity inherent in everything? Maybe it's the communal element I'm > missing, that language is an agreed upon convention, used by a group of > people.. > > "...part of the whole intensity of our moment as poets involves a deep > broadening and reexamination of what we think of as language": I think this > maybe is an accurate description of our present situation; that we're in a > transitional moment with respect to language, leaving an unclear distinction > between visual art / poetry. > > J. > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > From: Jim Andrews > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 8:28:55 AM > Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry > > > I've had some discussions recently > > following from a remark by a friend that the distinction between > > visual art and poetry is reactionary, similarly to the hard and fast > > distinction that used to be made between sculpure and painting. > > what do you mean by "reactionary"? > > books on language in visual art have tended to concentrate on the work of > conceptual artists. such as kosuth. > > visual poetry has not been prominent in visual art, certainly. partly > because visual art is a gallery-oriented thing. and more involved in > commerce than poetry tends to be. > > also, visual poetry very often is not sophisticated as image, ie, it's not > up to snuff as image. but even when it is, it's usually not very involved in > gallerys and commerce and so on. > > > Personally I can't help but thinking > > that even though often the distinction is blurred, there remains an > essential difference between the two; namely, that > > visual art might, but need not use language, but for poetry, however > widely > > understood, language is an essential ingredient. > > what do you mean by "language"? > > i think that what we think of as language is changing. > > just fer instance, in the theory of computation, a language can be simply a > set of strings. and the theory of computation can be viewed as the study of > the formal properties of sets of strings, of languages. clearly this notion > of language is a bit different from what a poet might typically think of as > language. > > but, also, we see how the realm of the visual can in some cases be mapped > to languages. we 'parse' the visual field. we give space a kind of syntax > and grammar. pattern recognition is language recognition because patterns > are expressed in computing environments as strings or sets of strings or > rules for generating sets of strings. > > all of which is just to suggest that part of the whole intensity of our > moment as poets involves a deep broadening and reexamination of what we > think of as language and where and how language operates. and of course this > touches arts and science. > > concerning poetry, for me, it's the intensity of the engagement with > language that counts. not whether it's in a particular form of language. > > ja > http://vispo.com > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 07:20:08 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Comments: RFC822 error: Invalid RFC822 field - "Reading at Small's Jazz Club in New York City". Rest of header flushed. From: Eric Hoffman Subject: Reading at Small's in New York City, 9/12/09 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Eric Hoffman =0AReading at Small's Jazz Club in New York City=0Ahttp://www.= smallsjazzclub.com/=0A=A0=0AWhen: Saturday, September 12th, 2009=0AWhere: S= mall's Jazz Club located at 183 W. 10th Street in the Village. =0ATime: 5 p= .m.=0A=A0=0AHope to see you there!=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 08:06:39 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Stephen Vincent Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable As much as I think/know there are many by now great pieces of 'concrete poe= try' that implicate both mediums - visual and linguistic(aka 'words', 'lett= ers') - into an integrated object, I think it's also fun, insightful, etc.,= to keep and figure out ways to keep both mediums=A0 'knocking heads' with = each other - that is, exploring ways in which the combination of visual and= linguistic offer the opportunity, for example, to yoke together opposites = and/or similarities to produce something different - maybe comic and/or bar= oque in ways that provoke the senses and mind into unpredictable places/pie= ces.=20 I say this now in part - if I can be self-serving here - because of a curre= nt blog "Daily Phrase Project"=A0 for this month in which my practice has b= een to combine a photograph and either a piece of signage or a spoken phras= e into 'a unit.'=A0 In addition to keeping my eye and ear perked to the loc= al ground (tho phrases sometime leap out of the international TV set), I fi= nd both the exploration and the resulting combinations often to be revelato= ry. As to whether or not this work may also be taken as a form of 'social s= culpture', that thought, for whatever its worth, has crossed my mind, too. = As well as make me rethink other viz/po considerations.=20 If interested take a look at: http://stephenvincent.net/blog/ Stephen Vincent --- On Mon, 7/27/09, nieuwland jeroen wrote: From: nieuwland jeroen Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Monday, July 27, 2009, 10:32 AM Thanks Jim,=20 'reactionary' wasn't a word my friend used, but I assume he meant that ther= e was a time when a distinction between visual art / poetry made sense, or = at least was accepted, but that now it is anachronistic.=A0=20 I guess it does come down to what is meant with language and I do understan= d that images could be arranged in a formally 'linguistic' systematicity. I= t seems weird though that a visual artist or poet could present their work = as either art or poetry. Not that I insist on the distinction, on the contr= ary. But I do have my doubts about calling syntactically/grammatically mapp= ed images poetry. Isn't there a systematicity inherent in everything? Maybe= it's the communal element I'm missing, that language is an agreed upon con= vention, used by a group of people..=A0=20 "...part of the whole intensity of our moment as poets involves a deep broa= dening and reexamination of what we think of as language": I think this may= be is an accurate description of our present situation; that we're in a tra= nsitional moment with respect to language, leaving an unclear distinction b= etween visual art / poetry.=20 J. ________________________________ From: Jim Andrews To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 8:28:55 AM Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry > I've had some discussions recently > following from a remark by a friend that the distinction between > visual art and poetry is reactionary, similarly to the hard and fast > distinction that used to be made between sculpure and painting. what do you mean by "reactionary"? books on language in visual art have tended to concentrate on the work of c= onceptual artists. such as kosuth. visual poetry has not been prominent in visual art, certainly. partly becau= se visual art is a gallery-oriented thing. and more involved in commerce th= an poetry tends to be. also, visual poetry very often is not sophisticated as image, ie, it's not = up to snuff as image. but even when it is, it's usually not very involved i= n gallerys and commerce and so on. > Personally I can't help but thinking > that even though often the distinction is blurred, there remains an essen= tial difference between the two; namely, that > visual art might, but need not use language, but for poetry, however wide= ly > understood, language is an essential ingredient. what do you mean by "language"? i think that what we think of as language is changing. just fer instance, in the theory of computation, a language can be simply a= set of strings. and the theory of computation can be viewed as the study o= f the formal properties of sets of strings, of languages. clearly this noti= on of language is a bit different from what a poet might typically think of= as language. but, also, we see how the realm of the visual can in some cases be mapped t= o languages. we 'parse' the visual field. we give space a kind of syntax an= d grammar. pattern recognition is language recognition because patterns are= expressed in computing environments as strings or sets of strings or rules= for generating sets of strings. all of which is just to suggest that part of the whole intensity of our mom= ent as poets involves a deep broadening and reexamination of what we think = of as language and where and how language operates. and of course this touc= hes arts and science. concerning poetry, for me, it's the intensity of the engagement with langua= ge that counts. not whether it's in a particular form of language. ja http://vispo.com=20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =A0 =A0 =A0=20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 08:47:17 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve russell Subject: Re: The cost of our dead poets society MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable now i don't mind a little tourism in the town where i grew up as it gave us= the Kerouax house in Orlando Florida, but where are those little greasy el= ves when you need them to burn down DISNEY WORLD??????????????????????? --- On Mon, 7/27/09, David Chirot wrote: From: David Chirot Subject: Re: The cost of our dead poets society To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Monday, July 27, 2009, 2:42 PM One good thing abt the museums and landmarks approach is it helps generate money for the local community via tourism The money could be used for as Catherine suggest library places to teach or make zine posters anything- (there might be pressure to just crank out more little replicas of the hous= e and the figure(s) of the writer/s who lived in the house- the "Fauxk Art" approach i call it- local citizens become elves in a little Bronte workshop and one day rebel! and burn the place down and then no more tourists-- seriously, there have been efforts in recent years to restore the houses Po= e lived in in NYC-- my mother years ago sent a long long New Yorker article by a man who was in search of the house where Walt Whitman lived when he wrote and produced the First Edition of leaves of Grass.=A0 A very long search!=A0 Finally the wri= ter climbs many flights of stairs and knocks on the door of the place where Whitman would've lived--and a giant Rastafarian answers the door. The writers says--did you know that the great poet Walt Whitman lived here when he wrote Leaves of Grass, the first version? the gentleman at the door replied--ho do you know a great poet isn't living here NOW. Recently, by accident, someone fired an actual shot during those mass recreations of the Battel of gettyburg in whcih people i exact historical uniforms and with gun replicas and swords and cannon fight out the "reply" of the 150 year old batte. I am surprised more people do not start taking advantge of these battles to do some battling of their own-- i wonder if someday to keep the costs of maintenance down, these scenes might not be presented as are those of the caves where the cave paintings are-- the caves one may no longer visit as part of their "protection" are replicated in every way, and that way the tourist, the interested, the curious--may "*re--experience* in a literal way via the *re-creation* of th= e original house where once upon a time the great so and so wrote in one corner and used the chamber pot in another- to experience via a replica--is a very interesting concept in itself-- does one experience the same sensory and spiritual aura & drama of the original site? or does one come away with a replica of what might have been one's experience in the face or inside the original? so that one's "experience" becomes removed from the site, distanced by replication-- and is another way in which the world is "evacuated" by the simulacrum, the replicants, reproductions, simulations-- one's feelings of a place are no longer of place but of an abstracted, distanced "idea" or "concept" of the "installation"-- the materials one is experiencing are not the same as the originals, perhap= s made out of an entirely different kind of material, though looking all the same "very life-like"-- so now the living may visit a place where no one lived but is a life-like replica of a place where formerly people actually lived-- if "no one" other than an idea of a being, lives inside the replica--then i= s one encountering--no one? or a replkicant of the "writers spirit which one may still feel haunting these old walls." so--a "spirit" of the writer--becomes a replicant of the spirit of the writer existing in a replicated home of the writer-- surrounded by so much replication, does human remain strictly human, or doe= s it not perhaps begin to take on "the feelings and emotions of an imaginatio= n or idea of a replicant's feelings and ideas"-- and so eventually the person who enter the replicated house and meet the replicants of the spirits of the dead writer--inhabiting and haunting these replicated spaces--what then?--eventually the person becomes awarre of the touch of the replicated as being more real than the untouched original-to themselves and their freinds and al the rest who come there-- and by feeling only replications, replicants eventual the human might dream= , desire to be also a replicant of oneself's' dead being, or of one's living one--to "live on" as a replication of one 's spirit in a physical way impossible before-- then death would become more important than life because in death one can replicate life without the consequences as one remains only inside the replication of ones "safe" abode-- there would be then the necessitating of making a replicated body as well a replicated spirit-- one doesn't even have to die to "have one's replicant and spirit walk besid= e one"-- (perhaps related to --or a replicant of --"the Third Who Walks beside me"--as in Eliot or Burroughs-Gysin's The third mind--??-[-they had in mind the quote from Eliot]) i wi leave off there, but it is a variant on-what exactly are people seekin= g to view an original house where once the lady's slippers trod? are one's dreams one's life one's imagination altered by the contact with the spirit 'sitl infusing these pieces of furniture, these curtains, the very fireplace, with the spirit of the writer--" so that one walks out with a part of the "dead' one's being accompanying one-- and would this really be radically different once one was going to replicated caves and houses--- to touch greatness is this a way to Thank the writer and also hope that God willing some of the Greatness might rub off on oneself, or inhabit oneself as it is "drunk in," as one is "immersed in its spirit waves"-- i think the strangest "home of a writer" i have seen/been=A0 was that of Nostradamus (this was before much had been made of it being such--i imagine now a tourist trap of the Nostradamus-predictad MegaMagnitude!)-)--in Saint-Remy, where Van Gogh much later on committed suicide in the asylum just outside the little town-- this place was=A0 so tiny and almost unnoticeable in a street without sunsh= ine straight out of literally-- to be sure!-- the "Dark Ages"-- as t was so anonymously like every other tiny low ceilinged stone house among the row o= f them lined exactly next each other-- the streets looked more like it belonged in the nearby town of Uzes-- which is to say-- like a much darker copy of the film Las Hurdas (Land without bread) by Luis Bunuel (a mockumentary) On Fri, Jul 24, 2009 at 10:53 AM, Catherine Daly wrot= e: > Are you the one who also posted about how Edith Wharton's House is losing > money?http://www.edithwharton.org/ > > "Thanks to the generosity of our supporters= , > the co-operation of our principal creditors, and to a large gift from the > Alice M. Kaplan Memorial Reserve, The Mount has staved off the threat of > foreclosure that has recently threatened its existence." > > It always annoyed me that Lowe's supports Biltmore and not The Mount, but > The Mount people really overestimated the appeal of Wharton and the > Berkshires, and never hit up serious interior design / construction money= . > > As opposed to The Mount, it seems that Gaskell's house is supposed to be > turned into a community center.=A0 I think that sounds like a good use, > rather > than teaching writing in soulless "youth centres," teaching writing in a > pretty house that local craftsmen helped restore.=A0 I think everyone's > beginning to realize how public objects become landmarks.=A0 That said, > "street view" of the existing community center indicates it is in yet > another tumbledown mansion. > > The Keats house has been a museum since 1925. > > -- > All best, > Catherine Daly > c.a.b.daly@gmail.com > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 12:00:44 +0530 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve dalachinsky Subject: Re: mercy mercy mercy MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit went to open house at his studio lasdt nite to honor him films wine crackrs sausage fruit and a lovely rooftop in westbeth On Mon, 27 Jul 2009 10:59:38 -0500 Maria Damon writes: > Merce Cunningham, the American choreographer who was among a > handful of 20th-century figures to make dance a major art and > a major form of theater, died Sunday night. He was 90 and > lived in Manhattan. > > Read More: > http://www.nytimes.com/?emc=na > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 11:46:40 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jim Andrews Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry In-Reply-To: <669945.30025.qm@web34201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > "...part of the whole intensity of our moment as poets involves a deep > broadening and reexamination of what we think of as language": I think > this maybe is an accurate description of our present situation; that we're > in a transitional moment with respect to language, leaving an unclear > distinction between visual art / poetry. > > J. it may be that the gulf between the realms of visual art and visual poetry is, partly, a result of visual poetry doing something not simply worse but basically different from visual art. and that 'something' may relate to the above. the engagement of visual poetry with issues of language can be totally diverse and intense. difficult. idiosyncratic. personal. universal. but engaged with matters from computing to orality, poetry to code, visual art to publishing. 'the image' is not the main thing in visual poetry. this is often not understood by visual artists and visual poetry appears as the domain of writers who are simply incompetent and mainly unimaginative concerning everything visual. of course there is lots of that, but the main thing is that the image is not the main thing, in visual poetry, as it is in visual art. instead, it's the nature and intensity of the engagement with language. ja http://vispo.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 23:37:42 +0200 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Anny Ballardini Subject: the Four Seasons - a tribute to Antonio Vivaldi MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable For an exceptional summer, as exceptional are the contributors to this issue, an issue that concludes *The Four Seasons*, one poem after another t= o honor *Antonio Vivaldi*. Today, on the commemoration of his death on July 28, 1741, I felt I had to send out this announcement and I rushed to put together an Editorial. Only while writing these words, I realized it is Jul= y 28. Things happen above and below. I am therefore paying my reverence to th= e Maestro of the Conservatorio dell=92Ospedale della Piet=E0 to thank him for= his music. *Summer:* http://www.fieralingue.it/modules.php?name=3DContent&pa=3Dlist_pages_catego= ries&cid=3D340 *=B7* Editorial: Anny Ballardini *=B7* Charlotte Mandel *=B7* Marton Koppany *=B7* Bob Grumman *=B7* Dan Waber * =B7* Hoshang Merchant *=B7* Max Richards *=B7* Barbara Crooker *=B7* Tony Trigilio *=B7* Barry Spacks *=B7* Carol Novack *=B7* Tad Richards *=B7* Jerome Rothenberg *=B7* Jon Corelis *=B7* Wendy Vardaman *=B7* Edward Mycue *=B7* James Cervantes *=B7* David Howard *=B7* Frank Parker *=B7* Ann Fisher-Wirth *=B7* Ruth Fainlight *=B7* Pierre Joris *=B7* Grace Cavalieri *=B7* Elizabeth Smither *=B7* Eileen Tabios *=B7* Nancy Keane *=B7* Douglas Clark *=B7* Jeff Harrison *=B7* Sonja James *=B7* Marilyn Hacker *=B7* Pam Brown * =B7* Crag Hill *=B7 * Obododimma Oha *=B7* Fan Ogilvie *=B7* Ned Condini *=B7* Diane Kendig *=B7* Jerry McGuire *=B7* Donna Pecore *=B7* Barry Alpert *=B7* William Allegrezza *=B7* Rebecca Seiferle *=B7* Geraldine Monk *=B7* Geof Huth * =B7* John Gery *=B7 * Eugen Galasso *=B7* Wendy Taylor Carlisle *=B7* Evelyn Posamentier *=B7* Lars Palm * =B7* Daniel Zimmerman *=B7* Karl Young *=B7* Paolo Dalponte *=B7* Sharon Dolin And to thank all those who have followed me in this yearlong Tribute I woul= d like to invite you to read the previous issues with further additions: *Spring:* http://www.fieralingue.it/modules.php?name=3DContent&pa=3Dlist_pages_catego= ries&cid=3D333 *=B7* Editorial: Anny Ballardini *=B7* Lesley Wheeler *=B7* Barry Spacks *=B7* Jerome Rothenberg *=B7* Joseph Duemer *=B7* Frank Parker *=B7* Camille Martin *=B7* David Howard *=B7* Jeff Harrison *=B7* M=E1r= ton Kopp=E1ny = *=B7* Pam Brown *=B7= * Elizabeth Smither *= =B7* Edward Mycue *=B7= * Pierre Joris *=B7= * Dennis Barone *= =B7* Martin J. Walker = *=B7* Geof Huth *=B7*= Barbara Crooker *= =B7* Silvia Levenson *= =B7* Mark Young *=B7= * Katia Kapovich *= =B7* Daniela Gioseffi *= =B7* Jon Corelis *= =B7* Edward Mycue (Sec= ond Part) *=B7* Jesse Glass *=B7* Ned Condini *=B7* Wendy Taylor Carlisle *=B7* Tom Savage *=B7* Wendy Vardaman *=B7* Evelyn Posamentier *=B7* Larry Jaffe *=B7* Donna Pecore *=B7* Patricia Valdata *=B7* Jill Jones *=B7* Tad Richards *=B7* Hoshang Merchant *=B7* Tim Mayo *=B7 * Karl Young *=B7 * David Graham *=B7* Eve Rifkah *=B7* Ren Katherine Powell *=B7* Penelope Schott *=B7* Alexander Jorgensen *=B7* Larissa Shmailo *=B7* Beebe Barksdale-Bruner *=B7* Linda Benninghoff *=B7* Charlotte Mandel *=B7* Katerina Klemer *=B7* Claire Keyes *=B7* Georg= ia Ann Banks-Martin *=B7 * Christina Pacosz *=B7* Phibby Venable *=B7* Ada Jill Schneider *=B7* Ann Fisher-Wirth *=B7* Spencer Selby *=B7* Amy Gottlieb *=B7* Fan Ogilvie *=B7* Paul Vangelisti *=B7* Jerry McGuire *=B7* Jim Leftwich *=B7* Wendy Taylor Carlisle *=B7* Jean Vengua *=B7* Dan Waber * =B7* John Bloomberg-Rissman *=B7* Bob G= rumman *=B7* Sharo= n Dolin *=B7* Berty Skuber *=B7* Patrick McManus *=B7* David-Baptiste Chirot *=B7* Jennifer Hill *Winter: * http://www.fieralingue.it/modules.php?name=3DContent&pa=3Dlist_pages_catego= ries&cid=3D329 *=B7* Editorial: Anny Ballardini *=B7* Martha King *=B7* Hiram Larew *=B7* James Cervantes *=B7* Laura Kennelly *=B7* Edward Mycue *=B7* Alicia Ostriker *=B7* Geof Huth * =B7* Elizabeth Smither *=B7* Daniel Zimmerman *=B7* Barry Spacks *=B7* Eve Rifkah *=B7* Gertrude Halstaed *=B7* Beverly Matherne *=B7* Donna Pecore *=B7* Jeff Harrison *=B7* Grace Cavalieri *=B7* Diane Lockward *=B7* Camille Martin *=B7* Dennis Barone *=B7* Alan Sondheim *=B7* Alexander Dickow *=B7* Douglas Clark *=B7* David Graham *=B7* Bob Grumman *=B7* Eileen Tabios *=B7* Sarah Menefee *=B7* Pam Brown * =B7* Ray DiPalma *=B7* Jerry McGuire *=B7* Henry Reed *=B7* Paolo Ruffilli *=B7* Allen Bramhall *=B7* J.P. Dancing Bear *=B7* Mark Weiss *=B7* Susan Rich *=B7* Karl Young *=B7* Ruth Fainlight *=B7* Geoffrey Gatza *=B7* Jim Leftwich *=B7* Alan Michael Parker *=B7* Barbara Crooker *=B7* Jerome Rothenberg *=B7* Deborah Humphreys *=B7* Paolo Dalponte *=B7* Susan Edwards *=B7* Jean Lamberty *=B7* Ned Condini *=B7* Jill Jones *=B7* Lois Roma-Deeley *=B7* Fan Ogilvie *=B7* Peter Ciccariello *=B7* Frank Parker *=B7* Jon Corelis *=B7* Tim Mayo *=B7 * Alan Halsey * =B7* Spencer Selby *=B7* M=E1rton Kopp=E1ny *=B7* Wendy Vardaman *=B7* Dan Waber * =B7* Wendy Taylor Carlisle *=B7* Evelyn Posamentier *=B7* Sheila E. Murphy *=B7* Ann Fisher- Wirth *=B7* Bob Holman *=B7* Berty Skuber *=B7* Michael Peverett *=B7* Obododimma Oha *=B7* Richard Dillon *=B7* Diane Kendig *=B7* Jukka-Pekka Kervinen *=B7* Geraldine Monk *=B7* William Allegrezza * =B7* S=E9amas Cain *=B7* Tad Richards *=B7* Bill Morgan *=B7* Hoshang Merchant *=B7* James Finnegan *=B7* Michael Snider *=B7* Yerra Sugarman *=B7* Paul Vangelisti *=B7* Jukka-Pekka Kervinen *=B7* Patrick McManus *=B7* Bob Grumman *=B7* Jennifer Hill *Autumn*: http://www.fieralingue.it/modules.php?name=3DContent&pa=3Dlist_pages_catego= ries&cid=3D318 *=B7* Introduction by Anny Ballardini *=B7* Dirk Vekemans *=B7* Bobbi Lurie *=B7* Anny Ballardini *=B7* Obododimma Oha *=B7* Jeff Harrison *=B7* Cecil Touchon *=B7* Halvard Johnson *=B7* Jill McCabe Johnson *=B7* Ann Neuser Lederer *=B7* Barbara Crooker *=B7* Christina Pacosz *=B7* Penelope Schott *=B7* Georgia Ann Banks-Martin *=B7* Sandra Giedeman *=B7* Joel Weishaus *=B7* Pat Falk *=B7 * Tim Mayo *=B7* Wendy Taylor Carlisle *=B7* Wendy Vardaman *=B7* Bill Morgan *=B7* Eileen Tabios *=B7* Sheila E. Murphy *=B7* Alan Sondheim *=B7* David Graham *=B7* Tad Richards *=B7* Bob Grumman *=B7* Henry Gould *=B7* Jukka-Pekka Kervinen *=B7* Guido Catalano *=B7* Ruth Fainlight *=B7* Ann Fisher-Wirth *=B7* Fan Ogilvie *=B7* Larissa Shmailo *=B7* Geof Huth * =B7* Grace Cavalieri *=B7* Mark Weiss *=B7* Pam Brown * =B7* David Howard *=B7* Edward Mycue *=B7* Elizabeth Smither *=B7* Elena Karina Byrne *=B7* David-Baptiste Chirot *=B7* Nico Vassilakis *=B7* Allen Bramhall *=B7* Dan Waber * =B7* Aaron Belz * =B7* Nicholas Piombino *=B7* Joseph Duemer *=B7* Daniel Zimmerman *=B7* Geoffrey Gatza *=B7* Jon Corelis *=B7* Berty Skuber *=B7* Peter Ciccariello *=B7* Evelyn Posamentier *=B7* Sharon Dolin *=B7* Mark Young *=B7* Charles Martin *=B7* Skip Fox *=B7 * Dianalee Velie *=B7* William Allegrezza *=B7* Karl Young *=B7* Richard Dillon *=B7* Dan Waber * =B7* Geraldine Monk * =B7* Paul Vangelisti *=B7* Jim Leftwich *=B7* Hoshang Merchant The main index of the Poets=92 Corner: http://www.fieralingue.it/modules.php?name=3DContent As usual the order of apparition follows the order by which I received the submission. My best wishes, Anny Ballardini --=20 Anny Ballardini http://annyballardini.blogspot.com/ http://www.fieralingue.it/modules.php?name=3Dpoetshome http://www.lulu.com/content/5806078 http://www.moriapoetry.com/ebooks.html I Tell You: One must still have chaos in one to give birth to a dancing star! Friedrich Nietzsche =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 15:45:56 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Nico Vassilakis Subject: SuBtExT/Seattle : Norma Cole & Will Owen : 8/5/09 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =20 for more info: =20 http://subtextreadingseries.blogspot.com/ =20 =20 thanks for your time=2C =20 nico _________________________________________________________________ NEW mobile Hotmail. Optimized for YOUR phone. Click here. http://windowslive.com/Mobile?ocid=3DTXT_TAGLM_WL_CS_MB_new_hotmail_072009= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 18:08:04 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Maria Damon Subject: Poetry and Cultural Studies: A Reader. Book Party, Bowery Poetry Club! MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit September 19, 2009 3:00-5:30 PM BOWERY POETRY CLUB, NYC BOOK PARTY FOR: POETRY AND CULTURAL STUDIES: A READER, edited by Maria Damon and Ira Livingston CELEBRATE POETRY’S ENGAGEMENT WITH THE SOCIAL! GET YOUR PICTURE TAKEN WITH WALTER BENJAMIN! ENTERTAINMENT AT 4:30: READINGS BY TRACIE MORRIS, CHARLES BERNSTEIN, AMITAVA KUMAR AND OTHER SPECIAL GUESTS. FREE AND OPEN TO THE POETRY-AND-CULTURAL-STUDIES-LOVING PUBLIC This volume is the first of its kind to collect classic and contemporary work focused on the intersection of poetry and cultural studies, reaching from Wordsworth's "Preface to Lyrical Ballads" and W. E. B. Du Bois's "Of the Sorrow Songs" to present-day essays on rap lyrics, queer poetry, folk poetry, and beyond. Rethinking poetic experience and its roles in popular or mass culture, these essays effectively delineate the relationship between poetry and the public social culture in which it is engendered. Partial List of Contributors: Lila Abu-Lughod, Theodor Adorno, Miguel Algarín, Walter Benjamin, Charles Bernstein, Kamau Brathwaite, Bruce Campbell, Steven Caton, Dipesh Chakrabarty, Page Dubois, W. E. B. Du Bois, Rachel Blau Duplessis, Antony Easthope, Henry Louis Gates, Jr., Stephen Henderson, Yunte Huang, Robin Kelley, Audre Lorde, Hans Robert Jauss, John Mowitt, Americo Paredes, Jacques Rancière, Kristin Ross, Eve Kosofsky Sedgwick, Trinh Minh Ha, Barrett Watten, William Wordsworth. "It is time for this book. Poetry is studied more and more frequently with a cultural studies approach, and Damon and Livingston provide the perfect balance in this collection."--Juliana Spahr COPIES OF THE BOOK WILL BE OFFERED FOR SALE AT AUTHORS’ DISCOUNT ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 00:16:06 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Andy Gricevich Subject: Meta-Shakespearean Socially Critical Theater in Minneapolis MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, all! Our theater group, the Nonsense Company, will premiere our big new theater = piece, STORM STILL, at the Minnesota Fringe Festival, starting this weekend= . If anyone's interested in socially critical metatextuality (gosh, who isn= 't?), avant-garde music, historical oddities, experimental writing, humor a= nd pathos, very well-rehearsed acting, and a bit of targeted nastiness, ple= ase do come! It will be strange, fun, and probably a bit distressing.=20 (The attentive may also catch fragments of Foucault, Spicer, Crane, and oth= ers).=20 I've pasted our mass email blurb below. Hope you're all doing well! Andy Hello, all! The Nonsense Company is proud to premiere its new=0Aplay-thing, STORM STILL= , as part of the Minnesota Fringe Festival,=0Astarting this Friday!=20 Outside an abandoned school a war rages.=20 Inside, three kids have been performing an unsupervised rendition of King L= ear for years.=20 Further inside, the mad King debates the purpose of theater with his Fool, = a licensed therapist. There=0Ais music of many kinds, rapid character shifts, trenchant bits,=0Ah= ilarity, sadness, history, poetry, centuries-old legalese and medical=0Ajar= gon, and even a little Shakespeare. The Philadelphia City Paper called it "Extremely =0A funny, clever, li= terate, engrossing, and absurd, carefully orchestrated =0A chaos that = made for fantastic entertainment."=A0 And they only saw 25 percent of it. July 31st-August 2nd and August 6th-8th all shows at 10 p.m.=A0 (the show runs 95 intermissionless minutes) City of Lakes Waldorf School 2344 Nicollet Avenue South Help alert the masses!=A0 And support the Fringe: http://www.fringefestival.org/2009/show/?id=3D1154 Hope to see you there! The Nonsense Company http://www.nonsensecompany.com =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 04:37:53 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Audrey Berry Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry In-Reply-To: <43B2F981FDBD4914BC3F279641C2B33C@OwnerPC> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Jim, you write,"it's the intensity of the engagement with language that cou= nts. Not whether it's in a particular form of language." This hits it dead = on. The intensity of the engagement becomes=A0particularly=A0transparent in= the visual form, especially when the act of (spontaneous) making is eviden= t in the visual poem. When the action of the brush is undeniable, its splat= ter, intention and even its accident, the energy speaks, and language forme= d out of the shape. At least this is one of the many ways it's possible. Th= is is a bit different for digital visual poetry, since the body is not as d= irectly evident. I'm curious what you think about this notion. For me, visual poetry is visceral. It acts upon the body more immediately t= han language alone. The image is registered by the brain before language, o= r as 'open language', as it impacts the senses. Size and color, whether som= ething is can be touched or manipulated are other factors. Visual poetry ge= ts people to "walk through" poems, it can invite and engage even the most r= eluctant and distracted viewer/participant.=A0 Audrey --- On Mon, 7/27/09, Jim Andrews wrote: From: Jim Andrews Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Monday, July 27, 2009, 2:28 AM > I've had some discussions recently > following from a remark by a friend that the distinction between > visual art and poetry is reactionary, similarly to the hard and fast > distinction that used to be made between sculpure and painting. what do you mean by "reactionary"? books on language in visual art have tended to concentrate on the work of c= onceptual artists. such as kosuth. visual poetry has not been prominent in visual art, certainly. partly becau= se visual art is a gallery-oriented thing. and more involved in commerce th= an poetry tends to be. also, visual poetry very often is not sophisticated as image, ie, it's not = up to snuff as image. but even when it is, it's usually not very involved i= n gallerys and commerce and so on. > Personally I can't help but thinking > that even though often the distinction is blurred, there remains an essen= tial difference between the two; namely, that > visual art might, but need not use language, but for poetry, however wide= ly > understood, language is an essential ingredient. what do you mean by "language"? i think that what we think of as language is changing. just fer instance, in the theory of computation, a language can be simply a= set of strings. and the theory of computation can be viewed as the study o= f the formal properties of sets of strings, of languages. clearly this noti= on of language is a bit different from what a poet might typically think of= as language. but, also, we see how the realm of the visual can in some cases be mapped t= o languages. we 'parse' the visual field. we give space a kind of syntax an= d grammar. pattern recognition is language recognition because patterns are= expressed in computing environments as strings or sets of strings or rules= for generating sets of strings. all of which is just to suggest that part of the whole intensity of our mom= ent as poets involves a deep broadening and reexamination of what we think = of as language and where and how language operates. and of course this touc= hes arts and science. concerning poetry, for me, it's the intensity of the engagement with langua= ge that counts. not whether it's in a particular form of language. ja http://vispo.com=20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 01:45:19 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Alexander Jorgensen Subject: Pushcart Prize - looking for news MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Anyone able to pass along some news on the most recently awaited Pushcart? = Your time will be much appreciated. =A0 Regards, AGJ=0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 14:12:06 +0530 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve dalachinsky Subject: george russell MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit pan-metric a-metric the great composer thorist -pianist george russell passed away at 86 listen if you never have ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 15:08:26 +0530 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve dalachinsky Subject: reading MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Steve Dalachinsky - words with Albey Balgochian's Bassentric: Lisle Ellis...bass Mike Bisio...bass Albey Balgochian...bass Aug. 11th, 2009, 8 P.M. @ Local 269 (269 E Houston St.) the bar on the corner of Houston & Suffolk St. $10 ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 15:56:32 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: William Allegrezza Subject: Have Save Cracked Slab Books MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cracked Slab Books is trying to stay alive through the recession. In order to do that, we are offering three of our books 45%-60% off their usual prices in order to raise some funds. One of the books is our anthology of Chicago Poetry, The City Visible. The other books are Garin Cycholl's Rafetown Georgics and Michelle Noteboom's Edging. Please help us by purchasing a book. To purchase the books at the special price, visit http://crackedslabbooks.com/facebook.html Bill Allegrezza ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 16:04:50 -0600 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Adam Katz Subject: Got a used copy of 'A'? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello,You know how sometimes it's possible to just give someone the perfect gift? Well, I put a lot of thought into gifts for the people who are important in my life, and my best friend is getting married in Boston on Sunday, and if I could give him a copy of Zukofsky's 'A' - but it's out of print! See, he's a medieval scholar, but he loves modernist literature, though doesn't study it enough to know about 'A' yet, and I am really, really hoping...anyways, if someone has a copy they'd be willing to sell - for less than the cheapest copy on Amazon, which is $80 and I'm sure wouldn't come in time, and can meet me in Boston/Cambridge on Saturday/Sunday or have it delivered to the friend there who I'll be staying with - please backchannel! Best, Adam Katz ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 20:06:18 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Allan Revich Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry In-Reply-To: <18f206a20907280607w4da8ea9at616a258ba46a0e50@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I think that one of the advantages (among a few admitted disadvantages) of living in the age of postmodernity is that we no longer need to feel bound to any limiting grand narratives. There is room for poetry that rhymes. There is room for poetry that is pleasing to the ear. There is room for poetry that is classically composed. There is room for short-forms, long-forms, old forms, sonnets, villanelles, haiku, senryu, tanka, and zen. And there is also room for visual poetry, language poetry, concrete poetry, and for fluxus/intermedia works that cannot even be easily classed as poetry. Write, read, make, and create whatever it is that pleases you --- and as long as the global village continues to communicate via bits and bytes, you are bound to find an audience and some fellow travelers on whatever road you happen to travel on. Allan -----Original Message----- From: Poetics List (UPenn, UB) [mailto:POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU] On Behalf Of James Robinson Sent: Tuesday, July 28, 2009 9:08 AM To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry Interesting thread. It's funny. I am in the midst of proposing a show to a gallery. The name of the show is "I HATE POETRY READINGS"... Basically, it's an anthology bound on walls that promotes a public reading of work that resists , on some level, vocalization. I've always enjoyed art receptions and believe that kind of tone, and the communication amongst the viewers, is appropriate to fulfilling a text's meaning. Regular readings, in my experience, are so one way and very colonizing on the part of the reader...Further, there is also a serious tone, a stuffiness, that seems to stifle what could be valuable conversations regarding the work. The work I am looking for, and the work I've so far found for it, is what I call "post-genre" works. I somehow think it's important to stay away from the words "poems", "poetry", "visual poetry" -- people have assumptions of what these are, also, there are stereotypes of the "poem and poet" that I think are negative and cheesy-- black berets, warm and humid personalities. Case in point, I remember talking about poems to people who could care less-- their response: "Isn't poetry what you do before suicide?"-- So there's "poetry as symptom"... Work being produced today fail public's templates of what a poem is-- largely because of curriculum and public education... SO here's my thought: 1) Come up with a new label 2) do readings in appropriate settings 3) Publish and sell posters instead of books. JR On Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 1:32 PM, nieuwland jeroen wrote: > Thanks Jim, > 'reactionary' wasn't a word my friend used, but I assume he meant that > there was a time when a distinction between visual art / poetry made sense, > or at least was accepted, but that now it is anachronistic. > > I guess it does come down to what is meant with language and I do > understand that images could be arranged in a formally 'linguistic' > systematicity. It seems weird though that a visual artist or poet could > present their work as either art or poetry. Not that I insist on the > distinction, on the contrary. But I do have my doubts about calling > syntactically/grammatically mapped images poetry. Isn't there a > systematicity inherent in everything? Maybe it's the communal element I'm > missing, that language is an agreed upon convention, used by a group of > people.. > > "...part of the whole intensity of our moment as poets involves a deep > broadening and reexamination of what we think of as language": I think this > maybe is an accurate description of our present situation; that we're in a > transitional moment with respect to language, leaving an unclear distinction > between visual art / poetry. > > J. > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > From: Jim Andrews > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 8:28:55 AM > Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry > > > I've had some discussions recently > > following from a remark by a friend that the distinction between > > visual art and poetry is reactionary, similarly to the hard and fast > > distinction that used to be made between sculpure and painting. > > what do you mean by "reactionary"? > > books on language in visual art have tended to concentrate on the work of > conceptual artists. such as kosuth. > > visual poetry has not been prominent in visual art, certainly. partly > because visual art is a gallery-oriented thing. and more involved in > commerce than poetry tends to be. > > also, visual poetry very often is not sophisticated as image, ie, it's not > up to snuff as image. but even when it is, it's usually not very involved in > gallerys and commerce and so on. > > > Personally I can't help but thinking > > that even though often the distinction is blurred, there remains an > essential difference between the two; namely, that > > visual art might, but need not use language, but for poetry, however > widely > > understood, language is an essential ingredient. > > what do you mean by "language"? > > i think that what we think of as language is changing. > > just fer instance, in the theory of computation, a language can be simply a > set of strings. and the theory of computation can be viewed as the study of > the formal properties of sets of strings, of languages. clearly this notion > of language is a bit different from what a poet might typically think of as > language. > > but, also, we see how the realm of the visual can in some cases be mapped > to languages. we 'parse' the visual field. we give space a kind of syntax > and grammar. pattern recognition is language recognition because patterns > are expressed in computing environments as strings or sets of strings or > rules for generating sets of strings. > > all of which is just to suggest that part of the whole intensity of our > moment as poets involves a deep broadening and reexamination of what we > think of as language and where and how language operates. and of course this > touches arts and science. > > concerning poetry, for me, it's the intensity of the engagement with > language that counts. not whether it's in a particular form of language. > > ja > http://vispo.com > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 20:35:17 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Allan Revich Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry In-Reply-To: <89A2B8AB24C44419A48CFEB0360A8DFC@OwnerPC> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit RE: "...but my observation is that there still are lots of divides between visual art and visual poetry. ja" The idea of "divides" strikes me as outdated. I suppose that if one considers oneself to be something as limiting as a "painter", or a "poet" or a "novelist" or whatever sub-sub-genre of artist, then the idea of divisions might be attractive as a way to set oneself apart as an expert, or as a member of an exclusive elite. For me these divisions are arbitrary and mostly meaningless. I don't see why an artist needs to limit himself to any one medium, or even genre. I have been involved with Fluxus and Intermedia for a number of years. I think that the most interesting and meaningful work being created today is happening in the spaces in which media intersect. Visual poetry sits in the intersection of visual art and text-based language. It also exists within a continuum of expression that includes everything from typewriter based concrete poetry through asemic writing and glyphs to digitally created or intermediated work. I think that Merce Cunningham and his partner John Cage exemplified the idea of Intermedia perfectly in their collaborations and in their independent works. Allan -----Original Message----- From: Poetics List (UPenn, UB) [mailto:POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU] On Behalf Of Jim Andrews Sent: Tuesday, July 28, 2009 1:09 AM To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry it's nothing about computers, murat. a lot of visual poetry--of course there are wonderful exceptions--is not interesting as image. it is often interesting as text/image hybrid and possibly as language and/or poem in a mainly literary vein, or as proto-information/text step one poetics creator or as schematic language machine blueprint or musical 'score' or any number of other things that are strong enough functionally/conceptually that, in a real sense, it doesn't matter that, as image, they are naive or poorly executed or just not interested in the piece simply as image. usually visual poetry isn't by people whose main thing is visual art or who, otherwise, have managed to pick up a sense of image that makes inroads both literarily, in a broad sense, and in visual art. but, similarly, if you look at visual art, how often is it interesting concerning language even when it uses written language? it might be interesting as image or installation or event or in any number of other typically visual-art-oriented parameters. moreover, some scepticism regarding the efficacy of attention to the visual art oriented quality of image is warranted. often what's of interest is of interest as image for silly reasons. popular culture is a forty five year old determinedly juvenile. visual poetry is not often popular, it doesn't have to do the popular thing, and that also is valuable. also, a certain scepticism regarding the value of gallerys is useful. i remember hearing a big canadian curator say 'an artist without a gallery is nothing'. which is unbelievably arrogant. you know, in net art, early on, there was talk about the value of artists doing net art to be free from the gallerys. but of course much of that was punk-minded propaganda to attract the attention of a gallery. so i don't intend the remark simply as a criticism of visual poetry or visual poets. the practice is fluid, as douglas suggests. but my observation is that there still are lots of divides between visual art and visual poetry. ja http://vispo.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Murat Nemet-Nejat" To: Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 6:13 AM Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry > Hi Jim, > > "also, visual poetry very often is not sophisticated as image, ie, it's > not > up to snuff as image. but even when it is, it's usually not very involved > in > gallerys and commerce and so on." > > I do agree about poetry not being involved in commerce part of your > comment. > But what do you mean by "not sophisticated"? Are you not equating > sophistication by the techinical prowess of computers, in that way, being > trapped by the ghost of progress? Is progress not a quality that often the > poets/artists of one age feel about themselves only to be disillusioned > later, to be debunked or attacked by a later age? > > Ciao, > > Murat ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 17:39:39 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Hugh Behm-Steinberg Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry In-Reply-To: <89A2B8AB24C44419A48CFEB0360A8DFC@OwnerPC> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii It might make more sense to say that there are many artistic practices that are concerned with the interaction of language and visuality, including web design, graphic design, painting, conceptual art, sculpture, calligraphy (especially non-alphabetic), comix, graffiti/taggers and visual/concrete poetry. It's not that one practice is more or less reactionary than another, it's that each of these groups function as different communities with their own values, vocabularies, audiences and institutions. What's cutting edge to one group is ordinary practice to another and irrelevant to a third. More often than not the groups don't intersect, but there are lots of examples of people crossing over from one of these groups into another, like Ian Hamilton Finlay going from concrete poetry to sculpture/installation. Hugh Behm-Steinberg ________________________________ From: Jim Andrews To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 10:09:06 PM Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry it's nothing about computers, murat. a lot of visual poetry--of course there are wonderful exceptions--is not interesting as image. it is often interesting as text/image hybrid and possibly as language and/or poem in a mainly literary vein, or as proto-information/text step one poetics creator or as schematic language machine blueprint or musical 'score' or any number of other things that are strong enough functionally/conceptually that, in a real sense, it doesn't matter that, as image, they are naive or poorly executed or just not interested in the piece simply as image. usually visual poetry isn't by people whose main thing is visual art or who, otherwise, have managed to pick up a sense of image that makes inroads both literarily, in a broad sense, and in visual art. but, similarly, if you look at visual art, how often is it interesting concerning language even when it uses written language? it might be interesting as image or installation or event or in any number of other typically visual-art-oriented parameters. moreover, some scepticism regarding the efficacy of attention to the visual art oriented quality of image is warranted. often what's of interest is of interest as image for silly reasons. popular culture is a forty five year old determinedly juvenile. visual poetry is not often popular, it doesn't have to do the popular thing, and that also is valuable. also, a certain scepticism regarding the value of gallerys is useful. i remember hearing a big canadian curator say 'an artist without a gallery is nothing'. which is unbelievably arrogant. you know, in net art, early on, there was talk about the value of artists doing net art to be free from the gallerys. but of course much of that was punk-minded propaganda to attract the attention of a gallery. so i don't intend the remark simply as a criticism of visual poetry or visual poets. the practice is fluid, as douglas suggests. but my observation is that there still are lots of divides between visual art and visual poetry. ja http://vispo.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Murat Nemet-Nejat" To: Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 6:13 AM Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry > Hi Jim, > > "also, visual poetry very often is not sophisticated as image, ie, it's not > up to snuff as image. but even when it is, it's usually not very involved in > gallerys and commerce and so on." > > I do agree about poetry not being involved in commerce part of your comment. > But what do you mean by "not sophisticated"? Are you not equating > sophistication by the techinical prowess of computers, in that way, being > trapped by the ghost of progress? Is progress not a quality that often the > poets/artists of one age feel about themselves only to be disillusioned > later, to be debunked or attacked by a later age? > > Ciao, > > Murat ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 21:54:53 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Adam Parrish Subject: Digital Writing with Python: Final Performance Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v935.3) Strip, split, join, print: Digital Writing with Python Final Performance http://dwwp.decontextualize.com/show NYU Interactive Telecommunication Program 721 Broadway, New York, NY 4th floor, room 447 August 5th, 2009, 7pm-8:30pm Over the course of the Summer semester, seven NYU students have =20 composed, mangled, generated and remixed text with their new =20 programming language of choice: Python. Student projects under =20 development include programs to generate Fibonacci creation myths, =20 stochastic Walt Whitman madlibs, e.e. cummings/Twitter mashups, and =20 new poetic forms based on Gone With The Wind. After an intense semester, these students gather for one night only to =20= perform their textual creations. All are welcome to this evening of =20 experimental performances of digital writing! Digital Writing with Python is a course offered at NYU=92s Interactive =20= Telecommunication Program. (http://itp.nyu.edu/itp/). The course is an =20= introduction to both the Python programming language and contemporary =20= techniques in electronic literature. Students use Python to acquire =20 and analyze digital text, while devising new techniques for composing =20= texts by algorithmic means. The goal of the course is to experiment =20 with language and literature while exploring the aesthetic, technical =20= and expressive possibilities of computer-generated (and -mangled) text. Find out more here: http://dwwp.decontextualize.com/= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 15:37:33 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Mary Kasimor Subject: Re: Have Save Cracked Slab Books In-Reply-To: <7ebc05130907291356o46f415d6j2bfb0639fc3891bc@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Bill, The anthology looks very interesting. I ordered it--I hope that helps= . Best, Mary Kasimor --- On Wed, 7/29/09, William Allegrezza wrote: From: William Allegrezza Subject: Have Save Cracked Slab Books To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Wednesday, July 29, 2009, 3:56 PM Cracked Slab Books is trying to stay alive through the recession. In order to do that, we are offering three of our books 45%-60% off their usual prices in order to raise some funds.=A0 One of the books is our anthology of Chicago Poetry, The City Visible.=A0 The other books are Garin Cycholl's Rafetown Georgics and Michelle Noteboom's Edging. Please help us by purchasing a book. To purchase the books at the special price, visit http://crackedslabbooks.com/facebook.html Bill Allegrezza =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines= & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html =0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 01:22:55 +0530 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: steve dalachinsky Subject: Re: The cost of our dead poets society MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit speaking of kerouac it's been proven and upheld by the courts tht kerouac's will was foged now we'll see if it holds up when contested if it does the entire estste goes to his only living relative a nephew who is destitute drunk living in a trailer park the samps' now turn it all around say kerouasc' letter was forged and that nicosia is a bloodsucker but those phonies tho they have done good by publishing alot of jk's unpublished stuff have made it a multi-million dollar business anywa those who sided with sampas and you all know who you are may have to go loking elsewhere for employment soon any one for a bottle of cheap port wine??? On Tue, 28 Jul 2009 08:47:17 -0700 steve russell writes: > now i don't mind a little tourism in the town where i grew up as it > gave us the Kerouax house in Orlando Florida, but where are those > little greasy elves when you need them to burn down DISNEY > WORLD??????????????????????? > > --- On Mon, 7/27/09, David Chirot wrote: > > From: David Chirot > Subject: Re: The cost of our dead poets society > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Date: Monday, July 27, 2009, 2:42 PM > > One good thing abt the museums and landmarks approach is it helps > generate > money for the local community via tourism > The money could be used for as Catherine suggest library places to > teach or > make zine posters anything- > (there might be pressure to just crank out more little replicas of > the house > and the figure(s) of the writer/s who lived in the house- > the "Fauxk Art" approach i call it- > local citizens become elves in a little Bronte workshop and one day > rebel! > and burn the place down and then no more tourists-- > > seriously, there have been efforts in recent years to restore the > houses Poe > lived in in NYC-- > my mother years ago sent a long long New Yorker article by a man who > was in > search of the house where Walt Whitman lived when he wrote and > produced the > First Edition of leaves of Grass. A very long search! Finally the > writer > climbs many flights of stairs and knocks on the door of the place > where > Whitman would've lived--and a giant Rastafarian answers the door. > > The writers says--did you know that the great poet Walt Whitman > lived here > when he wrote Leaves of Grass, the first version? > > the gentleman at the door replied--ho do you know a great poet isn't > living > here NOW. > > Recently, by accident, someone fired an actual shot during those > mass > recreations of the Battel of gettyburg in whcih people i exact > historical > uniforms and with gun replicas and swords and cannon fight out the > "reply" > of the 150 year old batte. > > I am surprised more people > do not start taking advantge of these battles to do some battling of > their > own-- > > > i wonder if someday to keep the costs of maintenance down, these > scenes > might not be presented as are those of the caves where the cave > paintings > are-- > the caves one may no longer visit as part of their "protection" are > replicated in every way, and that way the tourist, the interested, > the > curious--may "*re--experience* in a literal way via the > *re-creation* of the > original house where once upon a time the great so and so wrote in > one > corner and used the chamber pot in another- > > to experience via a replica--is a very interesting concept in > itself-- > does one experience the same sensory and spiritual aura & drama of > the > original site? > or does one come away with a replica of what might have been one's > experience in the face or inside the original? > so that one's "experience" becomes removed from the site, distanced > by > replication-- > and is another way in which the world is "evacuated" by the > simulacrum, the > replicants, reproductions, simulations-- > > one's feelings of a place are no longer of place but of an > abstracted, > distanced "idea" or "concept" of the "installation"-- > the materials one is experiencing are not the same as the originals, > perhaps > made out of an entirely different kind of material, though looking > all the > same "very life-like"-- > > so now the living may visit a place where no one lived but is a > life-like > replica of a place where formerly people actually lived-- > > if "no one" other than an idea of a being, lives inside the > replica--then is > one encountering--no one? or a replkicant of the "writers spirit > which one > may still feel haunting these old walls." > > so--a "spirit" of the writer--becomes a replicant of the spirit of > the > writer existing in a replicated home of the writer-- > > surrounded by so much replication, does human remain strictly human, > or does > it not perhaps begin to take on "the feelings and emotions of an > imagination > or idea of a replicant's feelings and ideas"-- > and so eventually the person who enter the replicated house and meet > the > replicants of the spirits of the dead writer--inhabiting and > haunting these > replicated spaces--what then?--eventually the person becomes awarre > of the > touch of the replicated as being more real than the untouched > original-to > themselves and their freinds and al the rest who come there-- > > and by feeling only replications, replicants eventual the human > might dream, > desire to be also a replicant of oneself's' dead being, or of one's > living > one--to "live on" as a replication of one 's spirit in a physical > way > impossible before-- > > then death would become more important than life because in death > one can > replicate life without the consequences as one remains only inside > the > replication of ones "safe" abode-- > > there would be then the necessitating of making a replicated body as > well a > replicated spirit-- > one doesn't even have to die to "have one's replicant and spirit > walk beside > one"-- > (perhaps related to --or a replicant of --"the Third Who Walks > beside > me"--as in Eliot or Burroughs-Gysin's The third mind--??-[-they had > in mind > the quote from Eliot]) > > i wi leave off there, but it is a variant on-what exactly are people > seeking > to view an original house where once the lady's slippers trod? > > are one's dreams one's life one's imagination altered by the contact > with > the spirit 'sitl infusing these pieces of furniture, these curtains, > the > very fireplace, with the spirit of the writer--" > > so that one walks out with a part of the "dead' one's being > accompanying > one-- > > and would this really be radically different once one was going to > replicated caves and houses--- > > to touch greatness is this a way to Thank the writer and also hope > that God > willing some of the Greatness might rub off on oneself, or inhabit > oneself > as it is "drunk in," as one is "immersed in its spirit waves"-- > > i think the strangest "home of a writer" i have seen/been was that > of > Nostradamus (this was before much had been made of it being such--i > imagine > now a tourist trap of the Nostradamus-predictad > MegaMagnitude!)-)--in > Saint-Remy, where Van Gogh much later on committed suicide in the > asylum > just outside the little town-- > > this place was so tiny and almost unnoticeable in a street without > sunshine > straight out of literally-- to be sure!-- the "Dark Ages"-- as t was > so > anonymously like every other tiny low ceilinged stone house among > the row of > them lined exactly next each other-- > > the streets looked more like it belonged in the nearby town of > Uzes-- > which is to say-- > like a much darker copy of the film Las Hurdas (Land without bread) > by Luis > Bunuel (a mockumentary) > > On Fri, Jul 24, 2009 at 10:53 AM, Catherine Daly > wrote: > > > Are you the one who also posted about how Edith Wharton's House is > losing > > money?http://www.edithwharton.org/ > > > > "Thanks to the generosity of our > supporters, > > the co-operation of our principal creditors, and to a large gift > from the > > Alice M. Kaplan Memorial Reserve, The Mount has staved off the > threat of > > foreclosure that has recently threatened its existence." > > > > It always annoyed me that Lowe's supports Biltmore and not The > Mount, but > > The Mount people really overestimated the appeal of Wharton and > the > > Berkshires, and never hit up serious interior design / > construction money. > > > > As opposed to The Mount, it seems that Gaskell's house is supposed > to be > > turned into a community center. I think that sounds like a good > use, > > rather > > than teaching writing in soulless "youth centres," teaching > writing in a > > pretty house that local craftsmen helped restore. I think > everyone's > > beginning to realize how public objects become landmarks. That > said, > > "street view" of the existing community center indicates it is in > yet > > another tumbledown mansion. > > > > The Keats house has been a museum since 1925. > > > > -- > > All best, > > Catherine Daly > > c.a.b.daly@gmail.com > > > > ================================== > > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines > > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > > > > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check > guidelines & sub/unsub info: > http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 02:34:39 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Alan Sondheim Subject: more great audiovisual from neurotic rly mourn x-haustion MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed more great audiovisual from neurotic rly mourn x-haustion http://www.alansondheim.org/ct1.mp3 cobza w/ echo silly tune 1 http://www.alansondheim.org/ct1.mp3 cobza w/ echo silly tune 2 total cool maquette for Fooofwwaa dance/choreograph 2-moro http://www.alansondheim.org/maenad2.mp4 actually a narrative of sorts ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 00:29:48 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jim Andrews Subject: Re: Digital Writing with Python: Final Performance In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit terrific, adam. i also enjoyed your project page at http://www.decontextualize.com/projects/nite ja ----- Original Message ----- From: "Adam Parrish" Subject: Digital Writing with Python: Final Performance Strip, split, join, print: Digital Writing with Python Final Performance http://dwwp.decontextualize.com/show NYU Interactive Telecommunication Program ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 23:17:42 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: David Chirot Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry In-Reply-To: <669945.30025.qm@web34201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit One of the problems with this discussion is that there are many kinds of visual poetry; it is not some "pan-visual-=poetryism"--which can be dismissed as unsophisticated visually as Jim does. In the US--written poetry has been most of the base on which the visual poem is built--it is at the forefront of the examination of what a visual poem is qua poetry, and so the visual is relegated to a "lesser" realm. It is "language" which is fore fronted, though not in the more strict and linguistics/semantics orientations of much of earlier Concrete Poetry, Many aspects of Concrete Poetry at one point had much in common with early structuralism, and so their extensions in theory developed along linguistic lines, until, as Philadelpho Menezes points to and demonstrates historically in Poetics and Visuality a Trajectory of Contemporary Brazilian Poetry, the visual elements gain in importance as elements themselves, and these in turn develop into the demand for the deeper inquiry into the elements of sound, moving towards a "toaltity' of a work which is more akin to the cinema. I think a lot of the "devaluation of the visual" is partly responsible for the "less sophisticated, less visual, less intersting" aspects of visual poetry. In a sense, alotof visual poetry has nothing to do with visuality, looking, seeing, movements of the eyes in examining attentively the field and peripheries of the visual as a notation of sonic transmissions from out the cracks as it were of the walls--the sounds of colors, colors of sounds, --al of this is eschewed in much Visual Poetry of the kind Jim is writing about in favor of what is a process not of looking, but of reading. I think the uses of the virtual, of images which are there only via electricity--begins to decay the visual as a seeing, looking, with materials that exist physically, and whose movements in time and through spaces are effected by an immense number of continauly shifting phenomena--the weather being one of them. In the virtual real, the eye does not need to be as developing in looking "into" time and space, because there is less affecting the image, This virtual image becomes as it were "still" in a kind of "suspended eternity" in which neither the corrosions of time nor the effects created by the movements of objects in space that interact with the materials of the ever changing image exist. One of the striking aspects of many types of Visual Poetry is the lack of interest in the visual which the poetry displays. Instead, the fascination is strictly of a textual nature, in that the poetry is anchored by its dependence on letters, words, phrases, as supports for the construction of a form of cross word puzzle/scrabble effect and in a playing with the sizes and fonts of letters i relation to these "impositions of the grid" onto not what is seen, but what is placed there within a grid, the grid being the guide to seeing/reading.. In this realm of discussion, between the uses of text and of the virtual, what is vacated is the visual. That is the actual "art of looking" of which Robert Smithson wrote. Smithson writes that a great artist may create a work simply by casting a glance. This creates an art which exists in the act of looking's looking--there is no "object" produced, there is no "concept" expressed, there is no "trace" of this other than what exists for Smithson as a reality which is as durable as any sculpture, written poem, machine, etc Visual Poetry ironically then in the US seems to be far less about visuality and not even so much re poetry in this sense, as about a form of "solidifying" a text within a "stopped time" whose movements are done as "readings" rather than as the art of looking. : in a visual poem all the elements are treated as equals in terms of their opening to possiblities--, -that is to say--a color, a line, a dot, a form , the texture of the surfaces, the "indelible imprint of the material world"--al of these are elements of language just as are morphemes, letter, syllables, words, phrase-- in the arrangements of a visual poem al of these elements are "calling"--speaking--singing-sounding--color itself is a language--and languages do not have to be written or formalized--a language may be found expressive in sounding a side walk crack, a shadow, the passage of footprints through a field, or in snow--these provide a basis, as well as those things found al around one which are the evidences of time passing in the effects which are wreaked on materials considered durable-- if one examines peeling, fading, cracking painted walls or the cracked paints on boards oand doors, the movement of lichen and moss in obscuring the letters on a plaque, the cracking open of metal letters through decades of extremes of heat, cold, being blasted, being bombed, being burned, al of these continually present languages of forms and letterings, numbers, in the process of a negentropy of out of chaos emerging forms and these forms wearing down, being time affected, and then these themselves are regenerations of forms out of the new chaos-- a teeming swarming wold exists all around one and for the most part hidden in plain site/sight/cite from the no longer visual eyes of the virtual = written poetry-- if one is to work with visual poetry--then the visual art of looking needs to be worked at, with, for--as does the soundings which are elicited by colors,forms, fragments or phrases-- a great deal of what is called "visual poetry " by more language influenced workers is just a carrying on of the "pattern poetry" which dick Higgins made a book of. as far as visuality is concerned one might say, nice but weak-=eh--very weak! it is a rebranding of things long done, as though they have suddenly become "new and radical" because the names have been changed-- visual poetry at least for myself works with things which exits as actual found materials, found letterings, fragments forms--to be involved with the swarming teeming multiplicities which exists "before our very eyes"-- this kind of seeing requires a look /looking of far greater speed and attention than does what one finds in the virtual and digital--where the "framed" and stilled image is demanding instaed a "reading" within a confiement to the aream of textuality--qua "text"-- the function of the virtual is not to be participant in time--which poetry is after all, an art of time--but to delete time--to erase--to make disappear things that were by the touch of the button, by the changing of a name on line--and --peoples events names forms vanish --forever-deleted-- in another way, the virtual offers persons an example of "the new" and a glimpse of a simulated "eternity" in the virtual not being exposed ot the effects of time-- as long as one has sufficient protection the "textual visual poem" remains until one pulls the plug--or bombs the infrastructure, cuts off electricity due to non payment or as a siege weapon as with Gaza and in Rwanda--then , while the electricity is off and al communications have gone "dead"--then peoples events cultures disappear, are deleted--and when the virtual comes on again--the electricity--there are now completely new names for the places which had become for a while black holes in the fabric of controlled existence which is hthat of the virtual and digital online- in that sense in which things today are accepted unquestioningly like received ideas no one thinks about--"natural" ideas, facts--"known to all"--there develops what is truly reactionary--the end of questioning and the entrance into non stop existence of what has long been spurned in readers of fiction: the willing suspension of disbelief- and in the case of Visual Poetry what is abandoned, or has yet to be there in a real sense in termsof an art of looking--is viusality-- working with the found--one is having the experience of what Celan points towards in writing " Poetry no longer imposes itself, it exposes itself." exposing-exposure (to the elements, of a film negative)--the ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 13:21:51 +0200 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Anny Ballardini Subject: Re: the Four Seasons - a tribute to Antonio Vivaldi In-Reply-To: <4b65c2d70907281437j3de71cd4yacc80167ff0e28e3@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable With the lightness of notes, the entire Anthology has been characterized by late contributions, as soon as I send the update out, they start coming in. I would like to highlight two quite important for the Summer Issue that jus= t arrived: *=B7* David Graham :http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3110 *=B7* mIEKAL aND: http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3111 Enjoy, Anny On Tue, Jul 28, 2009 at 11:37 PM, Anny Ballardini wrote: > For an exceptional summer, as exceptional are the contributors to this > issue, an issue that concludes *The Four Seasons*, one poem after another > to > honor *Antonio Vivaldi*. Today, on the commemoration of his death on July > 28, 1741, I felt I had to send out this announcement and I rushed to put > together an Editorial. Only while writing these words, I realized it is > July > 28. Things happen above and below. I am therefore paying my reverence to > the > Maestro of the Conservatorio dell=92Ospedale della Piet=E0 to thank him f= or his > music. > > > > *Summer:* > > > http://www.fieralingue.it/modules.php?name=3DContent&pa=3Dlist_pages_cate= gories&cid=3D340 > > > > *=B7* Editorial: Anny > Ballardini > *=B7* Charlotte Mandel< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2967> > *=B7* Marton Koppany< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2975> > *=B7* Bob Grumman < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2976> > *=B7* Dan Waber > * > =B7* Hoshang Merchant< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2978> > *=B7* Max Richards< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2980> > *=B7* Barbara Crooker< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3003> > *=B7* Tony Trigilio< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3004> > *=B7* Barry Spacks< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3005> > *=B7* Carol Novack< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3006> > *=B7* Tad Richards< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3007> > *=B7* Jerome Rothenberg< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3008> > *=B7* Jon Corelis < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3009> > *=B7* Wendy Vardaman< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3010> > *=B7* Edward Mycue< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3011> > *=B7* James Cervantes< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3012> > *=B7* David Howard< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3013> > *=B7* Frank Parker< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3014> > *=B7* Ann Fisher-Wirth< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3015> > *=B7* Ruth Fainlight< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3016> > *=B7* Pierre Joris< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3017> > *=B7* Grace Cavalieri< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3018> > *=B7* Elizabeth Smither< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3019> > *=B7* Eileen Tabios< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3020> > *=B7* Nancy Keane < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3021> > *=B7* Douglas Clark< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3022> > *=B7* Jeff Harrison > *=B7* Son= ja > James > *=B7* Marilyn Hacker< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3029> > *=B7* Pam Brown > * > =B7* Crag Hill > *=B7 > * Obododimma Oha< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3032> > *=B7* Fan Ogilvie < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3034> > *=B7* Ned Condini < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3035> > *=B7* Diane Kendig< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3036> > *=B7* Jerry McGuire< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3037> > *=B7* Donna Pecore< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3038> > *=B7* Barry Alpert< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3039> > *=B7* William Allegrezza< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3040> > *=B7* Rebecca Seiferle< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3041> > *=B7* Geraldine Monk< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3043> > *=B7* Geof Huth > * > =B7* John Gery > *=B7 > * Eugen Galasso < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3060> > *=B7* Wendy Taylor > Carlisle > *=B7* Evelyn Posamentier< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3062> > *=B7* Lars Palm > * > =B7* Daniel Zimmerman< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3075> > *=B7* Karl Young > > *=B7* Paolo Dalponte< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3085> > *=B7* Sharon Dolin< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3107> > > > > And to thank all those who have followed me in this yearlong Tribute I > would > like to invite you to read the previous issues with further additions: > > > > *Spring:* > > > http://www.fieralingue.it/modules.php?name=3DContent&pa=3Dlist_pages_cate= gories&cid=3D333 > > > > *=B7* Editorial: Anny > Ballardini > *=B7* Lesley Wheeler< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2862> > *=B7* Barry Spacks< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2863> > *=B7* Jerome Rothenberg< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2864> > *=B7* Joseph Duemer< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2865> > *=B7* Frank Parker< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2866> > *=B7* Camille Martin< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2867> > *=B7* David Howard< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2868> > *=B7* Jeff Harrison > *=B7* M= =E1rton > Kopp=E1ny *=B7* > Pam > Brown *= =B7* > Elizabeth > Smither = *=B7* > Edward > Mycue *= =B7* > Pierre > Joris *= =B7* > Dennis > Barone *= =B7* > Martin > J. Walker *=B7* > Geof > Huth *= =B7* > Barbara > Crooker = *=B7* > Silvia > Levenson = *=B7* > Mark > Young *= =B7* > Katia > Kapovich = *=B7* > Daniela > Gioseffi = *=B7* > Jon > Corelis = *=B7* > Edward > Mycue (S= econd > Part) *=B7* Jesse > Glass > *=B7* Ned Condini < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2886> > *=B7* Wendy Taylor > Carlisle > *=B7* Tom Savage > > *=B7* Wendy Vardaman< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2889> > *=B7* Evelyn Posamentier< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2890> > *=B7* Larry Jaffe < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2893> > *=B7* Donna Pecore< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2899> > *=B7* Patricia Valdata< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2900> > *=B7* Jill Jones > > *=B7* Tad Richards< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2902> > *=B7* Hoshang Merchant< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2903> > *=B7* Tim Mayo > *=B7 > * Karl Young > *=B7 > * David Graham > > *=B7* Eve Rifkah > > *=B7* Ren Katherine > Powell > *=B7* Penelope Schott< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2909> > *=B7* Alexander Jorgensen< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2911> > *=B7* Larissa Shmailo< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2912> > *=B7* Beebe Barksdale-Bruner< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2913> > *=B7* Linda Benninghoff< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2914> > *=B7* Charlotte Mandel< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2915> > *=B7* Katerina Klemer< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2916> > *=B7* Claire Keyes > *=B7* Geo= rgia > Ann > Banks-Martin > *=B7 > * Christina Pacosz< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2919> > *=B7* Phibby Venable< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2920> > *=B7* Ada Jill Schneider< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2921> > *=B7* Ann Fisher-Wirth< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2922> > *=B7* Spencer Selby< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2923> > *=B7* Amy Gottlieb< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2925> > *=B7* Fan Ogilvie < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2926> > *=B7* Paul Vangelisti< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2944> > *=B7* Jerry McGuire< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2945> > *=B7* Jim Leftwich< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2948> > *=B7* Wendy Taylor > Carlisle > *=B7* Jean Vengua < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2951> > *=B7* Dan Waber > * > =B7* John Bloomberg-Rissman > *=B7* Bob > Grumman > *=B7* Sha= ron > Dolin > *=B7* Berty Skuber< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2968> > *=B7* Patrick McManus< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2969> > *=B7* David-Baptiste > Chirot > *=B7* Jennifer Hill< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3057> > > > > *Winter: > * > > http://www.fieralingue.it/modules.php?name=3DContent&pa=3Dlist_pages_cate= gories&cid=3D329 > > *=B7* Editorial: Anny > Ballardini > *=B7* Martha King < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2745> > *=B7* Hiram Larew < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2746> > *=B7* James Cervantes< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2747> > *=B7* Laura Kennelly< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2748> > *=B7* Edward Mycue< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2749> > *=B7* Alicia Ostriker< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2750> > *=B7* Geof Huth > * > =B7* Elizabeth Smither< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2752> > *=B7* Daniel Zimmerman< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2753> > *=B7* Barry Spacks< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2754> > *=B7* Eve Rifkah > > *=B7* Gertrude Halstaed< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2758> > *=B7* Beverly Matherne< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2759> > *=B7* Donna Pecore< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2760> > *=B7* Jeff Harrison< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2761> > *=B7* Grace Cavalieri< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2762> > *=B7* Diane Lockward< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2763> > *=B7* Camille Martin< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2764> > *=B7* Dennis Barone< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2765> > *=B7* Alan Sondheim< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2766> > *=B7* Alexander Dickow< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2767> > *=B7* Douglas Clark< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2768> > *=B7* David Graham< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2769> > *=B7* Bob Grumman < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2770> > *=B7* Eileen Tabios< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2771> > *=B7* Sarah Menefee< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2772> > *=B7* Pam Brown > * > =B7* Ray DiPalma > > *=B7* Jerry McGuire< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2775> > *=B7* Henry Reed > > *=B7* Paolo Ruffilli< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2777> > *=B7* Allen Bramhall< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2778> > *=B7* J.P. Dancing > Bear > *=B7* Mark Weiss > > *=B7* Susan Rich > > *=B7* Karl Young > > *=B7* Ruth Fainlight< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2783> > *=B7* Geoffrey Gatza< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2787> > *=B7* Jim Leftwich< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2788> > *=B7* Alan Michael > Parker > *=B7* Barbara Crooker< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2790> > *=B7* Jerome Rothenberg< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2792> > *=B7* Deborah Humphreys< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2793> > *=B7* Paolo Dalponte< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2794> > *=B7* Susan Edwards< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2795> > *=B7* Jean Lamberty< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2796> > *=B7* Ned Condini < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2797> > *=B7* Jill Jones > > *=B7* Lois Roma-Deeley< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2799> > *=B7* Fan Ogilvie < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2800> > *=B7* Peter Ciccariello< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2801> > *=B7* Frank Parker< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2803> > *=B7* Jon Corelis < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2804> > *=B7* Tim Mayo > *=B7 > * Alan Halsey > * > =B7* Spencer Selby< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2814> > *=B7* M=E1rton Kopp=E1ny< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2815> > *=B7* Wendy Vardaman< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2816> > *=B7* Dan Waber > * > =B7* Wendy Taylor > Carlisle > *=B7* Evelyn Posamentier< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2819> > *=B7* Sheila E. Murphy< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2820> > *=B7* Ann Fisher- > Wirth > *=B7* Bob Holman > > *=B7* Berty Skuber< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2824> > *=B7* Michael Peverett< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2825> > *=B7* Obododimma Oha< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2828> > *=B7* Richard Dillon< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2830> > *=B7* Diane Kendig< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2831> > *=B7* Jukka-Pekka > Kervinen > *=B7* Geraldine Monk< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2851> > *=B7* William Allegrezza< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2853> > * =B7* S=E9amas Cain< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2854> > *=B7* Tad Richards< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2855> > *=B7* Bill Morgan < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2856> > *=B7* Hoshang Merchant< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2857> > *=B7* James Finnegan< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2858> > *=B7* Michael Snider< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2859> > *=B7* Yerra Sugarman< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2860> > *=B7* Paul Vangelisti< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2946> > *=B7* Jukka-Pekka > Kervinen > *=B7* Patrick McManus< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2992> > *=B7* Bob Grumman < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2993> > *=B7* Jennifer Hill< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D3056> > > *Autumn*: > > http://www.fieralingue.it/modules.php?name=3DContent&pa=3Dlist_pages_cate= gories&cid=3D318 > > > > *=B7* Introduction by Anny > Ballardini > *=B7* Dirk Vekemans< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2568> > *=B7* Bobbi Lurie < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2569> > *=B7* Anny Ballardini< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2570> > *=B7* Obododimma Oha< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2571> > *=B7* Jeff Harrison< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2572> > *=B7* Cecil Touchon< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2573> > *=B7* Halvard Johnson< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2574> > *=B7* Jill McCabe > Johnson > *=B7* Ann Neuser Lederer< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2576> > *=B7* Barbara Crooker< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2577> > *=B7* Christina Pacosz< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2578> > *=B7* Penelope Schott< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2579> > *=B7* Georgia Ann > Banks-Martin > *=B7* Sandra Giedeman< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2581> > *=B7* Joel Weishaus< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2582> > *=B7* Pat Falk > *=B7 > * Tim Mayo > *=B7* Wendy > Taylor Carlisle < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2585> > *=B7* Wendy Vardaman< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2586> > *=B7* Bill Morgan < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2587> > *=B7* Eileen Tabios< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2588> > *=B7* Sheila E. Murphy< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2589> > *=B7* Alan Sondheim< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2590> > *=B7* David Graham< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2591> > *=B7* Tad Richards< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2592> > *=B7* Bob Grumman < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2593> > *=B7* Henry Gould < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2594> > *=B7* Jukka-Pekka > Kervinen > *=B7* Guido Catalano< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2596> > *=B7* Ruth Fainlight< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2597> > *=B7* Ann Fisher-Wirth< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2598> > *=B7* Fan Ogilvie < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2599> > *=B7* Larissa Shmailo< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2600> > *=B7* Geof Huth > * > =B7* Grace Cavalieri< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2609> > *=B7* Mark Weiss > > *=B7* Pam Brown > * > =B7* David Howard < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2622> > *=B7* Edward Mycue< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2623> > *=B7* Elizabeth Smither< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2625> > *=B7* Elena Karina > Byrne > *=B7* David-Baptiste > Chirot > *=B7* Nico Vassilakis< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2631> > *=B7* Allen Bramhall< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2632> > *=B7* Dan Waber > * > =B7* Aaron Belz > * > =B7* Nicholas Piombino< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2636> > *=B7* Joseph Duemer< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2645> > *=B7* Daniel Zimmerman< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2646> > *=B7* Geoffrey Gatza< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2647> > *=B7* Jon Corelis < > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2648> > *=B7* Berty Skuber< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2649> > *=B7* Peter Ciccariello< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2650> > *=B7* Evelyn Posamentier< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2657> > *=B7* Sharon Dolin< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2658> > *=B7* Mark Young > > *=B7* Charles Martin< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2660> > *=B7* Skip Fox > *=B7 > * Dianalee Velie< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2662> > *=B7* William Allegrezza< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2663> > *=B7* Karl Young > > *=B7* Richard Dillon< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2813> > *=B7* Dan Waber > * > =B7* Geraldine Monk< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2852> > * =B7* Paul Vangelisti< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2947> > *=B7* Jim Leftwich< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2949> > *=B7* Hoshang Merchant< > http://www.fieralingue.it/corner.php?pa=3Dprintpage&pid=3D2979> > > > > The main index of the Poets=92 Corner: > > http://www.fieralingue.it/modules.php?name=3DContent > > > > As usual the order of apparition follows the order by which I received t= he > submission. > > My best wishes, > > Anny Ballardini > > > > > > > -- > Anny Ballardini > http://annyballardini.blogspot.com/ > http://www.fieralingue.it/modules.php?name=3Dpoetshome > http://www.lulu.com/content/5806078 > http://www.moriapoetry.com/ebooks.html > I Tell You: One must still have chaos in one to give birth to a dancing > star! > Friedrich Nietzsche > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelin= es > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > --=20 Anny Ballardini http://annyballardini.blogspot.com/ http://www.fieralingue.it/modules.php?name=3Dpoetshome http://www.lulu.com/content/5806078 http://www.moriapoetry.com/ebooks.html I Tell You: One must still have chaos in one to give birth to a dancing star! Friedrich Nietzsche =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 07:12:52 -0600 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jonathan Ball Subject: Re: Got a used copy of 'A'? In-Reply-To: <461e0fe0907291504v5ae76875xc6ff87002a1fca01@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit A 1-12 is available in a first edition, although somewhat damaged, for $45 CDN here: http://www.apollinaires.com/miva/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=apollinaire&Product_Code=2123 Also available are A 22 & 23 for $35 CDN here: http://www.apollinaires.com/miva/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=apollinaire&Product_Code=1720 This webstore is run by Jay MillAr, and if you ask nicely I'm sure he'd rush an order for you. Hope this helps Jonathan Ball On Wed, Jul 29, 2009 at 4:04 PM, Adam Katz wrote: > Hello,You know how sometimes it's possible to just give someone the perfect > gift? Well, I put a lot of thought into gifts for the people who are > important in my life, and my best friend is getting married in Boston on > Sunday, and if I could give him a copy of Zukofsky's 'A' - but it's out of > print! See, he's a medieval scholar, but he loves modernist literature, > though doesn't study it enough to know about 'A' yet, and I am really, > really hoping...anyways, if someone has a copy they'd be willing to sell - > for less than the cheapest copy on Amazon, which is $80 and I'm sure > wouldn't come in time, and can meet me in Boston/Cambridge on > Saturday/Sunday or have it delivered to the friend there who I'll be > staying > with - please backchannel! > Best, > Adam Katz > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > -- www.jonathanball.com www.jonathanball.blogspot.com www.haikuhoroscopes.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 09:45:08 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Paul Siegell Subject: Dusie Dusie Dusie Dusie Dusie Dusie Dusie Dusie Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Give it up for Susana Gardner! Dusie #8 is live!=20 And at 314 pages, it's a free, downloadable E-BOOK > http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/6654316-dusie-issue-8=20 Contributors: rodney koeneke - justin katko - brenda coultas - victor hern=E1ndez cruz = - cindy savett - paul legault - jow lindsay & justin katko - jennifer h= . fortin - rosamond king - jayne cortez - andrew zawacki & jennifer sch= uberth - angela genusa - sara mumalo - jessica rainey - matthew hittinger - juli= a cohen - james maughn - derek henderson - edward smallfield - ek rzepka - mark cunningham - heather sweeney - kismet al-hussaini - sandra huber rauan klassnik - anne waldman - karen weiser - dawn pendergast - david to= ms - julia drescher - emily carr - andrew peterson - pattie mccarthy - elizabeth bryant - karen weiser - jr pearson - gian lombardo - john olson= - jim goar - vernon frazer - rosamond king - letitia trent - michael fisher= - jennie neighbors - leslie scalapino - megan kaminski - rob mclennan - kis= met al-hussaini - heather sweeney - sarah dowling - sara mumolo - elizabeth bryant with jennie neighbors sarah rosenthal - robert heffernan - jennifer firestone & dana teen l= omax - elizabeth bryant with leslie scalapino - amy king - david toms - jessica rainy - ek rzepka - tara rebele - ana bo=9Eičević - kar= yna mcglynn - william minor - megan kaminski - amish trivedi - anne gorrick - brandon brown - randolph healy - rachel warriner - david wolach - mary biddinger - ariell= e guy - sarah rosenthal - cynthia roth - marthe reed - lisa samuels - julie= t cook - cara benson - paul siegell enjoy! =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 10:57:25 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Murat Nemet-Nejat Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry In-Reply-To: <89A2B8AB24C44419A48CFEB0360A8DFC@OwnerPC> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jim, When I say the "visual" in poetry I mean a poetry where the eye is very important, not as an image; but the way it moves in the experience of the poem, as in a film or photograph, organizing what it sees into thought. In other words, the visual is a movement of weaving. I do not think "visual poetry," the way it is defined today does anything of the sort. It seems to me it often is an exploration of new technological techniques provided to it. In that sense, it lacks resistance or it has resistance of a technical rather than intellectual kind. That is why I was objecting to your expression "not interesting as image." It implied, to me, the desire for a complexity impelled by technical openings, prowess, without anything else generating it. Of course, I may be wrong or misunderstand you. The same argument occurred a few months ago when I asked why the special effects in the film *Blade Runner*, the last film where *no* digital effects were used, were much more poweful and resonant than many science fiction films which followed it. My guess was that, because to create special effects in *Blade Runner* was so hard and laborious, the creators only used what effects were necessary, in other words, which came from the vision of the film and were integral to it. Otherwise, as most cases afterwards, special effects are cliches. Ciao, Murat On Tue, Jul 28, 2009 at 1:09 AM, Jim Andrews wrote: > it's nothing about computers, murat. a lot of visual poetry--of course > there are wonderful exceptions--is not interesting as image. it is often > interesting as text/image hybrid and possibly as language and/or poem in a > mainly literary vein, or as proto-information/text step one poetics creator > or as schematic language machine blueprint or musical 'score' or any number > of other things that are strong enough functionally/conceptually that, in a > real sense, it doesn't matter that, as image, they are naive or poorly > executed or just not interested in the piece simply as image. usually visual > poetry isn't by people whose main thing is visual art or who, otherwise, > have managed to pick up a sense of image that makes inroads both literarily, > in a broad sense, and in visual art. > > but, similarly, if you look at visual art, how often is it interesting > concerning language even when it uses written language? it might be > interesting as image or installation or event or in any number of other > typically visual-art-oriented parameters. > > moreover, some scepticism regarding the efficacy of attention to the visual > art oriented quality of image is warranted. often what's of interest is of > interest as image for silly reasons. popular culture is a forty five year > old determinedly juvenile. visual poetry is not often popular, it doesn't > have to do the popular thing, and that also is valuable. > > also, a certain scepticism regarding the value of gallerys is useful. i > remember hearing a big canadian curator say 'an artist without a gallery is > nothing'. which is unbelievably arrogant. you know, in net art, early on, > there was talk about the value of artists doing net art to be free from the > gallerys. but of course much of that was punk-minded propaganda to attract > the attention of a gallery. > > so i don't intend the remark simply as a criticism of visual poetry or > visual poets. > > the practice is fluid, as douglas suggests. but my observation is that > there still are lots of divides between visual art and visual poetry. > > ja > http://vispo.com > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Murat Nemet-Nejat" > To: > Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 6:13 AM > Subject: Re: Visual art / poetry > > > Hi Jim, >> >> "also, visual poetry very often is not sophisticated as image, ie, it's >> not >> up to snuff as image. but even when it is, it's usually not very involved >> in >> gallerys and commerce and so on." >> >> I do agree about poetry not being involved in commerce part of your >> comment. >> But what do you mean by "not sophisticated"? Are you not equating >> sophistication by the techinical prowess of computers, in that way, being >> trapped by the ghost of progress? Is progress not a quality that often the >> poets/artists of one age feel about themselves only to be disillusioned >> later, to be debunked or attacked by a later age? >> >> Ciao, >> >> Murat >> > > ================================== > The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines > & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html > ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 16:02:50 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Al Filreis Subject: PoemTalk #20: Baraka's "Kenyatta Listening to Mozart" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v935.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Today we are releasing episode 20 of the PoemTalk series, a discussion of a 1963 poem written and performed by Amiri Baraka (as, then, LeRoi Jones), featuring three first-time PoemTalkers: Herman Beavers, Alan Loney, and Mecca Sullivan. http://www.poemtalk.org Al Filreis http://www.writing.upenn.edu/~afilreis ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 13:42:04 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Joel Weishaus Subject: 'The Gateless Gate" Pages 27-28 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear Friends, and Colleagues; Here are the next two pages (one screen) of the Gateless Gate: Pages 27-28 http://web.pdx.edu/~pdx00282/Gate/Pgs%2027-28.htm Mirror site: http://www.cddc.vt.edu/host/weishaus/Gate/Pgs%2027-28.htm Introduction: http://web.pdx.edu/~pdx00282/Gate/Intro.htm Please let me know if you wish to be deleted from these periodic = notices. Comments are always welcome. -Joel =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 20:06:28 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Amanda Earl Subject: AngelHousePress Essay # 6 - Marcus McCann Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed the sixth of our AHP essay series is now up: Marcus McCann muses on authorship, male birth envy and plagiarism vs plunder in his essay "Genus Envy: Is Our Culture Fixated on Plagiarism?" Marcus McCann is the editor of Ottawa's Capital Xtra, organizer of the Trangress Festival and the NaughtyThoughts Book Club, and a host of CKCU's Literary Landscapes. Soft Where (Chaudiere, 2009) is his first full-length book of poems. Amanda Earl AngelHousePress www.angelhousepress.com the angel is in the house ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 20:28:18 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Kyle Schlesinger Subject: ED SANDERS READING IN BROOKLYN FRIDAY JULY 31 @ 8:00 Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit @ The Arm 281 North 7th Street Williamsburg Brooklyn, NY 11211 http://www.thearmnyc.com (posted for Dan Morris) ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 19:11:27 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Stephen Vincent Subject: Photography Interest?? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii FYI -If you have an interest -as I know some of us - in photography, I have begun writing reviews for two magazines, the revived B/W (Black and White photography), and Color - both from the same publisher. Both have same, adventurous as possible editor, John Lavine. I have recently written on Larry Sultan, Leo Rubinfien, Linda Connor, and Robert Dawson, and (coming up Jim Goldberg, Michael Light) and, eventually Reneke Dykstra. Most of these folks are working one kind of interesting edge or other. Anyway the mags are pretty well distributed in what remains of news shops in America. Stephen Vincent http://stephenvincent.net/blog/ Current July home of the Daily Phrase & Photo project ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 00:49:08 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: CA Conrad Subject: poet John Wieners 40TH ANNIVERSARY CELEBRATION MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit poet John Wieners 40TH ANNIVERSARY CELEBRATION 40 summers ago John Wieners wrote ASYLUM POEMS (Angel Hair Books) click here: http://phillysound.blogspot.com/2009_07_01_archive.html READ WIENERS THIS SUMMER! He's always good for us, CAConrad -- PhillySound: new poetry http://PhillySound.blogspot.com THE BOOK OF FRANK by CAConrad http://CAConrad.blogspot.com ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 07:36:25 -0400 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: Jeffrey Side Subject: Found a good article called 'POETRY SCENE: CURRENT DIFFICULTIES' Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Found a good article called 'POETRY SCENE: CURRENT DIFFICULTIES' http://www.textetc.com/modernist/current-difficulties.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 11:05:02 -0500 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: William Allegrezza Subject: New Moria Online MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The new issue of Moria is online: http://www.moriapoetry.com/v11i23.html It contains poetry by: Subhashis Gangopadhyay Deborah Meadows, Marcia Arrieta, Becca Klaver, Natalie Knight, Holms Troelstrup, John Moore Williams, Talia Reed, Brian Zimmer, Jason Fraley, Adam Strauss, Tom Hibbard, Nick Demske, Sarah K Bell, Scott Doolin, Hugh Tribbey, Ann Fine, Mark Young, Alexander Jorgensen, Andrew Topel. It also has an article by Heather Momyer on Stein, Myer, and Fraser ================================== The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 09:09:46 -0700 Reply-To: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" Sender: "Poetics List (UPenn, UB)" From: amy king Subject: This Summer's Saturday -- Tomorrow Night MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable The Stain of Poetry carries on, so please forward: Â = =0A=0AThe Stain of Poetry carries on, so please=0Aforward:=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A= =0A=C2=A0=0A=0AWe're excited to introduce you to our new venue,=0AGoodbye B= lue Monday!=C2=A0 A "cave of wonders, living room, library, and=0Acuriosity= shop," they offer a=C2=A0variety:=C2=A0 sake-infused lemonade, your=0Afavo= rite beers, chocolate cake and other tasty items -- what more could you=0Aw= ant?=C2=A0 How about some killer poets?=C2=A0=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0AJoin us for = the superlaunch:=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0ASaturday, August 1st @ 7 p.m. =C2=A0=0A= =0A=C2=A0=0A=0A~ Julian Brolaski, Adam Fieled, Nada Gordon,=0AScott=C2=A0Hi= ghtower, Chris Stackhouse & David Wolach ~=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0AGoo= dbye Blue Monday=0A=0A(go through cafe room=0A=0Ato back garden stage)=0A= =0A1087 Broadway=0A=0A(corner of Dodworth St)=0A=0ABrooklyn, NY 11221-3013= =0A=0A(718) 453-6343=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0AJ M Z trains to Myrtle Ave=0A=0Aor J = train to Kosciusko St.=C2=A0=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0A~=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0AJulian T. = Brolaski is the author of the chapbooks=0AHellish Death Monsters (Spooky Pr= ess,=C2=A02001), Letters to Hank Williams (True West Press,=0A2003), The Da= ily Usonian (Atticus/Finch, 2004) and Madame Bovary=E2=80=99s Diary (Cy=0AP= ress, 2005) (under=C2=A0the name Tanya Brolaski), Buck in a Corridor=0A(fly= npyntar, 2008) and the blog herm of warsaw.=C2=A0 Xir first book gowanus=0A= atropolis is forthcoming from Ugly Duckling Presse. Brolaski lives in Brook= lyn=0Awhere xe writes poetry, serves as a Litmus Press editor, plays countr= y music in=0AThe Low & the Lonesome, and curates th=E2=80=99every-other-mon= thly freakshow=0AMongrel Vaudeville.=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0A~=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0AAd= am Fieled is a poet, musician, and critic based=0Ain Philadelphia. He has r= eleased several books and chapbooks, maintains two=0Ablogs, and is finishin= g his PhD at Temple University, where he teaches.=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0A~=0A=0A= =C2=A0=0A=0ANada Gordon is the author of four poetry books:=0AFolly, V. Imp= , Are Not Our Lowing Heifers Sleeker than Night-Swollen=0AMushrooms?, and f= oriegnn bodie =E2=80=93 and, with Gary Sullivan, an e-pistolary=0Atechno-ro= mantic non-fiction novel, Swoon. She practices poetry as deep entertainment= =0Aand is a proud member of the Flarf Collective. Visit her blog=0A=0Aat ht= tp://ululate.blogspot.com.=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0A~=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0AScott Highto= wer=E2=80=99s third collection, =E2=80=9CPart of the=0ABargain,=E2=80=9Drec= eived the 2004 Hayden Carruth Award. His translations from Spanish=0Ahave g= arnered him a Willis Barnstone Translation Prize. He is a contributing=0Aed= itor to =E2=80=9CThe Journal.=E2=80=9D=C2=A0 His reviews=C2=A0frequently ap= pear in =E2=80=9CColdfront Magazine=E2=80=9D and=0A=E2=80=9CBoxcar Poetry R= eview.=E2=80=9D=C2=A0=C2=A0 A native of central Texas, he lives with=0Aone = foot in New York City, one in Texas, and one in Madrid, Spain. =C2=A0He tea= ches at NYU, and has taught poetry,=0Anon-fiction writing, and translation = at Drew, F.I.T., Fordham, and Poets House.=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0A~=C2=A0=0A=0A= =C2=A0=0A=0AChristopher Stackhouse is the author of poetry=0Acollected in t= he chapbook Slip (Corollary Press, 2005); co-author of Seismosis=0A(1913 Pr= ess, 2006), a dialogic collaboration featuring Stackhouse=E2=80=99s drawing= s=0Aand text by writer/professor John Keene (Northwestern University), with= essays=0Afrom poet Ed=0A=0ARoberson and poet/critic Geoffrey Jacques. He= =0Aholds has MFA in Writing/Interdisciplinary Studies from Bard College; is= a Cave=0ACanem Writers Fellow; and is a 2005 Fellow in Poetry, New York Fo= undation for=0Athe Arts. His recent essays have been published in the liter= ary journal=0AAmerican Poet, and the anthology A Best of Fence: The First N= ine Years. He will=0Abe a guest faculty member in the Naropa University Sum= mer Writing Program 2009,=0Aat the Jack=0A=0AKerouac School of Disembodied = Poetics in Boulder,=0AColorado. He organizes Readings at Max Protetch Galle= ry in New York City with=0Apoet/assistant gallery director Stuart Krimko. C= urrently completing a=0Amanuscript of poetry, while also=C2=A0doing researc= h for the development of a=0Anon-fiction book on poetics, Stackhouse lives = and works in Brooklyn New York.=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0A~=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0ADavid W= olach is professor of writing, poetics,=0A&=C2=A0philosophy at The Evergree= n State in Olympia,=0AWashington, and visiting poet in Bard College=E2=80= =99s Workshop in Language &=0AThinking.=C2=A0 Author of Fractions of M, The= Transcendental Insect Reader,=C2=A0Acts of Art/Works of Violence, and the= =0Aforthcoming Scripto Erratum (sound/text compositions, scored with compos= er Arun=0AChandra & video artist Tasha Glen), David=E2=80=99s work has appe= ared this year or=0Ais forthcoming from Bird Dog, CRIT, Night Train, Diode,= The Concelebratory=0AShoehorn Review, Venereal Kittens, [...]: An Antholog= y of New American Writing,=0AAB OVO, and Ignavia Press: Journal=0A=0Aof Tra= nsgressive Queer Writing. =C2=A0Much of his work is multi-media and perform= ative,=0Aand has been featured at venues such as Buffalo Poetics Series 200= 9, The=0AAmerican Cybernetics=C2=A0Conference 2009, and Bard=E2=80=99s Visi= ting Poets=0ASeries.=C2=A0 David is also editor of Wheelhouse Magazine & Pr= ess and curator=0Aof PRESS: A Cross-Cultural Literary Conference.=0A=0A=C2= =A0=0A=0A~=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0AHosted by Amy King and Ana Bo=C5=BEi=C4=8Devic= =0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0AINFO:=C2=A0=0A=0Ahttp://stainofpoetry.wordpress.com/=0A= =0A=C2=A0=0A=0ARSVP:=C2=A0=0A=0Ahttp://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=3D103= 132898882=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0A=C2=A0-- Amy's Aliashttp://amyking.org =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The Poetics List is moderated & does not accept all posts. Check guidelines & sub/unsub info: http://epc.buffalo.edu/poetics/welcome.html